GUI Handicap question

darsar

Hi all,

Just a quick question I hope someone could answer.

Reading the 'Country Handicap' thread, I have tried to join Slievenamon but I have a problem. I really don't want to go down there to play three rounds and there is the option of sending down a letter from my previous club stating what my handicap was when I left but here is the problem. I left early 2004 and the club say the records don't go back that far.

So, do you think I could get the some sort of letter from the GUI?

Thanks for reading

f22

After 5 years I doubt it to be honest

copacetic

I'd be very hopeful that the GUI would say no to something like that. If the handicap is more that a year out of date no club should accept a letter imo, it's a bandits charter, distance handicaps have a bad enough reputation already. If you aren't willing to play the 3 rounds you shouldn't join them imo.

darsar

copacetic wrote: »

I'd be very hopeful that the GUI would say no to something like that. If the handicap is more that a year out of date no club should accept a letter imo, it's a bandits charter, distance handicaps have a bad enough reputation already. If you aren't willing to play the 3 rounds you shouldn't join them imo.

Having just turned 23 with a small child and mortgage, I just don't have the €18,000 to join the club I left five years ago to move to the UK.

I suppose your right also as I was 13.8 when I left and now play nearer to 8-10.

copacetic

jamegg wrote: »

Having just turned 23 with a small child and mortgage, I just don't have the €18,000 to join the club I left five years ago to move to the UK.

I suppose your right also as I was 13.8 when I left and now play nearer to 8-10.

I didn't mean you should join somewhere expensive, just that if you are going to join somewhere as a distance member you should at least be willing to play the 3 rounds. You could easily do it over a weekend.

darsar

I know I should but the hassle of hotels and time off work and also finding a member of that club to play with me to mark the card. They give the option of sending this letter clearly on their webpage so that's why I tried to get one of these. I'm sure you understand were I'm coming from and I equally do understand why your against this type of thing. I just want to play competitive golf and can't get into semi opens without the handicap.

Sandwich

Why do you want a handicap in the first place if fitting in a few rounds is such a hassle? Surely you want a handicap to play golf - not to find it a chore to fit in a few games?

To the experts : Even if you have one, are handicaps not suspended now if you dont hand in a sufficient number of qualifying single cards a year?

Mister Sifter

I'm with Copa on this one. If the GUI did what you ask they would be totally demeaning the whole handicap system. Thankfully, i'm pretty much certain it would never happen.

It's €180 for distance membership of Slievenamon is it not? Why not just pay an extra few quid and join Corballis or something where membership is only around €350. You'll then have it handy for getting 3 cards in, no need for hotels, an option for cheap golf when you want a game but there's no opens on.

darsar

Sandwich wrote: »

Why do you want a handicap in the first place if fitting in a few rounds is such a hassle? Surely you want a handicap to play golf - not to find it a chore to fit in a few games?

To the experts : Even if you have one, are handicaps not suspended now if you dont hand in a sufficient number of qualifying single cards a year?

I actually have alot of time to play golf (home from work each day at no later than 2pm). The hassle is travelling to Clonmel to fit the rounds in. When I was younger my grandfather got myself and my cousin(same age as me) into his golf club. They play in the Wednesday and Saturday competitions and I can't as I don't have a handicap. My cousin is still a student so his fee is roughly €350 p/a while mine would be €18,000 and whatever for each year after.

Like I said I already understand fully why people are against this but going back to the origional question of obtaining this letter, the webpage clearly states it accepts handicaps from former club. It is just an easy option I am looking into.

copacetic

jamegg wrote: »

Like I said I already understand fully why people are against this but going back to the origional question of obtaining this letter, the webpage clearly states it accepts handicaps from former club. It is just an easy option I am looking into.

I'd be pretty sure they mean the club you are leaving. i.e they assume you have an up to date handicap, not a 5 year old one. A 5 year old handicap is meaningless.

Boden08

Would you not be better to join a pay as you play option around dublin - Grange Castle, Corballis, Deer Park or wherever. That way you could put your three cards in at your convenience and still get a handicap cheaply enough without having to travel.
You'd not be paying for a membership you're going to struggle to get the value of that way?

jampotjim

jamegg wrote: »

I actually have alot of time to play golf (home from work each day at no later than 2pm). The hassle is travelling to Clonmel to fit the rounds in. When I was younger my grandfather got myself and my cousin(same age as me) into his golf club. They play in the Wednesday and Saturday competitions and I can't as I don't have a handicap. My cousin is still a student so his fee is roughly €350 p/a while mine would be €18,000 and whatever for each year after.

