Drivers license not acceptable form of ID?

prodigal_son

I take it as a compliment when I am asked for id when i purchase alcohol, or try and enter a club. It doesn't happen as often as it used to. I'm 27...

However, I take it as an insult when I'm told that Drivers license, is not accepted and i need a garda age card or passport.

Im not carrying around my passport to prove I'm 18, and at 27 I'm not going to apply for a garda age card.

I've heard different things from different people, they are allowed to do this, they are not, I even heard that over 21 people technically don't have to show id.

So what is the official stance?

Sorry if there is a thread somewhere else about this, Ive looked but couldn't find.

Payton

Might be suited to "Legal Discussions" Forum

budgemook

I am also 27. I don't carry ID. When I get asked I tell the bouncer no, I don't carry ID as I am 27. Haven't been turned away yet. One time I even had ID but wouldn't show it, just told him no.

eth0_

If they won't accept a driving license they're just being awkward pr1cks. Go to another off license/supermarket.

gerrycollins

prodigal_son wrote: »

I take it as a compliment when I am asked for id when i purchase alcohol, or try and enter a club. It doesn't happen as often as it used to. I'm 27...

However, I take it as an insult when I'm told that Drivers license, is not accepted and i need a garda age card or passport.

Im not carrying around my passport to prove I'm 18, and at 27 I'm not going to apply for a garda age card.

I've heard different things from different people, they are allowed to do this, they are not, I even heard that over 21 people technically don't have to show id.

So what is the official stance?


Sorry if there is a thread somewhere else about this, Ive looked but couldn't find.

The offical stance is that if a club/pub or shop have a policy in place then there aint much you can do against it im afraid.

in my shop its garda ID only.

Can you imagine going to a judge and telling him you were discriminated against etc then the pub pops up and claim that they have gotten faked Licences(ive seen them myself) presented so they now no longer accecpt them, no judge will go against the pub (generally speaking other issues may apply) as underage drinking is such an issue lately.

if i ask for id and you dont present it(ref your over 21's comment) i can refuse the sale and thats the end of that.

it is a bit of a grey area however each pub/shop are to their own devices when it comes to asking for ID and accecpting various kinds. The garda ID is a safe bet as it verfied by the local cop shop. Passports and driving licences are really taken at the pub/shop discretion and risk as the driving licences are easy to fake.

I have hundreds weekly that come in with their student cards,social welfare card, ATM card, and the fake driving licences are so easy to spot too.

JohnC.

Citizens Information seem to think

Appropriate identification includes a National Age Card, a passport, a driving licence, or a identitiy card issued by an EU member state

Though I'm not sure that's any kind of legal definition of appropriate identification.

10-10-20

I have to agree. It's considered by most to be an 'official state document'.
You don't see the Guards looking for a copy of your passport to validate your license...?

Soundman

Working in a venue, the three forms of ID that legally we have to accept unless we believe it to be fake, is:

National Age Card
Passport
Drivers Licence (provisional or full)


If I recall, the law also states that if you are under the age of 26, or can be mistaken for being under 26, then you must carry a legal form of ID to gain entry to a licensed premises or to buy alcohol in a shop or off-licence.

dudara

It all depends on what the store policy is. We don't have a standard ID in Ireland, so therefore they can accept what they want.

calex71

Am I correct in thinking pub / shop/ maybe even Garda can't actually specifically request to see your passport, as it is the property of the dept. of foreign affairs, they can say it will be accepted as proof of id but that you have to volunteer it , that cannot request to see it

eth0_

I think it's laughable that some offies will only accept passport or national age card - give how easy the national age card is to FAKE! It's almost an underhand way of allowing underage drinking.

foggy_lad

eth0_ wrote: »

I think it's laughable that some offies will only accept passport or national age card - give how easy the national age card is to FAKE! It's almost an underhand way of allowing underage drinking.

was in tescos a few weeks ago late at night and three young lads were at the till with three bottles of spirits and they all looked underage(aqbout 14years old) but the woman at the till ignored what they looked like and proceeded to accept a passport from one of them who is under 18 but most likely using an older brothers passport,

i suggested they should insist on a driving license at least as what lad over 18 is not going to have this? a passport may be left lying around for a younger sibling to find and use in off licenses but most young people over 18 will carry their driving license around with them. needless to say my suggestion was ignored so i stated very clearly that the youth in question was under 18 but again was ignored. so much for off-licenses being responsible!

