Pav closing for the summer?

cunnins4

Does anyone know for certain when the Pav is closing for the summer for redevelopment? I've been told it's next Friday (5th of June).

Can someone confirm this please?

The Walsho

fh041205

I've been reliably informed that it won't be closing anytime soon. And even when it does close it will only be for 4 weeks.

piby

The Pav's being redeveloped?

GlasnevinRed

From what I heard it's partly to make it more accessible ie for peoplein wheelchairs etc.

Some thing really needs to be done about the toilets aswell.

Kwekubo

There was an article in TN a while back, IIRC there will be wheelchair access, more toilets and private rooms which sports clubs will have the use of. http://www.trinitynews.ie/index.php/news/college/306-800000-pav-plan-revealed

Boston

800K for 89 square meters. That seems an insane amount of money.

Fad

Boston wrote: »

That seems an insane amount of money.

But the toilets will be usable!

nedward

I asked the manager the other day, he said that it's not closing, they have no money for refurbishments

5318008!

yay!

i like the picnic tables!

Cantab.

nedward wrote: »

I asked the manager the other day, he said that it's not closing, they have no money for refurbishments

Good.

Too many construction/extension projects gone wrong around college.

Mark200

Cantab. wrote: »

Good.

Too many construction/extension projects gone wrong around college.

I don't know if you'd feel the same if you ended up in a wheelchair over the summer.... I think I remember you arguing about the decision to make front square accessible to wheelchair users.

Boston

Give every wheelchair user a grand, you'd save money.

Mark200

Boston wrote: »

Give every wheelchair user a grand, you'd save money.

Unless they could glue all the money together to make a nice smooth ramp, I don't think that'd help.

t0mm

The only way I can see them making the pav accessable for wheel chair users is either a massive ramp going out the sides somewhere or a lift, no way they could fix the front/inside without gutting it and changing the entire layout (which I assume they are doing due to the massive cost).

tolosenc

Sorry, but a wheelchair user in the Pav on a Friday wouldn't stand a chance. It's standing room only, if that.

Boston

Mark200 wrote: »

Unless they could glue all the money together to make a nice smooth ramp, I don't think that'd help.

It's a solution to a problem no one had. Did any of the bleeding hearts actually ask the disabled students what they wanted? There are buildings in trinity which aren't wheelchair accessible that students have to use, these should be the priority. Even the buildings with as supposedly wheelchair accessible are poorly designed.

t0mm wrote: »

The only way I can see them making the pav accessable for wheel chair users is either a massive ramp going out the sides somewhere or a lift, no way they could fix the front/inside without gutting it and changing the entire layout (which I assume they are doing due to the massive cost).

The article said a lift.

Awayindahils

I've seen the plans.

The back stairs are going to be come a lift and the pav bar itself is going to come out on both sides where the picnic tables are.

Hope it doesn't close till at least Sunday! I intend to get destroyed on Saturday afternoon.

Pirbright

The design team has only started meeting. Contractors have been short-listed by the architect. Both sides are being extended out. Lift at the back with new steps alongside. Funding is in place.

Expect works to begin early July.

Cantab.

Pirbright wrote: »

The design team has only started meeting. Contractors have been short-listed by the architect. Both sides are being extended out. Lift at the back with new steps alongside. Funding is in place.

Expect works to begin early July.

Let's hope they ditch that crap oil painting in favour of some more club photographs.

And I hope the extension works will be built to the same quality as the pavilion itself. i.e. will last 100 years and won't look a weathered mess after 10.

Ron DMC

Cantab. wrote: »

Let's hope they ditch that crap oil painting in favour of some more club photographs.

If they're throwing that out, I bagsy it.

GlasnevinRed

Awayindahils wrote: »

Hope it doesn't close till at least Sunday! I intend to get destroyed on Saturday afternoon.

Tomorrow afternoon for me. Can't wait!!!:D

Hamiltonion

They had the cheek to send me an email saying reg was going up to E1500 and now they're blowing that much on the pav or redelopments for a small minority of students? Last time I checked a bar with wheelchair access wasn't essential for learning, would the money not be better spent on improving academic facilities/later library opening hours in exam season/subsidised meals/more grants?

Boston

Hamiltonion wrote: »

They had the cheek to send me an email saying reg was going up to E1500 and now they're blowing that much on the pav or redelopments for a small minority of students? Last time I checked a bar with wheelchair access wasn't essential for learning, would the money not be better spent on improving academic facilities/later library opening hours in exam season/subsidised meals/more grants?

Well we're all paying a gym levy because the sports department are tight for money. I don't understand how if they've 800K to spend.

