UPC Tech Support Nightmare!

RAWLiNGS

Here is my story;

I have 10MB UPC, It has been 10MB up until last week, when It dropped to 1-2MB.

So my basic Troubleshooting;

==>Run Ubuntu Live CD, Connect laptop to UPC modem via LAN (The actual UPC modem, no access point etc.) speed is 1MB. Same via the supplied Netgear.
OK grab my laptop and check at my neighbors, connection is perfect via LAN (same Ethernet cable).
(So I have proven that Its not my computer, neither my equipment).

OK -I thought- ring Tech Support and they will help.

I told everything to the guy, he says he will assign someone to this.
OK -I thought- appointment made for yesterday. Of course they didnt come.
Rang tech support today, he says (the exact same agent) that I have to call premium support and they will sort it out over the phone... Ok, I said... turned out to be a 95c/m call, Rang support back a girl picks up the phone, she tells me that I need to contact Netgear so they can callout and fix my problem...

The Laptop was bypassing the Netgear, but she kept saying that its working on their and it must be the netgear....

Am I missing something? Am I doing something wrong? Any suggestions?

vibe666

you need to ask to speak to a manager. if your netgear router is plugged out and not part of the equation it can't be part of the problem.

a classic case of 1st line support no knowing their ar$e from their elbow.

demand to be put through to a manager and make as much of a fuss as you can without getting irate. irate will get you nowhere except having them hang up on you, so stay as calm as you can manage, but insist they put yo through to a manager. have your speech ready, maybe write down bullet points of what troubleshooting you've done so far and what happened each time you rang and make a point of saying you waited in all day for an engineer visit that didn't materialise and that you need this fixed asap.

shinzon

The Laptop was bypassing the Netgear, but she kept saying that its working on their and it must be the netgear....

So your saying here that you were plugged directly into your cable modem and some gonk in tech support told you it was the netgear that was at fault

That is quite possibly the most ridiculously stupid thing in the entire universe an agent could ever say, and as for any agent telling you that Netgear will be out to fix it for you if you call them LOL just LOL, as for the advice here its spot on get a manager its a crying shame to have to go that route but well its your only option if thats the level of competency on the phone



Shin

vibe666

shinzon wrote: »

So your saying here that you were plugged directly into your cable modem and some gonk in tech support told you it was the netgear that was at fault

and people keep telling me that UPC support are top notch these days. and to think i almost believed them. :eek:

i lost all faith when i was on a call to them and said that the status page on my scientific atlanta modem was saying that i couldn't get an upstream lock and she had to put me on hold so she could go and ask someone what a "scientific atlanta modem" was.

it wasn't that she misunderstood me either, she said it back to me perfectly, she just didn't know what it was.

"hi, welcome to ntl 'thick' support". :rolleyes:

RAWLiNGS

shinzon wrote: »

So your saying here that you were plugged directly into your cable modem and some gonk in tech support told you it was the netgear that was at fault
Shin

Trust me, I was shocked, literally I couldnt speak, I was SHOCKED. :eek:

I call them this evening, I will ask for a TL, I will try to be nice. If Its not sorted, I pay them a visit in Eastpoint .

Updates will follow.

dub45

Rang tech support today, he says (the exact same agent) that I have to call premium support and they will sort it out over the phone... Ok, I said... turned out to be a 95c/m call,

I am surprised that none of the other posters picked up on this lark.

This is a disgrace - a routine support call being referred to a premium number:rolleyes:

When this so called 'service' was first mooted several of us on here expressed concern about this type of referral.

It is ironic that UPC who are so specific in relation to customers complying with draconican terms and conditions do not feel under the same obligations themselves!

From the UPC webiste:

http://service.upc.ie/service/?cid=123&aid=84

What type of technical support is available?

At Chorus ntl we know that technology can be a bit intimidating sometimes. That’s why we offer our broadband customers two technical support services that they can call on when their computer is misbehaving. Broadband Support deals with issues related to the broadband service such as the cable connection to your computer and basic functions of Outlook Express. Premium PC Support deals with computer problems that are not directly related to our broadband service such as setting up a new computer, firewalls and viruses.

