ASICS Gel Kinsei and 'The Stick'

gerard65

Been doing a bit of research on these, can anyone here give me some personal feedback before I'm parted with my yoyo's.

makker

Got a pair last Xmas in the Annotts sale

Personally dont like them much, they feel like concrete blocks on my feet!

rigal

Bought the Kinsei 2's in the Arnotts sale about a year and a half ago. I didn't know about gait anaylsis at the time so just assumed they would be fine given they were the top of the range :rolleyes:. After running in them a few times I found -

1) they were heavy compared to my old kayanos
2) they had great overall support but not enough in the arch area for me. I think my feet are a bit too narrow for them and hence was getting sore arches a lot.

I'm not a very heavy runner (6ft & 12st) so in hindsight they may not have been suitable for me - possibly too much support. When I went to a certain well known running shop in Dublin a few months later the sales guy told me that in his opinion asics had thrown the kitchen sink at the shoe, in terms of latest technology, but that it wasn't a great shoe. I have no doubt that others on here have them and think they're great though!

Bought the stick 3 months ago and find it excellent for getting rid of knots etc in the calves and I use it a lot on the lower legs in general, particularly if I'm feeling stiff before a run. From what I've read I think a foam roller might be able to work on other areas more easily and with better effects (quads, hamstrings etc). In hindsight I should have bought a foamroller.

TFBubendorfer

I've got "The Stick". I bought it in Boston this year when I was in holiday spending mood, otherwise I wouldn't have spent as much money on a glorified plastic rolling pin.

Having said that, it's reasonably effective on my calves. Now that I have it, I keep using it.

baza1976

What is the "Stick" any link???

daymobrew

baza1976 wrote: »

What is the "Stick" any link???

http://www.thestick.com/

Krusty_Clown

I used to wear the Kinsei I's which I quite liked. Bought a pair of Kinsei IIs, and I started to pick up niggles and mild injuries. They are very heavy. My physio reckons he gets loads of business because of people wearing Kinsei IIs. I switched to Mizuno Waveriders, and they've been brilliant. A damn site cheaper too. I got my last pair from Wiggle for 81 euro. Kinsei 2 are around 165 euro, :eek:

ronanmac

I have found the Stick to be very effective in loosening out my hamstring, which always seems to have some bit of tightness. You can definitely feel it working on your calves also. Would recommend it.

lizanne83

I am also needing a lot of advice on the Kinsei 2. I had been wearing Kinsei 1 ever since they came out and as soon as Kinsei 2 were released, I got in Arnotts. I’m on 3rd pair since. However, this time last year I got severe pelvic stress fracture after Berlin marathon. I had done all training and racing that year (2008) in Kinsei 2 and with orthotics. Had not run (nor able to walk for time!) with injury since.

Basically many physio’s and runners have since said that the kinsei’s are possibly a key contributing factor for injury… the Heel apparently is too high, hence causing a tilt (pelvic tilt)…. Also these are a very heavy runner. However the pro’s for me is that they’re an ultra-supportive and comfortable shoe, especially for long distances.

The big dilemma now is that I am finally healed (1 year later!) and have gently returned to grass running a few weeks ago… but still wearing the kinsei 2. They feel great but god knows if they could cause re-injury. Everybody here raves about Mizuno, Brookes, Saucony, New Balance etc…. All I have known and accustomed to running in is Asics!
I need a supportive and neutral runner (for orthotics) but not as technologically mummified and built up heavy as the kinsei … So the question is: what is similar to the Kinsei 2 but lighter and the ‘correct’ heel height….

gerard65

Thanks for the replys, its great to get 'hands on unbiased' feedback.
Lizanne83, this months (November issue) 'runningfitness magazine' has a good shoe guide which may help you. One shoe you could research is the Brooks Dyad 5, they say " This one's a rare shoe. It is for low arched runners who do not over-pronate. That means it is stable with support around the arch. It is also a good option to go for if your podiatrist tells you that you need a neutral shoe to go with your orthotics".

wizwill

lizanne83 wrote: »

I am also needing a lot of advice on the Kinsei 2. I had been wearing Kinsei 1 ever since they came out and as soon as Kinsei 2 were released, I got in Arnotts. I’m on 3rd pair since. However, this time last year I got severe pelvic stress fracture after Berlin marathon. I had done all training and racing that year (2008) in Kinsei 2 and with orthotics. Had not run (nor able to walk for time!) with injury since.

Basically many physio’s and runners have since said that the kinsei’s are possibly a key contributing factor for injury… the Heel apparently is too high, hence causing a tilt (pelvic tilt)…. Also these are a very heavy runner. However the pro’s for me is that they’re an ultra-supportive and comfortable shoe, especially for long distances.

