Olympic good news

thebaz

It will be good to see a form of rugby in the Olympics, even if its only 7s , think it will be good for the overall development of game

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/olympic_games/8196956.stm

Stev_o

Too bad the IRFU is too tight to support it.

thebaz

Stev_o wrote: »

Too bad the IRFU is too tight to support it.

I would expect the top teams (including Ireland) to put out their best teams - I'm sure O'Driscoll and others would like a gold

Euro_Kraut

Does this mean there will be a Great Britain Rugby team? No England, Scotland or Wales I would imagine. What is the story with the lads from the North? Presume they could play for either.

Riskymove

Stev_o wrote: »

Too bad the IRFU is too tight to support it.

i thought thet relaunched last year.....they were in the world cup this year and I think they are taking part in leagues this season

Stev_o

thebaz wrote: »

I would expect the top teams (including Ireland) to put out their best teams - I'm sure O'Driscoll and others would like a gold

Id doubt it they wouldn't be able to fit it in with the general season and anyway they'd be smoked by proper 7's teams.

SpAcEd OuT

thebaz wrote: »

I would expect the top teams (including Ireland) to put out their best teams - I'm sure O'Driscoll and others would like a gold

Fitzgerald
Earls
Bowe
O'Driscoll
McFaddden
D'arcy
Felix Jones (pace)

Might be a good 7s side!

Riskymove

This was the WC squad:

Ireland Rugby World Cup Sevens Squad

Gary Brown Blackrock College - Leinster
Kieran Campbell Galwegians - Connacht Captain
Brian Carney Clonakilty – Munster
James Coughlan Dolphin – Munster
Conan Doyle Garryowen - Munster
Tom Gleeson Cork Constitution – Munster
Eoghan Grace Shannon – Munster
Felix Jones Old Belvedere – Leinster
Paul Marshall Ballynahinch – Ulster
Daniel Riordan Buccaneers - Connacht
Kyle Tonetti Blackrock College – Leinster
Brian Tuohy Cornish Pirates


so jones has some experience of it alright! Carney is gone

Riskymove

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Does this mean there will be a Great Britain Rugby team? No England, Scotland or Wales I would imagine. What is the story with the lads from the North? Presume they could play for either.

it might be like soccer with them not being able to take part?

Stev_o

Riskymove wrote: »

This was the WC squad:

Ireland Rugby World Cup Sevens Squad

Gary Brown Blackrock College - Leinster
Kieran Campbell Galwegians - Connacht Captain
Brian Carney Clonakilty – Munster
James Coughlan Dolphin – Munster
Conan Doyle Garryowen - Munster
Tom Gleeson Cork Constitution – Munster
Eoghan Grace Shannon – Munster
Felix Jones Old Belvedere – Leinster
Paul Marshall Ballynahinch – Ulster
Daniel Riordan Buccaneers - Connacht
Kyle Tonetti Blackrock College – Leinster
Brian Tuohy Cornish Pirates


so jones has some experience of it alright! Carney is gone

And they lost to the might of Zimbabwe!

ALH-06

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Does this mean there will be a Great Britain Rugby team? No England, Scotland or Wales I would imagine. What is the story with the lads from the North? Presume they could play for either.

Presume so - isn't that the case with all other Olympic sports?

Stev_o wrote: »

Id doubt it they wouldn't be able to fit it in with the general season and anyway they'd be smoked by proper 7's teams.

That's the major problem - qualifying leagues / Olympic preparation would conflict with the current XV game setup. The season is already too congested... Which would ultimately mean that the IRFU would have to establish an entirely separate system in order to achieve a feasible standard in 7s - would have to contract players especially for a 7s squad etc. The cost would be huge, it'd be like funding an extra province! It also would mean that the squads of the four provinces be weakened and the Irish XV game's playing pool (already shallow) diminished further.

It's decision time for the IRFU. If we continue to throw together 7s teams for the odd tournament, we just won't be able to compete with the top teams, or even the likes of Kenya, Portugal etc... Personally, I don't think we have the resources. I think the IRFU does a great job of carefully managing the limited resources we have in order to achieve the maximum success. A world-class 7s team is a step too far.

