A6 2.0 tdi e or bmw 520d

ashleey

Looking for a nice saloon car next year. Has anyone compared the audi vs the bmw? I've always driven audis but the small engine a6 seemed a bit disappointing when i drove one as a loan car last year. Does anyone have any views given that the audi is a bit cheaper and there's a new 5 series coming soon?

EPM

I'd still pick the 520d over the A6 even if they new one was coming. You could use it as leverage to get a better deal

R.O.R

EPM wrote: »

I'd still pick the 520d over the A6 even if they new one was coming. You could use it as leverage to get a better deal

I've just been pricing a 5 Series for a customer. They are now offering a Business Edition for around €1,300 more than the SE which gets Business Navigation System, Integrated Bluetooth (usually around €1,300 alone), CD Changer and Dakota Leather.

Probably to try an kick start stagnant 5 Series sales. The A6 isn't bad but I'd take the 5 as well.

Or, I might be tempted to save over €10k and get a Superb 2.0Tdi 170ps DSG Elegance which is better specced and bigger inside.

Zonda999

R.O.R wrote: »

I've just been pricing a 5 Series for a customer. They are now offering a Business Edition for around €1,300 more than the SE which gets Business Navigation System, Integrated Bluetooth (usually around €1,300 alone), CD Changer and Dakota Leather.

So i guess this is the beginning of the end of the current model!

ashleey

The new 5 series would be nice if the bank manager is in a good mood. Slightly off thread, is there much room in the back of an a5? Say for 3 kids under 6?

-Chris-

The A5 only has 4 belts, so won't take 3 kids in the back.

BMW did the same thing last time with the Comfort Pack on the 5 Series - you'd get leather, alloys and a few other bits for cheap enough money.

ashleey

At least that narrows down the choices. Thanks for info. Hate visiting dealers without all the facts

tweaf

A6 everytime.

-Chris-

ashleey wrote: »

Does anyone have any views given that the audi is a bit cheaper

What's your budget, Ashleey? We'll pick a spec and see how it measures up the the Beemer.

bazzachazza

I had a spare couple of hours a few weeks ago and went back into a BMW dealer and a Merc dealer just to make sure I made the right choice when I got my A6.

First the BMW 5 series.

In plain Jane spec it looked slightly bland outside. M spec on the 3 and 5 is what I feel should be standard.

Inside it doesn't set my world alight. The dash area is not to my liking but that would probably change if I actually owned one. Rear passenger space is good but I found rear wheel arches force your arm up which I found ok sitting in it but might become annoying over longer periods of time.

Cheapest I could find on BMW.IE is €47400 for a 170 odd bhp diesel maybe there is cheaper.



Now for the new Merc E class.

Not overly keen on the new front two squareish headlights didn't appeal to me. There are also more sharp angles all around the car.

Inside its nice but they do continue the square sharp angle theme.

Cheapest starts about €43600 or so for the 170bhp diesel version.


The Audi gives it a good run but not in basic spec.

E engine is similar to outgoing in power but is cleaner so cheaper road tax.

Its a comfortable car to drive I have the 170bhp diesel and I find it great to drive and last tank returned 48.4mpg.

Its well loaded but you will still find yourself looking at the options list.

In certain specs its only a couple of thousand more than an similar A4.

The A4 is a good car but again you will find yourself wanting to add to it .

I looked briefly at the 3 series but find it too small in the rear and boot and ended up costing too much to get one spec'd like I wanted.

bazz26

Surely there is a new A6 in the pipeline too over the next 18 to 24 months or so? The current model has been around since early 2004 which is about 12 months after the current 5 Series was launched.

As ugly as the E60 is from certain angles, I still would choice it over the A6. I just cannot warm to the A6, the interior is too conservatively styled for me.

Zonda999

bazz26 wrote: »

Surely there is a new A6 in the pipeline too over the next 18 to 24 months or so? The current model has been around since early 2004 which is about 12 months after the current 5 Series was launched.

As ugly as the E60 is from certain angles, I still would choice it over the A6. I just cannot warm to the A6, the interior is too conservatively styled for me.

2012 before the next gen A6 will land on our shores, Chris said once

bazzachazza

New A6 due in 2011/12.



