Only score women in relationships

LegacyUser

So I know this is going to sound extremely shallow, and please note that I'm well aware of how sick I sound and for that I apologies in advance.

So it started when I was a kid, I realised I was pretty good at chatting up women. I learned to love the game and always loved a chase, but it became more and more easy for me. I like a bit of a challenge, so women who were hard to get were always attractive to me. However its been getting easier and easier as time goes by. Single girls are only too keen to meet a guy and hook up or date, all in the hopes of getting into a relationship. You probably read it on here all the time.

Which leads me to my current situation. Ive now become fond of chasing women who are already in relationships. I think its the fact that the don't want me that make me so keen. Now obliviously I get turned down by a few of them, but a lot of them end up getting persuaded and I end up going home with them.

I feel so guilty about what I'm doing, but I cant stop. Like for example on Saturday I went to a club in Dublin and took this girl back to my place who has been in a relationship for like 4 years, she told me she has never cheated before which makes it so much more of a turn on for me. Ive even managed to pick up the brides in hen parties.

I cant live with myself, I feel so perverted doing what I'm doing, but I can't help it. When I get a few drinks into me, all I do is hunt non single women. How can I stop this. How can I make up for my sins.

I wake up everyday thinking that karma is going to bite me in the ass one of these days.

LegacyUser

Wow, i am not sure if you are being brutally honest, but your post reads slightly like bragging... In which case, i'm not sure you do want to change...
All i know, is that convincing girls to cheat on their boyfriends is mean, i know they are the ones in relationships, but why tempt people away, you dont know whats going on with them...!
I would imagine that most of the girls you 'pull' are having problems with their boyfriends/ husbands and are confused by you to be honest. If i was 100% solid with my partner there would be no hope so your actualy probably ending some seriously loving relationships (the real kind that have ups and downs) by what your doing!
I dont know what to say except you are right, karma is a b****h and even if you never get hurt or cheated on, you may never meet someone to even settle down with either!
By the sounds of your behavior pattern, you have no intention of settling down, but one day....
And if you keep going the way you are, it's not just other relationships you'll ruin, no girl wants to marry a man who has a reputation like you describe yourself to have...!!!

Crash Bang Wall

Are you Charlie Harper!!!

seriously mate, cop on or you will get a hiding from someone

seahorse

I think the same way about your behaviour as I would towards the actions of a woman doing the same thing: that you are to be pitied.

Clearly you cant get it together to have a meaningful relationship of your own, so you get your kicks in causing a great deal of hurt and damage to those who do. You are the biggest loser in all of this whether you realise it or not.

I reckon if every couple on earth who've ever experienced infidelity were to split up tomorrow morning there'd only be a minority of couples left, so what you're doing is nothing new. Most strong couples will survive the hurt caused by your drunken one nighters; but there you are, still alone. Maybe some day you'll come round to doing something to help yourself? Only you can decide on that one.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Like for example on Saturday I went to a club in Dublin and took this girl back to my place who has been in a relationship for like 4 years, she told me she has never cheated before which makes it so much more of a turn on for me

I guess its insecurity mixed with an instinct to cuckold. Maybe a counseller, might help you work out why taken women are so attracted to you.

If you do this to a lot of girls, statistically one of them's gonna have a boyfriend who'll be willing to hunt you down. Might be in your best interests to quit whilst ahead.

Do you ever do this with male friend's girlfriends/wives?

LegacyUser

do you develop feelings for any of these women... or is it just the sensation of the chase...

is it ever more than one night?

OS119

OP, don't worry about it, you've nothing to be ashamed of - you didn't drug them, or bash them with a hammer and drag them into the bushes - sentient human beings, mentally able to make their own decisions, slept with you after you asked them if they'd like to. big deal.

most of them - experience tells me - will have walked away with few regrets and either gone back to their partners and happily continue with their lives after 'scratching the itch', or they'll have reasessed their relationships and found them wanting.

if these lasses didn't want to sleep with you then they wouldn't have. don't lose a moments sleep over it - indeed you should congratulate yourself for being a very modern man, you respect a womans right to choose who do she sleeps with, rather than trying to make such decisions for her.

and yes, the urge to 'cuckold' is a pretty normal male urge, you enjoy it, she enjoys it (hopefully), she's unlikely to mention it to her partner, so no harm done.

LegacyUser

'indeed you should congratulate yourself for being a very modern man, you respect a womans right to choose who do she sleeps with, rather than trying to make such decisions for her.'

I think that comment is not helpful at all, if you read OP message, you'd see that he admits puersuading, that's manipulation and even though he is nowhere near drugging them, he is hassling them until them 'end up' going home with him...

ImAScumbag wrote: »

I think its the fact that the don't want me that make me so keen. Now obliviously I get turned down by a few of them, but a lot of them end up getting persuaded and I end up going home with them.

That is NOT respecting a woman's right to choose and as someone who has been hassled in the pub by guys, i know how manipulative they can be, and a small fight at home, can be twisted by these guys, they say anything and everything to get a girl into bed and would promise the world.(thank god i dont go to the pub after rowing with my bf!)

I would never condone hassling a woman into bed, it's one thing to ask, but that is not what OP is suggesting he does and when alcohol is involved, combined with that kind of practised manipulation...

Come on, if OP was in the pub with your GF laying it on thick and heavy, you may not think it so cool...

LegacyUser

I'm in shock here, can’t believe how some people are and how lightly some people take cheating... You're talking about destroying relationships, ruining people's lives. OP I think you should stop, simple as. I think what you are doing is very wrong and hurtful and for what?? your hole??? Very selfish. Its not a problem you have, its a hobby and you can certainly stop if you wish but I'm not sure you really want to, do you?

