I CANNOT BLOODY BELIEVE THIS!

IT Loser

Got a letter in todays post, from the Dept of Social Welfare, White Envelope with a white and green letter, which set out the following:-

"I have decided that you are entitled to jobseekers allowance. Your weekly rate is made up as follows:"

Etc.

It continues " Your first payment will be IN YOUR POST OFFICE {their caps} on 08-SEPT-2009" and every TUESDAY after that so long as you continue to meet the conditions.....we will issue any arrears not included in your first payment shortly......


Signed, Deciding Officer....**** *****

All well and good.

BUT


Not one hour from receiving that letter in the post, I get a phone call, from a woman in the department, who in no uncertain terms, insists that I call in to see her at 9:45am tomorrow morning, Tuesday.

I asked her did I need to bring anything. She said no.

I asked her what it was pertaining to, she said she could not tell me over the phone.

I then told her I had just received a letter, and was I in payment or not.

She said I was not.:eek::eek:...and that she could not tell me any more over the phone, as she could not guarantee who I said I was {she rang me, you understand} and could I just call in tomorrow and we would..."work something out"

"Work What Out" says I.......

"Just call in and ask for me" came the reply.




Can anyone tell me WTF is going on here.......????

Nicola xxx

u probably are entitled to what they are saying you would be getting, but maybe there is a discrepancy over some details, and it needs to be cleared up in the office first. my friend used to have that alot, letters telling her money would be in her account or local an post... then get another letter sayin she had to attend local social welfare office lol. just go at 9.45am and make sure she has all the info she needs, take everything just in case as that will be another excuse not to pay you, take ur passport, current p45, proof of address, bills in ur name, and ask if the info in that letter is correct, if its not tell her to send you another one with correct info , as you may need it in the future if things go wrong Hope u get ur money sorted!!!

IT Loser

Nicola xxx wrote: »

u probably are entitled to what they are saying you would be getting, but maybe there is a discrepancy over some details, and it needs to be cleared up in the office first. my friend used to have that alot, letters telling her money would be in her account or local an post... then get another letter sayin she had to attend local social welfare office lol. just go at 9.45am and make sure she has all the info she needs, take everything just in case as that will be another excuse not to pay you, take ur passport, current p45, proof of address, bills in ur name, and ask if the info in that letter is correct, if its not tell her to send you another one with correct info , as you may need it in the future if things go wrong Hope u get ur money sorted!!!

So do I, thanks for your encouragement.

I was applying/approved for JSA, so there is no P45 in effect.

I dont know what the problem is.

She categorically refused to tell me anything over the phone, on grounds that I might not be who they thought I was.

So basically, i have been left hanging another 24 hours, when I should have been down picking up my payment tomorrow.

For what it is worth, the entire matter has a decidedly informal and irregular sound to it.

Kotek Besar

If I were you, I'd go to the PO first thing and collect whatever money's there for me. Then I'd pop along to meet yer one at 09:45.

Just to be on the safe side.

IT Loser

benifa wrote: »

If I were you, I'd go to the PO first thing and collect whatever money's there for me. Then I'd pop along to meet yer one at 09:45.

Just to be on the safe side.

Hello Benifa,

The lady who rang today says that I am not in payment so even if I went down to the PO tomorrow to collect, there might not be anything there for me.

Also, it would be hard to get from where I live to the Dept. in under 45 mins, PO only opens around 9.

But thanks for the encouragement! As I said, it all sounds so very irregular and so very unusual.

Its really disheartening stuff.

What on earth could she want to "sort out"??

Kotek Besar

Sorry IT Loser, I misread your OP.

IT Loser

benifa wrote: »

Sorry IT Loser, I misread your OP.

No probs.

Nicola xxx

i would not worry today about it now, she will tell you tomorrow morning, but i would recommend taking all proof of who you are, even bank statements. i would ask why there was a problem, and why it was left till the day before your first payment to let you know u wouldnt be paid hopefully your payment is not delayed too long, tell her you were entitled to be paid from tuesday and u are finding it hard to live on nothing. you have all the evidence u need of who you are, if its a mistake on their part you are entitled to an explanation as its delayed your payment
i think when you leave JSA they give u a current P 45 for next job

IT Loser

Nicola xxx wrote: »

i would not worry today about it now, she will tell you tomorrow morning, but i would recommend taking all proof of who you are, even bank statements. i would ask why there was a problem, and why it was left till the day before your first payment to let you know u wouldnt be paid hopefully your payment is not delayed too long, tell her you were entitled to be paid from tuesday and u are finding it hard to live on nothing. you have all the evidence u need of who you are, if its a mistake on their part you are entitled to an explanation as its delayed your payment
i think when you leave JSA they give u a current P 45 for next job

Cheers Nicola....

