can i be fired?

ps3man

Ok heres the story, i work pt in retail, i just got a realy bad anonymous shopper report, my management say its very serious, im not usualy like that with customers just a bad day, our opperations manager is coming to talk to me about it, what can they do to me?

Magic.Marker

They have to give you a verbal & written warning before they can sack you. Have you ever gotten either of these before?

rogerer

mnnn. sounds a wee bit fishey? is business bad in your shop? could be trying to set you up so as to avoid payin you redundancy...? take a sickie time away from job to think about things and maybe look for another one

wmpdd3

Do not take sick time you will put yourself in a much worst position.

Mystery shoppers are a pain in the ass but they are on of the things you have to be measured on. It depends what you lost the store points on.

Were you rude, did you forget to ask for a loyalty card etc.
Your best bet is just to go through the report with the manager, list the things you didn't do and promise them you will do them in future. This will be part of your review anyway so may as well do this now.

How long are you there? usually if you go to performance management after a shopper report it is because there is written proof you have been trained on this countless times but you still didn't perform

If you caused the store to fail the MS, this probably means the manager lost their bonus, head office will be less lightly to foot bills for customer complaints as it will be seen as the stores fault. So make sure you agree this is serious for the store.

Rogerer: Drives me mad when I here advice to pull sickies. This ruins it for everybody else that is actually sick, This is retail not the civil service.

Dave!

Read your employee handbook or whatever and see what it says about dismissal.

As mentioned, you usually must be issued a verbal and formal/written warning before you can be sacked. Maybe certain transgressions can be instant, but this doesn't seem like one.

doolox

Unfortunately there can be no bad days in retail as things are so competitive that the slightest slip will lose customers and lose sales. Shops are finding rents and overheads so high now that only excellent service and excellent atmosphere will work in retail now.
Its like show business. you might feel like sh1t but you have to take the stage and smile 'till it hurts...............
I remember shopping in one of those big Uk owned electrical retail places and being offered extra cover for a lot of extra cash. I casually asked the sales guy why bother when so few take it up and he told me that it is part of the requirements of the job and they are checked up on it frfequently so the offer must be made. Also all the loyalty card stuff that I don't bother with have to be offered at the point of sale as well.
Its these details and fiddly special offers which make retail a pain in the arse for workers and customers alike.
Management should realise people want it plain and simple and quick. Anything that causes delays at the till should be avoided.

Modo_09

dont pull a sickie. just makes things worse with your boss. you messed up. admit it. say it wont happen again. explain it was a bad day. you cant get sacked for making 1 mistake or having 1 bad customer. if its a frequent thing you may be in more trouble.

ps3man

i have beem there nearly two years without a problem, i got full marks 2momths ago from a ms and my sales are usually very high, but i did so bad with this ms that i really am worried, the ms report said that i ignored her and did not offer her anything

Eoin

Magic.Marker wrote: »

They have to give you a verbal & written warning before they can sack you. Have you ever gotten either of these before?

They only have to do that if it's in their disciplinary procedure, which is up to them to define. If they have a disciplinary procedure in place that has a warning system, then the odds are that they have a clause for gross misconduct which can result in immediate termination. I think it would then be up to the (ex) employee to take a case that it wasn't gross misconduct.

gerrycollins

ps3man wrote: »

i have beem there nearly two years without a problem, i got full marks 2momths ago from a ms and my sales are usually very high, but i did so bad with this ms that i really am worried, the ms report said that i ignored her and did not offer her anything

your safe and will get a verbal warning etc.

aoibhebree

OP, I definitely don't think you could lose your job - generally that would only happen for multiple minor offences, or for something major like if you were caught stealing or drinking on the job. You'll probably get away with just a warning; the manager will probably be keeping a very close eye on you for a while though!

rogerer wrote: »

take a sickie time away from job to think about things and maybe look for another one

How could anyone ever consider this to be good advice?!

