Stepson out of jail, what to do?

mirwillbeback

Hi,

Long time advice giver, shoe on the other foot now.

With my gf 10 years this year, her husband died of cancer a few years before, she had 2 boys when I met her, since then we've had another 2 - loads of testosterone in the house

Get on great with her 2nd eldest, ( 19 ) a real treasure and we're like father and son. My two boys are 6 & 3, amazing kids and we have a great little close knit family.

Problem is her eldest, now 22. He's been out of our house since he was 15, went down a bad road, dealing drugs, robbing cars and eventually 2 armed robberies he's been inside for last 3 years for. He came out this week, despite what I feel about him and how he's treated him mam for the last 7 years, I agreed to say nothing apart from that he isn't welcome in our house.

Well, since he came out on Monday, he's been evicted from where he was meant to stay, lost his sheet that he's to get signed every day for probation, called his mam 3 times saying sh!te like " you're my mam, you need to sort it out " or " so your two younger boys are more important than me ".

Anyways, my gf is very upset over his attitude and the fact he's gone right back into his drug taking gang of wasters. I am absolutely at boiling point. I gave him a hiding once before when he tried to kick in our front door and threaten her ( not knowing I was on a half day from work ) and I am very close to doing it again. Best thing is for her to ignore him ( my opinion ) but he is still her son and it's easy for me to say.

Sorry for long post, but what is best thing to do?

Thanks in advance,

Paul

Victor

Unless you are actually being attacked, violence is not the solution.

He needs to be told that respect goes both ways. If he wants something, he needs to give something back.

Does he have someone official dealing with him on rehabilitation issues?

CDfm

His accomadation is a probabion issue and its up to him to sort it out and not his mother or you.

If he tried to kick in the front door you are right not to want him around. Rehabilitating is his own choice not yours nor your gfs.

philologos

OP: I'd say, let him back into the house. However, insist that he doesn't go anywhere near this gang of his, and insist that he goes to rehab if he has issues with drug addiction. However after being inside for so long I doubt that that would have exascerbated much. After being in jail, you never know, his attitude towards his mother could have genuinely changed. Then again, I'm a second chance kind of guy.

Queen-Mise

i would go the other way with the boy. Get a barring, protection order against him.

He sounds completely out of control and also very dangerous.

His mother needs to tell him she loves him and when he sorts himself out, he is welcome back into your lives. But the two younger boys need to be protected.

Dont go down the violence route again. This lad is dangerous.

Queen-Mise

Jakkass wrote: »

and insist that he goes to rehab if he has issues with drug addiction. However after being inside for so long I doubt that that would have exascerbated much.

They are loads of drugs in the irish prison system. Mainly heroin & hash.

Addiction doesnt stop or halt, it gets worse continually. As soon as he put a drug or alcohol he will be as bad or worse before he went to prison. It may take a couple of weeks to kick in but it will.

Does he take drugs or just deal them.

Splendour

mirwillbeback wrote: »

Hi,

Long time advice giver, shoe on the other foot now.

With my gf 10 years this year, her husband died of cancer a few years before, she had 2 boys when I met her, since then we've had another 2 - loads of testosterone in the house

Get on great with her 2nd eldest, ( 19 ) a real treasure and we're like father and son. My two boys are 6 & 3, amazing kids and we have a great little close knit family.

Problem is her eldest, now 22. He's been out of our house since he was 15, went down a bad road, dealing drugs, robbing cars and eventually 2 armed robberies he's been inside for last 3 years for. He came out this week, despite what I feel about him and how he's treated him mam for the last 7 years, I agreed to say nothing apart from that he isn't welcome in our house.

Well, since he came out on Monday, he's been evicted from where he was meant to stay, lost his sheet that he's to get signed every day for probation, called his mam 3 times saying sh!te like " you're my mam, you need to sort it out " or " so your two younger boys are more important than me ".