Stev_o

ALH-06 wrote: »

It's decision time for the IRFU. If we continue to throw together 7s teams for the odd tournament, we just won't be able to compete with the top teams, or even the likes of Kenya, Portugal etc... Personally, I don't think we have the resources. I think the IRFU does a great job of carefully managing the limited resources we have in order to achieve the maximum success. A world-class 7s team is a step too far.

Their own view

SEVENS RUGBY IN THE OLYMPICS : THE POSSIBILITY of rugby becoming an Olympic sport will be known tomorrow when the International Olympic Committee’s (IOC) executive makes a recommendation in Berlin on the eve of the World Athletics Championships.

Seven sports are vying for a maximum of two recommendations with rugby sevens in a strong, some say pole, position to capture one of those places and return to the Olympic fold for the first time since the Paris Games in 1924.

For the IRFU the challenge of fielding a sevens team that is good enough to compete in an Olympic Games while at the same time maintaining a world-class XV will be formidable and may be fraught. The IRFU are fully behind rugby’s bid but if the IRB are successful in their frantic behind-the-scenes lobbying there will be some hard thinking to be done in Ireland over the next few years leading up to the 2016 event.

“We’re fully supportive of the application and the benefits that would accrue to the game in a total sense,” says IRFU director of rugby, Eddie Wigglesworth. “If rugby was accepted we’d seek to give it a high profile. But there is no doubt that a lot would depend on the selection process for the team. Young players and older players would love the chance to become Olympians but it would also be in total conflict with the Magners League and Heineken Cup, not to mention international rugby.

“Would we play the IRB Sevens series to ensure we qualified if that was part of the selection process? Would we start it two years out, four years out? There is also a very different physiological aspect to sevens.”

Ireland have only dipped their toes into the sevens game. While Irish teams have played in Dubai and Hong Kong, the IRFU believe that they would initially have to start with a squad of 20 players, who would concentrate on the sevens game. That would be in addition to the 32 players contracted to Ulster, Leinster and Ulster and the 28 in Connacht. The financial outlay would be enormous.

“We found in Dubai in March that if you are not playing sevens regularly in the IRB Series you get hosed by teams like Kenya, Canada or the USA,” said Wigglesworth. “You can’t just walk on to a pitch in a totally new game and expect to win. It’s physical but not as physical at the 15-man game and the type of fitness needed is different too. We’ve seen that in Dubai.

“But really a lot of it depends on the selection or qualifying process. If it was open and they (IOC) said there was no selection, it’s the best 12 teams then we’d have an issue about what players to put in. A closed selection is a very expensive process and we are not awash with money. People think we are but we are not as most of it went into the stadium. They (IOC and IRB) may say a player can only be available if he has played in six out of the eight IRB Series or that a country must compete in the IRB Series. These are very important issues to know.

“Kenya, for example, are doing very well. They are competitive and compete in the IRB Series. How would Uganda get in? They don’t have the money and the IRB wouldn’t have the money. Would it be like soccer where it’s under-23 and would that age profile fit the game of rugby? Would there be an Olympic qualifying tournament?”

The devil is in the detail and while Wigglesworth is far from panicking, the challenge to dovetail the extremely reputable and successful brand of 15-man rugby with the sevens game is the problem that jumps out.

The IOC is notoriously detailed about selection processes and adhering to their protocol. They also like to see a global spread in the game, which rugby does have especially in sevens and they want to see gender balance, which in rugby is much less developed on the women’s side. If successful in gaining entry, that in time could become an issue.

“Take a young guy on a sevens contract, which tends to be lower value,” explains Wigglesworth. “Then halfway through he’s offered a Munster or Leinster contract in the 15-man game. Then where do we put him, in the Olympics or as a potential 15s player with Munster or Leinster. Also if the top players in 15s say we want to be an Olympian, you know, that could be a problem.”

The idea of the Olympic Games, however, is no problem, says Wigglesworth, simply a challenge. And an attractive challenge at that.

Euro_Kraut

ALH-06 wrote: »

Presume so - isn't that the case with all other Olympic sports?

Not in Soccer. GB does not feild a team as the sport is organised by 3 seperate bodies. IRE cannot feild a team and the sport is organised by 2 bodies here.

