VW Golf GTI or Honda Integra Type R

Paul MCM

Hey

Im just looking for some advice on what my new car should be.

Looking at a 2005 Gti or a 2002 Type R. What do you think? Insurance on the Type R is around €1800 so im hoping the Gti will be cheaper.

Just cant make up my mind. Had my mind set on theType R but not sure if its worth the hassle with every knacker trying to nick it.

Any help would be welcome.

Atomic Pineapple

DC5 Integra Type R, no contest really, dont know why your even comparing it to a Golf GTI in terms of performance or fun driving factor.

Get a good alarm on it, DC5's wouldn't be targeted as much as older Japanese spec DC2's

Berty

I luuurrrvvv the DC5 but there are things to consider when considering each car.

The DC5 comes with a lot of baggage. Boy racer look and picked on by the Traffic Corps.

The Golf GTi is then powerful but is also considered to be a sleeper because of its close styling to the regular Golf.

If you do not care what people think of you then buy the DC5 in BLUE!!

cmf86

Definatly go for the DC5, I loved mine and wish I still had it, if I hadnt of lost my job i would of kept it. Brilliant car and brilliant fun aswell

Gumbo

DC5 gets my vote, try be different and source a milano red one!
GTi is very nice too, lazy power delivery because of the turbo, but once remapped its a different car!

its a tough choice to be made if im honest.

pure driving pleaseure - the DC5 wins hands down
but the golf with the right spec is nice, comfy and a sleeper.

only thing that throws ne away from the teg is the insurance problem, the image problem and the proposed theft problem.

when i had my last teg, there wasnt as much theft of them going on

Fallon2304

DC5 without a doubt, no comparison to the GTi, better car in almost every department. Lot's of aftermarket performance bits available too.

JHMEG

kceire wrote: »

try be different and source a milano red one!

Milano red is non-metallic and oxidises/fades! Might be a moot point tho, as I'm not sure the DC5 ITR was available in that colour.

Cyrus

JHMEG wrote: »

Milano red is non-metallic and oxidises/fades! Might be a moot point tho, as I'm not sure the DC5 ITR was available in that colour.

nothing a proper polish and wax routine wouldnt sort out

Gumbo

JHMEG wrote: »

Milano red is non-metallic and oxidises/fades! Might be a moot point tho, as I'm not sure the DC5 ITR was available in that colour.

it was 100% available in red as i had one for the weekend about 3 years back when i was considering upgrading the DC2. they look superb in that colour, the one i had, had the black recaros in it too.

in regards to the non metallic issue, maybe it would throw a few people, but i had an 02 EP3 in milano red and aslong as its washed and polished regulary, it wont be a problem, i used autogylm super resin polish and it worked a treat.

Paul MCM

Thanks for all the help guys. Looks like ill go for the DC5.

colm_mcm

how about a TT 225, surely this would be better competition for the DC5?

Paul MCM

Its not the performance of the two cars, its the image and the hassle each one comes with.

Im kind of just worried the teg would be more likely nicked then a GTi but I suppose any car can be if its in the wrong place at the wrong time.

colm_mcm

my point is, if you're looking for the refinement/right-on image of the Golf, and the Coupe sportiness of the DC5, then a TT would be a good choice. On a twisty road, even a 180bhp Quattro TT is a quick car. throw the 225 engine in there, and you've got a seriously tasty car. The interior of the TT is way ahead of the Teg, and lets be honest, the styling of the DC5 isn't that great.

fig mclough

i would go for the GTI, there serious car in my view i wouldnt even compare it to a honda. there slick and neat and look well with a sunroof. evo would be im my mind also if i was you, but then again everybody has there own taste.

best of luck

Gumbo

fig mclough wrote: »

i would go for the GTI, there serious car in my view i wouldnt even compare it to a honda. there slick and neat and look well with a sunroof. evo would be im my mind also if i was you, but then again everybody has there own taste.

best of luck

just as you say you cant compare a GTi to a Honda, theres no way in hell you can compare an Evo to a GTi

honda = faster & louder
GTi = quickish & more refined

but to quote colm_mcm, a TT 225bhp with remap = yum yum

JHMEG

colm_mcm wrote: »

The interior of the TT is way ahead of the Teg,

That's when it's all working. But seriously you don't but a car like a DC5 for the interior.

and lets be honest, the styling of the DC5 isn't that great.

