dealer takes my deposit i come back 3 days later with rest of cash and its gone

SpannerMonkey

dealer takes my deposit on monday im on my way back to him half way across the country 3 days later with rest of cash and he calls me says he has to give me my deposit back says sorry mate cant discuss it i called him before i left and it was all good :mad:, im freaking out :mad:i spent weeks trying to find exactly what i wanted i gave him a deposit cause i wanted to do a check on car , did check all good so went back and its gone is this legal ??????????

Ps im out of pocket for check done on car and 2 X 3 hour trips

Santa Claus

Is he a SIMI member ? if so you could complain to them about the dealers actions.

Midnight_EG

Did you sign anything to say you were buying the car, if so you had a contract, and that would be breach of contract on his grounds, letting you sue him

SpannerMonkey

i have a receipt for deposit of 500 quid and saying how much due with description and reg number of car on it the receipt has his company name on it would that count ???

no not an SIMI member

Midnight_EG

Should do, did he tell you specifically he was selling the car to you, and was definetly keeping it for you, or did he only give you first refusal?

Despite the deposit, he reserves the right to give it back to you and sell the car to the highest bidder, all at his discretion.

If he told you he was giving it to you, sue his ass for breach of contract

SpannerMonkey

he said when i gave him the deposit "well thats grand the cars yours il take it down off the internet this evening " but that was verbal how could i prove it , and he didnt take it down off the net until today just before i was on my way up to him

djtechnics1210

Sue

Mr.Diagnostic

Maybe he discovered something wrong with the car and didnt want to sell you a bad one!

So you are disappointed, take it on the chin and move on.

I would have to wonder if this forum is mostly populated by the legal profession with the amount of calls to law.

craichoe

Midnight_EG wrote: »

Did you sign anything to say you were buying the car, if so you had a contract, and that would be breach of contract on his grounds, letting you sue him

Once there was a cash transaction there was a binding contract, the seller has not delievered what was agreed and is liable to provide the item as described.

-Chris-

Before you sue or nything else, do you know why he's no longer selling the car?

Find that out.

MagicMarker

Out of interest, what could possibly happen if the OP sues? The car's gone, the deposit is handed back, is he entitled to compensation?

Bluefoam

Why would someone be expected to pay a deposit if the dealer had no interest in keeping the car for them.

Is it possible that the dealer needs the car on the lott to generate more business and is taking deposits to help his cash flow. I hear of this in lots of other industries. OP make sure you get your money back immediately! If you payed by credit card or cheque make sure you inform your bank. You may never see the money again.

Who is the garage in question? I want to make sure I stay away from them.

galwaytt

Can't see the problem, tbh. Sure you've lost that car, but you got your money back. I thought it was the garage that was 'gone' from your title, so frankly, bit of a storm in a teacup.

It's not as if there's a shortage of used cars on the market.

Heck, I'll hold my car for you without deposit, and you can me in full on collection !

masterK

I'd contact the National Consumer Agency to find out how you stand legally rather than listening to hearsay on here:
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/

kdevitt

What on earth would he want to sue him for considering his deposit is being returned? Emotional distress??? Losing the money on the car check is a pain in the nuts, but there was no obligation to do it, so can't see that the garage is responsible for it.

Just take your deposit back and get on with it - there are loads of reasons why it may have been withdrawn for sale, sounds like you may have had a lucky escape.

axer

You have a legally binding sales contract and the dealer no longer had the rights to sell the car off to someone else or get out of the contract. The problem here is there is no agreement as to what happens upon breach of contract. You could try to get performance of contract forced upon the dealer at which point the dealer could be forced to get back the car and sell it to you but the other buyer (if there is one) could sue him too. More than likely the most you could reclaim is compensation for the petrol and time of travelling to pick up the car and your money back (but you already have your money back). What else can you sue for?

bazz26

Sounds to me like the dealer got a better offer for the car.

To be honest I'm a bit surprised some folks are suggesting that the OP got his deposit back, to take it on the chin and move on. If this was the reverse and the OP messed the dealer around you could be almost guaranteed that folks here would be claiming that the dealer should rightly keep the deposite as compensation for the customer wasting their time. Otherwise what is the point in a deposit in the first place?

Shouldn't the OP be entitled to some sort of compensation for being put at a disadvantage though having travelled across the country thinking that the deposit secured the car?