Eve_Dublin

OS119 wrote: »

OP, don't worry about it, you've nothing to be ashamed of - you didn't drug them, or bash them with a hammer and drag them into the bushes - sentient human beings, mentally able to make their own decisions, slept with you after you asked them if they'd like to. big deal.

most of them - experience tells me - will have walked away with few regrets and either gone back to their partners and happily continue with their lives after 'scratching the itch', or they'll have reasessed their relationships and found them wanting.

if these lasses didn't want to sleep with you then they wouldn't have. don't lose a moments sleep over it - indeed you should congratulate yourself for being a very modern man, you respect a womans right to choose who do she sleeps with, rather than trying to make such decisions for her.

and yes, the urge to 'cuckold' is a pretty normal male urge, you enjoy it, she enjoys it (hopefully), she's unlikely to mention it to her partner, so no harm done.

This is not a victimless "crime"...what about the husband/boyfriend of those women? How would they feel if they found out? What happened to being a decent person and having a little regard for someone beyond yourself? Granted, he owes no loyalty to these men but I don't owe anything to most strangers I meet on a daily basis but I still try to be decent to them. The OP is colluding in sordid behaviour and he's right to feel ashamed and want to make a change.

Do you actually know what "cuckold" means?? Look it up before you proclaim it as a normal male urge. Pfff.

OS119

Eve_Dublin wrote: »

This is not a victimless "crime"...what about the husband/boyfriend of those women? How would they feel if they found out? What happened to being a decent person and having a little regard for someone beyond yourself? Granted, he owes no loyalty to these men but I don't owe anything to most strangers I meet on a daily basis but I still try to be decent to them. The OP is colluding in sordid behaviour and he's right to feel ashamed and want to make a change.

Do you actually know what "cuckold" means?? Look it up before you proclaim it as a normal male urge. Pfff.

her relationship with her partner is her problem, its none of his business. end. of. story.

and yes, i do know what 'cuckold' means. it has become a generic rather than specific term, and has several 'sub' meanings, one of which is to enjoy shagging another mans wife without his knowledge - and i don't think i know a bloke who wouldn't enjoy it, so yes, i'd describe it as 'a fairly normal male urge'.

Liam Byrne

OS119 wrote: »

....one of which is to enjoy shagging another mans wife without his knowledge - and i don't think i know a bloke who wouldn't enjoy it

You obviously don't know me, then! Shagging another man's wife without his knowledge would put me RIGHT off.....

Sickening!

OS119 wrote: »

so yes, i'd describe it as 'a fairly normal male urge'.

You obviously don't know many decent men, so. :rolleyes:

OS119

Liam Byrne wrote: »

You obviously don't know me, then! Shagging another man's wife without his knowledge would put me RIGHT off.....

Sickening!



You obviously don't know many decent men, so. :rolleyes:

what, would you rather he watched?

what's sickening? rape is sickening, but having consensual sex - and getting a cheap thrill out of the 'naughtiness' of it - with someone able to make their own decisions isn't. sorry, we've left the 12th century...

if your man isn't able to make any form of long term relationship - assuming he wants to - because of 'commitment' issues, and uses this type of sexual encounter to validate that, then thats sad, but either way, its absolutely no business of anyone elses.

omahaid

I dont condone what the OP is doing one bit but he is not cheating on anyone. If I caught my wife-to-be in bed with another man I would not be pissed with the other man, he did not cheat on me.

While the OP's "urge" is not really morally right, he is not the one in the wrong, all those women can always say no.

omahaid

ImAScumbag wrote: »

I feel so perverted doing what I'm doing, but I can't help it.

It certainly is not illegal and if both parties enjoy it then where's the harm. If the women you meet really wanted to stay faithful they would. Unless you're using hynposis

Liam Byrne

OS119 wrote: »

what's sickening? ...... having consensual sex - and getting a cheap thrill out of the 'naughtiness' of it - with someone able to make their own decisions isn't. sorry, we've left the 12th century...

You suggested that EVERY MAN would enjoy it, and that it was "NORMAL".

That's incorrect and sickening.

You said it yourself - "cheap thrills" at the "naughtiness" of it - sounds like a 12-year-old.

And if you think common decency and respect is 12th century.... :rolleyes:

if your man isn't able to make any form of long term relationship - assuming he wants to - because of 'commitment' issues, and uses this type of sexual encounter to validate that, then thats sad, but either way, its absolutely no business of anyone elses.

Except, since he's the third-party, the second party; the boyfriend / husband.

You can be damn well sure it's his business if he's going to be with someone who's shagged a male slapper.

LegacyUser

I think what the OP is doing is common enough to be called a 'common male urge' tbh.

I'm married but was single for years & still go out with a group of single girls. I get way more of a certain kind of attention since being married. In fact, out of a group of four girls I'll be harassed most on a night out - and yes, I mean harassed, while my single friends get different attention. Thats because a certain kind of man (like the OP) fantasises that married women must be 'gagging for it' and thinks that they can have no strings sex. In fact I've even had men BEGGING at the end of the night. I don't lead anyone on BTW, these are just guys you meet on a night out while my mates are on the pull. I'm always upfront about being married and don't flirt. As I was single for a long time I see the way men can be different towards me now. And it is always that saddo pressure and manipulation approach, sometimes asking personal questions about my rel and trying to dig for weak areas.

So OP, seeing as you've bothered to post this as a PI so you therefore want advice:

Do you really want to be that guy who hangs out in the bars trying to pressure women into sex for one night? Does anyone really want to be that guy?

Its more fun when you don't have to work so hard for it. In fact its really fun when the girls meet you half way and want you too.

OS119

Liam Byrne wrote: »

You suggested that EVERY MAN would enjoy it, and that it was "NORMAL".