Anyways, my gf is very upset over his attitude and the fact he's gone right back into his drug taking gang of wasters. I am absolutely at boiling point. I gave him a hiding once before when he tried to kick in our front door and threaten her ( not knowing I was on a half day from work ) and I am very close to doing it again. Best thing is for her to ignore him ( my opinion ) but he is still her son and it's easy for me to say.

Sorry for long post, but what is best thing to do?

Thanks in advance,

Paul

I feel sorry for this poor chap (easy to say when I'm not going through it I know). His Dad died when he was very young, then his Mom meets someone a few years later. It must have been difficult for him to lose his Dad and then have another man take over what he possibly perceived as being his role i.e. eldest male in the house. From his jealousy over the younger boys, I imagine he hasn't dealt with any of this too well.

Paul, did he have any counselling during this transition period? Maybe you could take a totally different approach. Meet him for a pint and tell him how concerned you and his Mom are for him and that you would like to help him. Can you try and relate to him in anyway at all with something you yourself have gone through? Show him your flaws.Let him see we all mess up. He may be coming across in an angry fashion but beneath this anger and resentment I think there's a young boy still pining for his father.

Above all, whatever you do, don't ignore it.

CDfm

Queen-Mise wrote: »

i would go the other way with the boy. Get a barring, protection order against him.

I dont think you would be able to get a barring order if he hasnt done anything wrong other than being an asshole.

He is not your child so your feelings will be different towards him naturally enough than his mothers are. But you and his mother need to tackle it as a family unit.That said you cant have him living with you if he is using and dealing -pure nuts.

My suggestion is that while he his hanging out with his old friends you cant really take him into the family and you need to find out more as to whether or not he has given up drugs and dealing. Is this being monitored by his probation service?

It is going to be a very difficult family situation for you and you will need outside help so why dont you contact Narcotics Anonymous to see what they can offer in support.In this way you and his Mum can say well you are welcome but you need to clean up your act first.

http://www.nasouth.ie/

Now NA may not be for everyone but there are other treatment programmes too

http://www.tallaghtdtf.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=16&Itemid=29

One of the councellors listed here Liam O'Brien in Killinarden was an order priest and a teacher and helped out a family I know and he might be worth a call and would be used to these situations.

I hope this helps

Edit - you can help him out with clothes food ciggerettes etc and have him around for or bring him out for sunday lunch etc but what you cant do is give in to his addiction. So its a case that you say we love you man but hate what becomes of you when you are on drugs.

LegacyUser

NO NO NO NO NO !

Do not let him back to the house to ruin everyone elses happiness i have a sister who gave us hell you have to be cruel to be kind its only a matter of time before he is back inside if he is back with the old crowd funny they aren't bending over backwards for him why should you i understand your GF is his Mam but you but have other children to think about dont let him bring them down hes a big boy now didnt need his Mam when he was robbing and taking drugs sorry if its a bit harsh but it was the ONLY route that warked with my sister trust me we did everything and now 3 years later she is clean sober and in college

BE CRUL TO BE KIND and dont let this ruin a happy family

cowzerp

Jakkass wrote: »

OP: I'd say, let him back into the house. However, insist that he doesn't go anywhere near this gang of his, and insist that he goes to rehab if he has issues with drug addiction. However after being inside for so long I doubt that that would have exascerbated much. After being in jail, you never know, his attitude towards his mother could have genuinely changed. Then again, I'm a second chance kind of guy.

Worst advise ever, dont let him near your home-he's a waster and should be left out in the cold, if he messes your family about you know what to do, you reap what you sow and he's not doing himself any favours..

Nevyn

You have two very small children in the house and they should come first.
They need a safe, stable and secure home.
The step son is an adult and needs to sort himself out and there are services he can advail of.

thefeatheredcat

Paul,

Having someone that has had such a troublesome past in the house is probably not suitable for the others in the family; you need to protect what you have to ensure that you have a safe environment for your family.

If he did live with you it could cause a big rift between your gf and yourself and yourself and your gf's other child. And perhaps put your children at risk.

