Forza 3

Stephen

Another fruit of E3: http://www.eurogamer.net/videos/e3-forza-motorsport-3-trailer. Coming October, apparently.

WANT.

amacachi

I'll be getting this on launch day. From what I can gather from the site the Special Edition is only in america, which is ****ing annoying.

kaimera

is it the 'drifting' vid that is available on xbl?

bah, crap vid if so...

ya it is. bleh tbh...I was expecting more for a game that is due out soon tbh.

prolly get it anyway but it better be worth the price over fm2

NeoKubrick

How can you get excited over a new racing game nowadays? It's a dead genre now. The only element that can improve is the graphics and you only get a giant leap every generation.

Leprekaun

Nah, thats not true. Physics can always improve, even if by a little. IMO, Forza 2 is the most realistic simulator out there now, although I haven't tried iRacing which seems to be getting a lot of praise but they charge you an arm and a leg for that. I really can't wait for Forza 3, will be getting launch day too. I just hope they improve the physics and not fall into the "we've adjusted it to make it easier for the pick up and play gamer" cr@p

Grim.

Leprekaun wrote: »

iRacing which seems to be getting a lot of praise but they charge you an arm and a leg for that.

i wasnt mad on the sub either till i played it the best sim i've ever played but its ****in hard

NeoKubrick

Leprekaun wrote: »

Nah, thats not true. Physics can always improve, even if by a little. IMO, Forza 2 is the most realistic simulator out there now, although I haven't tried iRacing which seems to be getting a lot of praise but they charge you an arm and a leg for that. I really can't wait for Forza 3, will be getting launch day too. I just hope they improve the physics and not fall into the "we've adjusted it to make it easier for the pick up and play gamer" cr@p

Physics can't always be improved, just as something that's defined as 'perfect' can't be improved. I don't think you can do a lot other with physics than what they have done already.

Kinetic^

NeoKubrick wrote: »

How can you get excited over a new racing game nowadays? It's a dead genre now. The only element that can improve is the graphics and you only get a giant leap every generation.

The same way people get excited over a new fighting or sports game. It's the same thing every time but they enjoy it. Forza has a lot of depth to it and a massive community worldwide from drifting clubs to car tuners to painters. Don't try and say something is dead because you have little to no knowledge of it.


Personally I think they need more tracks and not bringing in 1 track but having 3/4 variations of it. 10 new tracks, most of them being real life as well as the old ones would be great. The Bugatti Veyron would be awesome. More then 8 cars in a race would be a nice feature, up to 16 perhaps. We've only seen a cut video so far and considering GT5P looked really well, it's got a lot to live up to.


For anyone who's interested in leagues for Forza then check out this site, IFCA Racing. Very helpful bunch of guys, mostly, and there will always something running to interest you. I ran the endurance (teams of 2) race before, very enjoyable. These guys tend to be at the very top end of the leaderboard and will usually set top lap times even in the races. Enjoy.

NeoKubrick

Kinetic^ wrote: »

The same way people get excited over a new fighting or sports game. It's the same thing every time but they enjoy it. Forza has a lot of depth to it and a massive community worldwide from drifting clubs to car tuners to painters. Don't try and say something is dead because you have little to no knowledge of it.

If you're referring to me indirectly when you talk of these "people" that get excited over a "[Street Fighter]" or "[PES]" game, then that's an inaccurate comparison and totally different subject. Aside from the fact I look only for the release date of the next PES update each year and hardly count the days on my calendar, I enjoy PES as a competitive game and competitively, though the changes small, the players evolve the game (new exploits, moves, cancels, tactics etc.). It's the same with Street Fighter, and to a lesser extent any game that's played competitively.

Apart from the infamous wall exploit in Project Gotham Racing and shunting your opponent in Forza 2, how has the game of racing evolved competitively?


I was referring to the rigor mortis of the genre of racing, not the competitive side: the incapacity of racing developers to improve the games, which relates to the process of making the games, not playing them.


As an aside, fighting games, it's arguable though dead, have the capacity to be revived if some developers discards the established order and creates new rules, the same can't be said of any racing game. I think football is not perfect, yet. I think there is still room for improvement in the movement and ball-control, but yeah, the majority of sports titles, too, have very little road to finish their journey and probably some have finished it already.

