Ruby V McCoy

Kauto

Just to state im not a fan of either. But for my money Ruby is by far the better jockey. A race where it was highlighted was the novice hurdle in Galway. If Ruby was on Glenstal Abbey he would have won the race. Same cant be said if McCoy was on Fair Duels. Again i would say Ruby would have won on the Glenstal Abbey last night in Sligo whereas McCoy somehow managed to get beat.
We all see mcCoy is great pushing the head of some donkey in Strafford on a Wet Wednesday but ruby to me just looks the far superior jockey. He has a better racing brain, better style in the saddle and to my mind is every bit as strong as McCoy in a finish as was highlighted in Galway.

Morgans

McCoy is very very good, just not as good as a lot of people think. He isnt the greatest ever and is probably not the greatest riding at the moment. I think he is one of the best personalities of the jockeys with engaging with very little nonsense from presenters but with a clear wit and intelligence. Surpreme will to win.

Whyno

Kauto wrote: »

Just to state im not a fan of either. But for my money Ruby is by far the better jockey. A race where it was highlighted was the novice hurdle in Galway. If Ruby was on Glenstal Abbey he would have won the race. Same cant be said if McCoy was on Fair Duels. Again i would say Ruby would have won on the Glenstal Abbey last night in Sligo whereas McCoy somehow managed to get beat.
We all see mcCoy is great pushing the head of some donkey in Strafford on a Wet Wednesday but ruby to me just looks the far superior jockey. He has a better racing brain, better style in the saddle and to my mind is every bit as strong as McCoy in a finish as was highlighted in Galway.

Do you ever stop talking bulls1t out of your pocket. Stop backing odds on runners in the summer on soft ground imo.
Wait til ruby gets stuffed on a 1/2 favourite and youll be back on calling for ruby to retire.
Tony McCoy is the best nh jockey on the planet. Ruby is a very very close second. 2 completely differnent styles but both very effective and get the job done. Ruby is involved wit the 2 top nh stables in the uk & gb and gets to ride far more superstars than McCoy.
As for that race in galway the uphill finish suited dual gales because he wants further and the run to the line blunted GAs finishing speed.
As for wha happened in sligo yesterday evening i lol at your comment.The ground was knee deep and a mudlark won the race from GA who clearly didnt see out the trip on bottomless ground.

jayroyal

Ruby's a far far better jockey , mccoy lost the champion hurdle any other jockey bar mccoy would have won . He's great at banging the whip out , on bad horses but he's not as good a ruby or davy russel. He just can't sit easy on a horse , i don't think he can read a race half as well as ruby. I never back mccoy cause he whiping away after three furlongs. Mccoys the midweek rider but that about it.
Ruby is NUMBER 1

Whyno

jayroyal wrote: »

Ruby's a far far better jockey , mccoy lost the champion hurdle any other jockey bar mccoy would have won . He's great at banging the whip out , on bad horses but he's not as good a ruby or davy russel. He just can't sit easy on a horse , i don't think he can read a race half as well as ruby. I never back mccoy cause he whiping away after three furlongs. Mccoys the midweek rider but that about it.
Ruby is NUMBER 1

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::eek::eek::eek:

fintonie

the difference is when it comes to the big races ruby will pick the right horse mcoy falls down on this most times, ruby is the best by far.

Whyno

fintonie wrote: »

the difference is when it comes to the big races ruby will pick the right horse mcoy falls down on this most times, ruby is the best by far.

Give an example of this like a good man......:(

fintonie

Whyno wrote: »

Give an example of this like a good man......:(

so you have not noticed my good man are you wearing blinkers;)

Whyno

fintonie wrote: »

so you have not noticed my good man are you wearing blinkers;)

I gather you cant back it up. Crawl back under your stone and come back wit some examples and then we'll agree to disagree. Until then stop boring me

fintonie

Whyno wrote: »

I gather you cant back it up. Crawl back under your stone and come back wit some examples and then we'll agree to disagree. Until then stop boring me

so he has been top jockey at the big meetings how many times, give him the ride he will win, let him pick he makes a mess of it, but you didn't notice this,
you do love him.

mike65

Wichita Lineman

Enough said.

