Great players that never made the B&I Lions.

thomond2006

Peter Stringer.....should have been picked in 2005, Ireland's most capped scrum half and an absolute fighter on the pitch

Anthony Foley..... greatest player never to make the lions imo, an absolute legend

David Humphreys.... arguable but was a great number 10

Chris Paterson....debatable but was always a money kicker for Scotland

Marcus Horan..... Could you throw him in? meh..


Any others?

Zico

Ayola Erinle

gcgirl

I feel like i've been violated !! I've been thinking about this since it was announced its squad!!

gcgirl

One of my old Favs Simon Geoghegan!

Stealdo

Me

mink_man

dan carter!

chupacabra

Dennis Hurley.. there is still time yet.

thomond2006

chupacabra wrote: »

Dennis Hurley.. there is still time yet.

/falls off chair

/rings solicitor to prepare injury lawsuit


:D:D

remus808

thomond2006

Serious suggestions please. :D:D

Carter is ineligable and who knows about Stealdo?

Karmabass: Dowling??? Ah here....

Stev_o

Smugo himself

Profiler

thomond2006 wrote: »

Peter Stringer.....should have been picked in 2005, Ireland's most capped scrum half and an absolute fighter on the pitch

He wasn't better than than Gareth Cooper, Chris Cusiter, Matt Dawson or Dwayne Peel so No - didn't deserve a place in 2005.

thomond2006 wrote: »

Anthony Foley..... greatest player never to make the lions imo, an absolute legend

Too young for 1997. In 2001 Foley wasn't better than Scott Quinnell, Martin Corry or Simon Taylor and didn't deserve a place on the 2001 tour and was not within an asses roar of the 2005 squad.

thomond2006 wrote: »

David Humphreys.... arguable but was a great number 10

Hmmm - but no... too many better No 10's ahaed of him and wasn't even first choise for Ireland during his career.

thomond2006 wrote: »

Chris Paterson....debatable but was always a money kicker for Scotland

Not enough pace as a winger and there were players who were not as good as kickers (not by much) who were more versitile players.

thomond2006 wrote: »

Marcus Horan..... Could you throw him in? meh..

I just don't see it. too many Welsh, Scottish and English props ahead of him...


Any others?[/quote]

+ 1 to gcgirl for Simon Geoghegan.

What about the Claw... maybe 1997??

Chucky the tree

Marcus horan is nearly as comical as suggesting dennis hurley.

Amazotheamazing

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Marcus horan is nearly as comical as suggesting dennis hurley.

Not when Tim Payne can make a tour.

razorblunt

Simon Taylor by that I mean I know he got a game in 2001 but he never got a fair run at it, still goes down as a Lion I guess,

SomeFool

Really thought Trevor Brennen should have got a shot in 2005.

thomond2006

[/quote]
+ 1 to gcgirl for Simon Geoghegan.

What about the Claw... maybe 1997??[/quote]

The Claw was picked for 1993 but had work commitments.

He was also picked in 1997 but got injured and was replaced by Paul Wallace who started all three tests.

coylerwhaa

+ 1 to gcgirl for Simon Geoghegan.
best Irish back not to make a Lions Team

gcgirl

thomond2006 wrote: »

+ 1 to gcgirl for Simon Geoghegan.

What about the Claw... maybe 1997??[/quote]

The Claw was picked for 1993 but had work commitments.

He was also picked in 1997 but got injured and was replaced by Paul Wallace who started all three tests.[/QUOTE]

Jees i hope Paul Wallace has repaid The claw with many a pint for his inclusion for the 97 tour, That a bit hard on him between work and getting injured, hell of a player !

Riskymove

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Marcus horan is nearly as comical as suggesting dennis hurley.

after seeing how some of the props got on.... I don't know

premierstone

Riskymove wrote: »

after seeing how some of the props got on.... I don't know

He'd have been as effective as Shane Williams on the wing aswell

jam_on_toast

For all his leadership material, foley was not a good enough player to make the lions.

The only argument to bring horan would be to keep a working front row unit together. ie, if flannery and hayes were going, it would make sense to bring horan as he works well with them. As an individual player, he is some way down the list.

Stringer, doesnt have a good enough all round game.

Humphreys, i thought he should have made the 2001 tour instead of ROG.

Would love to have seen trevor make the 2005 tour but Eddie made sure that didnt happen.

d'Oracle

Dion O Cuinnegan?

:pac:

Amabokke

This thread should actually be "Unlucky players that never made the Lions"

Any of the great players that were available and not injured were selected. If you even look at the current Lions squad that went on tour before all the injures most of them were good to great players in Europe and deserved to be there. If a player is great and not just good he would've been on the Lions team, no doubt. An in 2005 it would've helped if you were English when your game was just good.

thomond2006

Good point Bokke.

TarfHead

jam_on_toast wrote: »

Humphreys, i thought he should have made the 2001 tour instead of ROG.

ROG's selection for the 2001 tour was the wild card of it's day - much like Earls for this tour. I always assumed that selection in 2001 was thanks to the Cork Con 'mafia'.

The inverse of this thread would be 'Not great' player who did make the Lions. What about Vinny Cunningham in 1993 ?
Before he headed off, the St. Marys first team organised a collection and presentation for him. I know a couple of lads that were involved & he was less than impressed to be handed a cushion to make his time on the bench more comfortable !

Leslie91

Stev_o wrote: »

Smugo himself

Jeeeeeez that IRFU badge looks a whole lot like the supposed new one we have a coming.

Money for nothing or what!?.

Amazotheamazing

Franno claims he was a Lion, was on the bench for a one-off game (against France, iirc).