One excuse they may have is that they could have tried to contact me on my mobile, which is broken, {it wont charge}....but they wrote out to me before and today they contacted me without any difficulty on the landline! So I dont think they can have any real excuse about me being hard to find.....:D And besides, I have been ringing them periodically from my landline number throughout the Summer with a view to monitoring the progress of my claim.

I will have my birth cert, Soc. Services card, proof of job seeking, bank statements etc, all in a row for them.

Its odd though, she said that there was no need for me to bring in anything. She kept on telling me to "just call in, and we will work something out". Work what out? What is there to work out?

It could be nothing, it could be that they are trying to prevent fraud, that they are worried about handing out cash, especially a large back payment, without checking it out first.

Odd.

Xiney

It is odd and highly cryptic, this business of "just call in and we will work something out"

As previously stated by other posters, I'd bring in every piece of documentation you can think of:

- proof of identity (birth cert, passport, driver's license)
- proof of address (bills, bank statements)
- proof of [lack of] income (bank statements)
- proof of jobseeking (list of jobs that you've applied for since becoming unemployed)

The jobseeking one is important! I was called in to come see someone in the office to "sign something" and when I got there I was told to make a list of jobs that I'd applied for. Obviously I couldn't remember much past the one that I applied for that morning, so I asked if I could return when I had a list. She said yes of course. I returned with my list, and she looked at it and said, oh, I wanted jobs from the entire period you were unemployed. Since December. So I had to come back another day with a different list! :eek:

IT Loser

Xiney wrote: »

It is odd and highly cryptic, this business of "just call in and we will work something out"

As previously stated by other posters, I'd bring in every piece of documentation you can think of:

- proof of identity (birth cert, passport, driver's license)
- proof of address (bills, bank statements)
- proof of [lack of] income (bank statements)
- proof of jobseeking (list of jobs that you've applied for since becoming unemployed)

The jobseeking one is important! I was called in to come see someone in the office to "sign something" and when I got there I was told to make a list of jobs that I'd applied for. Obviously I couldn't remember much past the one that I applied for that morning, so I asked if I could return when I had a list. She said yes of course. I returned with my list, and she looked at it and said, oh, I wanted jobs from the entire period you were unemployed. Since December. So I had to come back another day with a different list! :eek:

Thanks for getting back to me Xiney. Yes, your word "Cryptic" is pretty similar to my own description of "Irregular". I prefer to use the formal terminology that way they get the message about who they are dealing with. I now have to go up and gather together documentation which I spent all Summer trying to get them to take, and which, it appears, I may need at a moments notice. Well I will have it for them and then some.

One thing which did occur to me was that, as I have been 5 months waiting, they may have already decided that I have reached the point where I am due an interview.

However, the fact that they {a} explicity said that I had not entered payment, contrary to the letter received today and {b} the fact that they said that I did not need to bring materials in with me, would suggest that this is not the case. After all, who demands proof of job-seeking from people who are not in receipt of job seekers allowance/benefit in the first place????

However, even if they did surprise me with a request for names etc, the truth of the matter is that they are obliged to follow due process and the rules of natural justice.

Witholding payment, thanks to their own tardiness, or to fulfill other criteria, would be outside those rules of natural justice.

Thanks anyway for your support. I had just better go and see what is wrong with these people. It might be nothing more than they wish to re-affirm my identity and address before they give me my payment and/or back-payment. Or it could be something more serious. I will keep you all posted. Ta.

Xiney

Also, if you owe people (friends, family) money, bring proof of this as well (ious and the like)... since they may ask you how you were supporting yourself.

daveyboy_1ie

Best of luck I.T, hope you get sorted, my brother was in a similar position and he has a wife and kid to support. Bloody awful stuff and he was made to feel so low because he was asking for what he was entiteld to, working 16 years in the bar trade and as many as 3 sick days in all that time. Best of luck anyways.

IT Loser

Xiney wrote: »

Also, if you owe people (friends, family) money, bring proof of this as well (ious and the like)... since they may ask you how you were supporting yourself.

I Owe my brother money but there is no proof that I owe him......I defaulted on my loan repayment for August and borrowed off him to make good on my obligations for the Month of September. I also defaulted on the €20 direct debit for Setanta {which the family paid, it was on my account} but I defaulted on that too as I had spent the €20.