That's incorrect and sickening.

you need to learn the difference between common, normal and 'what every single male on this earth does'.

the only thing that unites every single male on this earth is a having internal organs, the other stuff falls into most (often called 'normal'), common (also often called 'normal'), some, and pretty rare.

if we believe - as genetists tell us - that 10%(ish) of children are being brought up by men who believe they are the childs genetic father but aren't, and given how easy it is to arrange contraception and how difficult it can be to get pregnant anyway, the percentage of women who 'play away' from their partner must be pretty significant - i'd even call it 'common'! - ergo, the number of men who sleep with this significant number of women must also be pretty significant - or 'common'!.

Eve_Dublin

OS119 wrote: »

her relationship with her partner is her problem, its none of his business. end. of. story

This highlights the kind of person you are more than anything else. This might well be a common enough urge among some men but there's a hell of a lot of selfish people in this world (and look what a mess we're in because of them)...just because it's fairly common behaviour (or so you claim...I don't believe it), it does NOT make it right. It's pathetic and the women are JUST as bad.

Grow a conscience and have a bit of respect for others ffs. :mad:

Eve_Dublin

OS119 wrote: »

you need to learn the difference between common, normal and 'what every single male on this earth does'.

the only thing that unites every single male on this earth is a having internal organs, the other stuff falls into most (often called 'normal'), common (also often called 'normal'), some, and pretty rare.

if we believe - as genetists tell us - that 10%(ish) of children are being brought up by men who believe they are the childs genetic father but aren't, and given how easy it is to arrange contraception and how difficult it can be to get pregnant anyway, the percentage of women who 'play away' from their partner must be pretty significant - i'd even call it 'common'! - ergo, the number of men who sleep with this significant number of women must also be pretty significant - or 'common'!.

But can you explain to me why this makes it okay??

Liam Byrne

OS119 wrote: »

you need to learn the difference between common, normal and 'what every single male on this earth does'.

OS119 wrote: »

one of which is to enjoy shagging another mans wife without his knowledge....i don't think i know a bloke who wouldn't enjoy it, so yes, i'd describe it as 'a fairly normal male urge'.

i.e. every single bloke that you know; and unless you're hanging out with some very unrepresentative group or other, that could be extrapolated to "every".

I'd be more inclined to believe that there are blokes that you know who wouldn't enjoy it, so it's reflective of the population, but it didn't suit your argument to say so.

OS119 wrote: »

ergo, the number of men who sleep with this significant number of women must also be pretty significant - or 'common'!.

Pretty "common" alright.......sleazy, really.

Yes, some guys will get a warped thrill from this crap; others will sleep with the women for what it is, rather than getting an extra cheap thrill from shagging someone else's girl, others won't even know or be told, and wouldn't dream of it if they knew.

So even within the subset that facilitate the cheating, you're still way off in claiming that it's a "fairly normal male urge" to get a cheap thrill from "shagging another mans wife without his knowledge".

Moomoo1

I don't buy the 'the woman is the one solely responsible' line either. Picture the situation: she's probably had much to drink, she might have had a row at home, you name it. Then this really attractive and manipulative guy comes along and tries to sweep you off your feet, to augment your insecurities, and to cop off with you. People are not computers, some may not be strong enough to withstand a psychological barrage like that - no matter how strong the relationship might have been previously.

As for 'every normal bloke wants to get off with other peoples' wives', that's just BS. Unless 'normal' stands for 'selfish egoist sociopath'.

There is another issue here, that some unreg people highlighted: why should women who have no intention at all of cheating have to go to clubs and listen to random men trying to manipulate them and belittle their partners and relationships? That's doesn't sound like most people's idea of an enjoyable night out...

Moomoo1

...I am still somewhat surprised however with how many people the OP managed to get off with (granted, as a % of the ones he approaches it's not that big but still), mainly because I can't see this from the point of view of the woman. I mean, getting off with brides on hen nights is pretty heavy stuff (where are the friends watching btw). So is it

1) the alcohol and/or problems with the women's existing relationships
2) that they put women under a constant spell where they aren't able to stop and have a reality check before the deed is done
3) that they make women think 'I will err just this once'?

Liam Byrne

All the above said, you've got to feel sorry on some level for some poor sod who's so sexually deviant that he can only get it up when he's getting a cheap thrill out of the fact that it's someone else's girl.....

I mean, by definition, that means that he's never going to be able to have a proper relationship, unless of course he's also schitzophrenic!

Moomoo1

Liam Byrne wrote: »

All the above said, you've got to feel sorry on some level for some poor sod who's so sexually deviant that he can only get it up when he's getting a cheap thrill out of the fact that it's someone else's girl.....

I mean, by definition, that means that he's never going to be able to have a proper relationship, unless of course he's also schitzophrenic!

I don't feel sorry for him. In fact, in a way I envy him (I was always hopeless chatting up women) for the number of women he slept with. And let's not forget, his DNA will probably be passed on much more effectively than yours or mine...

Liam Byrne

Moomoo1 wrote: »

I don't feel sorry for him.

I don't, in general, because he's behaving appalingly. But it did strike me that this fetish means he'll never know what a proper relationship is like.

Moomoo1 wrote: »

In fact, in a way I envy him (I was always hopeless chatting up women) for the number of women he slept with.

Really ? I'm all for quality, not quantity, so what the OP is describing would have no appeal for me. Call me a serial monogamist or whatever, but I'd view that as a lot more fulfilling than this sort of crap. But then I have a moral compass and no need for a fetish.

Whatever about hooking up with someone single the odd time, I would see no appeal whatsoever in being with someone who was with their b/f the night before and will be with their b/f tomorrow; if she treats him like that (someone she supposedly cares about) she'll probably treat you worse.

Moomoo1 wrote: »

And let's not forget, his DNA will probably be passed on much more effectively than yours or mine...