Richie_Gorey

Delon Armitage

Iron Hide

Denis Leamy for sure in '05 and instead of Worsley this year. Surprised he didnt get a call up in place of Ferris.

themont85

Plenty of lads in the 40s/50s/60s/70s who wouldn't have been able to have 10+ year careers with work and maybe had 3/4 windows for careers which maybe didn't coincide with Lions tours.

Guys like;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Casey_(rugby_player)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Ensor

Plenty more if I was bothered thinking about it.

dingbat

thomond2006 wrote: »

Peter Stringer.....should have been picked in 2005, Ireland's most capped scrum half and an absolute fighter on the pitch

I think you're misremembering that season. Going into the 6 Nations, a Lions place was Stringer's to lose. However, he spent the entire championship trying to desperately add a break to his game to the detriment of all else. He forgot the reason why people thought he was so good in the first place. And he played himself out of the squad.

In terms of his career, yes, he's probably unlucky not to have made it. But Lions tours are rarities; one has have fortuitous timing to be playing well at that particular point in time. And 2005 was not good timing for Stringer.

anonymous_joe

Victor Costello?

Dunno, really, generally, the best players do get picked, and you'd be unlikely to miss out if you deserved it...

premierstone

Yeah like Joe has eluded to I dont think there has been any real absolute clangers, but there has been many who were desperately unlucky with the timing of the tours i.e if it had have been two years previously when they were in top form etc.

Luckycharm

Geoghean for me thought they did keep a place open for him in 1997 but he was injured

Seriously not sure how anyone can claim cussiter and disagree on Axel being unlucky.

anonymous_joe

Luckycharm wrote: »

Geoghean for me thought they did keep a place open for him in 1997 but he was injured

Seriously not sure how anyone can claim cussiter and disagree on Axel being unlucky.

The likes of Foley would have been at their peak at a time when lads like Dallaglio were about... Then say, Charvis, as well... Some great players... Unlucky, but c'est la vie.

Chris Cusiter's very underrated. Good player. Scotland have two world class scrum halves. Well... good scrum halves.

chalkitdown

Tom Clifford.

Amazotheamazing

chalkitdown wrote: »

Tom Clifford.

Hard to know if you're joking or not, but Tom Clifford got three test caps for the Lions.

Eoin

I was shocked to read that Simon Geoghegan wasn't a Lion, but Luckycharm said it was an injury which is different to never being picked.

Most of the other Irish players mentioned would have been marginal calls I think, as opposed to a travesty that they weren't picked.

anonymous_joe wrote:

Victor Costello?

If the tour had been just after the 2003 RWC, he might have been a contender - I thought he had an excellent campaign, but I think he was at his absolute peak then - he wasn't playing that well for Ireland before that if my memory serves.

Snickers Man

Definitely agree that Geoghegan should have been a Lion. He would have really enhanced his reputation playing with good players. Remember he played in the worst Irish team ever and was still a star.

I would also categorise Foley as unlucky in that his time coincided not only with great number 8s who might have kept him off but a great captain as well in Johnson. But I think a player like he would have done really well on a Lions tour.

Great Irish player from history that never made it: how about Kevin Flynn? A Wanderers centre who could glide through defences like they weren't there. Played between 1959 and 1973, one of the longest international spans ever.

Wasn't a great tackler though, so tended to get left off the Irish team in favour of meat-fisted Munster men who could tackle an elephant but couldn't pass the ball or make a break to save their lives. So the likes of Jerry Walsh and Barry Bresnihan went on Lions tours while Flynn never did.

There's probably some of you young chaps wondering who the hell Kevin Flynn was. Well, ask your dads.

Strange how fickle fate can be. Flynn was recalled after years in the wilderness for the 1972 season. Ireland beat France in Paris for the first time in 20 years. That was on January 29th 1972. The following day in Derry there occured the event known ever since as Bloody Sunday.

Two weeks later, amid protests, Ireland went to Twickenham and won thanks to a last minute try scored in typical manner, gliding through the midfield defence, by Kevin Flynn. Then, thanks to the fraught political circumstances of the time, neither Wales nor Scotland would come to Dublin.

Ireland were on for a Grand Slam that year. Admittedly, it was not a foregone conclusion because Wales had a great team at the time but it would have been a cracker of a decider in Lansdowne Road. And had they won, the names of that team would be known to everybody. Some still are because of their achievements before and since, not least with the Lions, but a few of them would probably leave even those who can remember those days scratching their heads.

At the risk of straying off topic, here's the Irish first XV from 1972. See if you remember them.
Tom Kiernan,
Tom Grace, Mike Gibson, Kevin Flynn, Wallace McMaster,
Barry McGann, John Moloney,
Ray McLoughlin, Ken Kennedy, Sean Lynch,
Con Feighery, Willie John McBride,
Fergus Slattery, Stewart McKinney, Denis Hickie.

10 Lions in that lot. And the number eight was the eponymous uncle of Disco Den.

remus808

Red Storm wrote: »

Denis Leamy for sure in '05 and instead of Worsley this year. Surprised he didnt get a call up in place of Ferris.

Not suprised at all, he looked well off the pace against USA and Canada.

Morgans

Outside of Geoghan, there arent too many obvious omissions. I think Tony Ward was was called out as a replacement IIRC but was not originally selected. Philip Matthews didnt tour with the Lions, and I dont think Willie Anderson got called up.

Snickers Man

Morgans wrote: »

Outside of Geoghan, there arent too many obvious omissions. I think Tony Ward was was called out as a replacement IIRC but was not originally selected. Philip Matthews didnt tour with the Lions, and I dont think Willie Anderson got called up.

Ward played a test in 1980. in fact I think he set a points scoring record that day.

Matthews not getting on to the 1989 tour to Australia was one of the big surprise omissions at the time, if I remember rightly.