Requesting a specific teacher

yourmano

Right, this may end up getting a few backs up but I'm just looking for an opinion. My niece is starting secondary this year. She's psyched. Was over at the house last weekend and my sister was talking about the school. My niece is big into languages. There are 3 Irish teachers in the school she is going to. One is well established, the other a Gaelgóir but not an Irish teacher, was in our brother's gf's class in college and the third very different. She's all about getting them to communicate. The kids find her tough but great.

Ok, so we were talking and my niece's Dad said he'll try and get her grinds with this teacher if she is not lucky enough to get her. He doesn't think she will, she's the last one in so usually gets the lower classes. Until I said...why don't they request her. Has anyone ever heard of this? I mean, why not? It's out money paying for this service. And why should we not get what we want? All opinions welcome although I hope ye are enjoying your well deserved hols, tough job no doubt. Cheers y'all.

implausible

yourmano wrote: »

It's out money paying for this service. And why should we not get what we want?

Is it a private school?

You're right about getting the backs up. If every parent did this and were listened to, schools would not function. Tbh, it sounds like your brother-in-law is very full-on if he's talking about the child getting grinds and she hasn't even started yet! If your niece is good at languages, she'll flourish in any class.

Leave the running of the schools to the professionals, though I'm half-tempted to advise him to ask, just to see the reaction!!

uriah

deemark wrote: »

Is it a private school?

You're right about getting the backs up. If every parent did this and were listened to, schools would not function. Tbh, it sounds like your brother-in-law is very full-on if he's talking about the child getting grinds and she hasn't even started yet! If your niece is good at languages, she'll flourish in any class.

Leave the running of the schools to the professionals, though I'm half-tempted to advise him to ask, just to see the reaction!!

Can you imagine the principal of that school trying to sort out a time-table?

Parents are very anxious when their children are moving into second-level, especially when well-meaning friends and relatives dish out advice.
This anxiety can rub off on the child and may affect their attitude to school. If parents could relax and adopt a wait-and-see approach, it would benefit everybody. If or when problems arise, talk to the teacher/principal. Asking for a particular teacher before your child even starts may indeed 'get backs up' and the child doesn't need this.

As for the idea that we should get what we want because 'it's our money paying for this service' - there is no way that any school could (or should even attempt to) accommodate the wishes of each parent, and if it cannot be done for all, it mustn't be done for any.

gaeilgegrinds

I find this really interesting. Firstly, I don't really see it as being pushy,a wee bit anxious perhaps but after all it is an important time.

We've had this big time lately in our school and sometimes manage to make parents happy. Their fears are rarely unfounded and by that I mean they usually know well what they're asking for. Logistically it's a nightmare, timetables are just finished in our place so it's probably far too late to ask.

If I were you I'd sit this out for first year. See how good/bad you feel about your child's teacher. But ask away in second year because it's much easier for us, in my school anyway, to chop and change at that stage.

And I wouldn't take what was said as criticism, I find it refreshing when a parent, much less and uncle takes an interest like this. It never ceases to amaze me how perceptive our students are and how in our place soft teachers who seemed cool in first year are all of a sudden not so cool by Leaving Cert. I had a reputation as being the tough one in first year in our school but my Leaving Cert that's what they want, different teachers suit different students. Best of luck to your niece and I hope she enjoys what may well be the best years of her life.

January

gaeilgegrinds wrote: »

I find this really interesting. Firstly, I don't really see it as being pushy,a wee bit anxious perhaps but after all it is an important time.

We've had this big time lately in our school and sometimes manage to make parents happy. Their fears are rarely unfounded and by that I mean they usually know well what they're asking for. Logistically it's a nightmare, timetables are just finished in our place so it's probably far too late to ask.

If I were you I'd sit this out for first year. See how good/bad you feel about your child's teacher. But ask away in second year because it's much easier for us, in my school anyway, to chop and change at that stage.

And I wouldn't take what was said as criticism, I find it refreshing when a parent, much less and uncle takes an interest like this. It never ceases to amaze me how perceptive our students are and how in our place soft teachers who seemed cool in first year are all of a sudden not so cool by Leaving Cert. I had a reputation as being the tough one in first year in our school but my Leaving Cert that's what they want, different teachers suit different students. Best of luck to your niece and I hope she enjoys what may well be the best years of her life.