The big dilemma now is that I am finally healed (1 year later!) and have gently returned to grass running a few weeks ago… but still wearing the kinsei 2. They feel great but god knows if they could cause re-injury. Everybody here raves about Mizuno, Brookes, Saucony, New Balance etc…. All I have known and accustomed to running in is Asics!
I need a supportive and neutral runner (for orthotics) but not as technologically mummified and built up heavy as the kinsei … So the question is: what is similar to the Kinsei 2 but lighter and the ‘correct’ heel height….

If there is any suggestion that your previous injury, which sounds quite debilitating was caused by the type of runners you were using i would highly recommend a trip to a good sport podiatrist. Perhaps post a thread looking for a one in your area.

I have a pair of kinsei (which i only ran in a few times), they are very heavy, I think asics broke the mould with these, i dont think there is many comparative models from other brands.

RedB

Lizanne83,

For what its worth - I'm a bit of an asics follower myself and went to a recent gait analysis roadshow that asics did. I got orthotics recently and brought them with me. I was recommended the Nimbus 11. I'm 14st so that may be the reason! I'm holding off until after the DCM as a change now would be hard.

lizanne83

Ger, thanks for the advice on shoe-guide in running fitness. I have quite a high-arch actually so the Brooks Dyad may not be best idea but will have a look at options.
Don’t have a podiatrist but had seen biomechanics lab in Maynooth for my custom made orthotics (with bump in middle for high-arch!) but he wasn’t very helpful in terms of shoe advice… I’m thinking getting a gait analysis though in regular shoe store (elvery's)

@ Wizwill, thanks for the advice too.

@ RedB, yes many people have recommended the Nimbus but I have never liked when testing in shops, they just don’t feel right. Also I don’t need support in terms of weight; I’m less than 60kg… I just need foot support due to many previous feet & lower-limb injuries… and still at end of recovery from serious injury. And I didn’t feel nimbus had this this same support. Good luck in the DMC!

wizwill

here is a good guide showing comparative shoes, no kinsei though


http://www.brooksrunning.com/Help/Fit+&+Sizing/Brand+Comparison+Chart/

baldykav

Gerard + lizzane,

Your foot and gait pattern is going to be completely different to everyone else's on this forum so people's experience of a certain brand of shoe is completely subjective and of no use to you.

For one person the Kinsei may be the best shoe there is, but for others a wave rider/brooks adrenaline would be more effective. It all depends on what level of pronation, supination you have or whether you're a neutral striker. Get your Gait analysis checked by a shop (amphibian king/runways etc) who do Gait analysis and have a good selection of brands (not just asics - at least brooks, new balance, asics, saucony.)

I run in custom orthotics which were designed with only mild arch support so the muscles underfoot don't become excessively weakened, this means that I personally need a shoe with mild pronation control but also a basic construction on the sole so as not to disrupt the orthotic at work. The outcome is the Asics GT 2140, cost me 80 euro's, and feels unbelievably good.

Price means nothing, function and fit is everything.

In my opinion, and in the opinion of a lot of biomechanics people I have met, the Kinsei is rubbish. Asics also destroyed the Kayano a few years back, don't know if this has been resolved since though.


The stick is good, although watch your back when putting pressure through it. Particularly at the calf.

lizanne83

Hi baldykav,
Yes I agree about Gait Analysis… had this done in RunWays about 2 years ago but I still stuck with Asics regardless… Everyone’s running technique and biomechanics is different and I think mine are a key factor for injury, especially with kinsei so it seems.
I just don’t know where I should go first: Biomechanics lab (Maynooth) as I think I’m due new orthotics (2.5 years on same pair) so perhaps he should also advise on my type of gait… I know I have high arches and a pronator of sorts but not sure about now or what levels. Also I think a neutral shoe is needed for orthotics…
Or should the first step be to get a Gait analysis (Amphibian / Runways) and take the shoe choice from there?
Agreed: Money is nothing when dealing with your health in any form. I have learned the hard way ;-)
Thanks for the advice

gerard65

Hi baldykav, it was more personel feedback rather than advice I was looking for. I've had the Gait Analysis done and am neutral but because of age and weight I need good cushioning. I agree with you about the kayano's - version 13 and 14 were poor, but the updated 15 is as good as the 12's. Because of the feedback I'm holding back until the kinsei 3 is out and put through it paces.
As for the 'stick', I was advised to use an old 'D' size battery and roll it along the muscles using my palm. I've only been using it a couple of days and its amazed me. The soreness and tightness is gone and its even improved a foot problem I've had for a couple of weeks.