Like I said I already understand fully why people are against this but going back to the origional question of obtaining this letter, the webpage clearly states it accepts handicaps from former club. It is just an easy option I am looking into.

You can join a lot of courses around Dublin without the Hello money..

I am in Carton and got it for a bit less than €2k for the year and is savage but City West do it also starting out at €500 for the year inc GUI

darsar

Joining a club online for €180 and (hopefully) getting a GUI handicap without having to go to Tipperary was obviously a really big attraction to me. Thus, asking if you guys thought I would be able to get my 5 year old handicap onto a letter. Clearly the general view is no so my question has been answered. As I said the main reason I want a handicap is to play the same golf course with my cousin and grandfather so joining a public course for €300 that I will never play I will be getting the same value for joining a club for €180 that I never wll play either. Although it may be the case I pay the extra few bob to play the three close to me if im going to have to play the three rounds anyway.

jimmystars

Give the club a ring and ask can you submit 3 scorecards from a course closer to you. Id say that they would oblidge as i played with a guy from slievenamon who told me he did this.

1916

Sandwich wrote: »

To the experts : Even if you have one, are handicaps not suspended now if you dont hand in a sufficient number of qualifying single cards a year?

A handicap cannot be taken from you as long as you remain a member of the relevant club and you have paid your GUI levy, thus you cannot be asked to re-submit 3 cards. Also at annual handicap review time a players handicap cannot be reviewed upwards unless with approval from the GUI (although I'd say that is a routine rule the way it is applied)

So you might not play any competitions between now and 2050 and you still will have a handicap. Inter Club comps are different and to qualify you must have played in 4 comps in prior year

PhilipMarlowe

It's not entirely true to say your handicap can't be taken off you. I'm not sure if the direction below is in place in Ireland (yet?) but it indicates that your handicap can lapse to the extent that it's not valid in competitions (not just inter-club competitions which have stricter rules).

http://www.congu.com/template2.asp?pid=54&parent=2

25.1 A Union may direct that the handicap of any player, in whatever Category, who fails to return a stipulated minimum number of Qualifying Scores in a period between Annual Reviews shall lapse.
25.2 A handicap that has lapsed in this manner will not be acceptable for competition where a CONGU® Handicap is required but may be used for social golf and the like.
When a player fails to return the specified number of scores in the period between Annual Reviews of handicaps resulting in a lapse of handicap, the following points are relevant:
The handicap is ‘starred’ and deemed to be inactive in the sense that it is not acceptable for competitions in which a CONGU® Handicap is required. The ‘starred’ handicap, however, is not ‘lost’. It can be used in the normal manner for all forms of social golf and is valid where a handicap certificate is a condition required to play at another golf course.
A ‘starred’ handicap does not preclude a Member from playing in a club 18 hole Qualifying Competition in order to have a CONGU® Handicap allotted. Such scores, however, must be excluded from the calculation of the CSS.
Clubs have discretionary powers in very exceptional circumstances to allow the retention of a CONGU® Handicap where ill health or injury has precluded a player from returning the specified number of scores.

MiniGolf

I think I know the club you want to join.... €18000 yikes :eek:

I joined Slievenamon last year and have just renewed!
I went down on a friday morning, played 2 rounds, stayed in a lovely B & B, played saturday morning and was home by 3pm saturday afternoon. I think the whole thing cost me about €375 for everything. Membership, insurance, food, fuel, accomodation etc.:D
You don't need to stay in a hotel and eat in a fancy restaurant if you are on a budget! The restaurant in the club serves good food!
Once you do it you never have to go near the club again as long as you submit cards.... and if I am right about your "preferred" club when you play their open comps they do the return for you!! I have played a few there.
They are geared up for distance members and will organise a member to play with you.

You say you are home no later than 2pm.... + 2 hrs to Clonmel (from Greystones) = 4pm...a round will take max 3 hrs (On a slow day!) Why not go down on a friday afternoon and play your final 2 rounds on saturday..... home by 7 pm latest!!!
BTW I live near Greystones!

macgabhs

I was in a similar position to the op a while back. I enquired with my previous club with which I had a handicap up to 3 years ago. The club manager there told me that they will only issue letters for a 6 month period after leaving to enable the transfer of a handicap after that it is as if you never had a handicap and have to go through the 3 card routine again. I ended up joining elmgreen for €300 from June to January and put in 3 cards. If it helps you can have your cards signed by anybody who gas a GUI handicap they don't have to be an elmgreen member. This was very useful for me as I didn't know anybody in elmgreen and got my brother to sign my cards.