Mark200

I think a lift is a ridiculous idea.. not only the huge cost in building it, but then maintenance too. Sure it couldn't be that hard to build a ramp on the side of the building or beside the stairs or something?

I don't agree with the whole "a bar with wheelchair access isn't essential to learn" thing though... a bar at all isn't "essential" to learning, neither are the clubs and societies. It doesn't mean money shouldn't be spent on them.

Mark200

Mark200 wrote: »

I think a lift is a ridiculous idea.. not only the huge cost in building it, but then maintenance too. Sure it couldn't be that hard to build a ramp on the side of the building or beside the stairs or something

The slope on the ramp would have to be very low to get up it by hand, so if a ramp was built around the Pav you'd have to go around the entire building a few times on a wheelchair until you finally get to the bar.

I assume you've never been in a wheelchair (honest question)? Ramps can be tough to get up. Even getting up 'The Ramp' at the Arts Building is pretty tough going. I went around in a wheelchair for a bit of a day when I was Education Officer and I think I failed the first go getting up it.

I'd imagine the funds for doing up the Pav would come from a 'capital' fund strictly speaking rather than from the Dept. of Sports, Boston. But that's just a guess.

StinkyMunkey

Pav wont be closing anytime in the next few weeks anyway. Exams dont finish till the 12th of june. And if it doesnt close this summer, it will go ahead next summer for definite.

Cantab.

Given the crap that's gone up around college lately, there's a good chance the extension will be just that; crap. And expensive crap at that.

Mark200

Dónal wrote: »

The slope on the ramp would have to be very low to get up it by hand, so if a ramp was built around the Pav you'd have to go around the entire building a few times on a wheelchair until you finally get to the bar.

I assume you've never been in a wheelchair (honest question)? Ramps can be tough to get up. Even getting up 'The Ramp' at the Arts Building is pretty tough going. I went around in a wheelchair for a bit of a day when I was Education Officer and I think I failed the first go getting up it.

I'd imagine the funds for doing up the Pav would come from a 'capital' fund strictly speaking rather than from the Dept. of Sports, Boston. But that's just a guess.

Nope never been in a wheelchair for more than a few seconds messing around but I realised that the slope can't be too steep... I was kinda thinking of a little windy one at the side of the pav or something

Boston

A ramp has to be one in ten. Meaning for each meter it goes up it need to be 10 meters long. Considering the pave is about 4 meters off the lowest point, thats a 40 meter ramp, also you need level platforms every "so many" meters and at every turn. A Ramp would massive destroy the image of the pav, and as Donal said, would have to go all around the building to gain the elevation needed. The Arts block ramp is too steep and must have been designed by a retard. Similiar the one neer the berley is too narrow.

Jonathan

Has any one consulted the trinity paralympic team on what way they would like to access their sports bar?

gamma23

Jonathan wrote: »

Has any one consulted the trinity paralympic team on what way they would like to access their sports bar?

Trinity send a team to the Paralmpics now do they?

The Walsho

Boston wrote: »

A ramp has to be one in ten. Meaning for each meter it goes up it need to be 10 meters long. Considering the pave is about 4 meters off the lowest point, thats a 40 meter ramp, also you need level platforms every "so many" meters and at every turn. A Ramp would massive destroy the image of the pav, and as Donal said, would have to go all around the building to gain the elevation needed. The Arts block ramp is too steep and must have been designed by a retard. Similiar the one neer the berley is too narrow.

Excellent choice of words there. Given the topic of discussion and all.

Podge_irl

The Walsho wrote: »

Excellent choice of words there. Given the topic of discussion and all.

Mental retardation and physical disability requiring a wheelchair don't have a massive overlap.

StinkyMunkey

Boston wrote: »

A ramp has to be one in ten. Meaning for each meter it goes up it need to be 10 meters long. Considering the pave is about 4 meters off the lowest point, thats a 40 meter ramp, also you need level platforms every "so many" meters and at every turn. A Ramp would massive destroy the image of the pav, and as Donal said, would have to go all around the building to gain the elevation needed. The Arts block ramp is too steep and must have been designed by a retard. Similiar the one neer the berley is too narrow.

Fact is, a ramp was never an option. There will be a lift where the back stairs was.

On a different note, people saying a wheelchair lift is a unwarranted exspense are just thinking of themselves and not the needs of people with disabilities. Of course you dont need alcohol to get through college, but how would the average student feel if he came to the bar and was told he cant have a beer because he doesnt need one...!

The wheelchair lift is going to cost alot of money, but the people in wheelchairs and their friends in the long run, will make a major contribution towards its exspense over the coming years.

Boston

gamma23 wrote: »

Trinity send a team to the Paralmpics now do they?

