600lb bomb defused in Forkhill

FlutterinBantam

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0908/armagh.html


What was the reasoning behind this ??

Local people put at risk for what?

Looks like some criminals not too happy that their operations were getting disturbed.

Fair play to the forces of law and order on both sides for preventing innocent loss of life.

dlofnep

A moronic action. This does absolutely nothing to further the goal of Irish unification. Putting innocent rural folk at risk is pointless, and counter-productive.

FlutterinBantam

Fair play to the PSNI for preventing potential major loss of life.

dlofnep

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Fair play to the forces of law and order on both sides for preventing innocent loss of life.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Fair play to the PSNI for preventing potential major loss of life.

Caught you the first time buddy, don't worry.

FlutterinBantam

Well anyway, hopefully the people behind the bomb will be put away for a long time,that kind of stuff has no place in politics in 2009.

Politics is the way forward, these neanderthals should be exposed and handed over to the authorities.

Vested interests, I suppose, scarfed under the banner of some kind of "OOirish Freedom" but in reality lining their own pockets.

Like most of the so called "freedom fighters"

Great it all worked out well anyway.

mike65

Thats the trouble with Potassium Nitrate 10-10-20 bombs - easy to make.

FlutterinBantam

Pity they didn't go the way of Wesley and Harris.

Fratton Fred

Let's hope this doesn't make the UDA change their minds on decommisioning.

Kalashnikov_Kid

More in depth report here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/8244138.stm

Police have said a large bomb planted close to the Irish border in south Armagh was intended to kill officers.

The 600lb bomb was made safe by an Army bomb disposal team near Forkhill.

The device had a command wire running from where it was planted in Northern Ireland to a firing point across the border in the Republic.

It is suspected that dissident republicans planted the bomb. Police said it could have had a "devastating outcome".

"The actions of terrorist criminals in planting this device in the Forkhill area put local people and police officers at significant risk," Chief Inspector Sam Cordner said.

'Reckless'

"Their actions were reckless and dangerous in the extreme. Their target may have been the police, but they did not care who they killed or injured.


Chief Inspector Sam Cordner: "This was a device planted by reckless criminal terrorists"
"It is only through the hard work and professionalism of police officers and their military colleagues that the area has been made safe."

The BBC's Ireland Correspondent Mark Simpson said the discovery of the bomb was the most serious incident involving dissident republicans since the killing of two British soldiers and a police officer in March.

He said the most "worrying aspect for police" was the size of the bomb and that "even by Northern Ireland's grim standards, 600lb is a big device".

"It shows what the dissidents are capable of producing," he added.

"But at the same time the fact that the attack failed shows they lack the 'expertise' the IRA used to have during the troubles.

"What is more, even in hardline republican areas like south Armagh they lack significant public support. "

He said the question now was what forensic evidence had been left on the bomb.

The remains of the device, which contained fertiliser-based homemade explosives, have been removed for further examination.

The Irish Army and police carried out a similar security operation in the Republic.

The alert in the area began last Tuesday following a telephoned warning to a newspaper.

Sinn Fein MP for Newry and Armagh, Conor Murphy said he was "extremely concerned."

He said: "I would question the motives of those who are putting the local community in such danger.

Dangerous

"I challenge those who have planted this bomb in the community to come forward and explain why they have done so? How is this furthering the struggle for Irish freedom?"

SDLP MLA Dominic Bradley condemned those who planted the bomb and also questioned the police response.

"Everybody accepts the dangerous nature of policing this type of threat by the PSNI, however, serious questions must be asked about the response time in dealing with the device and evacuating people from their nearby homes.

"It seems the PSNI may have known about this bomb days before they moved people and if that's the case then it's certainly cause for much concern."


Resident Marian Hollywood: "They're out to kill me and my neighbours"
"The bomb was found 50 yards from Marian Hollywood's home."

Ulster Unionist deputy leader Danny Kennedy said the attempted attack was "deeply alarming".

"It is likely to assume that members of the PSNI were the target of this bomb; however had it detonated it could have killed any passer by," he said.

"This shows how reckless these republicans were in their targets and highlights their total disregard for human life."

DUP assembly member William Irwin said it was imperative people in the area helped police catch those responsible.

"There is still the very real threat of terrorism here in Northern Ireland and this has been proven once again by the murderous thugs who left this massive bomb near the border," he said.

In January, a 300lb bomb was defused in Castlewellan, County Down.

It is thought the bomb was planted by dissident republicans who were trying to target the Ballykinler army base.