Drummerboy08

bazz26 wrote: »

Sounds to me like the dealer got a better offer for the car.

Sounds to me as if nobody in here (except maybe the OP) knows exactly why the dealer pulled out of the sale.

He could have gotten a better offer, or,
he could have discovered something seriously wrong with the car, saving the OP from a lot of hardship.

So, can we leave out the "sue the pants off him" statements until we know exactly what happened?

-Chris-

Did the dealer find out the car was crashed and being a good guy cancel the sale?

Was the dealer selling the car on behalf of someone else and that someone else pulled out of the "selling"?

Did the dealer get a better deal and unscrupulously take that offer?



What paperwork was signed, what exactly was the contract in place (SIMI contracts have "get out" clauses for where a deposit is returned or a car is delayed)? This wasn't a SIMI dealer, but maybe there's a case for "this is the way things are done in the motor industry" and suing is a waste of time.


Edit: DB08 beat me to it!

SpannerMonkey

i accept that there is probably nothing i can do but its just infuriating and i dont want to keep doing it to someone else , i did a check on the car it said owner catagory Garage so he had to have owned it , the car was absolutely spotless , drove perfectly and i cant see how when he had it advertised for weeks that there was only a problem he found out about an hour before i colleccted it i have contacted the national consumer agency and they say in the sale of second hand goods from a dealer i have entered into a contract , i will continue it , accept that the car is gone just want to frighten him into not doing it again to someone else

Drummerboy08

You need to find out why he pulled the car out of the sale. It could be something seriously wrong with it that might not show up on a drive. The car could have been stolen from his premises.

You just dont know what happened, so before you go dragging his name through the mud, find out exactly why he did it.

It may have been a genuine reason, or it may be something more sinister.

Similar happened to me, except he had refused a deposit, very annoying, little you can do. What goes around comes around though

bazz26

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

Sounds to me as if nobody in here (except maybe the OP) knows exactly why the dealer pulled out of the sale.

He could have gotten a better offer, or,
he could have discovered something seriously wrong with the car, saving the OP from a lot of hardship.

So, can we leave out the "sue the pants off him" statements until we know exactly what happened?

I never said sue the pants off him, I suggested that the OP should be compensated for the time and effort made to get to the dealer on the assumption that the car was secured via the deposit. This could be in many forms like a free service, valeting, car mats, etc. This is the same in my books as a dealer holding onto a deposite after they went to the trouble of valeting and servicing a car they thought they had sold only for the customer to pull out of the deal. Should it not work both ways?

SpannerMonkey

thats the problem guys if he told me what happened and it was reasonable i would have absolutely no problem , if there was something wrong and he did this id thank him but he just says cant talk about it have to send your deposit back , a reasonable explanation IS what i want more than anything else

and im not dragging his name through the mud i have intentionally not told anyone here his name

Drummerboy08

bazz26 wrote: »

I never said sue the pants off him, I suggested that the OP should be compensated for the time and effort made to get to the dealer on the assumption that the car was secured via the deposit. This could be in many forms like a free service, valeting, car mats, etc. This is the same in my books as a dealer holding onto a deposite after they went to the trouble of valeting and servicing a car they thought they had sold only for the customer to pull out of the deal. Should it not work both ways?

Sorry Bazz, my comments were not specifically aimed at you, just some other posters who automatically call for heads to roll.

smash

To be honest, if all was well before you left the house and the transaction was cancelled while you were on your way then maybe it was something simple like he was getting the car ready and scratched it or dented it or something!

BlackWizard

davy_b wrote: »

i have a receipt for deposit of 500 quid and saying how much due with description and reg number of car on it the receipt has his company name on it would that count ???

no not an SIMI member

Once money passes hands it's a legally binding agreement.

Not 100% on that as it's been years since I studied that boring stuff.

Personally I wouldn't go down the legal route. I'd enquire more about why it happened. He sounds like a bit of an a$$.

You should name the garage by the way.

guerito

There's very little point in going down the legal route. If verbally he agreed to sell you the car, then yes, you have a binding contract, but unless you had someone with you how do you prove it? It might end up being your word against his.

If the car is gone, you can't sue for performance of the contract (assuming it can be proven). If it's been sold on to someone else, things could get very messy very quickly.