In this case the op had proven that there was nothing wrong with the pc in question.

Wonderful customer service - totally unnecessary referral to a premium number service and a no show!!

I wonder how many innocents are being referred to this premium number?

dub45

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

Trust me, I was shocked, literally I couldnt speak, I was SHOCKED. :eek:

I call them this evening, I will ask for a TL, I will try to be nice. If Its not sorted, I pay them a visit in Eastpoint .
Updates will follow.

A friend of mine visited them there some time ago in desperation. He was told that there was 'no customer interface' there. I wish you luck.

RAWLiNGS

dub45 wrote: »

A friend of mine visited them there some time ago in desperation. He was told that there was 'no customer interface' there. I wish you luck.

I work in Easpoint as well, two minutes away from the UPC building, so I can go there every day

Boom_Bap

My most wonderous experience was when the Online light was out on the Scientific Atlantic modem meaning there was no signal coming into the modem or the modem was screwed.
Of course they didnt know what the Scientific Atlantic was, after advising them that it's the hardware they provide the agent resumed with thier analysis of the problem.
Unplug and wait 3 minutes....when querying the 3 minute time period and explanation could not be provided. So after restarting after 3 minutes with no joy, i was asked if my computer was still on, which it was. I was asked to reboot my machine, i told them that there was no problem with my machine, it was connecting to the Net Gear no problem, just no signal coming into the Scientific Atlantic.
The agent insisted that i reboot, so to humour them i did, no joy as expected, then unplugged the modem, turned off the machine, waited 3 minutes to turn the modem back on and then the machine. No change as expected.
I re-iterated that this is not a problem with my machine, it's a problem with the signal......the next question was about the OS that i use and they wanted to troubleshoot my settings........at this point i asked to speak to a supervisor as the support i was getting was rubbish. i was told i would get a call back.......still waiting for the callback.
But when i called again later, i got the automated service telling me that an appointment for an engineer was booked.

RAWLiNGS

dub45 wrote: »

In this case the op had proven that there was nothing wrong with the pc in question.

Wonderful customer service - totally unnecessary referral to a premium number service and a no show!!

I wonder how many innocents are being referred to this premium number?

Yesterday, on the second call -after they told me that I have to get on to Premium Support- I was pissed off, I admit that, today I call them again and I'll be nice

FloatingVoter

Got the bill today for the support line - €18...just to be told they were stumped and would get back to me. That was last Saturday. No call yet.

BostonB

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

...
Am I missing something? Am I doing something wrong? Any suggestions?

Log into the modem and see whats happening there.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/cmtips/signal.html

dub45

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Got the bill today for the support line - €18...just to be told they were stumped and would get back to me. That was last Saturday. No call yet.

Could you tell us what problem you phoned them with?

thund3rbird_

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

Here is my story;

I have 10MB UPC, It has been 10MB up until last week, when It dropped to 1-2MB.

is it safe to assume from your original post (above) that this is a speed issue?

you don't mention where you checked your speeds - a 'speedtest' site??
try downloading a large file from heanet & check the transfer rates

also, there's no need for the ubuntu cd - just use whatever OS is on your laptop. no point giving them an unsupported os excuse as well :rolleyes:

log in to the modem & check the sync rates

is it still syncing at 10M?
check the SNR levels - low SNR could be affecting your throughput/sync

run some traceroutes to determine where the issue is

FloatingVoter

dub45 wrote: »

Could you tell us what problem you phoned them with?

I have 20 Mbs package. Perfect in the morning but drops as low as 2/3 Mbs every evening. The drop starts about 5.30/6 and stays bad until 3 AM. No joy on the upc phonelines as they say its perfect from their end and yesterday refused point blank to send out a technician.