I'm not a teacher but the opposite was true for me, we had an easy teacher for Gaeilge in the Junior Cycle and by the time the senior Cycle came along we were crying out for the "stricter" teacher (the girls that were doing Ordinary Level in the Junior cycle had the "stricter" teacher and always complained about how hard she made them work!!). For the senior cycle the teachers were swapped and we had the other teacher and she wasn't strict she just had a much better approach to teaching than the other teacher had.

If parents know about teachers (from other siblings or relatives experiences of them) then I'd see no problem with requesting a certain teacher teach a level. Whether they get that teacher or not would bee a different story!

yourmano

The issue isn't really easy vs strict here, I just wonder as it's our taxes that pay for this service are we not allowed have a say in it? I mean I've known of people to ask for a different doctor etc, what is the difference really? I have great respect for teachers but with one who rarely turns up, another not qualified in the subject and the third exemplary...should we not have the best one for the students who feel they'll click best with her? Perhaps her Dad is a bit pushy, ok, no perhaps about it, but he had no opportunity to get an education and my niece is very smart so he obviously only wants the best.

Sir Humphrey

yourmano wrote: »

I mean I've known of people to ask for a different doctor etc, what is the difference really?

The world of a difference. Doctors do not have to deal every day with six or seven groups of thirty patients of similar age and circumstances who are assigned to them for an entire year. If Doctors were operating under a system like that requesting a different one might be trickier.

There is of course not the slightest problem with accommodating an individual student per se. The problem with doing it for schools is that it sets a precedent whereby people outside the school can decide what's what without any reference to the actual day to day workings of a school, which might be just a tad impractical.

I'm not sure what paying taxes has got to do with anything. You pay taxes for your local recycling centre too but it's located at a place deemed to suit the majority rather than the individual who wants special treatment because it is the most practical thing to do.

Obviously in special needs cases or whatever circumstances are different but this appears to be more a beauty contest based on hearsay than anything else.

Fast_Mover

In my school (along with all others no doubt!) there were teachers that were categorized as bad/good/great. I got my share of each going through school. Had a 'bad' teacher for biology, but still managed to come out with an A2, as opposed to my bestfriend who had the 'great' teacher and got a B3. You get out what you put in yourself, no teacher no matter how great they are can do it for you.
My cousin also happens to be the deputy-principal..but I/my parents never dreamed of asking her to put me in with a different teacher that was deemed 'great'.
Just got to play the hand your dealt. Such is life.

I'm now a primary school teacher myself..will my principal have parents coming in requesting for such and such a teacher for their child?! ..or if there's two classes request one teacher over another!?:rolleyes:

implausible

yourmano wrote: »

I have great respect for teachers but with one who rarely turns up, another not qualified in the subject and the third exemplary...should we not have the best one for the students who feel they'll click best with her?

Maybe she should go to another school!

And as for students 'clicking' with a teacher, we are not there to 'click' with the students, we're there to teach them. I've often got the best work out of students who I definitely did not click with! You can pick subjects but it's a recipe for utter chaos to cherry-pick teachers.

If your niece is that bright and her father that pushy, then I'd imagine she will excel in any class. If it isn't mixed ability, she'll probably get the 'good' teacher anyway.

Parents can have a say in the running of schools, through Parents' Associations and Boards of Management, but their input is limited, as is right. You can't have the students running the school (or the lunatics running the asylum!).

rainbowtrout

yourmano wrote: »

The issue isn't really easy vs strict here, I just wonder as it's our taxes that pay for this service are we not allowed have a say in it? I mean I've known of people to ask for a different doctor etc, what is the difference really? I have great respect for teachers but with one who rarely turns up, another not qualified in the subject and the third exemplary...should we not have the best one for the students who feel they'll click best with her? Perhaps her Dad is a bit pushy, ok, no perhaps about it, but he had no opportunity to get an education and my niece is very smart so he obviously only wants the best.

Doctors deal with patients on a one to one basis, much easier to change doctor. Do you suggest that every parent then goes into the school and asks for specific teachers? Which students get the 'best' teachers then?


To be honest I'd be more worried that he's already suggesting grinds when she hasn't started secondary school yet. If she's good at languages as you say, she'll get on fine whatever class she's in.

I know that if he came into my school and requested a different teacher from the one assigned to his daughter's class he'd be told where to go! One student can't be favoured over all the others in the year.

yourmano

Well she'll need them if she gets the poor teacher. Other than that she's fine, I don't really believe she needs any grinds but her Dad really wants her to have every opportunity.

implausible

Why? Does the 'poor' teacher not speak the language? Does she not teach the Junior Certificate course, using a Junior Cert textbook?!