The only thing you would probably get would be compensation for expenses plus maybe a small payout for the inconvenience. Plus the satisfaction of having costs awarded against the dealer. Assuming, that is, that there wasn't a valid reason for the dealer pulling out of the sale.

That said, you would probably get an offer of settlement from the dealer before it ever got to court, but it still seems an awful lot of hassle for very little material benefit. I do sympathise with the OP, but people shouldn't spout off about suing without thinking a little first.

SpannerMonkey

im lucky enough to have a solicitor in the family and i got her involved she did some investigation and found that i have a perfect case , she rang him and after he calmed down he gave her the explination apparently there was a reasonable explination to do with previous owner and the car he sold him having trouble ,so he offered me a car a year newer with lower mileage i was buying a 530d sport he offered a 520i sport so not interested but still fair enough on his part

yop

davy_b wrote: »

im lucky enough to have a solicitor in the family and i got her involved she did some investigation and found that i have a perfect case , she rang him and after he calmed down he gave her the explination apparently there was a reasonable explination to do with previous owner and the car he sold him having trouble ,so he offered me a car a year newer with lower mileage i was buying a 530d sport he offered a 520i sport so not interested but still fair enough on his part

There was a legit reason, so fair enough on his part. U got away with it I think

snollup

Mr.Diagnostic wrote: »

Maybe he discovered something wrong with the car and didnt want to sell you a bad one!

So you are disappointed, take it on the chin and move on.

I would have to wonder if this forum is mostly populated by the legal profession with the amount of calls to law.

I'd wonder if your a car dealer yourself.

OP, I'd be looking for an amazing deal on another motor ot else sue the dodgy fecker.

profun

woops

SpannerMonkey

in fairness he offered a good deal and all i wanted was a legit reason and there would be a lot of hassle and expense following it when he has a legit legal reason

smcgiff

davy_b wrote: »

im lucky enough to have a solicitor in the family and i got her involved she did some investigation and found that i have a perfect case , she rang him and after he calmed down he gave her the explination apparently there was a reasonable explination to do with previous owner and the car he sold him having trouble ,so he offered me a car a year newer with lower mileage i was buying a 530d sport he offered a 520i sport so not interested but still fair enough on his part

If you're happy fair enough, but he did have a lot of time to come up with an excuse - an excuse he didn't have for you at the time.

As for the good offer on the BMW - this may have had a lot to do with a certain solicitor being involved.

Had to laugh at the suggestions above that were along the line of... 'He may have spotted a problem with the car and didn't want to sell it to you'. Sounds like that's been dusted off and used before.

Such honesty would be rare at the best of times - but then to be too much of a hero not to tell you this at the awkward time of handing back your deposit! :pac:

Only going on the info above... If I had to guess I would still say he got a better deal.

I wonder where the car is now... www.mywheels.ie.

robtri

just reading this thread now..... intertesting.....

it is possible the dealer had found out something at the alst minute, but lets be honest here, the chances are remote, and more than likely he got a btter deal...

I think you did right reporting him to the NCA, leave it at that and move on.... plenty of other nice cars out there, no point in you wasting more and more of your time on this dealer, not worth it.

niceirishfella

Santa Claus wrote: »

Is he a SIMI member ? if so you could complain to them about the dealers actions.

Ohhhhh WOW..........He'll not sleep tonight.:p

ToxicPaddy

smcgiff wrote: »

I wonder where the car is now... www.mywheels.ie.

I think that site might be abit out of date, says my car hasnt been taxed in nearly 3 months, but I have a tax disk sitting in the holder on my window saying the opposite.. :rolleyes:

Back on topic, Id be seriously p*ssed off with that dealer, its hard enough finding a decent second hand car as it is without some as*hole not even having the courtesy to call you and explain in detail what is happening and why it happened.

If a solicitor had not got involved, Im sure he would still be ignoring you..

If I you have grounds, sue him, even if its for nothing more than his incompetence and wasting of your time and effort..

Tox

-Chris-

robtri wrote: »

it is possible the dealer had found out something at the alst minute, but lets be honest here, the chances are remote, and more than likely he got a btter deal...

I completely agree, but I think a bit of perspective is needed to counter those who instantly bay for blood, I'm just playing devil's advocate.

smcgiff

-Chris- wrote: »

I completely agree, but I think a bit of perspective is needed to counter those who instantly bay for blood, I'm just playing devil's advocate.