Leprekaun

Well, in regards to racing competitively, thats why there are leagues and a lot of proper leagues are regulated properly. Keeping the racing clean is something which has to be managed by stewards and can't be controlled properly otherwise. In GT5P, there is the barging penalty which is efficient but has the flaw where it lacks to appreciate a racing incident (example: a driver ahead goes off the track and rejoins without paying attention to the oncoming traffic and a major collision occurs and the driver who crashed receives a penalty) so its a hard system to manage electronically.

Even at the highest racing disciplines like F1 or LMS are monitored by people, not systems. So its all about the management. If there is proper management, leagues will be run properly, if there isn't proper management, leagues will be messy.

In PES, the matches are monitored by a system that monitors parameters such as ball position, players' positions and contact between players. Thats all it has to do and there isn't any dispute to tackles because if you slide tackle a player, the other team gets a free kick.

So because football games' rules are in black and white, proper judgement isn't required but with racing, human judgement must be involved to be fair to the drivers.

NeoKubrick

Leprekaun wrote: »

Well, in regards to racing competitively, thats why there are leagues and a lot of proper leagues are regulated properly. Keeping the racing clean is something which has to be managed by stewards and can't be controlled properly otherwise. In GT5P, there is the barging penalty which is efficient but has the flaw where it lacks to appreciate a racing incident (example: a driver ahead goes off the track and rejoins without paying attention to the oncoming traffic and a major collision occurs and the driver who crashed receives a penalty) so its a hard system to manage electronically.

Even at the highest racing disciplines like F1 or LMS are monitored by people, not systems. So its all about the management. If there is proper management, leagues will be run properly, if there isn't proper management, leagues will be messy.

In PES, the matches are monitored by a system that monitors parameters such as ball position, players' positions and contact between players. Thats all it has to do and there isn't any dispute to tackles because if you slide tackle a player, the other team gets a free kick.

So because football games' rules are in black and white, proper judgement isn't required but with racing, human judgement must be involved to be fair to the drivers.

That's an entirely different discussion altogether which has no relevance to my post.

Stephen

Here's another clip, allegedly made using the game's replay editor:
http://www.eurogamer.net/videos/e3-forza-3-gameplay

kaimera

Stephen wrote: »

Here's another clip, allegedly made using the game's replay editor:
http://www.eurogamer.net/videos/e3-forza-3-gameplay

ny0m ny0m.

gimme gimme gimme 350z drifting....proper drifting that is affected by upgraded parts etc.

also I read that drag racing will be back. Awesome. I the drag strip in FM and was disappointed it was gone from FM2.

Also, be nice to be able to play split-screen with both players sharing the same pool of cars like from one users career for eg.

Kinetic^

NeoKubrick wrote: »

If you're referring to me indirectly when you talk of these "people" that get excited over a "[Street Fighter]" or "[PES]" game, then that's an inaccurate comparison and totally different subject. Aside from the fact I look only for the release date of the next PES update each year and hardly count the days on my calendar, I enjoy PES as a competitive game and competitively, though the changes small, the players evolve the game (new exploits, moves, cancels, tactics etc.). It's the same with Street Fighter, and to a lesser extent any game that's played competitively.

Apart from the infamous wall exploit in Project Gotham Racing and shunting your opponent in Forza 2, how has the game of racing evolved competitively?


I was referring to the rigor mortis of the genre of racing, not the competitive side: the incapacity of racing developers to improve the games, which relates to the process of making the games, not playing them.


As an aside, fighting games, it's arguable though dead, have the capacity to be revived if some developers discards the established order and creates new rules, the same can't be said of any racing game. I think football is not perfect, yet. I think there is still room for improvement in the movement and ball-control, but yeah, the majority of sports titles, too, have very little road to finish their journey and probably some have finished it already.

I'm not referring to you at all. PES if anything has gone backwards and it's last 2/3 release have been an abomination to the series. It's evolved into a big pile of turd leaving EA laughing at Konami in their attempts to regain traction in the market that was once theirs.

Until the console racing games reach the same physics levels as Live for Speed on the PC, they will continue to try and improve their physics through small changes. They're nowhere near this stage so there's plenty of room to evolve provided the system can withhold the load put on it.