Whyno

fintonie wrote: »

so he has been top jockey at the big meetings how many times, give him the ride he will win, let him pick he makes a mess of it, but you didn't notice this,
you do love him.

lol @ you, McCoy is retained by jp to ride all his horses most of which wouldnt run to heat thereselves. Ruby is stable jockey for willie mullins & Paul Nicholls both champion trainers with any amount of superstars in their yards. Ruby is top jockey at the big meetings because he gets to ride the best horses end of story nothing to do wit him being a great jockey which he truly is. For gods sake ive never sat on a horse in my life and i could win on some of the machines ruby has rode.
Wichita lineman mike is wha i gather your refering to the ride in chel....Unreal

fintonie

Whyno wrote: »

lol @ you, McCoy is retained by jp to ride all his horses most of which wouldnt run to heat thereselves. Ruby is stable jockey for willie mullins & Paul Nicholls both champion trainers with any amount of superstars in their yards. Ruby is top jockey at the big meetings because he gets to ride the best horses end of story nothing to do wit him being a great jockey which he truly is. For gods sake ive never sat on a horse in my life and i could win on some of the machines ruby has rode.
Wichita lineman mike is wha i gather your refering to the ride in chel....Unreal

go back over the last 5yrs when it comes to the big meetings where the jockey decides he falls short like quantum falling, but im not saying he is a bad jockey, there was a time he was riding copious amounts of horses for the best stables in Britain but his eye is skew wayed

Kauto

Just to state i do not back odds on shots. I mostly lay these sort of horses especially on soft summer ground as you state. I just think that ruby has a great racing brain that is light years ahead of McCoy. McCoy doesnt have the ability to sit still on a horse. Ruby can do it all ways. As i said i dont like either of them so i would think i am unbiased.

fintonie

OK this got a little out of hand (no pun) so I will break it down for you, simplify it like,

McCoy = good strong jockey

ruby ten times better.

Slimity

Completely different styles, hard to compare them. But if you owned a horse that was favourite for the Gold Cup say, who would you want on your horse? My choice would be Walsh.

Morgans

That's about right. Not that McCoy wouldnt win on most. However, if you wanted one to win a seller at Fontwell, it would be McCoy every time.

I do tire when McCoy in an all-out drive gets one up in the last 50 yards, its all down to McCoy, The horse got the McCoy treatment...blah..blah...blah. But when he loses in an all-out drive the winning jockey never gets any credit. The idea that some in the media seem to propogate that if McCoy is leading or upsides at the last, his strength means you are likely to win (he will be carried home), when in fact you are as likely to win with most other jockeys on board.

Some call him the greatest jockey. I'd have him fourth in the current crop, but he does have the greatest will-power and maybe from what Ive heard probably the soundest of the top riders.

Whyno

Kauto wrote: »

Just to state i do not back odds on shots. I mostly lay these sort of horses especially on soft summer ground as you state. I just think that ruby has a great racing brain that is light years ahead of McCoy. McCoy doesnt have the ability to sit still on a horse. Ruby can do it all ways. As i said i dont like either of them so i would think i am unbiased.

What about his rides on exotic dancer. The man has ode 3k plus winners and will continue to ride over 4k.
He has a majestic racing brain and its impossible to measure him to ruby in my opinion.
As i said 2 completely different styles but both very effective.
All we have to do is compare both jockeys rides on Brave Inca. simple thing is that they both won on him riding slightly different ways. Mccoy slighty more forceful and ruby a bit more stylishly but same result.

eagle eye

Some awful bull**** being spouted in this thread.

We all know who the op likes, well I did before I even opened the thread.

Anybody with at least a bit of cop on or an unbiased person would have Ruby Vs AP or AP vs Ruby or Walsh vs McCoy, but Ruby vs McCoy:pac: its just gives it away.

I'm not taking sides either, the two best I've ever seen. Why do we have to pick one.

I will say that if there was a gun to my head and I needed a horse to win a hurdle race to save my life, I would go for AP. If it was a 2 1/2 mile chase I'd take Ruby.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

premierstone

jayroyal wrote: »

Ruby's a far far better jockey , mccoy lost the champion hurdle any other jockey bar mccoy would have won . He's great at banging the whip out , on bad horses but he's not as good a ruby or davy russel. He just can't sit easy on a horse , i don't think he can read a race half as well as ruby. I never back mccoy cause he whiping away after three furlongs. Mccoys the midweek rider but that about it.
Ruby is NUMBER 1

Watch a video of the ride McCoy gave Straw Bear to beat Harchibald in a Christmas Hurdle and tell me that McCoy cant sit on a horse or ride a tactial race, this thread just about sums up this forum tbh a load of crap been spoute by people that no fcuk all only who rode the last looser they backed :mad:

To compare the two is pointless and stupid tbh, both legends of the sport and will be remebered as two of if not thee two greatest of all time.