Nah - wouldn't sue either. I certainly wouldn't be going back to this garage again though. Fool me once etc...

Big Nasty

I would be looking for your deposit back AND the Motorcheck fee too in order to go away quietly and cause no fuss. Whether there was a legitimate reason or not it's still not the OP's problem so that's the least the dealer could do IMO.

JD1763

This happened to me before in a VW dealership on the south side. Paid the deposit on a car that had just come in, next day got a phone call to say the car had been sold by his 'boss' without him knowing. Asked to speak to his boss at which point I was told this is my job if you say anything. Just took the deposit back and walked out but told everyone I know not to do any business with that garage. I learned alot about dealing with the motor trade in those few weeks of car hunting - alot of it not good.

Dabko

Sounds like the dealer got a better offer.

Go to the off-licence, buy a nice bottle of scotch/vodka, sit down this evening and get hammered. Hell, even have a cry for yourself if it helps.
These things happen.

And dont be listening to the 'americanisation-of-the-nation' crowd with their sus sue sue mentality.

SpannerMonkey

Dabko wrote: »

Sounds like the dealer got a better offer.

Go to the off-licence, buy a nice bottle of scotch/vodka, sit down this evening and get hammered. Hell, even have a cry for yourself if it helps.
These things happen.

And dont be listening to the 'americanisation-of-the-nation' crowd with their sus sue sue mentality.

:rolleyes: HAHAHA well thats a plan anyway

Bluefoam

I think the appropriate action would be to name the dealer...

Santa Claus

Bluefoam wrote: »

I think the appropriate action would be to name the dealer...

I think that decision is up to the mods in fairness !!!

So just to get it straight OP, the car that the dealer sold to the previous owner of the 530 had trouble and so the buyer brought back that car and took his old 530 back, is that right ?


To all the folks who suggested that the dealer pulled the sale due to a problem with the car, why would the dealer not either :
A. Stall for time and fix it
or
B. Admit there was a problem and offer the deposit back

That happened me once with Sweeney & Forte in Clontarf when buying a 1 year old Alfa....I saw the car on the day they took it as a trade-in and left a deposit but while they were servicing it prior to me colecting it they discovered a problem with the gearbox and called me.
They said they could fix it if I could wait a week, or they'd give me back my deposit and give me a free service within a year on any other alfa I got elsewhere.
I took my deposit back and got my free service on another car 10 months later, but I must have told loads of people about my experience and how honest and professional the dealers were. 2 lads I worked with bought their new company cars there as a result of that and my family bought 3 cars from them within 2 years, so it worked out for the garage too.
Just to clarify though, that was back when they were an Alfa/Fiat dealership, now they're just a used car showroom who import most of their stock from the UK.

Bluefoam

Santa Claus wrote: »

I think that decision is up to the mods in fairness !!!

So just to get it straight OP, the car that the dealer sold to the previous owner of the 530 had trouble and so the buyer brought back that car and took his old 530 back, is that right ?


To all the folks who suggested that the dealer pulled the sale due to a problem with the car, why would the dealer not either :
A. Stall for time and fix it
or
B. Admit there was a problem and offer the deposit back

That happened me once with Sweeney & Forte in Clontarf when buying a 1 year old Alfa....I saw the car on the day they took it as a trade-in and left a deposit but while they were servicing it prior to me colecting it they discovered a problem with the gearbox and called me.
They said they could fix it if I could wait a week, or they'd give me back my deposit and give me a free service within a year on any other alfa I got elsewhere.
I took my deposit back and got my free service on another car 10 months later, but I must have told loads of people about my experience and how honest and professional the dealers were. 2 lads I worked with bought their new company cars there as a result of that and my family bought 3 cars from them within 2 years, so it worked out for the garage too.
Just to clarify though, that was back when they were an Alfa/Fiat dealership, now they're just a used car showroom who import most of their stock from the UK.

Only place I have found that regularly have sportswagons.

Scouserfan

Consider yourself lucky. if he is f**king you around before you buy it, imagine the grief if you had to get something done under warranty.
Lucky escape, and stick to an SIMI dealer, preferably a franchised dealer, for any make.

Anan1

Scouserfan wrote: »

and stick to an SIMI dealer, preferably a franchised dealer, for any make.