aster99

this might be a really silly qestion but does the person who signs the card have to play the round with you?

jimmystars

They do

darsar

MiniGolf wrote: »

I think I know the club you want to join.... €18000 yikes :eek:

I joined Slievenamon last year and have just renewed!
I went down on a friday morning, played 2 rounds, stayed in a lovely B & B, played saturday morning and was home by 3pm saturday afternoon. I think the whole thing cost me about €375 for everything. Membership, insurance, food, fuel, accomodation etc.:D
You don't need to stay in a hotel and eat in a fancy restaurant if you are on a budget! The restaurant in the club serves good food!
Once you do it you never have to go near the club again as long as you submit cards.... and if I am right about your "preferred" club when you play their open comps they do the return for you!! I have played a few there.
They are geared up for distance members and will organise a member to play with you.

You say you are home no later than 2pm.... + 2 hrs to Clonmel (from Greystones) = 4pm...a round will take max 3 hrs (On a slow day!) Why not go down on a friday afternoon and play your final 2 rounds on saturday..... home by 7 pm latest!!!
BTW I live near Greystones!

Aye, I will most likely take this option.

I emailed the club asking about playing 3 rounds close to home and sending them like Jimmystars suggested but I got no reply.

Out of curiosity, surely a person could send off their good rounds back to Slievenamon and not when they should be getting .1 back. That can't be right?!!

darsar

macgabhs wrote: »

If it helps you can have your cards signed by anybody who gas a GUI handicap they don't have to be an elmgreen member. This was very useful for me as I didn't know anybody in elmgreen and got my brother to sign my cards.

Did he play with you?!!!

jimmystars

jamegg wrote: »

Out of curiosity, surely a person could send off their good rounds back to Slievenamon and not when they should be getting .1 back. That can't be right?!!

at most clubs you input all home and away scores into a computer and they automatically get updated by the handicap secretary of the home club.

darsar

jimmystars wrote: »

at most clubs you input all home and away scores into a computer and they automatically get updated by the handicap secretary of the home club.

But surely then before you go out to play you have to register you are going out to play otherwise you could just not put it in the computer after the round if it was bad. ( for people trying to stay at a lower handicap obviously)

PhilipMarlowe

With most 'proper' setups, you sign into the computer before you play your round. In my home course if you don't sign in beforehand you are DQ'ed. It stops people playing a round, deciding they have a good score and then paying the money and entering the competition.... likewise, if you played crap you wouldn't be inclined to pay a fiver afterwards for the privilege
I have played in open competitions in Kilkenny and for some reason you 'sign in' to a book in the pro shop but enter your scores (or not) afterwards at the computer. I don't understand how this is allowed because I doubt they'd check that everyone who signed in to the book entered a score? Seems to me it allows people to avoid getting adjusted.

darsar

Licksy wrote: »

With most 'proper' setups, you sign into the computer before you play your round. In my home course if you don't sign in beforehand you are DQ'ed. It stops people playing a round, deciding they have a good score and then paying the money and entering the competition.... likewise, if you played crap you wouldn't be inclined to pay a fiver afterwards for the privilege
I have played in open competitions in Kilkenny and for some reason you 'sign in' to a book in the pro shop but enter your scores (or not) afterwards at the computer. I don't understand how this is allowed because I doubt they'd check that everyone who signed in to the book entered a score? Seems to me it allows people to avoid getting adjusted.

The only way I have ever known it is to pay and sign book at pro shop and if the card wasn't returned you were just given .1 back. How on earth can anybody decide to enter a competition after playing is beyond me!!

ozymandias10

jamegg wrote: »

The only way I have ever known it is to pay and sign book at pro shop and if the card wasn't returned you were just given .1 back. How on earth can anybody decide to enter a competition after playing is beyond me!!

In some clubs if you don't return a card you a cut point one...you should return a card always (if you have entered a competition) this stops people getting point ones and only playing nine holes etc

Matt Santos

Licksy wrote: »

With most 'proper' setups, you sign into the computer before you play your round. In my home course if you don't sign in beforehand you are DQ'ed. It stops people playing a round, deciding they have a good score and then paying the money and entering the competition.... likewise, if you played crap you wouldn't be inclined to pay a fiver afterwards for the privilege
I have played in open competitions in Kilkenny and for some reason you 'sign in' to a book in the pro shop but enter your scores (or not) afterwards at the computer. I don't understand how this is allowed because I doubt they'd check that everyone who signed in to the book entered a score? Seems to me it allows people to avoid getting adjusted.