I would disagree. It's quite an appealing wedge shape. TT is like a bar of soap.

colm_mcm

DC2 is a nice wedge shape, DC5 is like a tall family hatchback that became a Coupe. completely out of proportion. Don't get me wrong, it has some interesting details, the tail lights and headlights are really nicely done, but overall the car is too tall and narrow.

Now there are those that say looks aren't hugely important, and will point at the bhp per litre that the engine gives, or go weak at the design of the diff, but in my mind a Coupe has to be good looking, and a DC5 just isn't.

fig mclough

much of a muchness, but power isnt everything hell a few jobs with a glanza and it would give anything a run for it money. it style, comfort and extras and for me the golf does it for me. also if he gets the teg hes getting a 7 year old car which is a big turn off for alot of people compare to a 05 golf!

JHMEG

colm_mcm wrote: »

DC2 is a nice wedge shape, DC5 is like a tall family hatchback that became a Coupe. completely out of proportion. Don't get me wrong, it has some interesting details, the tail lights and headlights are really nicely done, but overall the car is too tall and narrow.

Jeez, colm I don't agree. I think it's a more modern take on the wedge shape.

in my mind a Coupe has to be good looking, and a DC5 just isn't.

Mine too, but again I disagree. Anyway, looks are subjective..

And shur why would you.. a few jobs on a glanza and off you go!

bazz26

fig mclough wrote: »

much of a muchness, but power isnt everything hell a few jobs with a glanza and it would give anything a run for it money. it style, comfort and extras and for me the golf does it for me. also if he gets the teg hes getting a 7 year old car which is a big turn off for alot of people compare to a 05 golf!

The reasons you just described there might also be applied to a Golf TDi or any other ordinary car rather than a fast coupe or hot hatch. People who are looking at a DC5 or GTi would tend to put performance higher up their wish list than things like the year on the number plate, etc.

fifth

Friend of mine is looking to buy a DC5 as well, to be honest I can't wait til he does!

Always wanted one..never pulled the trigger though.

Go for the Integra!

cpoh1

This is my daily run around, I think its a pretty good looking car.

http://img40.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=48032_DSCF0744_122_627lo.JPG

Interior is very functional and the seats, seating position and steering wheel are all fantastic (recaro and momo brand). Handling wise the DC5 will knock the socks off any gti or audi TT. I was very close to buying a TT as my daily runaorund, until I had a good drive off a work colleagues 225 model. Its fast in a straight line especially but doesn't really feel like it. It ticked all the boxes for me, good looking, comfortable, gorgeous interior and nippy. Its hard to explain but the car just didn't want me to push it on, a true sign of any fun car is when you want to tar it every time you drive it. The gti golf is in the same catagory. With the DC5 I just want to redline her on every slip road.

Mine is modified though, tein coilovers with edfc, cold air intake, spoon manifold and exhaust, mintex m1144 pads too. It makes a big difference and the car is faster and handles much better than my old dc2.

a TT
One of the buddies had one, I wouldn't even compare it to an integra, totolly different car. Also if the stereotype is that a Teg is a bit knackery the TT must be a poofs car.

--Kaiser--

Golf GTI is nowhere near the same league as a Teg Type R

Biro

Fairly large gap between them alright, almost chalk and cheese in their execution. The DC5 is a raw, kind of stripped out and lightened car, with super firm suspension that will rattle you on a bumpy road, the Golf is a comfortable car with tweaked suspension and a 197bhp engine. Firmer than a standard Golf by a large margin, but soft next to a DC5. So which ever you'd prefer maybe.
DC5 now and GTi when you're older and want a more sedate car maybe!

squod

Biro wrote: »

Fairly large gap between them alright, almost chalk and cheese in their execution. The DC5 is a raw, kind of stripped out and lightened car, with super firm suspension that will rattle you on a bumpy road, the Golf is a comfortable car with tweaked suspension and a 197bhp engine. Firmer than a standard Golf by a large margin, but soft next to a DC5. So which ever you'd prefer maybe.
DC5 now and GTi when you're older and want a more sedate car maybe!

+1

The Honda's great if you're only reading about it. This is Ireland, with Irish roads and all. Wait 'till the rains of winter wash away your local roads,
then tell me how to compare the two cars.