Morgans

Why is it so stupid or pointless to compare the two?

Sure, its pointless to compare any horses/jockeys if that attitude was taken,

yet you follow up that statement by comparing them to the other jockeys like Francome, Maloney, Carberry, Dunwoody, Winter when you say that they (McCoy and Ruby) are the two greatest of all time.

premierstone

Morgans wrote: »

Why is it so stupid or pointless to compare the two?

Sure, its pointless to compare any horses/jockeys if that attitude was taken,

yet you follow up that statement by comparing them to the other jockeys like Francome, Maloney, Carberry, Dunwoody, Winter when you say that they (McCoy and Ruby) are the two greatest of all time.

It is pointless because you cant there are too many variables and it is impossible to have a definitive answer.

And I did not say they are the two greatest of all time, I said they are two of the greatest, there is a difference.

Also I notice you said you would have McCoy fourth in the current jockeys, please do enlighten us as to who the other two superior Jockeys are (Im assuming Ruby is one of them although if you only reate McCoy as 4th god only knows)

Morgans

You seem to assume you know more than me Premierstone, despite once again you saying that judging the difference between jockeys with all the variables and differences never allow for a definite answer.

I personally think Carberry and Murphy are more talented. Probably the most naturally talented riding at the moment. Murphy on Witicha Lineman at Chepstow was every inch as good as McCoy at Cheltenham in my opinion. Each of course has their flaws, but there you go. And also, in the last year, I think Choc Thornton could in fact be better that the lot if he carries on the way he is going. Probably the most consistent jockey at the moment.

And I wouldnt neccessarily have Ruby on top of the pile at the moment. Two years ago, yes i would have, but he rode poorly last year on several occasions. Maybe ego getting in the way a bit and often horses got him out of trouble. I think the ride he gave Mikhal d'Haguenet at cheltenham was desperate. Townend got several horses to jump better than Ruby last year. Kempes - Ballytrim to name two.

There are plenty like Whyno who use the 3000+ wins to argue that McCoy is the greatest jockey of all time simply because of the stats. I take it that these must think Richard Johnson is the second best.

I think its a given that all comparisons are pointless. Sure who knows if Arkle was better than Kauto Star or Sea the Stars was better than Brigadier Gerard. None of it matters really.

And you said "if not the two greatest of all time" suggesting to me in some way that you think that they might be.

deccy15

jayroyal wrote: »

Ruby's a far far better jockey , mccoy lost the champion hurdle any other jockey bar mccoy would have won . He's great at banging the whip out , on bad horses but he's not as good a ruby or davy russel. He just can't sit easy on a horse , i don't think he can read a race half as well as ruby. I never back mccoy cause he whiping away after three furlongs. Mccoys the midweek rider but that about it.
Ruby is NUMBER 1

the fact that no-one in the history of nh racing has ever rode as many winners as ap mccoy answers the question!!! ruby rode some ''bad'' mullins horses at galway all week and didn't win on 1 of them (dual gales had some good maiden form). and as for reading a race ,its easy 2 just sit there and wait when ur sittin on the best horse in the race as ruby usually is!!

AP McCOY, BEST NH JOCKEY EVER!!!!!!

halfthetrack

Ruby by a landslide, that ride by McCoy on Glenstal abbey was a disgrace, he ran wide all the way round looking for better ground and cruised up beside and didnt kick on, out battled on the run in, mccoy hasnt got Rubys timing he only knows one way to ride makes a balls of it everytime he is on a good thing. McCoys record speaks for itself at the big festivals anyone can get a win riding for top stables in stratford during the week. I'D lay McCoy all day overrated

Rickos

Kauto wrote: »

Just to state im not a fan of either. But for my money Ruby is by far the better jockey. A race where it was highlighted was the novice hurdle in Galway. If Ruby was on Glenstal Abbey he would have won the race. Same cant be said if McCoy was on Fair Duels. Again i would say Ruby would have won on the Glenstal Abbey last night in Sligo whereas McCoy somehow managed to get beat.
We all see mcCoy is great pushing the head of some donkey in Strafford on a Wet Wednesday but ruby to me just looks the far superior jockey. He has a better racing brain, better style in the saddle and to my mind is every bit as strong as McCoy in a finish as was highlighted in Galway.