As for the interior its a personal thing. You either like certain things or you don't.

Zonda999

I'd prefer if it went more along these lines:)

bazz26

Looks like the Audi designers are getting very lazy, could easily be an A4 or A5 Sportback.

-Chris-

All manufacturers work to have a common look across all their cars. It's hardly laziness... :rolleyes:

Zonda999

bazz26 wrote: »

Looks like the Audi designers are getting very lazy, could easily be an A4 or A5 Sportback.

There is absolutely nothing official about either of those pics to be fair. In bazzachazza's pic, from that angle, i couldn't tell it from a current A4, or an A5 sportback for that matter

bazzachazza

I think there artist impressions.

No official pictures available yet.

mickdw

I think the new E Class (with proper spec and wheels) would be the pick.

Out of the A6 & 5 series, its hard to decide. New model 5 coming soon although better car all round than A6. I wouldnt buy either at the present time

-Chris-

Zonda999 wrote: »

There is absolutely nothing official about either of those pics to be fair. In bazzachazza's pic, from that angle, i couldn't tell it from a current A4, or an A5 sportback for that matter

bazzachazza wrote: »

I think there artist impressions.

No official pictures available yet.

Autoblog think the new A6'll be based on the Sportback Coupe, which is possibly the A7.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/07/13/rendered-speculation-2011-audi-a6/

bazz26

While it is true that every model within a manufacturer's range has a similar corporate identification I think they still need to distinquish one model from another in their range a little bit more other than size. They are only artist's impressions so maybe the artist is just being lazy and will reserve judgement on the finished product.

Anyway this is going way OT.

ashleey

I like and am familiar with audi interiors and know the options. Bmw are more bland inside but all reviewers say they drive best. Maybe the merc will be the best financial decision. Wouldn't want to lash out about than 40k minus trade in and also pick the worst depreciating model. Is the e class for the older person though?

mickdw

ashleey wrote: »

Is the e class for the older person though?

Some would say it is but im 30 and would consider one instead of my A5

Zonda999

ashleey wrote: »

Is the e class for the older person though?

No more than an A6 or a 5 series IMO. Just because your not a senior citizen, doesnt mean that you have to put up with the rough ride in the 5 series. In terms of resale value, though, it is hard to see the others keeping their value as well as a new model E220cdi, a couple of years down the line

bazzachazza

I feel its aimed more at the 35+ man than anything younger. Hence the Noel Edmonds driving his new wife and kids.

Where as the C class is a bit younger manish a bit more aggressive looking



This is one Artist impression of the new 5 series due mid 2010



Spyshot

ashleey

I'm 40 and now petrified of being associated with noel edmonds. Had an s line a6 uk import before and was totally unsuited to any road outside germany. If the 5 series is similar then it has to be a merc. Pity it's the most expensive. Is the auto ok for the 220 cdi? It will help resale but cost in tax band

Zonda999

ashleey wrote: »

Is the auto ok for the 220 cdi? It will help resale but cost in tax band

Because the 220cdi would be a base model, i dont think an auto would be absolutely necessary, unlike in a bigger engine. You see plenty manual 520d's around. An auto will also shove up the initial price too of course

-Chris-

In my experience, being a non-auto punished Mercs far more than it punished any of the other brands, especially in the larger cars like the E-Class.
Do your research on that one, OP.

ashleey

All of a sudden it's bigger engines and autos. I may as well import a 3 year old a8 like i want to but my wife doesn't.

-Chris-

Nah, not really.

My €0.02:
Stay with the A6 2.0TDi, 520d or E220CDi.
Manual or auto in the Audi or Beemer, Auto only in the Merc.
My preference is auto in any of them, because I think it suits the size.
Leather is preferable.
Classy colours (silver, navy, black, grey) with a plush interior (black or beige leather, put wood in a beige interior).


Go secondhand and bigger if you want, the early '00 7-Series owners will be here in a moment, don't worry...
You'll need to get that one past the wife though - debadging may be in order???

ashleey

Makes sense. I'm back to the a6 as the cheapest option and the nicest interior but worst ride. It would be nice if they could manage to pep the engine up to 170 and still keep the co2 at 139

galwaytt

mickdw wrote: »

Some would say it is but im 30 and would consider one instead of my A5

...changing an A5 already ..? why, out of curiousity ?