In May the component parts of another fertiliser bomb were found near Rosslea in County Fermanagh.

About 100lbs of explosives were found in a field near the Donagh to Rosslea Road.

It is sad that dissidents still feel that they have to flex their muscles by playing with people's lives like this. Unfortunately, it is these types of activity that make the headlines and not others such as the strong public show of solidarity in Belfast city centre in the aftermath of the recent RUC killings.

Stupid sporadic activities like this deter from the fact that most Northerners are willing to move on and keep living in the 21st Century (backed up by the parts of the article I have highlighted).

sceptre

Aware as I am that a few kilos of plutonium are smaller than a few kilos of fertiliser, how fricking big is the typical garden variety[1] 600lb bomb? Does it fit in a van?

[1] yes, I know. Unfortunate choice of words

Fratton Fred

Like 30, 20 kilo bags of sand I guess. Would need a transit van I suppose.

mike65

You can get an infinite amount of stuff in the back of a Hiace in my experience.

I presume the bomb was in fact 10-12 seperate lumps clad in black wrapper which were transported on a flat bed.

dlofnep

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Let's hope this doesn't make the UDA change their minds on decommisioning.

Yup, good point. Anything like this will only give the loyalists an excuse to attack Catholics. With every action is a equal and opposite reaction. Let's hope someone innocent doesn't get harmed on either side because of this.

lostexpectation

howd they come across it? ah right, they phoned it in themselves.

FTA69

Thats the trouble with Potassium Nitrate 10-10-20 bombs - easy to make.

Still not something you could knock up in half an hour though, the fact a command wire was found would indicate they probably intended to use it as a mine and detonate it in the event of the Brits or cops passing in its vicinity. A 600lb bomb is massive and would have made sh*t of anyone within a fair distance of it. What the IRA usually did with such mines was pack the explosive into milk churns and then conceal them in the drainage culverts under the roads.

Personally I feel the Real IRA are simply practicing what some would call "propaganda of the deed", they are vaguely committed to disrupting the normalisation process in the north of Ireland and to achieve this they will attempt to escalate events. However they don't really have the capability to do so, beyond that I wouldn't view them as having a very long-sighted or strategic agenda in place.

Liam Byrne

lostexpectation wrote: »

howd they come across it? ah right, they phoned it in themselves.

What's the point of this post ? Are you trying to imply that we should be grateful ?

I'd be more "grateful" if they hadn't made it in the first place.

LordSutch

Planting 600lb Bombs in NI designed to maim, mutilate, & kill wasn't right in the 70s, 80s, or 90s > and its not right today either ..............

prinz

Anyone know if the road was to be used by anyone in particular. Seems to me to be overkill if it was just going to be a random attack, first thing that came to my mind was a very specific attack such as the Buchanan/Breen ambush.

Then again I thought I was stuck in a time warp too, 30 years later and nothing has changed.

27/10/1982: RUC officers killed by IRA bomb
Three RUC officers have been killed by a bomb, planted by IRA terrorists, which exploded beneath their armoured police car.
The officers were investigating the report of a robbery in Lurgan near Belfast when the bomb exploded and sent their car 40 yards (36 metres) into a field and caused a crater 60ft (18 metres) wide and 25ft (seven metres) deep....The police officers were driving down a country lane when command wire, linked to a nearby hill, was used to detonate the bomb....

The recent attacks are thought to be in response to the new assembly proposed to govern Northern Ireland. It is hoped that the assembly will turn proceedings back to politics and away from the current focus on violence.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/october/27/newsid_2478000/2478257.stm

FTA69

I imagine they wanted to target a PSNI patrol.

lostexpectation

Liam Byrne wrote: »

What's the point of this post ? Are you trying to imply that we should be grateful ?

I'd be more "grateful" if they hadn't made it in the first place.

ah calm down will ya, it just it seems these guys are doing this a lot, leaving half finished things around, anyway the police didn't find it themselves and we're told these guys are infiltrated to the hilt...

Joey the lips

Camelot wrote: »

Planting 600lb Bombs in NI designed to maim, mutilate, & kill wasn't right in the 70s, 80s, or 90s > and its not right today either ..............

I would not start bring old history into a new event! This has nothing to do with them times and linking it will only give us 20 pages of agreements and disagreements

Better to focus on this now say its wrong and wonder what the muppets are trying to achieve that politics is not!

FlutterinBantam

Well said Joey.