Licksy, I can tell you that before any result is published all of the above are checked. Any Comp Sec worth his salt first gets the print out from the Computer. Counts his returned cards and checks how many are signed into the book. These numbers are essential to find cards that are not entered into the computer. This happens because of faulty cards or maybe a problem on the Clubs side with the Computer when the player was coming in. The top ten or so from the computer print out are sought out and re-checked. A winner and subsequent places are found. Last job then is to make sure they actually signed the book and paid into the Competition.
To win any prize all of the neccesary criteria have to be checked and verified. Book signed into, monies paid, card filled out proper and lastly at least in my old club to see if your sub was paid for the year!!

randomer

ozymandias10 wrote: »

In some clubs if you don't return a card you a cut point one...you should return a card always (if you have entered a competition) this stops people getting point ones and only playing nine holes etc

I played a competition yesterday in another club. I entered my score into the computer and left my card in the box.

How do I give my score back to my own club?

Boden08

randomer wrote: »

I played a competition yesterday in another club. I entered my score into the computer and left my card in the box.

How do I give my score back to my own club?

Most clubs hosting opens will now enter this on the computer and Congu adjusts it as per your own club.
Most clubs have an away scores book for their members, and you should also record the details there.

randomer

Boden08 wrote: »

Most clubs hosting opens will now enter this on the computer and Congu adjusts it as per your own club.
Most clubs have an away scores book for their members, and you should also record the details there.

Thanks. I recorded it on the computer in the club I was playing. Do I just need to record the number of points I scored in my own club or do I have to enter the score on each hole? I dropped the score off and I cant remember what I got on each hole!

PhilipMarlowe

Usually there will be an Away Records sheet (or book) on the notice board. Just put in the venue, date, your overall score, handicap, the SSS of the course, the CSS if known etc... (any adjustments for disaster holes if it was strokeplay, no need for this in stableford).
Shouldn't be too important as it was all already done by computer but this is a good practice to get into because you are responsible for notifying your home club.

macgabhs

jamegg wrote: »

Did he play with you?!!!

yes sorry if I wasn't clear. The person must play the round with you

1916

Licksy wrote: »

It's not entirely true to say your handicap can't be taken off you. I'm not sure if the direction below is in place in Ireland (yet?) but it indicates that your handicap can lapse to the extent that it's not valid in competitions (not just inter-club competitions which have stricter rules).

http://www.congu.com/template2.asp?pid=54&parent=2

Not so, this only applies to Scottish clubs, since 2002

http://www.handicapmaster.org/handicaps/Unified_Handicapping_System_Page5.php

PhilipMarlowe

Handicaps will be marked 'inactive' in England from next year as far as I know... I was pretty sure that handicaps don't get lapsed over here because we discussed it here before but I am just making the point that since this facility is 'out there' so to speak, it could get introduced here in time?

1916

Old thread but...

Is Handicap starring now active in Ireland? See link to Tulfarris Golf Club

http://www.tulfarrisgolfclub.ie/Current%20News.htm

Figo69

On the subject of GUI handicap, i had played 3 competitions in the space of 7 days last week and neither of the results are shown on the golfnet website yet. Played in Charlesland, St.Magarets and Buncloudy.

Is there a problem with the website or is it usually that slow???

Sorry to hijack the actual thread.:)

mag

Figo69 wrote: »

On the subject of GUI handicap, i had played 3 competitions in the space of 7 days last week and neither of the results are shown on the golfnet website yet. Played in Charlesland, St.Magarets and Buncloudy.

Is there a problem with the website or is it usually that slow???

Sorry to hijack the actual thread.:)

are they showing up as away scores on golfnet yet?

Figo69

mag wrote: »

are they showing up as away scores on golfnet yet?

Actaully just noticed that now..yeah 2 of them on away scores..the third one was on last sunday.:)

mag

Figo69 wrote: »

Actaully just noticed that now..yeah 2 of them on away scores..the third one was on last sunday.:)

prob be updated by your hc sec this week then.

Figo69

Yeah hopefully sooner rather than later!:):):)

curly from cork

jimmystars wrote: »

Give the club a ring and ask can you submit 3 scorecards from a course closer to you. Id say that they would oblidge as i played with a guy from slievenamon who told me he did this.

congu rulebook clause 16.2
To obtain a handicap a player must submit such number of cards over 18 holes in such a manner as his home club requires, but not less than three, at his home club each of which must be marked and signed by a responsible person acceptable to the handicap committee.These ards should normally be submitted within a period of six months.