Stephen

MOAR

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/forza-motorsport-3-hands-on

steviec

NeoKubrick wrote: »

If you're referring to me indirectly when you talk of these "people" that get excited over a "[Street Fighter]" or "[PES]" game, then that's an inaccurate comparison and totally different subject. Aside from the fact I look only for the release date of the next PES update each year and hardly count the days on my calendar, I enjoy PES as a competitive game and competitively, though the changes small, the players evolve the game (new exploits, moves, cancels, tactics etc.). It's the same with Street Fighter, and to a lesser extent any game that's played competitively.

Apart from the infamous wall exploit in Project Gotham Racing and shunting your opponent in Forza 2, how has the game of racing evolved competitively?


I was referring to the rigor mortis of the genre of racing, not the competitive side: the incapacity of racing developers to improve the games, which relates to the process of making the games, not playing them.


As an aside, fighting games, it's arguable though dead, have the capacity to be revived if some developers discards the established order and creates new rules, the same can't be said of any racing game. I think football is not perfect, yet. I think there is still room for improvement in the movement and ball-control, but yeah, the majority of sports titles, too, have very little road to finish their journey and probably some have finished it already.

There are so many areas of game design where racing games can improve. The most recent racing game I've played, GRID (which didn't have realistic handling because it didn't want to), added a rewind function which Forza 3 have already announced they're copying and is likely to become a new genre standard. Some people will complain about it but it makes a huge difference to an already exciting game when you know you can actually take risks and you're not nervous about nursing your car round to avoid rendering the last half hour of play pointless by a crash.

That's just one little feature. The racing team building, sponsorship, tyre barriers that are actually made of tyres that break up and can roll out onto circuit, car damage physics beyond anything I've seen previously, day/night cycle at Le Mans are all features of this one game that I can think of off the top of my head which I've never seen in a racing game before.

And it's not even trying to be a sim - it's not just a matter of saying "the car obeys the laws of physics therefore this game is perfect" - there will always be room for design flair when it comes to car handling, and even for what people profess to be the most realistic of simulators, they have to have differences to account for the player not necessarily having a steering wheel, and obviously not being able to feel the g-forces a real driver can - which actually brings me back to another GRID innovation, the driver's eye in car view shows his head reacting realistically to g-forces in a way I haven't seen in other games, which also adds to the gameplay.

All this is aside from the obvious things that can always be improved like the car list, track list, quality of AI, multiplayer modes, new game modes etc.

I'm not specifically singing the praises of GRID btw, it happens to be what I've played most recently - you'll find most major racing game releases all add new things to the genre.

Silverfish

Can't wait can't wait can't wait.





Giggidy.

NeoKubrick

Kinetic^ wrote: »

I'm not referring to you at all. PES if anything has gone backwards and it's last 2/3 release have been an abomination to the series. It's evolved into a big pile of turd leaving EA laughing at Konami in their attempts to regain traction in the market that was once theirs.

Until the console racing games reach the same physics levels as Live for Speed on the PC, they will continue to try and improve their physics through small changes. They're nowhere near this stage so there's plenty of room to evolve provided the system can withhold the load put on it.

PES is a different subject altogether. The gameplay hasn't changed significantly since PES1; therefore, it can't have gone backward. It's just that it missed the online generation and hasn't given a decent product to all of those armchair warriors who prefer to play online rather than play with friends. It also helps FIFA when EA court the media better than Konami do.

steviec wrote: »

I'm not specifically singing the praises of GRID btw, it happens to be what I've played most recently - you'll find most major racing game releases all add new things to the genre.

Anything significant other than cosmetic? Ironically, I said the same thing after GRID came. I am a racing fan myself, by the way. It's just that I don't expect developers to re-invent the wheel for the racing genre. :P

Stephen

I loved GRID. Sure its no simulator but it was a fun game. I particularly liked the rewind feature. Saved me from tearing my hair out after stuffing it on the last lap of Le Mans :pac: Not so fond of the massively tail-happy 70s muscle car races that usually degenerated into bumper cars though!
I couldn't give a flying fcuk about leagues or online competition. I just like a fun racing game.