Raiser

Was there not some Dundalk Scumbag out in a vest and white Reeboks trying to light it with a cigarette lighter?

Da Bomb Squad Ltd.

FlutterinBantam

Uhmmm.. might need to be more specific on that one, that description covers almost everyone in that area.

Kalashnikov_Kid

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Uhmmm.. might need to be more specific on that one, that description covers almost everyone in that area.

I guess some people are still living in the past Flutter eh?

Manic Moran

sceptre wrote: »

how fricking big is the typical garden variety[1] 600lb bomb? Does it fit in a van?

Should do. It's only a little over a quarter-ton of material, about the same as 12 bags of fertilizer, I think.

But to put it in perspective, the standard bomb dropped in Iraq or Afghanistan to destroy a building is a 500lber, and that's mainly the weight of metal, not the explosive.
500-600lbs of explosives have proven sufficient to destroy main battle tanks in Iraq and Lebanon.

Note that an M1A1 turret weighs in at over 25 tons. (The whole vehicle is over 65 tons)



Now, I don't think the PSNI have anything of a nature that could compare to a tank, so you can imagine what a 600lb bomb would do to chaps in a passing Ford Mondeo.

NTM

lostexpectation

well there you go, it might have been too big

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/own-goal-fears-may-have-put-stop-to-bomb-1882384.html

FlutterinBantam

And we wonder why the forces of law and order are so jumpy in an area like that??

Shield

Thanks for all the support guys.

WinstonSmith

Guys I live quite close to where the bomb was planted. I've travelled on the road many times (probably on it when the device was there but before it was discovered on my way to a football match) and there are a couple of important observations to be made. Now I am in no way military minded but:

a) Why plant a bomb in relatively closely to those you claim to be fighting on the side of;

b) The Brits/PSNI/RUC (whatever you want to call them) seldom drive around any roads in South Armagh*;

c) Since there is very little military activity, in the area, why not plan the operation better where the chances of success would be greatly increased (South Down for instance is a lot more populated with PSNI officers than S. Armagh).

It seems that the answer to all these questions can be that the recent marginal increase in the amount of criminal activity by this particular organisation suggests the dying squawks of a wounded animal desperate to recapture the hopes of dreams long dead, and are ready and willing to lash out at all and sundry to claim that those dreams are still alive. Thus, the dreadful positioning, planning, timing and overall logistics of the operation evidenced by such an attack.





*For 30 years during the troubles, they famously disbanded the practice of driving anywhere in South Armagh at all, favouring the safer route in the air. Whilst ground transport has increased, it is very seldom, if ever I have seen any drive on the type of back road that this road is a prime example of.

prinz

WinstonSmith wrote: »

a) Why plant a bomb in relatively closely to those you claim to be fighting on the side of.

Who knows, but it's hardly something new, is it?

WinstonSmith wrote: »

b) The Brits/PSNI/RUC (whatever you want to call them) seldom drive around any roads in South Armagh*.

No comment. What a ridiculous statement to make. PSNI. Simple.

WinstonSmith wrote: »

c) Since there is very little military activity, in the area, why not plan the operation better where the chances of success would be greatly increased (South Down for instance is a lot more populated with PSNI officers than S. Armagh).

If you had read the article linked above on the matter you'd see that actually there was an increased presence of PSNI in the area, due to IIRC a robbery in Forkhill on Monday.

mega man

WinstonSmith wrote: »

Guys I live quite close to where the bomb was planted. I've travelled on the road many times (probably on it when the device was there but before it was discovered on my way to a football match) and there are a couple of important observations to be made. Now I am in no way military minded but:

a) Why plant a bomb in relatively closely to those you claim to be fighting on the side of;

b) The Brits/PSNI/RUC (whatever you want to call them) seldom drive around any roads in South Armagh*;

c) Since there is very little military activity, in the area, why not plan the operation better where the chances of success would be greatly increased (South Down for instance is a lot more populated with PSNI officers than S. Armagh).

It seems that the answer to all these questions can be that the recent marginal increase in the amount of criminal activity by this particular organisation suggests the dying squawks of a wounded animal desperate to recapture the hopes of dreams long dead, and are ready and willing to lash out at all and sundry to claim that those dreams are still alive. Thus, the dreadful positioning, planning, timing and overall logistics of the operation evidenced by such an attack.