RAWLiNGS

thund3rbird_ wrote: »

is it safe to assume from your original post (above) that this is a speed issue?

you don't mention where you checked your speeds - a 'speedtest' site??
try downloading a large file from heanet & check the transfer rates

also, there's no need for the ubuntu cd - just use whatever OS is on your laptop. no point giving them an unsupported os excuse as well :rolleyes:

log in to the modem & check the sync rates

is it still syncing at 10M?
check the SNR levels - low SNR could be affecting your throughput/sync

run some traceroutes to determine where the issue is

Speedtest.net, Eircom/speedtest, tried four different 1-2MB in average, the ping times are perfect, around 15ms to eircom.net, 50ms google.co.uk, and its always been like this.

Receive Power Level 6.9 dBmV
Transmit Power Level 38.7 dBmV

I cannot access sync nor SNR details.

bk

FloatingVoter wrote: »

I have 20 Mbs package. Perfect in the morning but drops as low as 2/3 Mbs every evening. The drop starts about 5.30/6 and stays bad until 3 AM. No joy on the upc phonelines as they say its perfect from their end and yesterday refused point blank to send out a technician.

The problem is that there are a lot of other users in your area on the same node and they all come online in the evening and start using it heavily causing congestion.

This is something that can't be fixed by an engineer in your home. It is a network issue of over subscription.

It can only be fixed by NTL sending out engineers to upgrade your areas nodes, by adding extra fibre or sub dividing the node. I'm sure the engineers in the Network Operations Center know that there is a problem in your area and have arranged an upgrade for you area, but it could take a few months before that happens.

Of course customer support will never tell you the above or admit this, they will always blame it on your pc, or the position of the moon, etc.

There is little you can do about this, your options are:

1) Wait for your area to be fixed, could take a few months.
2) Downgrade to a package more inline with what you are getting, i.e 3mb.
3) Move to a different provider.

BTW if you go with 2 or 3, don't let them charge you the download fee, under the sales of goods and service act they aren't supplying the service you are paying for.

bk

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

Speedtest.net, Eircom/speedtest, tried four different 1-2MB in average

I assume you mean 1 - 2 mbit/s. 1 - 2 MB is 8 to 16 mbit/s.

My above post to FloatingVoter also applies to you and pretty much anyone else having speed problems with UPC.

dub45

FloatingVoter wrote: »

I have 20 Mbs package. Perfect in the morning but drops as low as 2/3 Mbs every evening. The drop starts about 5.30/6 and stays bad until 3 AM. No joy on the upc phonelines as they say its perfect from their end and yesterday refused point blank to send out a technician.

And are you using a wireless network or are you connected directly to the upc modem?

RAWLiNGS

bk wrote: »

I assume you mean 1 - 2 mbit/s. 1 - 2 MB is 8 to 16 mbit/s.

My above post to FloatingVoter also applies to you and pretty much anyone else having speed problems with UPC.

yeah sure, megabit per sec, btw, im getting the details off the modem, will post it in a few mins

dub45

bk wrote: »

The problem is that there are a lot of other users in your area on the same node and they all come online in the evening and start using it heavily causing congestion.

This is something that can't be fixed by an engineer in your home. It is a network issue of over subscription.

It can only be fixed by NTL sending out engineers to upgrade your areas nodes, by adding extra fibre or sub dividing the node. I'm sure the engineers in the Network Operations Center know that there is a problem in your area and have arranged an upgrade for you area, but it could take a few months before that happens.

Of course customer support will never tell you the above or admit this, they will always blame it on your pc, or the position of the moon, etc.

There is little you can do about this, your options are:

1) Wait for your area to be fixed, could take a few months.
2) Downgrade to a package more inline with what you are getting, i.e 3mb.
3) Move to a different provider.

BTW if you go with 2 or 3, don't let them charge you the download fee, under the sales of goods and service act they aren't supplying the service you are paying for.

If this is the case then it makes it all the more appalling that the customer was referred to a premium support line by UPC:rolleyes:

Bad enough if UPC cannot provide the appropriate speeds but on top of that to be getting charged 18 euros for 'support'.

Only in Ireland!!!!:mad::mad:

FloatingVoter

dub45 wrote: »

And are you using a wireless network or are you connected directly to the upc modem?

