Thinking of selling homebrew

scull2009

Hello.
I am thinking of brewing and selling homebrew lager to maybe a local pub... by teaming up with them to sell cheap, this is just an idea (i know you have to try out different brews etc and you need kit). But i know most people like to go to the pub for
A. Social
B. Drink (get drunk)
C. So they aren't drinking alone at home
D. to get out of house

So if there was a decent pint or even bottled lager they could drink it for less money. As in many pubs you get rotten pints of the favourite brands i.e. carlsberg, harp, tennents, carling.

As the price of drink in pubs is so dear now, in north £2.70 or so a pint, south is absolutely extortianate, i feel sorry for alcoholics in the south at around 4.50 euros a pint any time i've been down.
Would i be able to sell cheap to a pub, say £0.50 per pint and then they sell at £2.00 per pint or what way does it work.

Using Wetherspoons as an example some ales in there are £1 per pint, do they not have to pay tax on them or what?

Also can you do several brews using homebrew equipment or would you need to buy mini brew metal tanks etc?

Sorry that it's all over the place but i'm just trying to put my ideas into a post.
Thanks

starbelgrade

There's a lot of micro-breweries around the country who sell their produce to local pubs & retailers... there's one very successful one in Carlow, but I can't think of the name of it.

There's also a pub on Dame Street in Dublin, opposite Burdocks fish n'chip shop (again the name escapes me), who sell a lot of different types of bottled beer including some irish ones. The guy who owns it is big into home brewing & hosts micro-brewery conventions there, where micro-brewers bring along their beers & meet up with other brewerers to sample each others wares, network & giv / get advice etc.

Definitely a good place to go to get information / advice on starting up yourself.

(apologies for my forgetfulness in the names - I blame the beer!)

shoutman

You could go to this forum http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=598 as there is a thread on homebrewing for some of those answers.

As for selling it into your local, a few things would spring to mind.

1) Would you have to have some safety standards in place, a bad batch and a few people getting sick from it could lead to a few lawsuits against the pub and i'm sure the publican wouldn't want to take that risk.

2) No doubt you still have to pay VAT on it so I'm not sure how cheaper the pub could sell it on for. As far as I know the cost price per pint in most pubs is actually quite cheap... but I'm sure someone could clear that up for you.

3) Are you looking to make money out of this or just doing it purely so you can get a cheap pint in your local? If it is the former I can't see there being much money if any money in a small scale operation like you would be able to run on your own, thats presuming you know about homebrewing in the first place etc.

shoutman

starbelgrade wrote: »

There's also a pub on Dame Street in Dublin, opposite Burdocks fish n'chip shop - Bull and Castle

.

Gambler

These guys might be able to give you some info on how other micro brewers are making money too:

http://www.irishcraftbrewer.com/

scull2009

i know the lager would be harder to make. so maybe could even think of trying to make cider (i'm an absolute novice in brewing, just more of an idea). Older drinkers don't drink cider, so then it would be more pushed towards the younger market, but then they only know magners.

A friend of mine's father has made a good bit of homebrew cider (probably againt because it was easier and he could drink it) and i think it was alright, probably not up to magners standard.

In my idea i am also wondering why nobody has done it (in co. derry anyway) other than wetherspoons chains. And im asking why don't they do it as surely it would bring the drink prices down. Also yes I would like to see at least one of my local pubs getting involved in ventures such as this.

What are the VAT prices on drink at the minute?

Sonnenblumen

scull2009 wrote: »

i know the lager would be harder to make. so maybe could even think of trying to make cider (i'm an absolute novice in brewing, just more of an idea). Older drinkers don't drink cider, so then it would be more pushed towards the younger market, but then they only know magners.

A friend of mine's father has made a good bit of homebrew cider (probably againt because it was easier and he could drink it) and i think it was alright, probably not up to magners standard.

In my idea i am also wondering why nobody has done it (in co. derry anyway) other than wetherspoons chains. And im asking why don't they do it as surely it would bring the drink prices down.

What are the VAT prices on drink at the minute?

You need to familarise yourself with product pricing and more specifically with beverage taxes. How can anyone want or hope to start a business and doesn't even know the applicable rates/tariffs/ licensing requirements. You're not related to the Garage Pizza man? Crazy stuff!!:eek:

BTW how about 'PLONKER' as the brand name?

scull2009

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

You need to familarise yourself with product pricing and more specifically with beverage taxes. How can anyone want or hope to start a business and doesn't even know the applicable rates/tariffs/ licensing requirements. You're not related to the Garage Pizza man? Crazy stuff!!:eek:

BTW how about 'PLONKER' as the brand name?

If you read my first post Heston Blumenthal you will see that i have clearly said this is just an idea and also in my other post i have said that i am a novice in brewing.
This is an idea so don't try to be smart, and if so, then stay away.

starbelgrade

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

You need to familarise yourself with product pricing and more specifically with beverage taxes. How can anyone want or hope to start a business and doesn't even know the applicable rates/tariffs/ licensing requirements. You're not related to the Garage Pizza man? Crazy stuff!!:eek:

BTW how about 'PLONKER' as the brand name?