Hopefully not - just in case this fetish is DNA related; but if it does happen, then at least there's a chance that it'll be "diluted" by the b/f's, whether from the night before or the night after....and I wonder if it did happen who the girl would run to ?

LegacyUser

I know this looks like a simple case of male sluttishness, but after babysitting my nephews all weekend, age 2 & 3, I noticed that certain toys only had value to them if the other one wanted it! lol.

Perhaps the op subconciously thinks that only women that other men 'possess' are worth having. Whaddya think op? Do you maybe not have confidence in what you yourself find attractive? Do you need someone to tell you ok to fancy a certain person?

Like most things, if you dig a bit deeper you will probably find the real reasons behind your behaviour. Your bravado could cover low self esteem.

Or perhaps you've watched too much porn, you know when the plumber calls over? lol

Gemini Sister

Moomoo1 wrote: »

I don't feel sorry for him. In fact, in a way I envy him (I was always hopeless chatting up women) for the number of women he slept with. And let's not forget, his DNA will probably be passed on much more effectively than yours or mine...

I wouldn't worry too much about his dna being passed on! He's what they invented the morning after pill for!

Quality really does matter more than quantity, but if quantity is all you know...

Moomoo1

Gemini Sister wrote: »

I wouldn't worry too much about his dna being passed on! He's what they invented the morning after pill for!

Quality really does matter more than quantity, but if quantity is all you know...

True, it does. I envy his talents rather than the way he uses them, which is why I will never ever feel sorry for him.

Liam Byrne

Unregistered wrote: »

I know this looks like a simple case of male sluttishness, but after babysitting my nephews all weekend, age 2 & 3, I noticed that certain toys only had value to them if the other one wanted it!

Well, I'd given him a mental age of a hormone-fuelled teenager, but yeah, maybe aged 2 or 3 suits better.

LegacyUser

All post appreciated so for,

To clear things up, as I know I sound like an arrogant prick.

I don't feel good about myself at all, some of the post indicated that it take two to tango, but this isn't really fair on the women that I target, a lot of the time they surcome due to manipulation on my behalf. I don't think I would necessarily play the trouble in a relationship card to much, its more I show them how there would be no consequences of their actions. Also I'm sure the drink has a little to play in it. Some women don't need to much convincing either. I also think that when men get into a relationship the tend to let themselves go a little, and I keep myself very fit, perfect body. You would be surprised how easy it is to get women in relationships.

I know that this post sounds like bragging, but honestly its not, its a plea for help

There have been a few affairs that have lasted more then one night, but I get very bored very quickly. Its all in the chase for me. Ive also had plenty of relationships in the past, but get very uneasy when it comes to getting cosy so I tend to end it

I know I must have some sort of deeply rooted problem here, perhaps I'm jealous of these men for having a nice normal relationship that I get off on ruining them, that's not to say Ive ruined all of them. I have bumped into a few girls a few months later and some of them say things have never been better with their oh's. Whats interesting to me is that I'm happy for them when this happens.

I want to change, I hate myself for doing this, but hormones take over, you can't tell a gay guy to just stop being gay.

One poster asked do I ever do it to my friends girlfriends or wives, well the answer to that is no, but I do make them consider it. Just never go though with it. There is a code among friends. Although there have been a few women Ive stolen from former friends.

I think maybe some of this might stem from when I was 14 and a friend was going out with this girl I liked. I figured all's fair in love and war so I stole her from him.

I would still love a bit of advice rather then debate over weather what I'm doing is wrong. I believe it to be wrong, I need help

thx in advance

Bottle_of_Smoke

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

I guess its insecurity mixed with an instinct to cuckold. Maybe a counseller, might help you work out why taken women are so attracted to you.

If you do this to a lot of girls, statistically one of them's gonna have a boyfriend who'll be willing to hunt you down. Might be in your best interests to quit whilst ahead.

Do you ever do this with male friend's girlfriends/wives?

Edit: Should have said - "might help you work out why taken women are so attractive to you"!

Bottle_of_Smoke

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Well, I'd given him a mental age of a hormone-fuelled teenager, but yeah, maybe aged 2 or 3 suits better.

In fairness, although I can understand your distaste for the OP's behaviour, he did come here looking to change and snide remarks aren't going to encourage him.

He's called himself "IamAScumbag" and as you pointed out yourself, he deserves our pity not anger.

LegacyUser

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Well, I'd given him a mental age of a hormone-fuelled teenager, but yeah, maybe aged 2 or 3 suits better.

Im asking for help here liam, not need to get insulting

Tar.Aldarion

The only reason I think you should stop is because you are ruining the guys lives and I know how that feels. Now I know it is the womans fault too, takes two to tango, but she may have been drinking, being pushed by a suave guy and well every relationship has it's faults, so she is vulnerable to what you are doing. I know in my relationships, it was realllly hard to stop a pretty girl trying to take you home when you had been drinking and maybe annoyed at the missus, I did not do anything but a lot of people would be persuaded easier, especially when there may have bene a row or whatever. It brings an artificial end to a relationship that could have been very good for decades because of a rough patch or doubts or whatever. The girl is of course at fault too and I am not sure, even with manipulation, if a girl cheats that she deserves you, but you are making it far worse on innocent people, could be up to years of depression if it's a long relationship.

I think you know what you are doing and you should take a look at yourself and why you do it.

Eve_Dublin

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

In fairness, although I can understand your distaste for the OP's behaviour, he did come here looking to change and snide remarks aren't going to encourage him.

He's called himself "IamAScumbag" and as you pointed out yourself, he deserves our pity not anger.

Nah, sorry, I would pity him if he was making a real effort to control his behaviour beyond posting it up on an internet forum. Cop out. OP, the only way you'll get over this is to seek professional help. You've an addiction that's affecting others and you need to stop.