OP - Audi would be my choice bar one thing: we've an 09 Multitronic 2.0 Tdi at work.......gorgeous. Suspension very firm, though. Too firm, really.........in all other respects, nicer than the 5. So maybe you need to drive, both.

E-class........mmm, apart from the sheer ugliness of it, it'd be a fine car.

Auto in all 3, and don't even dream of a manual Merc - you'll be 'married' to it for life.

EPM

ashleey wrote: »

Makes sense. I'm back to the a6 as the cheapest option and the nicest interior but worst ride. It would be nice if they could manage to pep the engine up to 170 and still keep the co2 at 139

Once you buy it you can get it remapped. The 140 brake diesel can achieve 180+ brake. This will affect your warranty if the dealer found out mind. Maybe Audi do a dealer approved remap?

R.O.R

ashleey wrote: »

Makes sense. I'm back to the a6 as the cheapest option and the nicest interior but worst ride. It would be nice if they could manage to pep the engine up to 170 and still keep the co2 at 139

Manual or Auto the 170 version is only in the 20% VRT bracket so €302 per year to tax and only carries a €1,370 premium over the 136bhp version.

I'll reserve judgement on the E-Class until I see one up close.

I'd take a Skoda Superb any day over an A6, but I'm not bothered about the badge like some folk are, but I'd take a 520d over all the options posted - preferably in M-Sport spec.

sk8board

Is the ride in the s-line A6 really as bad as everyone makes out?

It'd be my choice out of the 3, but probably not if its a back-breaker

ashleey

I had an 06 avant 3.0 litre diesel but i had to change it when the 4th child arrived. It was a uk car and so low that i was nervous of grounding it all the time. The irish ones aren't lowered as much, only to 'sports suspension' setting. I think the se setting wouldn't be too bad. It then points back to the bmw especially as their new releases are softer than the outgoing models. Then it's a choice between a 170 a6 se and the new 520d when it arrives next year. Bmw pricing will be interesting given the fall in the merc price.

conor_mc

ashleey wrote: »

I had an 06 avant 3.0 litre diesel but i had to change it when the 4th child arrived. It was a uk car and so low that i was nervous of grounding it all the time. The irish ones aren't lowered as much, only to 'sports suspension' setting. I think the se setting wouldn't be too bad. It then points back to the bmw especially as their new releases are softer than the outgoing models. Then it's a choice between a 170 a6 se and the new 520d when it arrives next year. Bmw pricing will be interesting given the fall in the merc price.

The A6 SE isn't supposed to be as bad as the S-line, HOWEVER..... the TDIe is dropped 20mm or so for aerodynamic/efficiency reasons, so that might put it somewhere between the s-line and the regular SE for ride comfort even though it's standard suspension and still on 17's.

sk8board

so the s-line is a back-breaker?

I commute mainly on M1/M50, and was looking at the s-line A6 avant.

drove my brothers s-line A4 last week, and though it was a bit harsh/rigid

Biro

R.O.R wrote: »

Manual or Auto the 170 version is only in the 20% VRT bracket so €302 per year to tax and only carries a €1,370 premium over the 136bhp version.

I'll reserve judgement on the E-Class until I see one up close.

I'd take a Skoda Superb any day over an A6, but I'm not bothered about the badge like some folk are, but I'd take a 520d over all the options posted - preferably in M-Sport spec.

The badge on the Superb doesn't bother me in the slightest either. It's the uglyness of the thing that bothers me the most! How could they make such a balls of it?

R.O.R

Biro wrote: »

The badge on the Superb doesn't bother me in the slightest either. It's the uglyness of the thing that bothers me the most! How could they make such a balls of it?

But you don't notice that when you are sat in the luxurious cabin, messing around with the touch screen radio

It's the trick saloon/hatch boot which throws it out of proportion. A price I'd be willing to pay for the savings and extra space over an A6.

EPM

Biro wrote: »

The badge on the Superb doesn't bother me in the slightest either. It's the uglyness of the thing that bothers me the most! How could they make such a balls of it?