Wireless, but the problem persists even when I connect. Been around the houses with upc and they insist everything is perfect. I think bk may have hit the nail on the head.
btw I've checked for spyware/malware etc. No nasty letters about Fair Usage Policy, and netgear themselves gave me the all clear about my security set-up with the router.:(

FloatingVoter

by the way I'm off Cork St. Dublin 8

DrivingInfo

dub45 wrote: »

If this is the case then it makes it all the more appalling that the customer was referred to a premium support line by UPC:rolleyes:

Bad enough if UPC cannot provide the appropriate speeds but on top of that to be getting charged 18 euros for 'support'.

Only in Ireland!!!!:mad::mad:

Very true only in Ireland

I was sent to this line today, and i told person that i would not ring any premium line as i only have the UPC BB 2 weeks and that it is their f**King problem, I got very annoyed over this pass the bucket Bull***t.

IT went the same way a few days ago when they told me it may cost 50 euro to have a tech call to my home. I told them i would take the router and stick it up the techs A*** if he tried to charge me.

Are we idiots to take this as we are paying for it.

Sorry! just a bit annoyed.:mad:

dub45

DrivingInfo wrote: »

Very true only in Ireland

I was sent to this line today, and i told person that i would not ring any premium line as i only have the UPC BB 2 weeks and that it is their f**King problem, I got very annoyed over this pass the bucket Bull***t.

IT went the same way a few days ago when they told me it may cost 50 euro to have a tech call to my home. I told them i would take the router and stick it up the techs A*** if he tried to charge me.

Are we idiots to take this as we are paying for it.

Sorry! just a bit annoyed.:mad:

Sadly we are:rolleyes:

However it is also down to lousy consumer protection. UPC know that they have nothing to fear in behaving like this. I would dearly love to know what instructions are given to their phone people on referring 'valued' customers to this so called 'support' line.

dub45

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Wireless, but the problem persists even when I connect. Been around the houses with upc and they insist everything is perfect. I think bk may have hit the nail on the head.
btw I've checked for spyware/malware etc. No nasty letters about Fair Usage Policy, and netgear themselves gave me the all clear about my security set-up with the router.:(

Given the hours involved it most likely is contention. I have always found it off that UPC do not appear to be required to publish their contentio ratios.

If I was you I would certainly claim back the 18 euros.

RAWLiNGS

thund3rbird_ wrote: »

is it safe to assume from your original post (above) that this is a speed issue?

you don't mention where you checked your speeds - a 'speedtest' site??
try downloading a large file from heanet & check the transfer rates

also, there's no need for the ubuntu cd - just use whatever OS is on your laptop. no point giving them an unsupported os excuse as well :rolleyes:

log in to the modem & check the sync rates

is it still syncing at 10M?
check the SNR levels - low SNR could be affecting your throughput/sync

run some traceroutes to determine where the issue is

Downstream Status
Operational Channel ID 26
Downstream Frequency 426250000 Hz
Modulation 256QAM
Bit Rate 42884296 bits/sec
Power Level 7.2 dBmV
Signal to Noise Ratio 40.9 dBmV

Upstream Status

Operational Channel ID 1
Upstream Frequency 45600000 Hz
Modulation 16QAM
Symbol Rate 2560 Ksym/sec
Power Level 38.7 dBmV

Three CPE connections (including mine of course) show up.

RAWLiNGS

UPDATE

Just rang NTL, I asked for TL right away, she asked me why, I told her I have Slow speeds, She said to me that "last time It was sent back as WIRELESS PROBLEM" so funny, isn't? I told them last time -approx. 10 times- that I am bypassing the Access point and that Im directly connecting to the Atlanta Modem...

Now, I told her the facts, she goes okay: "THE PROBLEM DEFINITELY ON OUR SIDE"

She said, that somebody from Level 2 will call me tomorrow, She asked my Mobile... Now, I hope this will be sorted, cause I really dont want to call in tomorrow again and ask for a TL...

bindybandy

It's unacceptable service really especially when you clearly explained that the problem was not with your pc. You should demand your money back or you will be reporting the abuse of a premium number to the relevant authority (is there an Irish version of Oftel? I'm out of date with that sort of thing?)