Liam Byrne

ImAScumbag wrote: »

Im asking for help here liam, not need to get insulting

I am not being insulting. I'm simply stating a fact. Adults [usually] accept responsibility for their actions; children do not. It's hardly MY fault if you are acting like a child ?

If I came on here and said "I have a strange compulsion to pull girls' hair and look up their skirts", I'd be told to grow up, because that's juvenile.

And forgive me if there is an element of contempt - even the most recent post smacks of bragging and arrogance:

ImAScumbag wrote:

I keep myself very fit, perfect body

In his own opinion. I've yet to meet ANYONE who has a "perfect body" (myself included) and I've DEFINITELY yet to meet anyone who'll claim it about themselves; then again, I wouldn't hang out with anyone that arrogant or deluded, since "perfect" is subjective.

ImAScumbag wrote:

I think maybe some of this might stem from when I was 14 and a friend was going out with this girl I liked. I figured all's fair in love and war so I stole her from him.

Wow! So you'll admit I was right about the teenager comment, then ?

Mind you, a psychological problem usually "stems from" something where YOU'VE been the victim; the above just proves that you've always been a thoughtless greedy type, and it completely contradicts the other part that you said:

ImAScumbag wrote:

One poster asked do I ever do it to my friends girlfriends or wives, well the answer to that is no, but I do make them consider it. Just never go though with it. There is a code among friends. Although there have been a few women Ive stolen from former friends.

Yes, there's an apparent admission in the posts that he knows well what he's doing is wrong, etc, but there's far too much of the other stuff in the posts for me to take that seriously...

As for the actual advice requested ? Go see a therapist to figure out whether you are indeed scared of having a proper relationship, because it does seem like that to me.

EDIT : I have, however had one thought. I'm no professional therapist, but if someone's that obsessed with their own "perfect body" and self-confessed "manipulating" girls into coming home with him, while they're taken, it would POSSIBLY be that they are conscious / concerned that their personality is not adequate to form a proper relationship......a bit like teenage girls who convince themselves that by being "better looking" they'll get that guy that they think they want, only to realise they don't really want them.

Alternatively, did the girl at age 14 go back to the friend, so that it wasn't a "steal", but more of a "borrow", because she preferred the friend ? If so, maybe that's the "cause" and the reason that we got only half of that story that wasn't relevant.

P.C. Psychobabble ? Maybe. And we're heading into areas that I don't understand - like I said, I'm not a professional therapist. And I'm also not being paid about a grand an hour to work out what's up with someone who just appears greedy, manipulative and inconsiderate.

So - as I said - I'd advise the OP to go see one.

Eve_Dublin

ImAScumbag bon wrote: »

All post appreciated so for,

To clear things up, as I know I sound like an arrogant prick.

I don't feel good about myself at all, some of the post indicated that it take two to tango, but this isn't really fair on the women that I target, a lot of the time they surcome due to manipulation on my behalf. I don't think I would necessarily play the trouble in a relationship card to much, its more I show them how there would be no consequences of their actions. Also I'm sure the drink has a little to play in it. Some women don't need to much convincing either. I also think that when men get into a relationship the tend to let themselves go a little, and I keep myself very fit, perfect body. You would be surprised how easy it is to get women in relationships.

I know that this post sounds like bragging, but honestly its not, its a plea for help

There have been a few affairs that have lasted more then one night, but I get very bored very quickly. Its all in the chase for me. Ive also had plenty of relationships in the past, but get very uneasy when it comes to getting cosy so I tend to end it

I know I must have some sort of deeply rooted problem here, perhaps I'm jealous of these men for having a nice normal relationship that I get off on ruining them, that's not to say Ive ruined all of them. I have bumped into a few girls a few months later and some of them say things have never been better with their oh's. Whats interesting to me is that I'm happy for them when this happens.

I want to change, I hate myself for doing this, but hormones take over, you can't tell a gay guy to just stop being gay.

One poster asked do I ever do it to my friends girlfriends or wives, well the answer to that is no, but I do make them consider it. Just never go though with it. There is a code among friends. Although there have been a few women Ive stolen from former friends.

I think maybe some of this might stem from when I was 14 and a friend was going out with this girl I liked. I figured all's fair in love and war so I stole her from him.

I would still love a bit of advice rather then debate over weather what I'm doing is wrong. I believe it to be wrong, I need help

thx in advance

Okay OP, fair enough but do you think you're going to get the help you need here? Not everyone is going to feel sympathy for you here and for all you know, one of the boyfriends/husbands could be reading this. I suppose the point I was trying to make is that, yes, you are doing wrong and other posters here are saying you're not and I was arguing with them, not you. What they're saying is of no benefit to you and perhaps you might take on board what they say because it's what you might want to hear in a moment of weakness so I was dismissing their claims just to be sure. You admitted that you have a problem so fair play. This is the first step in recovery from all addictions . If you can keep yourself from going near your friend's OHs, when people with with a serious drug addiction wouldn't think twice about stealing from friends and family, then I think you do have control over what you do, even if you claim otherwise.

To compare what you do to the sexual orientation of a gay man or woman is not the same: they aren't doing anything wrong, they have a clean conscience and there's no need for them to stop. You're a hetrosexual man with a fetish...not the same as a sexual orientation.

Perhaps you're looking in the wrong place for help...if you want to stop, then you're going to have to seek professional help. Perhaps someone can point you in the right direction for this. Fot the time being, you need to stop what you're doing, go cold turkey and take one day at a time...I don't believe you possess anymore more hormones than your average man or woman and we're all capable of celibacy if needs be, even those with a high sex drive...sometimes we don't have a choice in the matter.

