Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Gospel Reading at a Catholic Wedding

  • 10-07-2009 4:35pm
    #1
    LumpyMonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭


    Please forgive any lack of learning & understanding with this question . . .

    In a Catholic wedding, why does the priest have to deliver the Gospel reading?

    Surely this stinks of a pre-reformation time where the priests delivered the word of God to the people.

    Why can't a member of the congregation chosen by the bride & groom deliver the reading? Is this bound by tradition or a church ruling?

    Lumpy Monkey


Comments

  • #2
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    This happens in the Church of Ireland as well. I'm not sure if they would be as rigid as they seem to be in your case on it though. The general reason is because it includes Christ's direct words that the priest / pastor should read it. I don't see why there can't be some accomodation on it though OP.


  • #3
    prinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Doesn't a Catholic priest always read the Gospel....? Aren't the readings enough? Why don't you do away with the priest altogether and indulge your post reformation sensibilities with one of your congregation officiating.


  • #4
    Shane_C
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭Shane_C


    prinz wrote: »
    Doesn't a Catholic priest always read the Gospel....? Aren't the readings enough? Why don't you do away with the priest altogether and indulge your post reformation sensibilities with one of your congregation officiating.

    I agree

    Forgive me if i'm wrong but I think the gospel is one of those things only the priest can do.
    By the same logic, why not get one of your friends to marry you?


  • #5
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    Shane_C wrote: »
    By the same logic, why not get one of your friends to marry you?

    I think its always better to marry someone your friendly with.:D


  • #6
    LumpyMonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭LumpyMonkey


    Shane_C wrote: »
    I agree

    Forgive me if i'm wrong but I think the gospel is one of those things only the priest can do.


    What happens if you sneek a peek at one of the Gospels in your bible at home? Do you get struck down by lightening?

    I've read the Gospels many times, and in many translated forms, KJV being my personal preference. I'm still healthy and I haven't been condemned as a heretic yet.

    To paraphrase the great reformer Tyndale's final words "Lord! Open the people of Ireland's eyes."

    LM


  • Advertisement
  • #7
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    What happens if you sneek a peek at one of the Gospels in your bible at home? Do you get struck down by lightening?

    I've read the Gospels many times, and in many translated forms, KJV being my personal preference. I'm still healthy and I haven't been condemned as a heretic yet.

    To paraphrase the great reformer Tyndale's final words "Lord! Open the people of Ireland's eyes."

    LM

    I'm totally in agreement here LM. As for those being Tyndale's final words, that's incredibly interesting, where did you hear that from?


  • #8
    Michael G
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 797 ✭✭✭Michael G


    Jakkass wrote: »
    I'm totally in agreement here LM. As for those being Tyndale's final words, that's incredibly interesting, where did you hear that from?
    He did say he was paraphrasing. Tyndale's last words were: "Lord, open the King of England's eyes."


  • #9
    Michael G
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 797 ✭✭✭Michael G


    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    Please forgive any lack of learning & understanding with this question . . .
    Right. Regular Mass-goer, are you? Do you know much about why the Mass is the way it is?
    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    In a Catholic wedding, why does the priest have to deliver the Gospel reading? Surely this stinks of a pre-reformation time where the priests delivered the word of God to the people.
    We didn't really go along with the Reformation. We thought it was basically a mistake. We had our own Counter-Reformation. We believe that the priest isn't just one of us.
    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    Why can't a member of the congregation chosen by the bride & groom deliver the reading? Is this bound by tradition or a church ruling?

    Lumpy Monkey
    Or maybe you are in the wrong shop.

    You may well find people who will tell you that this is just what the Vatican says etc or that they are "Catholics" but don't go along with all that because "the Church is the people" but that is no more logical than people telling you they are vegetarians while eating a sausage. If people don't like what the Catholic church says, there are plenty of Christianity-Lite options where you meet a much nicer class of person.


  • #10
    Manach
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,768 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    From my reading of our doctrine; the priest's role is that of celebrating mass, and reading the Gospel is reserved under that remit. Non-catholics can attend mass, just not receive communion.