Part of the problem as I see it from my own experience working in call centres (10 + at this stage for my sins and 3 years of that was ntl tech support:D) is that Call centres are not really great places to work and most people just work in them to tide them over while they look for something else.

It takes a long time for somebody who is not really into pc's etc to understand how it all works (and some of them never learn/care!) By the time they learn anything well enough, they have moved on to another job so the experience leaves the company. So faced with a high turnover in staff and lots of calls queuing for tech support, the solutions they arrive at is to recruit cheap labour, give them a crash course training session and a bunch of scripts to follow for configuring email settings etc in the hope it will deal with the majority of the calls. Anything different from the basics & they have trouble dealing with and that is where it goes terribly wrong for the customer as they start to bull$hit.

In these cases what they should have, is a support group available to them to pass the tricker cases onto for second line support/analysis and to call you back to help. This way they don't waste your time and things gets fixed.
Of course this all costs more money and it's probably as other posters said, your area probably has more traffic than it can handle at peak times (blame it on the torrents:)) they don't want to admit it and unless network upgrades are done you are kind of stuck.

Depending on how long it will take to get a fix you might have to consider the options posted and one of them is to move providers. You can always come back again when things get sorted and probably avail of whatever offers are on at the time. I ditched Netsource about 4 years ago (terrific service while I had it) to go to ntl as they were cheaper and faster but a year later when they routed traffic out to Amsterdam and my Voip/gaming pings was terrible jumped ship to Digiweb Metro (again excellent service and speeds). Swapped back to ntl when the cap became an issue and so far all ok. It's like car insurance really you never stay with the one provider forever:)

Best of luck getting it sorted out.

Edit: Just seen your response now good for you - hopefully it will get you somewhere.

FloatingVoter

Good luck to Rawlings. Nice to hear good news

Trouble is I've the phone, TV and broadband from upc. Can I just chop or change the broadband without affecting the others ? (sorry about going off-thread).

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Good luck to Rawlings. Nice to hear good news

Trouble is I've the phone, TV and broadband from upc. Can I just chop or change the broadband without affecting the others ? (sorry about going off-thread).

You mean cancel Internet, leave the rest and go for an other provider?

Skittle

Don't get your hopes up with the second level support. I've just gotten off the phone with them. Same problem as yourselves, paid for 20Mb, was getting it until 2 weeks ago and now I get 6-8Mb at peak times.

The 2nd Level support guy, just reloaded my profile onto my modem and got me to reboot. Feck all difference, I'll keep an eye on it though. When it became clear that it wasn't making a difference, he tried to fob me off to the premier support line saying "they're the IT experts, as we can't see a problem on our side"... my arse....

They'll also tell you that they don't have contention because they use fibre optics, they're obviously well schooled in network infrastructure then:rolleyes:

RAWLiNGS

Skittle wrote: »

Don't get your hopes up with the second level support. I've just gotten off the phone with them. Same problem as yourselves, paid for 20Mb, was getting it until 2 weeks ago and now I get 6-8Mb at peak times.

The 2nd Level support guy, just reloaded my profile onto my modem and got me to reboot. Feck all difference, I'll keep an eye on it though. When it became clear that it wasn't making a difference, he tried to fob me off to the premier support line saying "they're the IT experts, as we can't see a problem on our side"... my arse....

They'll also tell you that they don't have contention because they use fibre optics, they're obviously well schooled in network infrastructure then:rolleyes:

OH MY GOD :eek: .... well if they cant fix it, i will cancel... and get smart.

FloatingVoter

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

You mean cancel Internet, leave the rest and go for an other provider?

Yes, I'm happy with the TV and phone. Am I living in cloud cuckoo land or can it be done ?