My bank statements will prove that I have missed payments for the want of money, but I wont be able to show them that as the bank has closed for today and my meeting is due before the banks open tomorrow.

Typical.

I spend half a year trying to show them stuff, and now I cant show them stuff.:(

~me~

they prob just need to sort out a few details! did you have an interview type thing there before? maybe they forgot something in it. i doubt they'd send that acceptance type letter unless you're entitled so this is prob just something missing or the office is wrong or something.

dont worry, and if they do withold payment you can always dispute their decision to someone in a higher position as its your right to do so. if you feel you are definitely entitled then go in and be polite, if they tell you they're taking away your payment then ask for this in writng with the reason why and then say thank you and leave. then you can appeal the decision to someone who knows what they're doing!

good luck!let us know how you get on!

IT Loser

daveyboy_1ie wrote: »

Best of luck I.T, hope you get sorted, my brother was in a similar position and he has a wife and kid to support. Bloody awful stuff and he was made to feel so low because he was asking for what he was entiteld to, working 16 years in the bar trade and as many as 3 sick days in all that time. Best of luck anyways.

Cheers fella!

IT Loser

~me~ wrote: »

they prob just need to sort out a few details! did you have an interview type thing there before? maybe they forgot something in it. i doubt they'd send that acceptance type letter unless you're entitled so this is prob just something missing or the office is wrong or something.

dont worry, and if they do withold payment you can always dispute their decision to someone in a higher position as its your right to do so. if you feel you are definitely entitled then go in and be polite, if they tell you they're taking away your payment then ask for this in writng with the reason why and then say thank you and leave. then you can appeal the decision to someone who knows what they're doing!

good luck!let us know how you get on!

Hi and thanks for your support.

Yes, I was in to them before, once to do my initial application, the next time to do my means test.

The Initial Application was early May 2009

The later means test was July 2009.

I rang them before the means test to see what was going on, and I rang them after the means test to see what was going on.

Then I got the letter today.

Maybe its just all very simple, but I wont be taking any chances.

I will, as ever, keep you all informed.

~me~

did you sign any forms?
i just remembered one of mine wouldnt go through cause it wasnt signed. i think it was child benefit though which isnt the same but it could explain it!

IT Loser

~me~ wrote: »

did you sign any forms?
i just remembered one of mine wouldnt go through cause it wasnt signed. i think it was child benefit though which isnt the same but it could explain it!

I think I signed whatever they gave me to sign, but tell you the truth I cannot remember what that was, other than my initial application, or maybe the means test.

Its all very very confusing and worrying.

~me~

dont let it worry you- if you're entitled you'll get it- it may take longer and it may take lots of writing and calling people but you'll get it if you need it.

IT Loser

~me~ wrote: »

dont let it worry you- if you're entitled you'll get it- it may take longer and it may take lots of writing and calling people but you'll get it if you need it.

AFAIK I am entitled. I mean, on the letter I received today, it said that my means had been assessed as "0", that the sum I was entitled to was €204.30 and that back pay was payable.

Now, why did that letter get issued if I am not entitled? It seems I will have more questions for them than they will for me!

Ta

Xiney

IT Loser wrote: »

I Owe my brother money but there is no proof that I owe him......I defaulted on my loan repayment for August and borrowed off him to make good on my obligations for the Month of September. I also defaulted on the €20 direct debit for Setanta {which the family paid, it was on my account} but I defaulted on that too as I had spent the €20.

My bank statements will prove that I have missed payments for the want of money, but I wont be able to show them that as the bank has closed for today and my meeting is due before the banks open tomorrow.

Typical.

I spend half a year trying to show them stuff, and now I cant show them stuff.:(

Ok well, you can't help things by worrying about it tonight beyond getting all your papers in order.

So get all your docs ready for tomorrow in a folder, stick them by your bed, set your phone to wake up in plenty of time for your meeting tomorrow, and sit yourself down in front of the TV with a mug of tea and some ginger nut biscuits (or whatever inferior replacement your house might have in stock :pac:) and veg out for the night.

Good luck at your meeting tomorrow, I'm sure it'll go fine. And happy days when you get your payment

IT Loser

Xiney wrote: »

Ok well, you can't help things by worrying about it tonight beyond getting all your papers in order.

So get all your docs ready for tomorrow in a folder, stick them by your bed, set your phone to wake up in plenty of time for your meeting tomorrow, and sit yourself down in front of the TV with a mug of tea and some ginger nut biscuits (or whatever inferior replacement your house might have in stock :pac:) and veg out for the night.