  • #11
    prinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    What happens if you sneek a peek at one of the Gospels in your bible at home? Do you get struck down by lightening?I've read the Gospels many times, and in many translated forms, KJV being my personal preference. I'm still healthy and I haven't been condemned as a heretic yet.


    Reading the Gospels is fine, and encouraged. Preaching the Gospel in an official Church ceremony, while presiding over a sacrament is another matter altogether.


  • Advertisement
  • #12
    Slav
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Slav


    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    In a Catholic wedding, why does the priest have to deliver the Gospel reading?

    Because acting in persona Christi he is the obvious man to do it.
    Surely this stinks of a pre-reformation time where the priests delivered the word of God to the people.
    I have no idea what pre-reformation time stinks like...
    Why can't a member of the congregation chosen by the bride & groom deliver the reading?
    Because the groom and the bride are not the most important figures at the Wedding Mass.
    Is this bound by tradition or a church ruling?
    It's bound by understanding that Mass is not a Bible study meeting.


  • #13
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    Slav wrote: »
    Because acting in persona Christi he is the obvious man to do it.

    Is the priest more in persona Christi than anyone else there though?


  • #14
    prinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Is the priest more in persona Christi than anyone else there though?


    As the only one anointed and capable of bestowing the sacrament of marriage then yes, I would have thought so.


  • #15
    Slav
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Slav


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Is the priest more in persona Christi than anyone else there though?
    He is not 'more', he's the only one.


  • #16
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    prinz wrote: »
    As the only one anointed and capable of bestowing the sacrament of marriage then yes, I would have thought so.

    Right yes, but imitato Christi means in imitation of Christ. Couldn't a lay person not imitate Christ in a way that some priests couldn't?

    I personally think the priest / pastor would be more entitled to perform the sacrament of marriage because he is trained theologically and has received the laying on of hands.
    Slav wrote: »
    He is not 'more', he's the only one.

    Hm, I'm not entirely sure about that :)


  • #17
    LumpyMonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭LumpyMonkey


    Thanks for your feedback everyone.

    To answer MichaelG, I don't go to mass as I'm not a member of the Catholic Church. This is why I’m asking questions – to learn, to gain knowledge & to understand . . . . is enlightenment discouraged in a Catholic Christendom?!!
    I'm a member of the Anglican Communion, and a keen (albeit novice) reader of bible & reformation history.

    Where my understanding falters is why a lay person can stand at the pulpit in a Catholic Church and read from The Epistles, but not from the Gospels. Why does someone (i.e. a catholic priest) need to be acting ‘in persona Christi’ to read from the Gospels, but not from other texts?


  • #18
    prinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Right yes, but you imitato Christi means in imitation of Christ. Couldn't a lay person not imitate Christ in a way that some priests couldn't?

    Definitely. Just not in the celebration of mass.


  • #19
    prinz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    LumpyMonkey wrote: »
    Where my understanding falters is why a lay person can stand at the pulpit in a Catholic Church and read from The Epistles, but not from the Gospels. Why does someone (i.e. a catholic priest) need to be acting ‘in persona Christi’ to read from the Gospels, but not from other texts?

    Probably because the Gospels are core texts, primary evidence so to speak.


  • #20
    postcynical
    Closed Accounts Posts: 341 ✭✭postcynical


    As I understand it a deacon can read the gospel. Also a priest is not necessary to confer the marriage sacrament as the bride bestows this on the groom and vice versa. Under ordinary conditions though a priest is required to be present to validate the marriage on behalf of the bishop. This is an administrative rather than a sacramental role.


  • #21
    Michael G
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 797 ✭✭✭Michael G


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Right yes, but imitato Christi means in imitation of Christ.
    No, it means representing Christ. The priest is nobody; just a cipher. He is there to say some words and make some gestures but he himself, as a man, is absolutely irrelevant. (The same is true for a priest offering the Sacrifice at Mass or giving Absolution in Confession.) It is as if, for the time it took, he did not exist while he did those things.


  • Advertisement
Advertisement