Wishbone Ash

eoin wrote: »

the odds are that they have a clause for gross misconduct which can result in immediate termination. I think it would then be up to the (ex) employee to take a case that it wasn't gross misconduct.

By no stretch of the imagination could this be construed as 'gross misconduct'. Gross misconduct would generally cover serious situations such as theft, assault, or being caught in a compromising situation.

wmpdd3 wrote: »

Drives me mad when I here advice to pull sickies. This ruins it for everybody else that is actually sick, This is retail not the civil service.

It drives me mad when those in the private sector assume that everyone in the civil/public sector takes 'sickies'. I have missed 7 days (certified) in 22 years - I'd safely say a much better record than many in the private sector. One of my colleagues hasn't missed a single day in 40 years. Another hasn't missed a day in 25 years and approximately 20 staff haven't missed a single day in 15 years. (I work in staff admin. and have access to the statistics).

Eoin

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

By no stretch of the imagination could this be construed as 'gross misconduct'. Gross misconduct would generally cover serious situations such as theft, assault, or being caught in a compromising situation.

I didn't mean to imply that it was gross misconduct, I was replying to the post I quoted in mine and saying that companies don't have to issue you with a warning before sacking you.

wmpdd3

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

By no stretch of the imagination could this be construed as 'gross misconduct'. Gross misconduct would generally cover serious situations such as theft, assault, or being caught in a compromising situation.

It drives me mad when those in the private sector assume that everyone in the civil/public sector takes 'sickies'. I have missed 7 days (certified) in 22 years - I'd safely say a much better record than many in the private sector. One of my colleagues hasn't missed a single day in 40 years. Another hasn't missed a day in 25 years and approximately 20 staff haven't missed a single day in 15 years. (I work in staff admin. and have access to the statistics).

I apologise if i have caused offence. I too haven't had a sick day in 10 years, but as part of my job I have to control absenteeism so it's a bit close to my heart.

ps3man

cheers lads, i dont think myself i will be let go but then again, i have to go in to the shop on thurs to explain my under performance and i have been advised not to say that i had an off day, what should i say?

Bondvillain

ps3man wrote: »

cheers lads, i dont think myself i will be let go but then again, i have to go in to the shop on thurs to explain my under performance and i have been advised not to say that i had an off day, what should i say?

You were advised correctly. No District/Area/Regional bod wants to hear that you've just "had an off day". That could potentially infuriate them.

All you can do is tell them that you are normally very conscientious, but you are very aware that there were aspects of your performance recently that have let you down, and have let the company down.


Tell 'em that you fully understand how important customers are to a retail outlet, and although you're embarrassed that it has taken a mystery shopper to bring this to light , you have learned from the experience, and you can only apologise for putting the company in this situation.

Point out that as a consequence, you'll certainly do everything in your power to ensure you don't offer anything less than 100% to the public every day in the future, for your own sake and for that of the company's reputation.

And sound like you mean it.

(actually meaning it would be better, but one step at a time. )

All you can do is be contrite and genuinely offer to make up the shortfall in performance.

I understand how tough that will be to do, though. I've got many years experience in customer orientated retail, and was always of the opinion that it would be a fantastic industry if it weren't for the customers.

clint_silver

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

By no stretch of the imagination could this be construed as 'gross misconduct'. Gross misconduct would generally cover serious situations such as theft, assault, or being caught in a compromising situation.

It drives me mad when those in the private sector assume that everyone in the civil/public sector takes 'sickies'. I have missed 7 days (certified) in 22 years - I'd safely say a much better record than many in the private sector. One of my colleagues hasn't missed a single day in 40 years. Another hasn't missed a day in 25 years and approximately 20 staff haven't missed a single day in 15 years. (I work in staff admin. and have access to the statistics).

maybe not you and your department.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/editorial/bitter-pill-of--sick-days-1549223.html
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/high-level-of-sickies-in-civil-service-to-be-probed-1549305.html

civildefence

If they're doing things by the book, they have to serve you 24hrs notice of a disciplinary hearing which you must attend. You are entitled to have a colleague accompany you at the hearing. They will put to you what you have been accused of and you must basically defend yourself. After the hearing they will decide if disciplinary action is necessary and if so at what level (usually a verbal warning). Be prepared if you're called to one of these as this is the kind of nonsense that puts HR saddos on their high horses.