I hope you do decide to find help. There's a deep-seated problem here that no one here can advice you on. Good luck.

Wibbs

Given that the chap is asking for advice then I would say he's looking for advice, internet forum or not.

Personally speaking; I went through a similar phase to the OP, though it lasted for a shorter time. I can only speak for myself and say that yes it was addictive and there was the thrill involved.

There was more to it though. With me it kicked off after a relationship went bad and she went off with someone else. It was a reaction to that. My cynicism went up and what better way to prove that people have no loyalty, than to go out and do the same.

It worked too. To a ridiculously easy degree which the OP will agree with. Which of course fed into my viewpoint at the time. I'll be honest here, I largely ignored the line "I have a boyfriend" as it didn't seem to matter to the degree I would have thought and the standards I had previously set for myself and partners. Of course because of my viewpoint I also conveniently ignored the women where it did matter. TBH they were in the minority, but that's not really the point, they should have been the standard, not the others.

This of course also made me cynical about relationships, which I wanted and chose to be after the last relationship went wallop. I wasn't looking for one as I would have been risking my own emotional vulnerability by trusting someone. One fed the other. Plus it have to admit the novelty of it all was attractive too.

So OP I would be asking, do you trust women? Do you see yourself in a long term committed relationship, or would you worry that someone else will "take her"?

I do think that like me back then, it's as much insecurity and issues of trust and novelty that is driving this.

Eve_Dublin

Wibbs wrote: »

Given that the chap is asking for advice then I would say he's looking for advice, internet forum or not.

Personally speaking; I went through a similar phase to the OP, though it lasted for a shorter time. I can only speak for myself and say that yes it was addictive and there was the thrill involved.

There was more to it though. With me it kicked off after a relationship went bad and she went off with someone else. It was a reaction to that. My cynicism went up and what better way to prove that people have no loyalty, than to go out and do the same.

It worked too. To a ridiculously easy degree which the OP will agree with. Which of course fed into my viewpoint at the time. I'll be honest here, I largely ignored the line "I have a boyfriend" as it didn't seem to matter to the degree I would have thought and the standards I had previously set for myself and partners. Of course because of my viewpoint I also conveniently ignored the women where it did matter. TBH they were in the minority, but that's not really the point, they should have been the standard, not the others.

This of course also made me cynical about relationships, which I wanted and chose to be after the last relationship went wallop. I wasn't looking for one as I would have been risking my own emotional vulnerability by trusting someone. One fed the other. Plus it have to admit the novelty of it all was attractive too.

So OP I would be asking, do you trust women? Do you see yourself in a long term committed relationship, or would you worry that someone else will "take her"?

I do think that like me back then, it's as much insecurity and issues of trust and novelty that is driving this.

Yeah but because you've been there yourself Wibbs, you're probably the only person who could give him advice and the only person who has given him advice up to this point or at least tried to get to the root of the problem without speculating...everybody else is trying their hand at amateur psychology but I think his problem is too serious for that because of the fact that it's affecting others and not just himself...and that's why I suggested professional help.

Wibbs

Well I could have written the OP's last post, including the bit about finding out down the line they were happy in their relationship after our affair, but defo not the part about the better body...

I would also naturally tend towards suggesting professional help, but that also has some issues for me. It's too easy an answer. What kind of professional does he go to and what help could they practically give? These are the questions I would have posed at the time if you had said same to me. It would have been easier for me in a way, as at least it could be easily traced back to "I've had my heart broken, so sod the world" viewpoint at the time. I suppose in the OP's case he has to try and find what is the reason behind his behaviour and there is one, or several.

I would say another aspect to it looking back is it was easy. The path of least resistance and emotional self protection in the face of cynicism. The sex part wasn't really the focus. It was part of it but IMHO not the engine behind it. EG I've had far better sex within a good relationship, than outside it. That's the rub though. I wasn't looking for a good relationship as I didn't believe it existed at the time. Very blinkered thinking.

For my part it changed with time. It was an acute phase rather than a chronic one like the OPs sounds like. It helped when I took the conscious decision to hang out with good couples, couples who don't cheat and are healthy for each other. That balanced out the bad stuff. Yes I realised(and TBH still believe) they're rare enough, but that doesn't mean I shouldnt pursue that as a goal, or acknowledge that as something that could happen for me. I also learned why they stayed together, not why others had affairs left right and centre.


Basically I moved the focus, from glass half empty to glass half full. Not so easy though as the glass half empty side had flirting, thrills and sex on it's side. I did it though. Then again I wan't doing it for long. Couple of years. If I had been doing it all my adult life it may have been far more difficult.

OP practical things IMH; When they mention the boyfriend, acknowledge it, protest that you didn't mean anything and stop flirting. IMHO if you don't react to it, neither will they if they are the cheating kind. If you do this regularly you'll know what I'm taliking about. Then make your excuses and move away. Rinse and repeat.

PS It's sometimes still tempting I have to admit. Only last weekend I was chatting to one woman having a ciggy outside the pub. The "I have a BF" line popped up and I didn't comment on that either way. Once that was out of the way she was happy to kick off the major flirting. She stopped when one of her male mates came out, but didn't when one of her female mates did. That told me it wasn't the first time for her. The old "cad brain" clicked in for a moment. FWIW I moved on and ended up chatting with someone who appeared to be single.

shellyboo

ImAScumbag bon wrote: »

I want to change, I hate myself for doing this, but hormones take over, you can't tell a gay guy to just stop being gay.

What a fcuking cop out.

Yeah, a gay guy can't change his sexual orientation - but he can stop himself sleeping with men if he wants.

EVERYONE, everyone, OP, is capable of exercising self-control. You're not different, you're not special, you're just lazy and selfish and self-pitying.