Good luck at your meeting tomorrow, I'm sure it'll go fine. And happy days when you get your payment

Thanks Xiney, you are a tower of inspiration. I have a phonebook of stuff to show them. I know it off by heart at this stage! Ta:cool:

Kotek Besar

Well it's 10.30, he must have had his meeting by now. Really intrigued as to what it's all about!

Fingers crossed it's good news.

daveyboy_1ie

benifa wrote: »

Well it's 10.30, he must have had his meeting by now. Really intrigued as to what it's all about!

Fingers crossed it's good news.

I came on specifically to see if there was any updates Yeah hopefully its a false alarm, I mean its common practice to say they cannot discuss anything over the phone.

~me~

well hes either still there fighting his corner or hes gone shopping with his money! hopefully its the latter! :pac:

daveyboy_1ie

or arrested with a load of stationary from the dole office

'I am taking this................and this.........................'

Joking aside hopefully its sorted for him

IT Loser

He he he..you lot are some jokers, laughing at my plight!

Anyways, it is apparently all very little to worry about in the end.

Here is what happened:- staff were drafted in from another district to help with the processing of the claims. One of these staff, the man who signed my letter, did not put the claim through properly and this showed up on the computer.

One of the members of the regular office staff noticed this, and perfectly innocently, sat down to try and complete the process themselves, and try to put my money through to me. All well and good.

However, as those of you who have been following my story from day one will have noticed, my claim for JSA is not what you might call the common, standard everyday claim.

One of the irregularities in my claim was that it was not immediately obvious to anyone reading my file how I had survived from March 2008 to May 2009 without any demonstrable income and without any income support {JSA, JSB, SWA etc etc etc}

The individual who was now putting my claim through is obliged to put his/her name to the claim. In the event that the irregularity turned out to be something serious, it is the person who puts the claim through who must answer to their superiors.

So, erring on the side of caution, the member of staff in question called me in so I could explain, as best I could, and in my own words, what I had been up to for the 15 month period. It was this that had caught their attention, and it was this that they wanted cleared up.

So I explained, unashamedly, that I have been basically living one day at a time, that I had some left over loan, that I borrowed and scraped whenever I could, and that this was what things had come to, and that I had never wanted to go back into the system. I accepted that this was very irregular.

The person in question said they were very happy with my version of events and that I would have my money very shortly, that they were putting the claim through and that what they had done had only been done to protect themselves, in the long run.

It was all very pleasant and very straightforward.......I explained to them that I had been trying all Summer to pass on information and they replied that, at different levels, different members of staff did different things...some of them did very formal tasks, others fleshed the matter out later on down the line.

So that should be that. We also got the collecting Post Office changed to suit the fact that I will be in town at the FAS centers and at the Law Society {they advertise young staff to established firms} most days from now on. {now that I have the cash to travel}

The member of staff took 5 samples of my signature and told me my signing on day would be a Wednesday and it was every 4 weeks after that. So thats another hint it should be all good from here on in.

Ahhhh......then the delay was caused by me walking 6 miles home in the rain by way of exercise on this fine, wet, 20 degree day.

Thanks for your time and effort everyone. :cool:

whats up doc

you should have been able to claim ages ago. you and thousands like you have spent all their savings, borrowed from family and friends trying to keep it together. Leaving you desparate, broke and walking home in the rain.
I hope you get something better very soon, Good Luck

daveyboy_1ie

Fair pay, although not set in stone yet, it seems as if things should work out from now on. Best of luck ok

Kotek Besar

Appreciate the update, IT Loser. Thanks! Glad it's all ok and it proves that, as best they can, they're *trying* to do things properly.

Good to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

Xiney

Delighted you got sorted after all this time

~me~

a weight off your shoulders id say! (and everyone you've been borrowing from!) glad its finally sorted for you!

miec

I hope you get a payment soon and glad to hear it got sorted.

IT Loser

Hi again, thanks for all the help and support. :cool:

Ironic is it not that if the Bray office had just soldiered on alone instead of getting "help" that this probably would not have happened. Somebody who was doing their job actually took time to both investigate the claim, and then fix it once they had decided the claim was legitimate...its how it should be done, but it should never take 4 months and 1 week! I dont mind being checked out, in fact there was someone on Joe Duffy just this very lunchtime talking about the way the system is being ripped off. I am actually relieved that somebody asked me straight questions and I was able to give them straight answers. Its like Confession!