Lollipops23

it really wrecks my head when Garda Id is the only form accepted; you need a passport to get one in the first place and passports are far harder to fake than a flimsy little card.

IMO some people get their jollies throwing their power around and telling people who are clearly over 18 that they can't serve them. i mean, i don't know anyone over the age of 25 who could pass for 17.

I've also been told by a total bollix of a bouncer that the law requires people to always carry a form of ID with them...??

calex71

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I've also been told by a total bollix of a bouncer that the law requires people to always carry a form of ID with them...??

Lmao was he Irish ? If not then maybe where he's from it is law, but if he was Irish lol @ him.

wmpdd3

Guys your talking about breaking the law, not just the premises but the person serving the alcohol getting a criminal record.

No way would I do it, if I had the slightest inkling, i would ask for ID and if they don't have it I'd refuse and take the abuse.

Having the business closed down for any length of time could put the business in jeopardy.

It does happen:

http://www.kilkennypeople.ie/local-court-cases/Pubs-closed-for-underage-drinking.1395162.jp

http://www.barkeeper.ie/News_Item.asp?News_ID=440

JohnC.

foggy_lad wrote: »

i suggested they should insist on a driving license at least as what lad over 18 is not going to have this?

Those who don't drive.

jhegarty

wmpdd3 wrote: »

Guys your talking about breaking the law, not just the premises but the person serving the alcohol getting a criminal record.

No way would I do it, if I had the slightest inkling, i would ask for ID and if they don't have it I'd refuse and take the abuse.

Having the business closed down for any length of time could put the business in jeopardy.

It does happen:

http://www.kilkennypeople.ie/local-court-cases/Pubs-closed-for-underage-drinking.1395162.jp


http://www.barkeeper.ie/News_Item.asp?News_ID=440

Given neither of those cases involves a drivers license , i don't see how it's relevant ?

Lollipops23

calex71 wrote: »

Lmao was he Irish ? If not then maybe where he's from it is law, but if he was Irish lol @ him.

he was irish, fairly young too. myself and my best mate(who's 3 years older than me) were going to the bar at the Olympia when we were at a Jimmy Eat World gig. For a start it was an over 18s gig, so it was reasonable to assume we were adults. also,niether of us look remotley younger than our ages, i look older than 22 for a start!

i did question him about that,he said it was the law.

PacManFan

foggy_lad wrote: »

was in tescos a few weeks ago late at night and three young lads were at the till with three bottles of spirits and they all looked underage(aqbout 14years old) but the woman at the till ignored what they looked like and proceeded to accept a passport from one of them who is under 18 but most likely using an older brothers passport,

i suggested they should insist on a driving license at least as what lad over 18 is not going to have this? a passport may be left lying around for a younger sibling to find and use in off licenses but most young people over 18 will carry their driving license around with them. needless to say my suggestion was ignored so i stated very clearly that the youth in question was under 18 but again was ignored. so much for off-licenses being responsible!

Just wanted to point out that Tesco stores nationwide have a policy that only passports and Garda ID cards are to be accepted as forms of ID. The cashiers don't have a choice in this, and they could get into trouble if they accept anything else.

Tar.Aldarion

'We only accept your most valuable form of ID or the most easily faked card ever'


Also, you are not meant to take your passport around with you on every day business, no?

PacManFan

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

'We only accept your most valuable form of ID or the most easily faked card ever'

If you're talking about the Garda ID card, then as far as I'm aware by law it must be accepted as a form of proof of age.

wmpdd3

I don't know why drivers licences aren't taken and age cards are. I have seen a few fake age cards alright. I have also seen foreign drivers licence with out pic or American ones that look really fake but are not.