*For 30 years during the troubles, they famously disbanded the practice of driving anywhere in South Armagh at all, favouring the safer route in the air. Whilst ground transport has increased, it is very seldom, if ever I have seen any drive on the type of back road that this road is a prime example of.

the illegal checkpoints set up by the ira in meigh might have had something to do with drawing the police into the no go areas of south armagh to attack them

FTA69

WinstonSmith wrote: »

a) Why plant a bomb in relatively closely to those you claim to be fighting on the side of;

If the bomb had of went off while buried in a ditch then it probably wouldn't have resulted in civilian casualties to be honest, it might well have blown out a number of windows in nearby houses but I doubt it would have killed people in their houses.

b) The Brits/PSNI/RUC (whatever you want to call them) seldom drive around any roads in South Armagh*;

The Brits don't, but the cops do. The PSNI do have a presence in South Armagh, during that Real IRA checkpoint a couple of weeks ago a number of unmarked PSNI vehicles ended up nearly driving into it.

c) Since there is very little military activity, in the area, why not plan the operation better where the chances of success would be greatly increased (South Down for instance is a lot more populated with PSNI officers than S. Armagh).

Because maybe they don't have the proper logistical base in the area? Similarly, I'd say they are hoping to try and create a situation where the PSNI will refuse to enter South Armagh without helicopter support, a bit like South Fermanagh at the moment.

It seems that the answer to all these questions can be that the recent marginal increase in the amount of criminal activity by this particular organisation suggests the dying squawks of a wounded animal desperate to recapture the hopes of dreams long dead, and are ready and willing to lash out at all and sundry to claim that those dreams are still alive.

I wouldn't write them off yet. While I fundamentally disagree with the approach taken by the likes of the Real IRA, they aren't motivated by monetary gain and they, or a similar group, will be around for the foreseeable future.

LordSutch

FTA69 wrote: »

The Brits don't, but the cops do. The PSNI do have a presence in South Armagh, during that Real IRA checkpoint a couple of weeks ago a number of unmarked PSNI vehicles ended up nearly driving into it.

So the 'Brits' seldom drive around any roads in South Armagh, but the cops do!

Always wondered what 'Brits' meant (Brits=Army)? but surely the IRA in all its many guises would also consider the Police Service of Northern Ireland & most of the population as as Brits? or am I missing something?

FTA69

"Brits" generally refers to the British Army.

but surely the IRA in all its many guises would also consider the Police Service of Northern Ireland & most of the population as as Brits? or am I missing something?

The term "Brits Out" means a British political and military withdrawal from Ireland, it does not, and never did, refer to the expulsion of Irish Unionists.

prinz

FTA69 wrote: »

The term "Brits Out" means a British political and military withdrawal from Ireland, it does not, and never did, refer to the expulsion of Irish Unionists.

If only it were that simple. I would need more than two hands to count the amount of times I've been addressed as a "Brit" right here on this very site. Seems to me it's a catch-all phrase, to include anyone who thinks terrorists are scum.

LordSutch

FTA69 wrote: »

"Brits" generally refers to the British Army.

The term "Brits Out" means a British political and military withdrawal from Ireland, it does not, and never did, refer to the expulsion of Irish Unionists.

So, for thirty years I thought 'Brits out' meant "British people out" when it actually meant political & military withdrawl only > I wonder was the 'Brits out' message lost on many in Ireland & abroad over the decades, due to its vagueness?

I certainly took personal offence when Adams & his cronies talked about the Brits this, & the Brits that, we want Brits out, etc, etc, etc (And all the time they were only talking about taking the Army off the streets)!

mega man

what has this to do with the thread?

getz

there is a lot of terrorism going on in derry at this moment in time,today people have been asked to leave their homes in the springtown area of derry after a suspect divice found,police are also investigating reports of an explosion in shantallow,man shot in both ,legs by masked gang this morning in derry ,there have been six paramilitary style shooting in derry over the last four weeks,

ednwireland

bomb scare in donegal town at the moment, pipe bomb left outside a building society

getz

is all this republican, real IRA/and IRA infighting ?

getz

the real IRA have admitted the three overnight attacks in derry on friday,the relatives of a serving police officer were the target of two bombs the first device exploded outside his parents home in shantallow,while a second device is being examined outside his sisters home in kylemore park.in a statement the group also claimed responsibility for shooting a man in his legs and hand at about 0130 BST,police are investigating the car believed to have carried the bomb in foxhill, oglaigh na heieann a small republican splinter group,has claimed responsibility

dvpower

FTA69 wrote: »

The term "Brits Out" means a British political and military withdrawal from Ireland, it does not, and never did, refer to the expulsion of Irish Unionists.