Biro

squod wrote: »

+1

The Honda's great if you're only reading about it. This is Ireland, with Irish roads and all. Wait 'till the rains of winter wash away your local roads,
then tell me how to compare the two cars.

Well, that's not necessarily the point I was trying to make. There's an element of comitment to Type R ownership, if you can put up with the unrefinement the rewards are there in the corners! If you can't then you need to find an alternative. I'd have loved a DC5 a few years ago, I couldn't stretch to the 25k asking price at the time. But now I wouldn't bother any more unless it was a weekend car. But back then when I wanted one, a GTI Golf just wouldn't cut it for me as an option. Now I'm married with a kid, a GTI is the better choice!!
I guess what I'm trying to say is get the DC5.

cpoh1

squod wrote: »

+1

The Honda's great if you're only reading about it. This is Ireland, with Irish roads and all. Wait 'till the rains of winter wash away your local roads,
then tell me how to compare the two cars.

Ive driven these cars on standard suspension and while turn in isint as sharp as my own is it still handles superbly and is very easy to live with. There's a lot more in the difference between the gti and dc5 than the gti having softer spring rates. Compared to older typeR models the civic and dc5 integra are much more civilised under normal driving conditions and unless you are driving roads with a grass strip down the middle everyday they are fine on irish roads.

We are still talking about a modern enough car with airbags, abs, brembo brakes, climate control etc. etc.

for my own personal tastes id rather choose a car based on fun and practicality all in one or else just buy a cheap runaround that will get me from A to B like my last car a suzuki baleno. The DC5 does this because its got a massive boot and fits 4 people comfortably while being a hoot to drive and cheap enough to run. The GTI doesnt have the best of both worlds for me, sure its practical but there's a lot more fun to be had for the same money and matching practicality.

WillieCocker

Integra R FTW!!!
Anyways the Golf GTI is the new Teg R, in terms of the amount of cocks driving them, tailgaiting etc.:pac:

Paul MCM

Wow thanks for all the replys. I guess its whatever floats your boat at then end of the day.

david....

id have the.
integra dc5 TR anyday before the gti

you will get a way more looks in the integra too.

kennethk

if ya couldn't pick, you could get one of these::D:D

Paul MCM

kennethk wrote: »

if ya couldn't pick, you could get one of these::D:D



Nice mate

Hanley

I REALLY want the teg.... I said if I passed my exams I'd consider buying myself one as a present but I doubt I'd get a decent one for 10k, which is about the most I'd stretch too.

And I'm only 23 with 1.5 years NCB on my own car and 1.5 years as named so I'd probably get murdered.

How's the Civic Type R compare??

I thoguht I wanted a GTI, but there's lots of time for that when I'm older - I just want a fast jap car now!!!

Tenzor07

I've driven an 02 GTi that with a piggyback ecu mod, the low down torque and power was great. smooth power right from the moment you put your foot down.. But it just felt sedate...boring almost..The Type-R is a bit of an animal, it just wants to be driven hard and blasted into the corners..

If your worried about the Integra image, maybe you would consider a Euro-R Accord, same engine and similar BHP/torque figues...

Sqaull20

Hanley wrote: »

I REALLY want the teg.... I said if I passed my exams I'd consider buying myself one as a present but I doubt I'd get a decent one for 10k, which is about the most I'd stretch too.

And I'm only 23 with 1.5 years NCB on my own car and 1.5 years as named so I'd probably get murdered.

How's the Civic Type R compare??

I thoguht I wanted a GTI, but there's lots of time for that when I'm older - I just want a fast jap car now!!!

If you want a fast jap, go with this MPS.

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=200926194444273

An extra 3 grand goes a long way with that.You get a modern turbo charged sleeper, still under warranty, modest looks so no hassle from anybody and the thing goes like all hell once on the boost.

It will leave a DC5 for dead once past 120kmh.The thing can beat a 65k Evo X FQ300 up to 200kmh and once past that, goodbye EVO:pac:

0-200kmh MPS = 22.7secs
0-200kmh 190bhp DC5 31.3secs

http://www.zeperfs.com/en/match1388-176-1680.htm

Thats leagues apart:p

You can remap the MPS to 320bhp easily because its turbo charged for 350e, at that power level you might find your self just below M3, RS4 territory.