If you want to stop sleeping with women who have boyfriends, STOP. It really and truly is that easy. Stop going up to them, stop talking to them, stop buying them drinks, stop flirting with them, stop going home with them, stop putting your penis in them. There are many steps along the way at which you could stop. You're just choosing not to.

Zoodlebop

OS119 wrote: »

her relationship with her partner is her problem, its none of his business. end. of. story.

and yes, i do know what 'cuckold' means. it has become a generic rather than specific term, and has several 'sub' meanings, one of which is to enjoy shagging another mans wife without his knowledge - and i don't think i know a bloke who wouldn't enjoy it, so yes, i'd describe it as 'a fairly normal male urge'.

I'm male. I am in a loving relationship. I don't have this "urge". Only a debased idiot with no regard for the society he lives in would feel, or in the worst case, yield to this "urge". I pity you. I would lose a finger rather than spend a second in the company of "the blokes you know".

I think you and the OP should take a long look at whether your behavior really makes you happy. If it does, then I despair for humanity, or at least for your version of it.

Wibbs

shellyboo I agree, but I would also say the same of many many unhealthy behaviours people get up to. Smoking, drinking too much, eating too much, taking drugs, pushing themselves too much, even extremes like self harm etc. I am not for a second saying it's an "addiction", nor am I saying that these are all on the same level. No way, but there seem to be similarities.

IMHO I think "addiction" is overused as a word though the unhealthy behaviours spring from similar points. A bad feedback loop that is self rewarding. Breaking that is hard as it won't be self rewarding for a while as you build a healthier feedback loop.

I think the OP had to figure out why he has this need. The rewards he gets are obvious. No strings sex with novel women, so that part of the equation is not the one to attack in my humble as it's a damn strong one. It's like telling a stoner to quit because "getting stoned isn't fun". Not gonna have much luck there.

The starting point of the why and how he can change that would be the angle I'd be taking.

LegacyUser

Wibbs wrote: »

For my part it changed with time. It was an acute phase rather than a chronic one like the OPs sounds like. It helped when I took the conscious decision to hang out with good couples, couples who don't cheat and are healthy for each other. That balanced out the bad stuff. Yes I realised(and TBH still believe) they're rare enough, but that doesn't mean I shouldnt pursue that as a goal, or acknowledge that as something that could happen for me. I also learned why they stayed together, not why others had affairs left right and centre.
.

This sounds like very good advice. At the moment, OP, you're surrounding yourself with negativity and weak people. You're not learning or growing and eventually, like most people, you probably will want a real relationship. You don't want to be so riddled with negativity and paranoia by then that you can't sustain it.

Also, I know you will disgree with this but: sometimes men aren't very good at estimating just how much pressure they are putting on women. You do this routine every time you go out, she doesn't (probably). I'm not saying that women are incapable of looking after themselves, but, for example, two friend of mine got off with each other awhile back. Both of these are good people that I've known for years, and I've known their dating styles etc. She felt extreme pressure to go much further than she wanted to; he had no idea he made her so uncomfortable. Its a long story, I suppose I'm just saying be very careful. Some men will badger and bully girls til they give in but convince themselves they've done nothing wrong. Oh but of course she wanted it all along, you'll say.... but if that was the case maybe she wouldn't have to be drunk, harassed, begged, flattered etc. ?

As for your behaviour. If you go through this routine because its easy, then you just need to set yourself higher challanges, go for the hottest girl, not the one you percieve to be the easiest or most vulnerable. Perhaps if you meet challenging girls, over time, you'll be able to fall for one. Visualise yourself with a different kind of girl. Also, sometimes the problems we think we have actually mask deeper problems. For years I was chronically single and didn't want to be, until I realised that actually I was terrified of getting involved with someone for fear of being hurt. I subconsciously chose partners that weren't going to stick around - but actually I was the one doing the running all the time. Have you been well loved in your life? How is your self-esteem, and I don't just mean regarding your bod or scoring abilities, look at the bigger pic.

If however this is a fetish, and you only want girls because of the men they are involved with, its better to seek professional help, sooner rather than later. I don't know if its possible for anyone to change their sexuality, ask an expert.

Zoodlebop

Moomoo1 wrote: »

I don't feel sorry for him. In fact, in a way I envy him (I was always hopeless chatting up women) for the number of women he slept with. And let's not forget, his DNA will probably be passed on much more effectively than yours or mine...

Good for him. An entire swathe of fatherless children. That's a great legacy. Really giving his stock the best chance of success. Sure he's no better than a fish, fertilizing eggs like it's his job. There's a lot more to fatherhood than that. That is the smallest part. At least they will have nothing to do with him as they grow up (hopefully).

Eve_Dublin

Wibbs wrote: »

shellyboo I agree, but I would also say the same of many many unhealthy behaviours people get up to. Smoking, drinking too much, eating too much, taking drugs, pushing themselves too much, even extremes like self harm etc. I am not for a second saying it's an "addiction", nor am I saying that these are all on the same level. No way, but there seem to be similarities.

IMHO I think "addiction" is overused as a word though the unhealthy behaviours spring from similar points. A bad feedback loop that is self rewarding. Breaking that is hard as it won't be self rewarding for a while as you build a healthier feedback loop.

I think the OP had to figure out why he has this need. The rewards he gets are obvious. No strings sex with novel women, so that part of the equation is not the one to attack in my humble as it's a damn strong one. It's like telling a stoner to quit because "getting stoned isn't fun". Not gonna have much luck there.

The starting point of the why and how he can change that would be the angle I'd be taking.

I think you're unnecessarily complicating the matter, Wibbs. Your motives or reason might not apply to OP's. Lack of self-control has a hell of a lot do with laziness and lack of any REAL desire to stop. People who tell me to stop smoking has no affect on me because although I SAY I want to stop, I love smoking and I have never REALLY made an effort to stop.