You sir need to back away from the internet.

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

Fact is, a ramp was never an option. There will be a lift where the back stairs was.

On a different note, people saying a wheelchair lift is a unwarranted exspense are just thinking of themselves and not the needs of people with disabilities. Of course you dont need alcohol to get through college, but how would the average student feel if he came to the bar and was told he cant have a beer because he doesnt need one...!

The wheelchair lift is going to cost alot of money, but the people in wheelchairs and their friends in the long run, will make a major contribution towards its exspense over the coming years.

Wheelchair users aren't any more or less important than the average student. I think you should rethink what you consider a need and what you consider a desire. Going around trinity I can think of numerous better examples where that money could be spent to improve accessibility for the disabled. It is desirable for all students to have access to the Pav, however all students need to be able to attend lectures.

As for contributing to the expense, the number of wheelchair users is tiny, and any one else would have gone to the pav regardless of accessibility. There's no way it would recoup the cost, and you onto a lossing arguement by suggesting it.

Mark200

Boston wrote: »

You sir need to back away from the internet.



Wheelchair users aren't any more or less important than the average student. I think you should rethink what you consider a need and what you consider a desire. Going around trinity I can think of numerous better examples where that money could be spent to improve accessibility for the disabled. It is desirable for all students to have access to the Pav, however all students need to be able to attend lectures.

As for contributing to the expense, the number of wheelchair users is tiny, and any one else would have gone to the pav regardless of accessibility. There's no way it would recoup the cost, and you onto a lossing arguement by suggesting it.

"recoup" and "contribute" are completely different things, so it's a bit ridiculous that someone is onto a lossing argument by "suggesting" something that they didn't say.

If you can think of better examples then tell someone responsible about them... because they obviously haven't thought of it.

Boston

Mark200 wrote: »

"recoup" and "contribute" are completely different things, so it's a bit ridiculous that someone is onto a lossing argument by "suggesting" something that they didn't say.

If you can think of better examples then tell someone responsible about them... because they obviously haven't thought of it.

Fair enough, I don't think they're going to make a major contribution. What makes you think they haven't thought of them? The issue is this, any college building under going major renovations has be wheelchair accessible. Do you know anything about building regulations or are you just mouthing off?

gamma23

Boston wrote: »

You sir need to back away from the internet.

Ok I am confused by what your getting at there, as you may have been about what I was getting at.

Boston

facetious

The Walsho

Podge_irl wrote: »

Mental retardation and physical disability requiring a wheelchair don't have a massive overlap.

Yeah, fair enough. Think I was just on the wind-up to be honest. I got pwned.

Mark200

Boston wrote: »

Fair enough, I don't think they're going to make a major contribution. What makes you think they haven't thought of them? The issue is this, any college building under going major renovations has be wheelchair accessible. Do you know anything about building regulations or are you just mouthing off?

More like you're just showing off.... I don't see what building regulations has anything to do with what I said. What makes you think they have thought of them? If you care as much as you seem to indicate then why don't you email whoever is responsible, "or are you just mouthing off?"

Boston

Mark200 wrote: »

More like you're just showing off.... I don't see what building regulations has anything to do with what I said. What makes you think they have thought of them? If you care as much as you seem to indicate then why don't you email whoever is responsible, "or are you just mouthing off?"

Of course you don't see what building regulations have to do with things. In order to get planning permission for that type of work the Pav has to make the building more accessible. Do you understand now why the lift is required? Should I get sock puppets and a chalk bord?

Email its the sign of caring? And of course the buildings offices is aware of the access problems around trinity, its their job to keep track of these things. I know exactly why nothing is done. To give you an example, in my office we wanted to replace the old doors and doorway, but we where told me couldn't do so without making the major chances to meet accessibility regulations. It's complex kid, and I honestly don't think you have it in you to understand. Go back to trying to figure out why doing " *p++ = value " keeps giving you that seg fault.

Epic Tissue

Boston wrote: »

Of course you don't see what building regulations have to do with things. In order to get planning permission for that type of work the Pav has to make the building more accessible. Do you understand now why the lift is required? Should I get sock puppets and a chalk bord?

Email its the sign of caring? And of course the buildings offices is aware of the access problems around trinity, its their job to keep track of these things. I know exactly why nothing is done. To give you an example, in my office we wanted to replace the old doors and doorway, but we where told me couldn't do so without making the major chances to meet accessibility regulations. It's complex kid, and I honestly don't think you have it in you to understand. Go back to trying to figure out why doing " *p++ = value " keeps giving you that seg fault.

:rolleyes:

cunnins4

anyway...............