A 'poor' teacher is not going to automatically empty your niece's head of every word of Irish she ever learned! Unless, that is, she is convinced she has a crap teacher, does nothing and blames the teacher if she fails.

I'm beginning to feel sorry for this poor kid, sounds like she's going to be on the receiving end of an awful lot of pressure. She'll have a hell of a lot more things to worry about in first year than the perceived standard of the teacher of one out of her 11/13 subjects.

Your brother-in-law should be more concerned with supporting his daughter through what is a very difficult transition for any kid, than lorrying on the academic pressure.

yourmano

She missed over half the year last year, came in lots of Mondays and Fridays. Is nearly at retiring age and doesn't even know the students names. Our neighbour is in her 3rd year class. The didn't know what level they were doing until May, no papers were bought for classwork. She often lets the students in the room and stands outside talking.
It's a fine school but this one teacher takes liberties, seemingly in her day she was alright but not now. I don't feel sorry for my niece, her parents care. I feel sorry for all the students who have this teacher though and all my teaching friends who can't get into it and would do a far superior job in my opinion.

rainbowtrout

yourmano wrote: »

She missed over half the year last year, came in lots of Mondays and Fridays. Is nearly at retiring age and doesn't even know the students names. Our neighbour is in her 3rd year class. The didn't know what level they were doing until May, no papers were bought for classwork. She often lets the students in the room and stands outside talking.
It's a fine school but this one teacher takes liberties, seemingly in her day she was alright but not now. I don't feel sorry for my niece, her parents care. I feel sorry for all the students who have this teacher though and all my teaching friends who can't get into it and would do a far superior job in my opinion.

Now while I accept there may be problems with this teacher, I don't buy into all of it. Students know all too well what level they are taking, many schools have English, Irish and Maths streamed, and students may then change level towards the end of 3rd year. Students sign forms in January of 3rd year stating the subjects and levels they are taking in their exams.

I don't buy papers for my classes anymore, I get them to buy them, I've been caught too many times ordering a set for the class and then having 5 or 6 students not give me any money for them. If they don't have them tough luck.

I'm just saying, what you hear from students, neighbours, the dogs on the street might have some truth in it, but don't believe everything you hear. You don't know what your neighbours child is like in class.


As for the other issues you've raised, if the teacher is leaving her classes unattended then parents do have real reason for concern and should make an appointment with the principal. But only if it happens. They can't go in all guns blazing on September 1st with a list of demands for something that may or may not happen.

Your niece may excel at Irish regardless of what teacher she has, or she may get the best teacher and decide to sit back and do nothing.

gaeilgegrinds

I assumed this post meant they were not bought as in, by anyone. I no longer buy them but the students do. Regarding levels, I heard of this once before, a teacher was supposed to be doing higher but had them all down for ordinary. It sounds terrible though but would definetely say that not all that the students say is 100%. It's not that they lie but might see things differently. I'd be in like a shot over her being out so much time though, as an Irish teacher I know there is no such thing as an Irish sub. So these are wasted classes. And she should not be leaving the class. Your niece will do fine but I'll keep an eye on all this, get on the B.O.M. and have your say. Or rather, get your sister and the child's father to, best of luck!

ulysses32

yourmano wrote: »

and all my teaching friends who can't get into it and would do a far superior job in my opinion.

Too many assumptions here. How good will your friends be thirty-nine years later?

Usually stories about teacher incompetence get exaggerrated in their journey from the classroom to the home to the neighbour to the neighbour's friend and so on...

If the concerns are so major then maybe a friendly word with the teacher might be a good idea. The parent could communicate his expectations and wishes for his child with regard to Irish. This might sound an alarm bell for the teacher if it is needed.

How many professions don't have colleagues who are suffering from age, stress, burn-out, etc.

If the situation is as as serious as has been made out here then I am sure the school management are aware of it.

If not, deal with issues as they arise, preferably through the Principal before the board.

yourmano

This has been brought up quite a bit in the school but when a teacher has been there longer than a new principal it's a tough one. I take your point on my friends and 39 years time though, who knows I suppose. I just hope they never leave the students unattended, whatever about the quality of their teaching.