Still, I'm going to have to do it some day because it will probably give me cancer, which is ultimately my problem...OP HAS to stop because he is directly affecting the lives of these women and their OHs. If this is not an insentive, then I don't know what is. Women give up smoking when they get pregnant to prevent their children becoming brain damaged etc. You can make all the excuses in the world....OP can stop if he really wants to.

I'm being very black and white about this, I know but I have a sibling who gave up a very self-destructive lifestyle that affected us all because he was a constant worry. Within a few weeks, he stopped with this lifestyle. He reached a point in his life where he couldn't go on the way he was going on and he desperatly wanted to stop...and he did.

If they OP desperately wanted to stop, he would....I don't believe he's there yet.

Sorry and just to add, my brother's behaviour was a lot more serious than OP's and I'm guessing it went on for a lot longer (23 years)

Wibbs

Eve_Dublin wrote: »

I think you're unnecessarily complicating the matter, Wibbs. Your motives or reason might not apply to OP's.

I agree.

Lack of self-control has a hell of a lot do with laziness and lack of any REAL desire to stop. People who tell me to stop smoking has no affect on me because although I SAY I want to stop, I love smoking and I have never REALLY made an effort to stop.

Because the feedback you get from smoking is higher than one you would get from giving up smoking at the moment.

Still, I'm going to have to do it some day because it will probably give me cancer, which is ultimately my problem...

Again where one feedback overpowers another.

OP HAS to stop because he is directly affecting the lives of these women and their OHs. If this is not an insentive, then I don't know what is.

I agree, but that reasoning won't make the difference for him. Not yet. He has started to admit to himself this is not on. Major first step. Like admitting honestly to oneself that smoking is unhealthy. The next step is the hard one. Doing something concrete about it. It's also difficult in one way because the other side of this feedbcak, the women involved are enabling this. Trust me one does not need to push or cajole much. Indeed I would even say the less you push the easier it is. Certainly for me when I was pulling this guff.

Women give up smoking when they get pregnant to prevent their children becoming brain damaged etc. You can make all the excuses in the world....OP can stop if he really wants to.

I completely agree, I'm just saying like you he's not there yet. So how does he get there?

I'm being very black and white about this, I know but I have a sibling who gave up a very self-destructive lifestyle that affected us all because he was a constant worry. Within a few weeks, he stopped with this lifestyle. He reached a point in his life where he couldn't go on the way he was going on and he desperatly wanted to stop...and he did.

Excellent and kudos to him, but along the line of his behaviour, say a month previously he wouldn't have stopped and no amount of "you can stop if you really want to" would have gotten through.

If they OP desperately wanted to stop, he would....I don't believe he's there yet.

Yep. This is why I'm suggesting ways he can approach that, by looking at the why part of the equation, not the stop part. 20 years of "smoking is bad m'kay" has proven, that while useful, it's not a cure.

Wagon

Wibbs wrote: »

There was more to it though. With me it kicked off after a relationship went bad and she went off with someone else. It was a reaction to that.
My cynicism went up and what better way to prove that people have no loyalty, than to go out and do the same.

Ah yes ive been cheated on too. But i never got the appeal of taking it out on other people that you dont know, like the boyfriends and husbands of others.

ImAScumbag bon wrote: »

I don't feel good about myself at all, some of the post indicated that it take two to tango, but this isn't really fair on the women that I target, a lot of the time they surcome due to manipulation on my behalf.

Sitting there ****ing moaning on the keyboard about how its not possible to change is a waste of time. Time to stop acting like a randy tenager.

I don't think I would necessarily play the trouble in a relationship card to much, its more I show them how there would be no consequences of their actions.

Its both parties at fault. But more yours because you purposly target the weaknesses in a relationship.

Also I'm sure the drink has a little to play in it. Some women don't need to much convincing either.

Some are just slappers.

I also think that when men get into a relationship the tend to let themselves go a little, and I keep myself very fit, perfect body. You would be surprised how easy it is to get women in relationships.

Could say the exact same thing about 2 of my ex girlfriends.

I know that this post sounds like bragging, but honestly its not, its a plea for help

I find it very dificult to actually sympathise with you. Plus the mental image in my mind of some tall lean fit twat with gelled hair and faded jeans trying to manipulate someone just for a quick shag pisses me off because all blokes get tarred with the same brush. including the more loyal ones. I get genuinelly angry at people like you because you actually dont give a crap about anyone else.

Pull your head out of your arse here. You can sign on and slay the self pity card all you want but all youve been doing so far is copping out, saying that 'hormones' take over. Thats only because the conscience is on a ****ing coffee break. I know girls like you too though, friends that slept with men who were married. My reaction was the same.

Now im not one for the quick fix option, in order to get past this you must actually wantto change. You need to stop thinking with your dick and use your ****ing brain and that will take some commitment.

Eve_Dublin

Yes "kudos" to my brother but what made him stop in the end was he finally saw what affect he was having on us all (again...his problems were a hell of a lot more serious than OP's). The reason I haven't stopped smoking yet is because it's MY problem....if I knew it was directly affecting the health of my family, I would stop (I don't smoke around anyone). Yes, the feedback I get from smoking overpowers my desire to stop...only because I know it's MY problem.

I'm sorry, I really think you're overcomplicating this situation. I believe it comes down to the prominance of the selfish gene in the OP and to what extent his conscience plays a part in how he lives his life. Instead of finding the reason why he carries on this way, why not stop because it's unfair to others??

Am I being too simplistic? Okay, I'll leave it for now. I've no constructive advice except stop ignoring the part of your brain that tells you what's right and wrong.

Good luck OP.

beggars_bush

Irish women are more unfaithful than their male counterparts

simple as