How is the relationship between him and his brother?
Has he had anything to say on this?

Give him support to get himself sorted out; he may have only gone back to the gang as he felt like he was being alienated from his family and had no other choice.

The least you can do is protect your family and support your gf through this, as she's probably torn on what to do and how she feels about this. Take it one step at a time and see how things go and move from there.

Queen-Mise

CDfm wrote: »

I dont think you would be able to get a barring order if he hasnt done anything wrong other than being an asshole.

You actually can get an order against someone on the threat or fear of action/violence.

Not sure of the exact name of which 'order' it is though

CDfm

Queen-Mise wrote: »

You actually can get an order against someone on the threat or fear of action/violence.

Not sure of the exact name of which 'order' it is though

You are probably thinking of a Safety Order but these are associated with Domestic Violence and normally are granted for an incident in the home over the preceeding 6 months.

I can't see how it would apply here at the moment unless he had made a specific threat.

If you wanted to check you could contact your local District Court Clerks office.

LegacyUser

Splendour wrote: »

I feel sorry for this poor chap (easy to say when I'm not going through it I know). His Dad died when he was very young, then his Mom meets someone a few years later. It must have been difficult for him to lose his Dad and then have another man take over what he possibly perceived as being his role i.e. eldest male in the house. From his jealousy over the younger boys, I imagine he hasn't dealt with any of this too well.

Sentimental rubbish..... He is an adult. A lot of people have have no decent parents never mind one and a Dad who passed away. Its no excuse for being a thug and thgs dont learn by being talked to...

What does your partner want? Some of it is her call.

philologos

cowzerp wrote: »

Worst advise ever, dont let him near your home-he's a waster and should be left out in the cold, if he messes your family about you know what to do, you reap what you sow and he's not doing himself any favours..

He's only just been out after a 3 year spell in prison. Is it really that unreasonable that he wants to see his mother?

I'm starting to feel that there is more behind this than is clear to the eye. His treatment from his family could be a part of his problem.

Yes, I think it's perfectly apt that the OP reach out to him in some way, but be firm with his stance and that him and his partner should make a loving effort to get him out of this life and put him on the straight and narrow.

The lack of compassion on here is quite something else.

Edit:

Unregistered wrote: »

Sentimental rubbish..... He is an adult. A lot of people have have no decent parents never mind one and a Dad who passed away. Its no excuse for being a thug and thgs dont learn by being talked to...

What does your partner want? Some of it is her call.

The OP says that the problems started when he was 15 he left home. He could have underlying emotional difficulties as a result of his treatment at home and certainly someone should have tried to stop him leaving home at 15?

It's a bit easy to say "he's an adult" however these problems seem to stem from adolescence.

CDfm

Jakkass wrote: »

He's only just been out after a 3 year spell in prison. Is it really that unreasonable that he wants to see his mother?

He wasnt on holiday he was jailed for being a dangerous criminal commiting armed robbery.He is asking his mother to sort his problems and not taking responsibility for his own actions.

I'm starting to feel that there is more behind this than is clear to the eye. His treatment from his family could be a part of his problem.

That may be so - but the OPs principle responsibility is the safety of his 2 youngest children, his partner and 19 yo stepson.The risks having him around would be very high.

Yes, I think it's perfectly apt that the OP reach out to him in some way, but be firm with his stance and that him and his partner should make a loving effort to get him out of this life and put him on the straight and narrow.

The lack of compassion on here is quite something

The guy needs to straighten himself out and there is nothing wrong helping him out that way or with essentials like food etc the safety of the family is the top priority and that should not be compromised.

He also needs to comply with the terms of his probation and from what the OP has said thats doubtful.