JSK 252

Talking about teacher incompetence my favourite one liner from my Irish teacher who is the laziest bitch alive:

Im payed to teach not to care.

or

I cant correct tonight because desperate housewives is on tonight. ( 2 weeks before the leaving)

I got on grand though. I just went to bru na pairce in killarney last summer and learnt more Irish in 2 weeks than from my teacher.

rainbowtrout

JSK 252 wrote: »

Talking about teacher incompetence my favourite one liner from my Irish teacher who is the laziest bitch alive:

Im payed to teach not to care.

or

I cant correct tonight because desperate housewives is on tonight. ( 2 weeks before the leaving)

That doesn't really say anything about your teacher's competence or lack of. It may surprise you to know that she is entitled to sit down and watch an hour of TV every now and again, even if it is two weeks before the leaving cert. Sometimes students forget that they just can't land in with work and expect it to be corrected and handed back almost straight away, teachers do have other stuff going on in their lives

JSK 252

rainbowtrout wrote: »

That doesn't really say anything about your teacher's competence or lack of. It may surprise you to know that she is entitled to sit down and watch an hour of TV every now and again, even if it is two weeks before the leaving cert. Sometimes students forget that they just can't land in with work and expect it to be corrected and handed back almost straight away, teachers do have other stuff going on in their lives

In all fairness now though the incident in question would have only taken 5 minutes to correct and I know for fact of teachers in my school who will happily correct students work coming up to a stressful period in the comfort of their own home while watching the telly.

I always believed that teachers took pride in their work and didnt just think of it as a chore.

Thats my 2 cents anyway

rainbowtrout

JSK 252 wrote: »

In all fairness now though the incident in question would have only taken 5 minutes to correct and I know for fact of teachers in my school who will happily correct students work coming up to a stressful period in the comfort of their own home while watching the telly.

I always believed that teachers took pride in their work and didnt just think of it as a chore.

Thats my 2 cents anyway

They do, and as a teacher I do. But I'm also entitled to a break. Sometimes you need a night to switch off.

spurious

I'd say in the coming year the sort of 'esprit' that meant teachers did lots of extra things they were not paid for in their own time will be thin on the ground.

Sir Humphrey

rainbowtrout wrote: »

That doesn't really say anything about your teacher's competence or lack of. It may surprise you to know that she is entitled to sit down and watch an hour of TV every now and again, even if it is two weeks before the leaving cert. Sometimes students forget that they just can't land in with work and expect it to be corrected and handed back almost straight away, teachers do have other stuff going on in their lives

It does say something about the teacher's judgment though. You really don't hand student a stick to beat you with and generalise about you like that.

I know a teacher who had Leaving Cert students plead with her to do extra classes with them in the lead up to the recent Leaving Cert and only a handful showed up in the end. Demoralising for the teacher, but there's 25 odd students with much greater scope than a single teacher to whinge about things that don't suit them, so teachers need to be more circumspect.

uriah

ulysses32 wrote: »

Too many assumptions here. How good will your friends be thirty-nine years later?

Usually stories about teacher incompetence get exaggerrated in their journey from the classroom to the home to the neighbour to the neighbour's friend and so on...

If the concerns are so major then maybe a friendly word with the teacher might be a good idea. The parent could communicate his expectations and wishes for his child with regard to Irish. This might sound an alarm bell for the teacher if it is needed.

How many professions don't have colleagues who are suffering from age, stress, burn-out, etc.


If the situation is as as serious as has been made out here then I am sure the school management are aware of it.

If not, deal with issues as they arise, preferably through the Principal before the board.

'Suffering from age' ???? What exactly do you mean?

Twenty-somethings suffering from hangovers?
Thirty-somethings suffering from lack of sleep, having been up all night with the baby?

gaeilgegrinds

http://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/15625


It would seem the parents mentioned by the OP is not alone in her sentiments, wondering how common this is nowadays!

TheDriver

We get parents constantly asking for certain teachers but usually its for all the wrong reasons, they want children with the teacher who "roars the stuff into them" which in turn doesn't always work for every child. It also puts pressure on the system of splitting classes or better again, someone wants to be in a teachers class even though they end up with students of a totally incompatible level and still expect to be taught at the level they want and not the class.
Its a minefield but remember one persons favourite teacher is anothers most hated, some kids love my style, some don't, fact of life.

Toto Wolfcastle

gaeilgegrinds wrote: »

http://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/15625


It would seem the parents mentioned by the OP is not alone in her sentiments, wondering how common this is nowadays!

Well that's fair enough tbh.