Actually Americans are the easiest to deal with they have no porb. leaving the drink behind and coming back with their passport.

Could we say only Irish Drivers licences?


I agree at €75, I wouldn't have my passport unless I'm leaving the country.

What's the alternative?

Is it really not reasonable to ask all under 25 to have an age card?

What really does annoy me is the over reaction of people when they are refused drink.

One customer even called the police because she didn't like the fact her little boy was treated like a criminal in the shop when his boose was taken from him.

Soundman

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I've also been told by a total bollix of a bouncer that the law requires people to always carry a form of ID with them...??

As I said earlier on...

Soundman wrote: »

If I recall, the law also states that if you are under the age of 26, or can be mistaken for being under 26, then you must carry a legal form of ID to gain entry to a licensed premises or to buy alcohol in a shop or off-licence.

Rev. Kitchen

The missus who is 25 went into tesco bought some fags from the woman at the counter then decided she wanted a bottle of wine, went to pay for that and was asked for ID she laughed but handed over the driver licence and she was refused. Said they only took Garda ID.

Never mind that she just bought fags which you have to be over 18 to do from the same woman !!!

axer

My understanding is a club/pub etc can accept or refuse any id they want since they have the right to chose their customers (as long as they are not discrimminating). Basically they don't "have" to do anything.

meathstevie

The reason why driving licences are not as accepted as passports and age cards is the fact that a load of underage people have been using fake driving licences to gain entry to clubs. International convention is that the only legitimate means of identification is a passport or a state issued identity card.

ShooterSF

Age cards are just as easy to fake. A friend of mine used to have one so I used my license as ID, back when I still had my age card (so they didn't have a fake and a real in their hands at the same time). I used to laugh to myself when the barstaff told me I should "have one of these" pointing to my mates forged Age card.
When I worked behind a bar we were told to accept only licenses and passports and NOT the age card. As far as I know OP they can do as they like.
Recently I went to tesco and was getting a case of beer with half a trolley of shopping. Lady at the counter asked me for ID (Im 25) and I handed her the license. You can guess what happened. I showed her my Credit Card also in my name but to no avail. I realise now it's store policy but I'm sure the member of staff that put back the shopping I left sitting at the till isn't too fond of it!

Monkey61

I've been refused service before in Tesco and in a local garage because my passport wasn't accepted as a valid form of ID and I was told that I had to have an age card! It is a passport ffs. Surely the most valid form of ID one can have and hardly easy to fake??

I'm lucky/unlucky in that I am 26 but could still probably pass for 16 at a push. Apart from the hassle I do get quite a lot of joy out of the shocked looks on the faces of bar staff when I show my ID and they realise that I am a couple of years older than they are.

On the subject of age cards though - would they be accepted as valid ID in foreign countries?

axer

I think it really does depends on who you are dealing with as to which is an acceptable form of ID.

If someone came to me with a forged passport - I wouldn't know the difference because I am not trained in looking for the security markings etc. The ID used is only as good as the person checking it.

The Age card is not a form of ID thus is not accepted in other countries. It is only proof of age in Ireland.

daheff

Soundman wrote: »

As I said earlier on...

slight difference in what lollipops said and what you are saying soundman...you are talking about entering a licensed premises...lollipops is saying at all times (even though the incident occured on a licensed premises)

i heard Luas staff quote this line too when trying to get peoples details.

maglite

Soundman wrote: »

If I recall, the law also states...you must carry a legal form of ID to gain entry to a licensed premises....

care to point out where that is said in the oireachtas ??

Soundman

maglite wrote: »

care to point out where that is said in the oireachtas ??

I think you missed a bit of what I was saying there maglite. On purpose or not I don't know.

What I did say was:

If I recall, the law also states that if you are under the age of 26, or can be mistaken for being under 26, then you must carry a legal form of ID to gain entry to a licensed premises or to buy alcohol in a shop or off-licence.

This was told to our security staff and I by members of the Garda Siochana on numerous occasions when they were dealing with young guys and girls outside our premises trying to get in without a valid form of ID.