It's nice to see people with knowledge impart their wisdom in such a graceful manner!!

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

starbelgrade wrote: »

There's a lot of micro-breweries around the country who sell their produce to local pubs & retailers... there's one very successful one in Carlow, but I can't think of the name of it.

There's also a pub on Dame Street in Dublin, opposite Burdocks fish n'chip shop (again the name escapes me), who sell a lot of different types of bottled beer including some irish ones. The guy who owns it is big into home brewing & hosts micro-brewery conventions there, where micro-brewers bring along their beers & meet up with other brewerers to sample each others wares, network & giv / get advice etc.

Definitely a good place to go to get information / advice on starting up yourself.

(apologies for my forgetfulness in the names - I blame the beer!)

Irishmans? Carlow brewing company?

starbelgrade

Amanda Delicious Knapsack wrote: »

Irishmans? Carlow brewing company?

I don't know the name.. I met a guy - friend of a friend - a few weeks back who studied brewing in the UK & he works for them. He said they were basically the only small brewery in the country who he could get a job as the other ones were all one man operations.

Funnily enough, I met him in the Bull & Castle (cheers, Shoutman!).

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

You need to familarise yourself with product pricing and more specifically with beverage taxes. How can anyone want or hope to start a business and doesn't even know the applicable rates/tariffs/ licensing requirements. You're not related to the Garage Pizza man? Crazy stuff!!:eek:

BTW how about 'PLONKER' as the brand name?

No need for that kind of crap here... How the hell do you think business develope? From an idea, the OP has the idea and is investigating. Your ignorance is not wanted here... now run along little boy.

antoinolachtnai

There is a licence concession (don't need a pub licence to run a bar on the premises) and a tax concession (pay a low rate of excise duty) related to running a small brewery if I remember correctly. This is certainly the case in the UK.

So your basic idea is sound in principle, but the investment and scale of operation involved is considerably larger than you were probably thinking of.

GoneShootin

@Sonnenblumen

Play nice or don't play at all

@Rest

Never feed the trolls

Sonnenblumen

Amanda Delicious Knapsack wrote: »

No need for that kind of crap here... How the hell do you think business develope? From an idea, the OP has the idea and is investigating. Your ignorance is not wanted here... now run along little boy.

Crap, what crap? Do you know that most (>80%) businesses fail? Did you ever wonder why? It has nothing to do with ideas (good or bad)!

But perhaps you know more?

Saruman

starbelgrade wrote: »

I don't know the name.. I met a guy - friend of a friend - a few weeks back who studied brewing in the UK & he works for them. He said they were basically the only small brewery in the country who he could get a job as the other ones were all one man operations.

Funnily enough, I met him in the Bull & Castle (cheers, Shoutman!).

Definitely Carlow brewing company.
They make O'Haras stout, Curim wheat beer and O'haras Red

I am not sure what the law is like in the UK but in Ireland it is very difficult and expensive to do what you are thinking of doing.
You would need to set yourself up as a brewery and get a bond from revenue to cover the alcohol you are producing and all kinds of stuff. There is a thread on the ICB website about setting up a brewery but it relates to Ireland and not the UK.

scull2009

thanks for all the info people apart from the dingleberry that was hanging on causing a stir.
will maybe just go for making some for myself or stronger spirirts and try not to go blind

BeerNut

OP, if you are serious about it, the absolute number one thing to do to start with is go and talk to some other people in this line of business: Hilden and Whitewater will have pointers that no-one else can tell you and that will never have occurred to you.

Independently-operated pubs tend not to be interested in cheap beer. It can create public order issues and won't have the kind of profits they get on the big brands. The big beer companies also do all the maintenance and technical work on the beer lines -- you'd either have to do that for everyone you supply or be sure that they're happy to do it themselves.

Beer drinkers are extremely brand loyal. Lots of punters will go to the bar and order the usual without so much as looking at what the pub sells. Suggest that there's an alternative and they get scared. Suggest that it's cheaper, and they're at least as likely to be turned off as be interested. You'll need some major point-of-sale material and lots of free sample kegs to get the pubs and drinkers on board.

And you will need to be able to give cast-iron supply guarantees. No spoiled batches, no "I'll have it next Tuesday". The pubs will be taking a gamble on it and if you don't deliver they're unlikely to offer a second chance. You need them -- they don't need you.

And that's before you even get into planning permission, commercial rates, licensing, bonding and excise. If HM Revenue & Customs are anything like our lot, they'll make it as difficult as possible to get the business off the ground in the first place.

It can be done, it has been done. But you need to know an awful lot more about how the drinks industry works than you will ever pick up just by being a pub customer.

Saruman

Here are a few lads you should contact that I came across today.
WC Brewery in Chester produce beer in homebrew quantities of 10 gallon batches and they have it sold in some local pubs and hotels so see what advice they can give you.

scull2009

thanks for the info again.
its very good to be told what might be involved in it.
it was just an idea i had