I remember a slogan from the H-Block protests

What do we want?
Political status.
When do we want it?
Now
Anything else?
Brits out
Who's a Brit?
Gerry Fitt.

I think that broadens the definition out way past British political and military people and even past Irish Unionists.

the_syco

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Let's hope this doesn't make the UDA change their minds on decommisioning.

In the past they would have just gone over to the RHC, in the same way that anyone left from the various *IRA groups went into the RIRA, but as the RHC has stated that they have decommisioned, I'm not sure what flag they'd now commit the crimes under?

WinstonSmith wrote: »

a) Why plant a bomb in relatively closely to those you claim to be fighting on the side of;

.
No poster says "join us now" like "look, we can still make a 600lb bomb like the good old days"...?

Fratton Fred

the_syco wrote: »

In the past they would have just gone over to the RHC, in the same way that anyone left from the various *IRA groups went into the RIRA, but as the RHC has stated that they have decommisioned, I'm not sure what flag they'd now commit the crimes under?

The Real Red Hand Commandos? Contiunity RHC? or some other convenient name that allows Loyalist extremists to tut tut at them and condemn their actions yet complain about internment and persecution when one of them is arrested?

Maybe.

dlofnep

Camelot wrote: »

So, for thirty years I thought 'Brits out' meant "British people out"

You thought wrong.

Fratton Fred

dlofnep wrote: »

You thought wrong.

Maybe you could offer a reason as to why, when an attrocity is carried out by Nationalists, it is the IRA/RIRA/INLA etc etc but when the "Other Side" commit an attrocity it is "The Brits".

There is no distinction ever made between the British Army, RUC or UVF. In Fairness, should not all Nationalist crimes be blamed on "The Irish"?

Genuine question, not looking for an arguement.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maybe you could offer a reason as to why, when an attrocity is carried out by Nationalists, it is the IRA/RIRA/INLA etc etc but when the "Other Side" commit an attrocity it is "The Brits".

There is no distinction ever made between the British Army, RUC or UVF. In Fairness, should not all Nationalist crimes be blamed on "The Irish"?

Genuine question, not looking for an arguement.

I'd disagree. When people talk about UVF/UFF they usually say loyalists

dlofnep

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maybe you could offer a reason as to why, when an attrocity is carried out by Nationalists, it is the IRA/RIRA/INLA etc etc but when the "Other Side" commit an attrocity it is "The Brits".

Um, only the British armed forces are referred to as the Brits - The UDA and so on are referred to as loyalists. I think you missed the memo on this. It's been quite obvious for a few decades now.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

There is no distinction ever made between the British Army, RUC or UVF.

Yes there is. Your lack of basic knowledge on this is either slightly amusing, or slightly disturbing - given the amount of threads we've had a banter in over the years.

British Army = Brits.

UVF/UDA = Loyalists.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

In Fairness, should not all Nationalist crimes be blamed on "The Irish"?

No, and not all loyalist crimes are blamed on The British people either. You're not making any sense to be honest.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Genuine question, not looking for an arguement.

It was a silly question to be honest.

Fratton Fred

dlofnep wrote: »

It was a silly question to be honest.

Apologies, I thought you might be able to engage in a reasonable discussion without going off on a rant.

If the british Army are referred to as "The Brits" then why aren't the IRA/INLA etc referred to as "The Irish". They claim to be fighting on behalf of all Irish people.

dlofnep

Fratton Fred wrote: »

If the british Army are referred to as "The Brits" then why aren't the IRA/INLA etc referred to as "The Irish". They claim to be fighting on behalf of all Irish people.

The British army are acting on behalf of the British people, as designated by the British Government. So when they say "Brits Out" - It refers to British rule, and British military. Not British people. The IRA is not designated by the Government of Ireland, so on an international stage did/does not represent the people of Ireland. It represented the people who believed in armed resistance, over political resistance. Although, "The Irish" was a term often used in 1970's Irish-skeptic London.

I don't see what's complex about this for you. It's a very simple concept.

If you believe that "Brits Out" refers to the average Joe Soap from England, instead of the logical explanation of a British governmental & armed forces system - then go for it. It doesn't make it anyway less laughable. As a Republican, I think I know what the meaning of "Brits Out" really means. If the BBC can recognise that Brits out refers to British occupation and not British people, then I'm sure you can too.

This thread is already going off topic. I'm sure we can manage to discuss the issue at hand. Irresponsible behaviour that put innocent people at risk.