Would you bring him into your house??

starchild

hi paul, i think its a really difficult one as obviously you dont want to disrupt a happy home, is there any middle ground where you can try to help him

i personally believe that the only way he will change is if he moves away and loses that group of friends, perhaps you could help him with rent or something for somewhere new

sometimes a second chance can be everything

philologos

CDfm wrote: »

He wasnt on holiday he was jailed for being a dangerous criminal commiting armed robbery.He is asking his mother to sort his problems and not taking responsibility for his own actions.

He's just asking his mother to help him after coming out of jail. I don't hold the same view as you do, which is once a scumbag always a scumbag. That mentality actually causes more problems than it solves, and if that kind of attitude is employed this time, it could make this worse rather than better.

CDfm wrote: »

That may be so - but the OPs principle responsibility is the safety of his 2 youngest children, his partner and 19 yo stepson.The risks having him around would be very high.

We have absolutely no evidence that this guy would kill anyone in that family. I don't see why if his mother would reach out to him and actually show him some compassion instead of shunning him.

CDfm wrote: »

The guy needs to straighten himself out and there is nothing wrong helping him out that way or with essentials like food etc the safety of the family is the top priority and that should not be compromised.

Yes, but it is clear that this guy needs help in order to straighten himself out. I think it's ridiculous to say that "the safety of the family" is top priority when he is a part of the family, or at least he should be regarded as such. It seems in this situation this son is the thrash of the family and I think this mindset could contribute to some of the problems he currently has.

CDfm wrote: »

He also needs to comply with the terms of his probation and from what the OP has said thats doubtful.

He needs help to comply, or else he'll just be back in the slammer. The OP and his girlfriend have to decide, do they really care about this guy?

CDfm wrote: »

Would you bring him into your house??

I'd like to think I would. It's hard to say not being in this situation though, however it seems like there is more to this than meets the eye.

mirwillbeback

Hi all,

Thanks for the advice.

Some seem to suggest that there's more to the situation than meets the eye, but that simply isnt true. We've tried everything to help over the years, as far back as 2003 we emailed eight local politicians looking for help as he had over 50 charges against him, was out of control and kept just getting released on bail to reoffend. One time, he was in court 3 days in a row for robbing cars the night before, and each time he was released. Another time, he ran from the court as he was called in, leaving me and his mam to face the judge.
One thing is that his mam certainly hasn't shunned him - quite the opposite. What really grates is that his mam and uncle have visited him in prison every week for the past 2 1/2 years, and the fact that none of his so called mates bothered to get off their drugged up arses to see him, you would think would let him see who cares about him. Instead, the 2nd day he's out he's up in his mate's house, and tells his mam that they were all out of their head.
He's 22 now, he needs to sort his life out. We are willing to help if he's willing to change, but he seems hell bent on self destruction.

Thanks again for all the advice.

Paul

djk1000

He's family, you can't walk away no matter what!

Your stepson is obviously hurting, he is lonely and damaged and as soon as he got out, he went for his junky friends comfort zone, a place where no one will challenge him and no one wants him to change, no one needs a commitment.

You have to show him that the grass is greener on the other side, you should use a carrot and stick approach. If he take a first step, like going to an Annonymous meeting with you, he is rewarded with a dinner out with you and his mum (make sure that he has a good time, show him that family life can be good). As he takes more steps, introduce him more and more back into the family, have him over for a BBQ, play some football with him and the younger kids in the park.

All of this should be conditional on him changing his ways slowly, NEVER bail him out if he gets into trouble, never give him a couch to sleep on and always understand that there will be slip ups and you need to distance yourself from him slightly when he does slip up.

Whatever he comes to you for next, make it conditional on him doing something in return for you.

WIZE

I think you should help him from outside the home .

See how it goes for a couple of weeks . Make appointments with him and if he is not willing to keep them then he gets no help . Show him that trust needs to be built before peace can be restored . I sure he doesn't trust you and visa versa but there needs to be a start. I think the best thing to do is to go to a football game together or what ever his interest is . If he behaves like a dick you can always walk away .

Some people need help .

Jagera

I believe you have 2 things to consider.