Here is the standard MPS with 257bhp ( though mazda are being modest, because many mags like autocar have it doing over 270bhp at the wheels ) against the RS4.You have to imagine that with a 20- 25% boost in bhp and torque from the remap, it should give an RS4 a real go, you'd have to spend serious money to get a DC5 anywhere near that, if its even possibile at all without throwing a twin turbo in there or something:D

1/4 mile MPS 13.7secs
1/4 mile RS4 13.4secs

http://www.zeperfs.com/en/match1388-1549.htm

RS4 does pull away pretty quickly once past 160kmh ( where quick ends and fast begins, but that stock mps in fairness ) look closely at in gear times, 3rd, 4th, 5th etc very close, thats real world.You will never be caught off the boil with an MPS, just bury your foot and once your above 2000rpm it will pull like a train.

Insurance is better than a Type R, im a year younger than you, with same experience and 123.ie wont quote me on a Type but MPS is 1500e

JHMEG

Sqaull20 wrote: »

If you want a fast jap, go with this MPS.

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=200926194444273

An extra 3 grand goes a long way with that.You get a modern turbo charged sleeper, still under warranty, modest looks so no hassle from anybody and the thing goes like all hell once on the boost.

It will leave a DC5 for dead once past 120kmh.The thing can beat a 65k Evo X FQ300 up to 200kmh and once past that, goodbye EVO:pac:

0-200kmh MPS = 22.7secs
0-200kmh 190bhp DC5 31.3secs

http://www.zeperfs.com/en/match1388-176-1680.htm

Thats leagues apart:p

You can remap the MPS to 320bhp easily because its turbo charged for 350e, at that power level you might find your self just below M3, RS4 territory.

Here is the standard MPS with 257bhp ( though mazda are being modest, because many mags like autocar have it doing over 270bhp at the wheels ) against the RS4.You have to imagine that with a 20- 25% boost in bhp and torque from the remap, it should give an RS4 a real go, you'd have to spend serious money to get a DC5 anywhere near that, if its even possibile at all without throwing a twin turbo in there or something:D

1/4 mile MPS 13.7secs
1/4 mile RS4 13.4secs

http://www.zeperfs.com/en/match1388-1549.htm

RS4 does pull away pretty quickly once past 160kmh ( where quick ends and fast begins, but that stock mps in fairness ) look closely at in gear times, 3rd, 4th, 5th etc very close, thats real world.You will never be caught off the boil with an MPS, just bury your foot and once your above 2000rpm it will pull like a train.

Insurance is better than a Type R, im a year younger than you, with same experience and 123.ie wont quote me on a Type but MPS is 1500e

I guess you don't realise all the figures you quoted are for the old DC2 ITR!

Sqaull20

Doesnt matter, new one with 210bhp or whatever it is, will get mullered as well:pac:

JHMEG

Here is the only vid on Youtube comparing a DC5 and MPS when drag racing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJPRrQGCjkg

The MPS doesn't get away from the DC5, despite the slight power difference.

I was hoping to find a Best Motoring vid from Tochigi or Suzuka where I would say the DC5 would get the better of the MPS on the first bend and leave it further behind at every subsequent bend (lighter, enabling later braking, MPS weighs 1400Kg, DC5 weighs 1180Kg).

Sqaull20

Once past the quick zone eg 160kmh the MPS will leave the DC5, that is clear when its electronically nannied to 155mph.Check the records, no Type R varient has beaten an MPS around any track.

JHMEG

Sqaull20 wrote: »

Check the records,

Can you find any records?

Tenzor07

This thread is going waaaayyy off topic

The op asked about a Golf or an Integra...:rolleyes:

Not a gas guzzling Mazda shopping trolley looking car with a big 2.3 litre lump in it :P

Sqaull20

JHMEG wrote: »

Can you find any records?

Of course

http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=45c81efb18f1d&car2=458b104d31b6e

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car45c81efb18f1d.html

Alot more out there as well if you look.

Mazda 3 MPS is noticeably faster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xuyaojwoa7M

Sorry for going off topic.

Atomic Pineapple

DC5 Track Times
Tsukuba 1:09.34

Mazda 3 MPS Track Times
Tsukuba 1:10.27
Nordschleife 8:39

DC2
Nordschleife 8:43


DC5 is nearly a second quicker around the Tsukuba track and the MPS is only 4 seconds Quicker around the Nordschleife (Nurburgring) than a DC2 so I'd imagine a DC5 would take it there too.