I was lucky enough to talk to Ruby on the Thursday night - the day of the race you refer to. He discussed his ride on Corrick Bridge and said he had to gather the horse after it hit the fence which stopped its momemntum - he didn't stop riding, or give up, he just had to get the horse settled.

We then discussed the race in question, and his simple argument was that he was on the better horse. He said it was as simple as that. MAybe he was being modest, but maybe he was telling the truth.

Yes, McCoy's ride on Wichita Lineman was brilliant - McCoy at his best. But for me Ruby is the better jockey. I know he has the two powerful stables behind him, but doesn't that say everything?

Either way, this is a golden era for jump jockeys what with McCoy, Ruby, Davey Russell, Barry Geraghty and I still like Paul Carberry. However, for me Ruby is the best.

Whyno

Morgans wrote: »

You seem to assume you know more than me Premierstone, despite once again you saying that judging the difference between jockeys with all the variables and differences never allow for a definite answer.

I personally think Carberry and Murphy are more talented. Probably the most naturally talented riding at the moment. Murphy on Witicha Lineman at Chepstow was every inch as good as McCoy at Cheltenham in my opinion. Each of course has their flaws, but there you go. And also, in the last year, I think Choc Thornton could in fact be better that the lot if he carries on the way he is going. Probably the most consistent jockey at the moment.

And I wouldnt neccessarily have Ruby on top of the pile at the moment. Two years ago, yes i would have, but he rode poorly last year on several occasions. Maybe ego getting in the way a bit and often horses got him out of trouble. I think the ride he gave Mikhal d'Haguenet at cheltenham was desperate. Townend got several horses to jump better than Ruby last year. Kempes - Ballytrim to name two.

There are plenty like Whyno who use the 3000+ wins to argue that McCoy is the greatest jockey of all time simply because of the stats. I take it that these must think Richard Johnson is the second best.

I think its a given that all comparisons are pointless. Sure who knows if Arkle was better than Kauto Star or Sea the Stars was better than Brigadier Gerard. None of it matters really.

And you said "if not the two greatest of all time" suggesting to me in some way that you think that they might be.

I used this as a positive in McCoys defence. As i`ve stated its impossible to compare the two imo. Both diffeent styles but very EFFECTIVE.All jockeys have their faults but these two sit on top of the pile in their trade. As for the ride on glenstal abbey sure wouldnt it make sense to ride the horse round the inner in the slop and run the geebag outta him so he`d be lucky to finish the race.Makes perfect sense doesnt it:rolleyes:
This thread is starting to get repetitive and thus a dose of bullsh1t. On to the top 5 jockeys and make sure and view mine

premierstone

Morgans wrote: »

You seem to assume you know more than me Premierstone, despite once again you saying that judging the difference between jockeys with all the variables and differences never allow for a definite answer.

I personally think Carberry and Murphy are more talented. Probably the most naturally talented riding at the moment. moment.

It may come as a suprise to you but I agree re. Murphy and Carberry, but to me who has the most talent and who is the better jockey are two entirely different propositions, for my money Carberry is the most talented and most natural ''horse man'' I have ever seen

Sizzler

Well after seeing Ruby repeat his trick of his ride on Deutschland in the last race at Ballinrobe last night on board Coffee Tea or Me and letting the leader get a 10L start with 2f to go :rolleyes:, I am going to say McCoy.

What people have to realise is JP McManus does not have anything within an a$$ses roar of quality compared to the horses that Ruby generally rides for the Nicholls & Mullins yards.

Morgans

I think most people know that its very very rare for a jockey to win a race, but its far more common for a jockey to lose a race. Because Ruby wins for Nicholls and Mullins doesnt mean he is the best. Just as when Scudamore was winning for Pipe, he was never really classed as the best of his generation. Dunwoody and Maguire (never champion) were miles ahead of him.