Firstly, keeping your family safe. You have a close knit family and you need to ensure it stays that way. He has access to your family and can do serious damage in his current state.

Secondly, rehabilitation will only come when HE wants it. Until then any support you give him is falling on almost deaf ears. However, one day it will get to a point where he wants out of that life and reaches out, and that's when you or his mam need to be there to grab his hand.

All the best with it.

weird

I find it amazing that he just "went bad" at the age of 15. There's nothing acceptable about a 15 year old boy being out on tier own at 15 regardless of the circumstances. Where was the parenting when he was 15? Why was he allowed to be out on his own? What drove him to go into this life? Was he not accpeted at home?

Seems to me like we are only getting a very one sided view of this situation.

Yes, wether you like it or not he's a member of your family and saying he is not allowed in the house is no way to go about mending fences. That said you can't have anti-social behavior going on.

Sounds like this is a family that is badly in need of some counseling. There isn't going to be a quick solution.

CDfm

Hi Paul

It really is sad - I have a 19 year old son and thank god he is a great lad. Im divorced and have seen lots of nice kids get into problems over the years and its not their parents fault.

I know a 23 yo girl who has just completed rehab and the lenghts she has gone to keep away from "old friends" really helped her. She is over 4 months clear.

That could be your guy if he thinks jail etc is not normal and where he doesnt want to be.

Keep positive.

CD

LegacyUser

If he's just out from 2 armed robberies then he's probably on probation- if he's using drugs again then let his probation officer know- get him locked up again

CDfm

Unregistered wrote: »

If he's just out from 2 armed robberies then he's probably on probation- if he's using drugs again then let his probation officer know- get him locked up again

Well I wouldnt go that far as its the Probation Officers job to monitor him. I would point out to him that hanging around the people he hangs around with can lead to increased police attention and a return to jail.

You should point the risks wouldnt he be better off on a FAS course if he qualifies.

The Big Red Button

weird wrote: »

I find it amazing that he just "went bad" at the age of 15. There's nothing acceptable about a 15 year old boy being out on tier own at 15 regardless of the circumstances. Where was the parenting when he was 15? Why was he allowed to be out on his own? What drove him to go into this life? Was he not accpeted at home?

Now that's a bit unfair. Some of the best parents can end up with messed up kids - and vice versa. And as to why he was allowed out on his own - it's quite difficult to physically restrain a 15 year old boy if he wants to go somewhere!

CDfm

Jakkass wrote: »

I'd like to think I would. It's hard to say not being in this situation though, however it seems like there is more to this than meets the eye.

I didnt mean this hypothetically - but as a would you bring a 22 year old drug user who has just come out of prison home and put them up.

Probably not.If you have done fair dues to you.

Most people wouldn't and not doing it because you have young kids is reason enough.

Lots of people don't because they are afraid - if not of the person themselves then their criminal associates -and rightly so.

philologos

CDfm wrote: »

I didnt mean this hypothetically - but as a would you bring a 22 year old drug user who has just come out of prison home and put them up.

Probably not.If you have done fair dues to you.

This is rather deceptive. This 22 year old is his girlfriends son, a part of his family. I feel that they are obligated to help him out and quick before he gets in more trouble.

He should have never been allowed to leave and move out at the age of 15. That's the root of these issues in my interpretation.

CDfm wrote: »

Most people wouldn't and not doing it because you have young kids is reason enough.

Most people wouldn't take in a 22 year old on drugs that they have no connection with, but as for taking in your son after being in jail. That's a different matter altogether.

CDfm wrote: »

Lots of people don't because they are afraid - if not of the person themselves then their criminal associates -and rightly so.

I'm aware, but when this is a relative of yours, I believe you are obligated to help in any way possible.

Nevyn

There comes a point even when a person is family that the well being of the more vulnerable members of the family have to be put first.

There are services available to him having just been released and he should make use of them if he is serious about rehabilitation and changing his ways so that he can be eventually welcome back into the family.