Provided that the Welsh and Scots were willing to play under the Union Jack it should be okay. The Irish team would have to play under the tricolour which is currently not the case. In the unlikely senario that we were to win Gold at the 2016 games we wouldn't be playing Irelands Call as the tricolour was hoisted. Some up north might have a problem with that.

Riskymove

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Not in Soccer. GB does not feild a team as the sport is organised by 3 seperate bodies. IRE cannot feild a team and the sport is organised by 2 bodies here.

Provided that the Welsh and Scots were willing to play under the Union Jack it should be okay. The Irish team would have to play under the tricolour which is currently not the case. In the unlikely senario that we were to win Gold at the 2016 games we wouldn't be playing Irelands Call as the tricolour was hoisted. Some up north might have a problem with that.

if there was a UK team then there'd be a choice for such people

however, such things did not stop wayne mccullough and others

spank_inferno

Shame it didnt make it to the 2012 games.
But at least we'll have Katie Taylor battering some small chinese girl for the gold instead!

OldJay

Stev_o wrote: »

Their own view

Eddie W actually said he supported the idea (which is still in survey stage amongst all unions and IRB). Then in that interview with Johnny Watterson pointed out some issues which could arise with selection criteria ie. teams possibly having to comprise of IRB Sevens players.
For example, when do you pluck a promising player from the rep sides and underage sides in the full season to commit to the Sevens series?
Actually not that simple an issue.

Stev_o

Justind wrote: »

Eddie W actually said he supported the idea (which is still in survey stage amongst all unions and IRB). Then in that interview with Johnny Watterson pointed out some issues which could arise with selection criteria ie. teams possibly having to comprise of IRB Sevens players.
For example, when do you pluck a promising player from the rep sides and underage sides in the full season to commit to the Sevens series?
Actually not that simple an issue.

But that's the in Ireland there is no 7's cultural or any backing. You have one off tournaments like Kinsale and others, even in the case of youth players iv played in the North Kildare 7's tournament during the Easter Break but again it's all locally organised and not backed by the IRFU. Hell Barnhall sent over a youth representative team to Scotland to compete in a tournament that was run in associations with Melrose Sevens 125th anniversary and i never saw it get one mention from any Leinster news site or IRFU site.

You have two choices developing sevens Ireland

1) Get the IRFU to run Sevens tournaments during the Summer concentrate on youth players and J2 players. Get your scouts down there and have a look whats on offer, i bet that you ll find players there that have what it takes to play 7's at a high standard yet are not invovled in any IRFU development programs ie Regional, Provisional

2) You look at the academy's identify those are suitable to sevens and use it as a development tool like Wales and Scotland.

Amabokke

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Fitzgerald
Earls
Bowe
O'Driscoll
McFaddden
D'arcy
Felix Jones (pace)

Might be a good 7s side!

Not enough pace.

OldJay

Stev_o wrote: »

But that's the in Ireland there is no 7's cultural or any backing. You have one off tournaments like Kinsale and others, even in the case of youth players iv played in the North Kildare 7's tournament during the Easter Break but again it's all locally organised and not backed by the IRFU

There has been a qualification season two years ago with a national sevens side and then the Sevens World Cup this year. Thats a start surely? No-one knows the selection criteria for Olympics yet so no plans can be formalised for that comp (the subject of this thread) until then.

Stev_o wrote: »

Hell Barnhall sent over a youth representative team to Scotland to compete in a tournament that was run in associations with Melrose Sevens 125th anniversary and i never saw it get one mention from any Leinster news site or IRFU site

If a club PRO sends in content for the IRFU website with photo(s), it will get posted. I would venture that the branches would be the same (I don't work for a branch so cannot answer for them).

OldJay

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Fitzgerald
Earls
Bowe
O'Driscoll
McFaddden
D'arcy
Felix Jones (pace)

Might be a good 7s side!

You're missing two forwards for the tackle area there. Every Sevens side needs them. Since we're just hypothesising here, I'd include players like Stephen Ferris and Niall Ronan to that team.

Chucky the tree

D'arcy and BOD would be poor 7's players I think. D'arcy is far too slow and doesn't have quick enough hands.