Again, I do have to stress that the interviewing officer today was very polite, very straight and very helpful. We should get to talk to people like that first, but the system is the system, I suppose.

As I say, I wont count any chickens just yet but here is hoping it all pans out smoothly!

Cheers!

tommy21

Well that seems to be good news at least, bit much that you have to wait again, but what can you do! Hope it works out.

IT Loser

tommy21 wrote: »

Well that seems to be good news at least, bit much that you have to wait again, but what can you do! Hope it works out.

Thanks Tommy....the member of staff in the office today said I can expect payment within one week. Its another week of a delay in getting back on track but whats another week when you have already waited 19.

cee_jay

Just think of the backpay and the cheque waiting for you at the end of it all

Sephiroth_dude

Glad it worked out for ya in the end .

IT Loser

cAr0l wrote: »

Just think of the backpay and the cheque waiting for you at the end of it all

Hey, no cheque- got a phone call today to tell me that some of my money had been sorted out, and to call into my local Post Office ASAP.

Lady behind the counter counted out the cash in 50's and handed it to me.

Up and Down and Up and....UP!

The remainder will be afforded to me on my next signing day, with basic collection every other week after that.

Thank Christ.:cool::P

IT Loser

Sephiroth_dude wrote: »

Glad it worked out for ya in the end .

Cheers Seph_Dude. Its been a long haul.:cool:

Poof Lantern

IT Loser wrote: »

Hey, no cheque- got a phone call today to tell me that some of my money had been sorted out, and to call into my local Post Office ASAP.

Lady behind the counter counted out the cash in 50's and handed it to me.

Up and Down and Up and....UP!

The remainder will be afforded to me on my next signing day, with basic collection every other week after that.

Thank Christ.:cool::P

It's not very dignified to celebrate signing-on.:rolleyes:

Xiney

Poof Lantern, please have a read of the state benefits charter before posting here again.

And for the record, if you'd been waiting 5 months for your jobseeker's allowance, you'd be celebrating a bit too, if only out of relief.

Ta,

Xiney

IT Loser

Cheers Xiney. Relief is indeed the word.

Poof Lantern

Xiney wrote: »

Poof Lantern, please have a read of the state benefits charter before posting here again.

And for the record, if you'd been waiting 5 months for your jobseeker's allowance, you'd be celebrating a bit too, if only out of relief.

Ta,

Xiney

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

January

Poof Lantern wrote: »

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

How do you know the OP has not been looking for gainful employment for the last 5 months? I'm sorry but unless you know someones elses circumstances you should really butt out. This OP has had a long battle with his local SWO office to have his JSA instated. Now that he has, he deserves to celebrate a little bit. The OP has already stated that he owes a lot of people money. So no doubt most of the €50's handed to him today have already left him to return to their owners!

~me~

I was gonna point out how wrong and insulting that poster was being but i decided against it because tbh its obvious to everyone but him, pay no attention to him IT Loser, you deserve that payment so you've every right to feel happy that you've finally got it. nobody wants to be put in your position but its happening to so many people right now and i didnt think anyone would be so naive to think that you were bragging about it or happy about the situation, when in reality you're just relieved that your situation has been made that little bit easier, as is your right.

Max Power1

Poof Lantern wrote: »

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

wow.

He was waiting 5 months for what he is rightfully entitled to. More than likely had to beg, borrow and any other means possible to survive during that period. Im sure that if you were in a similar circumstance you would be delighted too. In fact if he hadnt demonstrated the fact that he had looked for gainful employment to the various SW officers he dealt with he would not have been granted the allowance.

ITLoser - ignore this guy, I'd be delighted if I were in a similar situation! I'd say relief doesnt even begin to cover it mate! :pac:

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Poof Lantern wrote: »

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

Please don't post on this thread again or you will be banned.

Xiney

Poof Lantern wrote: »

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

When I asked you to read the forum charter, that was not simply an option.

Banned for one week. When you come back, make sure you've read it.

Xiney

Kotek Besar

Poof Lantern wrote: »

Xiney, I was not attempting to chastise the fellow for being on the dole. I just feel he wasn't showing the humility that should be demonstrated when someone requires such a service. If he had intimated his relief in a more humble manner, and signalled his intent to immediately search for gainful employment, I wouldn't have even voiced my concern.

For some reason I perceived the distinct possibility of the poster in question remaining on the dole for an interminable period of time.

I will apologise if this hypothesis is erroneous.

Best Regards,

Poof Lantern

What a pompous git.