S.I. No. 308 of 2009 -- Number 4 Temporary Membership

Sikamick

Note S.I. No. 308 of 2009

(4) A club shall not run any day or temporary membership schemes.

How will the sport survive or develop if a club cant have visitors / temporary members.

Its like attending a night club and been told your not a regular so you cant come in, how can you become a regular if you are not let in in the first place.

Am I reading this wrong.

Opinions on this S.I. Section (4) please.

Sikamick

pajero2005

Sikamick wrote: »

Note S.I. No. 308 of 2009

(4) A club shall not run any day or temporary membership schemes.

How will the sport survive or develop if a club cant have visitors / temporary members.

Its like attending a night club and been told your not a regular so you cant come in, how can you become a regular if you are not let in in the first place.

Am I reading this wrong.

Opinions on this S.I. Section (4) please.

Sikamick

That was my understanding of it too Sikamick. It seems like a stupid rule made by someone who is totally out of touch with the real world. It could ( and most likley will) drive some clubs under.

Alas the strangle hold on the shooting people of Ireland grows tighter:mad:

Sparks

It's a pain alright, but it doesn't ban guests. It just (in effect) bans walk-in members for commercially run ranges. (ie. no walking in off the street, renting a shotgun or whatever, and blazing away at a few clays, then walking away again afterwards).

You'd have to talk with CAI or whomever does your insurance to make sure guests are covered, of course.

So Hilltop and Courtlough are in trouble?

Sparks

I don't know if either of those two clubs do that Zara.
Besides, all you have to do is have a very low entry cost for membership and the commercial model is back open again. Charge a euro to join the club and then X euros per use of the range, take all the details required, and that's that.

The original motivation for the ban - as I understand it - was the concern that someone could walk in, join for a week, apply for their cert off that week's membership, get their firearm, and then vanish into the aether.

PJ Hunter

no to tempory memberships what it says, it's an annual fee, euro or not:(

(a) that each member be of good character,
(b) that each member pay an annual membership fee,
(c) that—
(i) members, and
(ii) persons who are not members but who attend events organised
by the club,
shall conduct themselves in accordance with the constitution,
(d) that persons referred to in subparagraph (c) who attend events
organised by the club at a shooting range shall abide by the rules, if
any, of that shooting range,
(e) that when a member is notified of the revocation of his or her firearm
certificate he or she shall immediately notify in writing the nominated
representative of that fact,
(f) that a person who applies for the first time for membership of the club
shall make that application in writing to the nominated representative
and shall give the names of a proposer and seconder, both of whom
shall be members of the club.
(4) A club shall not run any day or temporary membership schemes.
5. (1) The club shall appoint a nominated representative who shall be a
member of the club and who shall perform the functions specified in these
regulations.
(2) It shall be the duty of the nominated representative to ensure that the
club—
(a) complies with these Regulations,
(b) complies with any conditions attached to an authorisation granted in
respect of the club,
(c) does not permit its members, while on club premises or attending an
event organised by the club, to use a firearm for any purpose other
than that of promoting skill in the use of rifles and pistols for target
shooting.
(3) The nominated representative shall liaise with the Garda Sı´ocha´na in
relation to the compliance by the club with these Regulations and with any
conditions attached to an authorisation granted in respect of the club, and shall
meet with a member of the Garda Sı´ocha´na of the rank of superintendent or
his or her representative, whenever requested by the Garda Sı´ocha´na to do so.
4 [308]

PJ Hunter

where does the tourist stand wanting a day clay shooting. can they try it out:(

Sparks

Yeah PJ, but that doesn't rule out what I suggested.
Charge €1 extra on the first appearance in each calendar year - that's your annual membership fee.
Take their names and addresses and whatever the minimal information set required is.
Then charge for range access on a per-visit basis.

I mean, that's pretty much how Courtlough runs now, isn't it? (Apart from fee levels of course).

It's certainly how DURC and UCDRC run, well, more or less (though they don't recommend people for firearms certs based on membership).

rrpc

This legislation doesn't apply to clay target clubs.

Bananaman

Both Hilltop and Courtlough (there are plenty more but these were the ones mentioned above) offer

• Clay Pigeon Shooting,
• 50m Benchrest .22 Rifle shooting and
• Archery

as their 'Commercial' offering.

I cannot see the issue with people shooting a bit of benchrest.

B'Man

Sparks

rrpc wrote: »

This legislation doesn't apply to clay target clubs.

And Courtlough and Hilltop aren't just Clay clubs. If you're shooting rifles on-site, as they do, this applies.

rrpc

I made a simple statement of fact. Nothing more.

It's sometimes easier here to let the facts stand, the rumours seem to look after themselves. :rolleyes:

DMZ

Sparks wrote: »

It's a pain alright, but it doesn't ban guests. It just (in effect) bans walk-in members for commercially run ranges. (ie. no walking in off the street, renting a shotgun or whatever, and blazing away at a few clays, then walking away again afterwards).

You'd have to talk with CAI or whomever does your insurance to make sure guests are covered, of course.

The firearms legislation and range rules have no effect on the operation of a clay shooting range. Clay shooting ranges do not have to comply with any of the new legislation and in effect can do what they want as they always have, so our sport (rifle & Pistol) cannot have day members but clay clubs can, clay clubs have no requirement to keep registers, pay 1000 for the club and range are exempt from planning permission. Why do I do rifle & pistol!

rrpc

DMZ wrote: »

clay clubs have no requirement to keep registers, pay 1000 for the club and range are exempt from planning permission. Why do I do rifle & pistol!

They do need planning permission in some cases, especially if there are any permanent developments. Ashbourne had to apply for planning AFAIK.