Problem solved:D

kayos

sk8board wrote: »

so the s-line is a back-breaker?

I commute mainly on M1/M50, and was looking at the s-line A6 avant.

drove my brothers s-line A4 last week, and though it was a bit harsh/rigid

Hmmm I find this hard to understand, I have a UK import s-line A6 2.0TDI with the sports suspension. I find it lovely on the roads unless you are hitting the really bad pot holed roads we have around the place but I would not expect that to be nice in any car.

bazzachazza

ashleey wrote: »

Makes sense. I'm back to the a6 as the cheapest option and the nicest interior but worst ride. It would be nice if they could manage to pep the engine up to 170 and still keep the co2 at 139

Go for the 170bhp one, great engine and the suspension is not lowered. I personally have to say I love the ride its a lot softer than the S40 I just sold. Eats any of the bumps and small potholes that would normally have jarred me in the S40.

sk8board

kayos wrote: »

Hmmm I find this hard to understand, I have a UK import s-line A6 2.0TDI with the sports suspension. I find it lovely on the roads unless you are hitting the really bad pot holed roads we have around the place but I would not expect that to be nice in any car.

you're right; I found it great on good roads, but on the back roads you had to back off a little (nor was I travelling at all fast to begin with), and you could really feel it on speed bumps and such, irrespective of speed.
I'd say its that I'm not used to sports suspensions, and used to the fluffy ride of a renault.

You've appeased my hesitation either way. As I said, its a 26mile commute over motorway mainly, and the A6 does the job nicely for much less cost than the 5-series for a 3yo one. Theres not that many A6 s-line's about either, especially the Avant.

ashleey

Thanks all for a great discussion. Looks like a 170 a6 2.0 tdi se is the winner on the price, interior, suspension comfort and tax bracket compromise. I was tempted by a skoda but the ancient pd engine rules it out. Now to find a friendly dealer. We live in kilkenny and travel to donegal alot hence the worry about ride.

bazzachazza

May I suggest Foster motors in Dublin always pleasant to deal with or Robbie in Western Motors in Drogheda just off the M1.

I bought there and got a very good deal.

ashleey

Appreciate that. Discounts don't exist down our end of the country.

sk8board

ashleey wrote: »

We live in kilkenny and travel to donegal alot hence the worry about ride.

I travelled from KK as far as Athlone (same road as donegal I would guess) just last weekend, and averaged just 62kmph over a 125km journey! Thats how bad the roads are; definitely don't go with the s-line

R.O.R

ashleey wrote: »

Thanks all for a great discussion. Looks like a 170 a6 2.0 tdi se is the winner on the price, interior, suspension comfort and tax bracket compromise. I was tempted by a skoda but the ancient pd engine rules it out. Now to find a friendly dealer. We live in kilkenny and travel to donegal alot hence the worry about ride.

Superb 170 is the CR engine as well, the 140 is the old PD.

Bit out of your way, but Newmarket Motors in Co. Cork are very good to deal with (Bernard on the Audi side of things).

kayos

sk8board wrote: »

you're right; I found it great on good roads, but on the back roads you had to back off a little (nor was I travelling at all fast to begin with), and you could really feel it on speed bumps and such, irrespective of speed.
I'd say its that I'm not used to sports suspensions, and used to the fluffy ride of a renault.

Na the only reason I back off on the back roads is dodgy corners and a big lump of a car going around them and road too narrow .

I should have added my last everyday car was on coilovers and setup for the track so anything would be comfy compared to that. But on the flip side I think there is nothing worse than getting into a car that has a very soft suspension set-up.

I do a lot of driving and take in everything from motorway to twisty narrow crappy back roads. I get about 52mpg on the long runs and well I wont mention inner city driving as tbh my last 1.8T petrol was lighter on the fuel around town than the A6 .

ashleey

Thanks again. It looks like a false economy to go with the 'e' version and the standard black with black leather looks good. I don't think the irish se version comes with sat nav whereas the uk ones do. The 170 is quite rare in the uk though so finding a 6 month old post facelift one will be tricky. Will try maybe around september. Unless there will be good deals for new january ones from the dealers mentioned and use garmin to save a couple of grand on satnav