Nabber

civildefence wrote: »

If they're doing things by the book, they have to serve you 24hrs notice of a disciplinary hearing which you must attend. You are entitled to have a colleague accompany you at the hearing. They will put to you what you have been accused of and you must basically defend yourself. After the hearing they will decide if disciplinary action is necessary and if so at what level (usually a verbal warning). Be prepared if you're called to one of these as this is the kind of nonsense that puts HR saddos on their high horses.

You can have anyone over 18 as your witness. My suggestion would be have one of your union reps, but don't tell your employer it is a union rep.

As for why you behaved the way you did. Depends on your employer. I know I would tell my manager the truth, that I had an off day. He wouldn't buy the whole dissapointment thing. But then I know him and he knows me. So the situation doesn't have a yes or no answer. Have you sought advice other than here?

Eoin

By what book? Are these procedures not up to the company to decide upon?

kravmaga

ps3man wrote: »

Ok heres the story, i work pt in retail, i just got a realy bad anonymous shopper report, my management say its very serious, im not usualy like that with customers just a bad day, our opperations manager is coming to talk to me about it, what can they do to me?

What exactly are you being accused of, the company have to make full disclosure on what they are not happy with?

What is in the MS report?

Keep cool tomorrow and get a union rep in with you

ps3man

Bondvillain wrote: »

You were advised correctly. No District/Area/Regional bod wants to hear that you've just "had an off day". That could potentially infuriate them.

All you can do is tell them that you are normally very conscientious, but you are very aware that there were aspects of your performance recently that have let you down, and have let the company down.


Tell 'em that you fully understand how important customers are to a retail outlet, and although you're embarrassed that it has taken a mystery shopper to bring this to light , you have learned from the experience, and you can only apologise for putting the company in this situation.

Point out that as a consequence, you'll certainly do everything in your power to ensure you don't offer anything less than 100% to the public every day in the future, for your own sake and for that of the company's reputation.

And sound like you mean it.

(actually meaning it would be better, but one step at a time. )

All you can do is be contrite and genuinely offer to make up the shortfall in performance.

I understand how tough that will be to do, though. I've got many years experience in customer orientated retail, and was always of the opinion that it would be a fantastic industry if it weren't for the customers.

this was the approach i was thinknig, il let you know how i get on with it

ps3man

Bondvillain wrote: »

You were advised correctly. No District/Area/Regional bod wants to hear that you've just "had an off day". That could potentially infuriate them.

All you can do is tell them that you are normally very conscientious, but you are very aware that there were aspects of your performance recently that have let you down, and have let the company down.


Tell 'em that you fully understand how important customers are to a retail outlet, and although you're embarrassed that it has taken a mystery shopper to bring this to light , you have learned from the experience, and you can only apologise for putting the company in this situation.

Point out that as a consequence, you'll certainly do everything in your power to ensure you don't offer anything less than 100% to the public every day in the future, for your own sake and for that of the company's reputation.

And sound like you mean it.

(actually meaning it would be better, but one step at a time. )

All you can do is be contrite and genuinely offer to make up the shortfall in performance.

I understand how tough that will be to do, though. I've got many years experience in customer orientated retail, and was always of the opinion that it would be a fantastic industry if it weren't for the customers.

this was the approach i was thinking, il let you know how i get on with it

Ellechim

I think you got some great advice there from Bondvillian.

i've been managing people for years. If I ahd someone who always got great results/feedback and then had a bad report/feedback the conversation would be along the lines of trying to find out what happened that particular day and stressing that it couldn't happen again. If the person took the criticism on the chin, fessed up, apologised, understood the consequences, etc then that would be the end of it. The last thing a (decent) boss wants to do in these times is to demotivate the good staff......