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car45c81efb18f1d.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car473fc875611f8.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car45cef20ccccde.html

320bhp through the front wheels of an MPS would be great for dragging it alright but on track I'd take a DC5 with some mods against a 320bhp MPS, more reliable too I'd imagine without the turbo.

EDIT:

Sqaull20 wrote: »

Of course

http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=45c81efb18f1d&car2=458b104d31b6e

Thats against a Uk Spec Ep3 Civic Type R not a DC5 Integra Type R

kennethk

Hanley wrote: »

How's the Civic Type R compare??

well they are 197 bhp standard

Sqaull20

draffodx wrote: »

DC5 Track Times
Tsukuba 1:09.34

Mazda 3 MPS Track Times
Tsukuba 1:10.27
Nordschleife 8:39

DC2
Nordschleife 8:43


DC5 is nearly a second quicker around the Tsukuba track and the MPS is only 4 seconds Quicker around the Nordschleife (Nurburgring) than a DC2 so I'd imagine a DC5 would take it there too.

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car45c81efb18f1d.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car473fc875611f8.html

http://www.fastestlaps.com/car45cef20ccccde.html

320bhp through the front wheels of an MPS would be great for dragging it alright but on track I'd take a DC5 with some mods against a 320bhp MPS, more reliable too I'd imagine without the turbo.

EDIT:



Thats against a Uk Spec Ep3 Civic Type R not a DC5 Integra Type R

I will give you that one with the EP3, my bad, still the MPS still comes out on top:pac:

It will cost you something else to get a standard DC5 up to 320bhp MPS level in a straight line:p On any kind of straight line ( where most people drive on ) the MPS will be leaving a DC5 for dead, a remapped one will embarrass it:(

You dont have to worry about being in the right gear either:o

Just floor it and bye bye.

This guy gets his to 290kmh and hasnt much done to it, besides remap etc

No Type R can touch that, sorry to say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFcTLYeA_hk

B00MSTICK

I'm not too fond of the newer Civics/Tegs myself.

Would go DC2 or an EG but certainly not a GTI in anycase.

JHMEG

Sqaull20 wrote: »

I will give you that one with the EP3, my bad, still the MPS still comes out on top:pac:

You need to prove it, and so far you haven't. Even on a drag race the MPS wasn't able to pull away.

All the evidence is there (eg draffodx's post) to suggest that on the track a standard DC5 will come out on top.

Sqaull20

JHMEG wrote: »

You need to prove it, and so far you haven't.

All the evidence is there (eg draffodx's post) to suggest that on the track a standard DC5 will come out on top

But it hasn't.

One track is all he gave!

1sec it beat it by.

Straight line = MPS mullers it.

Track = basically the same, except for the straights where the mps will get ahead and stay ahead as its going to be pretty hard to keep a car that can go nearly 300kmh off your back.

Gumbo

Sqaull20 wrote: »

You can remap the MPS to 320bhp easily because its turbo charged for 350e, at that power level you might find your self just below M3, RS4 territory.

just incase anybody looks back at this thread for info on the MPS, you cant remap the MPS for 350 euro or nowhere near it im afraid.

there is only one company in the UK and Ireland that can tune these cars and to get it to 320 bhp it needs, increased induction, new exhaust, might need a front mount intercooler not sure on that one and a new inlet for the turbo then a remap/ECU change that has to be done by the crowd in England.

im sure stealthyspeeder will fill in the blanks on who does it, but it deffo 100% cannot be remaped by anybody in Ireland at the moment.

Edit -

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

I just put a specialised induction kit, turbo inlet hose and downpipe on mine, and got it remapped so its putting out 320 bhp at the mo!

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

The Mazda ECU is a byatch! only one place in UK that does it (nowhere in Ireland), its a place called turbopacs in Durham, their sister company response chips, did the remap for me (with a few other mods turbo inlet, downpipe and induction kit). Wild expensive cause they are so well locked down, but im loving it!

Atomic Pineapple

Big power isn't what the ITR is about, its a nimble, light, relatively powerful, great handling FWD car.

If you want big power then the MPS wins there