SpAcEd OuT

Justind wrote: »

You're missing two forwards for the tackle area there. Every Sevens side needs them. Since we're just hypothesising here, I'd include players like Stephen Ferris and Niall Ronan to that team.

I was thinking O'Driscoll could act as an extra forward.

SpAcEd OuT

Chucky the tree wrote: »

D'arcy and BOD would be poor 7's players I think. D'arcy is far too slow and doesn't have quick enough hands.

D'arcy for his step I think he'd tear up a 7s field!

SpAcEd OuT

Amabokke wrote: »

Not enough pace.

Welcome to Ireland.

ALH-06

Chucky the tree wrote: »

D'arcy and BOD would be poor 7's players I think. D'arcy is far too slow and doesn't have quick enough hands.

Doesn't have quick enough hands? Darcy???

[Jackass]

Yeah the world cup squad was pretty shocking!

I reckon our best 7's team would be: (chose 8 for the craic!!)

Fitzgerald
Earls
Kearney
Bowe
Sexton
Jones
Carr
McFadden

Stev_o

[Jackass] wrote: »

Yeah the world cup squad was pretty shocking!

I reckon our best 7's team would be: (chose 8 for the craic!!)

Fitzgerald
Earls
Kearney
Bowe
Sexton
Jones
Carr
McFadden

They'd still get hammered.

Chucky the tree

Jesus, I love the leinster love fest for Sexton is in full swing but him in a 7's match would be a disaster! Tomas O'Leary, David Wallace and Neil Ronan would have decent potential and I'd also give Johne Murphy a try.

Amabokke

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Welcome to Ireland.

Welcome to sevens

andrewdcs

7s isn't like the good old Richard Wallace and co. days, you need full time / 7s only players. As posted above you can't mix and match 15 man game players in, no matter how mobile. We get creamed by Ethiopia and Zimbabwe cos they are just better drilled and faster/lighter than anyone we'd put at fullback.

For a team tomorrow out of our elite I'd maybe, MAYBE stick Fitzgerald and Earls in.
Sexton, Darcy, O'Driscoll.... Jesus, goodnight. O'Driscoll as a forward though a good idea.

for 2016 getting schools AIL / Universities use it as a proving ground for pace/hands, set up more 7s tournaments / leagues. We'd find 15s players out of 7s, not the other way around.
SA play a lot of touch/tag rugby, thats what you want your schools playing to build a sevens team.

OldJay

andrewdcs wrote: »

SA play a lot of touch/tag rugby, thats what you want your schools playing to build a sevens team.

You couldn't be further from the truth with that assertion.

andrewdcs

Justind wrote: »

You couldn't be further from the truth with that assertion.

which one, that SA don't play much touch rugby or that the same skills are not relevant to modern 7s game?

OldJay

andrewdcs wrote: »

which one, that SA don't play much touch rugby or that the same skills are not relevant to modern 7s game?

The latter.
If you can't ruck and snaffle quick ball in Sevens, you will be murdered on-field.

Amabokke

SA coached were only given the greenlight before last year for a permanent sevens rugby base in Cape Town. Now professional fulltime players practice here inbetween tournaments. This has helped them alot last year. NZ and England are to follow with the same setup. To ask 15-man players to play 7s tomorrow, they will be creamed.

Also, not sure how much tag rugby they play in SA but until recently was not a big thing at all.

andrewdcs

Justind wrote: »

The latter.
If you can't ruck and snaffle quick ball in Sevens, you will be murdered on-field.

True, on the forwards front, you need quick back rowers. No touch/tag equivalent, but all the 'at pace' skills are there for juniors, i.e. creating overlaps, defensive lines, ball handling etc.
Likes of Kenya Portugal have semi-decent 7s teams (from games I've seen this season certainly) and don't have any 15s culture to speak of, very light weight teams. they just play a very fast paced expansive game. (and are extremely fit)

SA Lads in work here (I'm in London) all reckon touch has been a staple of social rugby for a few years, esp popular with the ladies, which brings in the guys....which brings in the ladies.

Gelio

Chucky the tree wrote: »

D'arcy and BOD would be poor 7's players I think. D'arcy is far too slow and doesn't have quick enough hands.

Lol