Best of luck tomorrow!

Mrs OBumble

ps3man wrote: »

cheers lads, i dont think myself i will be let go but then again, i have to go in to the shop on thurs to explain my under performance and i have been advised not to say that i had an off day, what should i say?

If you say you had an off-day, then that implies that every other customer that day also got c*ap service. Did they? Was it just a day? Or perhaps an off week, or even month? (That's what you manager would be thinking).

Usually it's best to tell the truth, and take even more blame than you deserve.

Mrs Shankly

Hi OP,

I think you need to swallow your medicine on this one- take any feedback on board, show your boss you are going to leave it as an isolated incident, and prove to them that you are improving.

It might even be no harm to ask your boss for tips on how to maximise your performance, etc- Just to show you are really serious.

I think you need to learn from this also- in a customer facing position, "off days"- though we all have them- need to be left for your break- the customer should not have to bear the brunt. We're all customers and we know what its like to get less than great service, and how frustrating it can be. So you need to make sure you're consistent. In this case, its probably better off for you that it was a MS report, and not a genuine irate customer.

Remember, we all make mistakes, its how we become better- what we learn from them is the most important thing! Demonstrate this to your boss.

Best of Luck!

civildefence

eoin wrote: »

By what book? Are these procedures not up to the company to decide upon?

By the Statute Book, its law.

Eoin

Do you have any links? All I can find is that a company should have displinary procedures, not what they should be.

There is a requirement under section 14(1) of the Unfair Dismissals Act 1977 that within 13 weeks of commencing employment, employees must be given a copy of the procedure to be used for disciplining or dismissing them. Such procedures may be contained within a collective agreement (i.e. negotiated) or be established by custom and practice . Other than this, there is no formal guidance on what the procedure should contain: the Act is silent, and there is (as yet) no code of practice on the subject, although this is an area where the Labour Relations Commission may take action. What guidance does exist comes from decisions of the Employment Appeals Tribunal .

Matts

ps3man wrote: »

Ok heres the story, i work pt in retail, i just got a realy bad anonymous shopper report, my management say its very serious, im not usualy like that with customers just a bad day, our opperations manager is coming to talk to me about it, what can they do to me?

Hi, How did this work out for you?
Hope it went ok for you all.

2fivers

Yeah, Im curious too. Any update?

ps3man

She never came in, mondAy im told she will be in

Cormac2791

ps3man wrote: »

cheers lads, i dont think myself i will be let go but then again, i have to go in to the shop on thurs to explain my under performance and i have been advised not to say that i had an off day, what should i say?

good luck:)

ps3man

Ok lads heres what happened

Sat down very shakey, got asked about the day i messes up on, had my manager waffle on about how im not very customer orintated but more task oriontated (at least i do something) finished with me signing a letter which was my 1st offical written warning, went on the shop floor and had 2 customers praise me for my help, why couldnt they be the mystery shopper fXXk my life

Gary ITR

ps3man wrote: »

Ok lads heres what happened

Sat down very shakey, got asked about the day i messes up on, had my manager waffle on about how im not very customer orintated but more task oriontated (at least i do something) finished with me signing a letter which was my 1st offical written warning, went on the shop floor and had 2 customers praise me for my help, why couldnt they be the mystery shopper fXXk my life

Ah this will be forgotten about unless you knacker up again. Don't worry about it dude.

I work on a Bar in a Nightclub at the weekends and I lost the head with a girl last night, was having a crap one. I roared at her to wait her turn in a really obnoxious way. I had to apologise to her straight away and I bought her a drink. Unfortunately in a customer facing role bad days don't count for anything