Pav isn't closing. Thanks for the info.

now girls, back to it....handbags ready........GO!

StinkyMunkey

Boston wrote: »

Wheelchair users aren't any more or less important than the average student. I think you should rethink what you consider a need and what you consider a desire. Going around trinity I can think of numerous better examples where that money could be spent to improve accessibility for the disabled. It is desirable for all students to have access to the Pav, however all students need to be able to attend lectures.

As for contributing to the expense, the number of wheelchair users is tiny, and any one else would have gone to the pav regardless of accessibility. There's no way it would recoup the cost, and you onto a lossing arguement by suggesting it.

As was already stated, contribute to exspenses is not recouping all exspenses. And the people who are friends to people in wheelchairs, who otherwise would have drank in a different bar with said people, are also going to contribute. Lets not forget, that the wheelchair lift will be there as long as the bar is. So we are talking alot of years that people who are in wheelchairs & friends are going to be spending money. Not to mention the people who are not part of the college, who are confined to wheelchairs and wish to have access to the bar.

And while i do agree, there are more pressing projects around college, which should take place before a wheelchair lift in a bar. DUCAC - the sporting body within the college, who own the pav, are not the building office. Who are the ones responsible for making buildings wheelchair accessible.

After every thing is said and done, its not an argument - the simple fact is, when the building work go's ahead in the pav, the wheelchair lift will be part of it.

I could argue that the college doesnt need half its societies or half its sports clubs, because they are not a neccessity either for getting through college. But the college still contributes towards them aswell, especially DUCAC who fund 50 sports clubs (from frisbee to surfing), granted it puts more funds into some more than others.

Boston

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

As was already stated, contribute to exspenses is not recouping all exspenses. And the people who are friends to people in wheelchairs, who otherwise would have drank in a different bar with said people, are also going to contribute. Lets not forget, that the wheelchair lift will be there as long as the bar is. So we are talking alot of years that people who are in wheelchairs & friends are going to be spending money. Not to mention the people who are not part of the college, who are confined to wheelchairs and wish to have access to the bar.

No the lift will not be there as long as the bar is, it will have to be maintained and replaced over a certain time span. I don't believe that the bar not being wheelchair accessible is a major disincentive for wheelchair users in a group to use the Pav since the pav does most business on days like to day, when people are at ground level. Also, why should we care about people not in the college? These people have no business using the bar regardless of whether or not they are disabled.

And while i do agree, there are more pressing projects around college, which should take place before a wheelchair lift in a bar. DUCAC - the sporting body within the college, who own the pav, are not the building office. Who are the ones responsible for making buildings wheelchair accessible.

True, and at least the sports center is almost fully accessible.

I could argue that the college doesnt need half its societies or half its sports clubs, because they are not a neccessity either for getting through college. But the college still contributes towards them aswell, especially DUCAC who fund 50 sports clubs (from frisbee to surfing), granted it puts more funds into some more than others.

I don't think anyone would argue that The college should fund a bar in the middle of Dublin city centre, the Pav pays for itself and then some.

At the end of the day I don't have a problem with them being forced to put in a lift, I agree with the policy, I take issue with the pav being refurbished at all from money which DUCAC could spent to better effect elsewhere.

Ron DMC

Boston wrote: »

Also, why should we care about people not in the college? These people have no business using the bar regardless of whether or not they are disabled.

I use the pav all the time and am neither a student, graduate or staff of the college.
I don't cause any trouble, what's the problem with me using the place?

Boston

Ron DMC wrote: »

I use the pav all the time and am neither a student, graduate or staff of the college.
I don't cause any trouble, what's the problem with me using the place?

No problem, but would your needs to be taken into account when determining how to spend college money? The bar is for students/staff/Alumni and afew other select groups, if others can use it without interfering, grand, but I don't think their needs should factor into spending decisions.

Ron DMC

Boston wrote: »

No problem, but would your needs to be taken into account when determining how to spend college money? The bar is for students/staff/Alumni and afew other select groups, if others can use it without interfering, grand, but I don't think their needs should factor into spending decisions.

Oh ok, I thought that by "These people have no business using the bar" you had a problem with me being there and spending money there?

That's fine, I agree with you. If I had four mouths, I wouldn't expect the pav to provide special pint glasses for me, but if I was a student it'd be nice to be accomodated.


Here, you know what the pav should spend money on?
- Girls' jacks, they are a joke. I mean, I know they have the new portaloos since Tuesday, but portaloos are manky, girls won't like that.

Jonathan

Ron DMC wrote: »

I know they have the new portaloos since Tuesday, but portaloos are manky, girls won't like that.

Where have they placed the portaloos?