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Yes, I'm happy with the TV and phone. Am I living in cloud cuckoo land or can it be done ?

you can cancel it, and leave the rest, but they gonna try charging you for that -i think so- if the contract isn't over yet. think its ~100e

FloatingVoter

and they'll hide behind the "up to 20 Mbs" clause if I say they broke the contract first. Peachy. Thanks for all the help folks...you should get jobs in customer support.

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

and they'll hide behind the "up to 20 Mbs" clause if I say they broke the contract first. Peachy. Thanks for all the help folks...you should get jobs in customer support.

Just for the record, I am a Customer Support Agent

FloatingVoter

my condolences;)

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

my condolences;)

Hell is a call center, with endless q, im telling ya

FloatingVoter

Confirmed: its congestion.


Saturday mornings, gotta love em.

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Confirmed: its congestion.


Saturday mornings, gotta love em.

Just been on the phone with 2nd Level Support, They said there is nothing wrong with the connection on their side, but they can send someone out, however if the engineer plugs in his laptop and the connection will be fine, I will be charged 60 euro for the callout.

"Proud of our services
Everyone in Chorus ntl is committed to offering our customers excellent service at all times:
We offer FREE customer service - no call out charges"

FloatingVoter

Keep a record of your speeds as a separate printout to show the engineer. This proves the problem is intermittent at least. I don't think they have a legal foot to stand on with the call out charge - like they said customer care is free.

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Keep a record of your speeds as a separate printout to show the engineer. This proves the problem is intermittent at least. I don't think they have a legal foot to stand on with the call out charge - like they said customer care is free.

this hasnt gone above 6 mb for two weeks, so they can f**k off and ill be here so... oh and i clearly mentioned that sometimes its up 6-7 which is very very rare.

FloatingVoter

whatever happens with the engineer, keep us posted. I'm not giving up either. Kidnap your engineer and send him to me.:)

RAWLiNGS

FloatingVoter wrote: »

whatever happens with the engineer, keep us posted. I'm not giving up either. Kidnap your engineer and send him to me.:)

haha, will do it

my mate is here with his macbook, so ill try it AGAIN with the 101st laptop, via the 5th eth, cable i found.

vibe666

don't forget your historical results on pseedtest.net are likely still available if your IP didn't change.

go to the "your results" bit at the top of the page to see your past speed tests and you can even download a copy and have them there to show the engineer so he can see it over time.

you can also see the results of other people in your area too in the "your summary" bit and compare your average results to everyone else.

FloatingVoter

Thanks...all the evidence in black and white.:)

dub45

RAWLiNGS wrote: »

Just been on the phone with 2nd Level Support, They said there is nothing wrong with the connection on their side, but they can send someone out, however if the engineer plugs in his laptop and the connection will be fine, I will be charged 60 euro for the callout.

"Proud of our services
Everyone in Chorus ntl is committed to offering our customers excellent service at all times:
We offer FREE customer service - no call out charges"

Yes but which of the companies are you actually contracted to?

There now appears to be three sets of Terms and Conditions:

http://www.upc.ie/termsandconditions/

The UPC T&C's now extend to 22 pages! The whole T&C thing has really become a farce at this stage (not just for UPC) it really is time that the consumer was given some protection by the so called authorities. It is absurd to expect any consumer to wade through 22 pages before signing up for something as relatively 'simple' as broadband.

vibe666

FloatingVoter wrote: »

I don't think they have a legal foot to stand on with the call out charge - like they said customer care is free.

they do. their whole point with that is, if they send out an engineer and he plugs in his own laptop and does a speedtest and gets much better speeds than you are getting then it pretty much conclusively proves that the problem is at your end and they've wasted an engineer visit on you, unless it turns out to be a faulty modem.

yes they say they have free callouts, but you can bet your s$$ that somewhere in the t&c's it'll state somewhere that they can't be held responsible for other peoples equipment OR the netgear routers they used to supply.

FloatingVoter

I should have just sold my soul. Less terms and conditions...and a half decent story to tell.:)

vibe666

i think you'll find that all the UPC execs already sold theirs and there's more of them than you, so you'd still be SOL.