Farmers behind big Clare wind project

Carlow52

http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0528/wind.html

...They collectively own more than 3,000 acres of mostly elevated land on Mount Callan - between Ennis and Miltown Malbay

Typical of the farmers: now that they have essentially destroyed the fresh water fishing industry: have stopped the nacesent hill-waking and other outdoor tourism industry, they now propose to destroy one of the finest pieces of scenery in Clare

Oldtree

It not just the farmers, see this thread:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055393679

With the bottom falling out of the farming markets it is only natural that the farmer would seek to find some other income. Tourism was the only thing going here in the 80's and soon it will be the only thing going on here now. Eco-tourism is an increasing market, increasing at 30% per year and expected to do so for the next ten years. Farmers and other landowners need options and it is up to us to help them choose the most sustainable option, imo.

Shiny

Good on them.

bowsie casey

Carlow52 wrote: »

Typical of the farmers: now that they have essentially destroyed the fresh water fishing industry: have stopped the nacesent hill-waking and other outdoor tourism industry, they now propose to destroy one of the finest pieces of scenery in Clare

Most "green"-minded people rant and rave about energy from fossil fuels - they want renewable energy: wind, wave etc. But then when someone wants to put up wind turbines it becomes a NIMBY syndrome, "and not over there either".... I don't get it.

Personally, having lived for several years in northern Germany and Holland, I think that turbines are very graceful structure, and are daily reminders of how we need to protect our environment, rather than being the ugly structures that many anti-turbine people suggest. Closer to home, I drive past the turbines at Derrybrien every day and think they are a great addition to the landscape, as well as displacing fossil fuel energy generation.

Good one the farmers I say - I hope that it goes ahead.

Rowley Birkin QC

Remind us again how exactly you destroy scenery?

Oldtree

Are you a town planner? your question seems to indicate that.

please see the following from the Landscape Appraisal for County Mayo

1.3.- Landscape Protection and Problem Definition “Preserving the character of the landscape, including views and prospects, and the amenities of places and features of natural beauty or interest (Part IV (7), 1st schedule (S10) LG (P&D) Act 2000”

The above statement, from the 2000 Planning Act, aims to protect views, prospects and amenities in the landscape. At the heart of this effort lies a highly complex interaction between the landuses which take place in the countryside; the appearance of those landuses when viewed from certain locations and the reaction of viewers to their appearance.

This interaction is made more complex because landuses constantly change in response to economic demands. Furthermore the aesthetic response of viewers can vary according to their cultural background and indeed may change over time, as a society’s cultural sensibilities develop and grow.

and there is much, much more .................................

How do you destroy scenery? Quite easily imo.

bonkey

bowsie casey wrote: »

a NIMBY syndrome, "and not over there either"

That would be BANANA syndrome.

Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything.

ckc123

There are wind turbines in my back yard already, and this proposal would have our house surrounded by them - where does it stop?

Rujib1

ckc123 wrote: »

There are wind turbines in my back yard already, and this proposal would have our house surrounded by them - where does it stop?

It's ok. to have electricity supplied to you from a great big ugly generating station, pumping big amounts of fossile fuel into the air and sitting outside the windows of the people in it's locality. However it's not ok to have the generators in your locality.

T

positron

I personally think wind farms makes countryside looks nicer. You still have the great view of the green countryside, and the satisfaction that its actually green is more than one way!

Rowley Birkin QC

I think we need to organise trips to the Netherlands for the NIMBY and BANANA people in this country.

There are windfarms everywhere. For a country with such a flat profile they really aren't that invasive.

@ Oldtree- It is still impossible to destroy scenery no matter how much legislation you quote. You can change it, alter it, remove/add/change some elements but its destruction is impossible. Go back 100-150-200 years and see what the landscape and scenery in Clare looked like; houses/shacks, white bungalows even, absolutely everywhere. All I'm saying is that a bit of perspective goes a long way.

Anyway, as far as I know these windfarms are usually only granted a 20 year permission.

Macha

I saw this brilliant idea in the news a few weeks ago:

The winners of this year's Next Generation design competition have unearthed an idea that's brilliant in its simplicity: adding wind turbines to already existing electrical towers. The project, aptly called Wind-It, would have wind turbines built on pylons and towers along high voltage lines across the US, sparing the need to build entirely new structures on private or government land--and they'd generate as much as a megawatt of power per tower. Has this concept solved one of the biggest problems with wind power?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2009/05/wind-power-electrical-tower.php

I don't know if it would work but it would be great if it did.

Funsterdelux

bowsie casey wrote: »

Personally, having lived for several years in northern Germany and Holland, I think that turbines are very graceful structure, and are daily reminders of how we need to protect our environment, rather than being the ugly structures that many anti-turbine people suggest

I agree, I'd like to think that I'm very "green" (a phrase I dont really like), and from my experience of seeing these structures around the country, I dont think they take away from the scenery at all. They're quite majestic, better than pylons or mobile phone masts.

breadmonkey

I used to think they were ok but now I think they really do ruin the landscape. Lets build a nuclear power plant and be done with it

Oldtree

What we have at this point in time as landscape (scenery) in certain parts of ireland is generally considered asthetically beautiful and worth preserving as it now stands. Turbines are can be pleasing things to look at in the right location, but Ireland is not flat and the contrast of a turbine in a flat landscape is a very different thing to the contrast of a turbine in an asthetically beautiful landscape or an SAC. (No offence intended to the dutch landscape.) and it would appear that a number of councils agree with this notion, thus scenic views and aspects preserved in development plans. That is not to say that space has been made available within development plans for wind power development.

ckc123

Rujib1 - do you think that the west of ireland should become one huge wind farm? With the benefits only going to a few landowners and mainly huge corporations?

Funsterdelux

ckc123 wrote: »

Rujib1 - do you think that the west of ireland should become one huge wind farm? With the benefits only going to a few landowners and mainly huge corporations?

Benefits are for everyone. The energy generation sector in this country is after opening up, we had the monopoly that is the ESB up until last year. We now have the power to choose for ourselves where we want our energy to come from. If one is a landowner, they themselves have the power to produce their own electricity and even sell any surplus.

Another point, with this interconnector to GB, a percentage of our power will come from nuclear, unfortunately. So why bother building one here, when we can buy from established power stations.

positron

Funsterdelux wrote: »

Another point, with this interconnector to GB, a percentage of our power will come from nuclear, unfortunately. So why bother building one here, when we can buy from established power stations.

Why pay someone else for something that you can do yourself?

And why not produce even more and try and reduce the fossil fuel dependency, or why not sell surplus energy to Europe?

Funsterdelux

positron wrote: »

Why pay someone else for something that you can do yourself?

And why not produce even more and try and reduce the fossil fuel dependency, or why not sell surplus energy to Europe?

Well, I'd be trying here to satisfy everyone here Positron, you know, the Pro-nuclear and the anti-nuclear parties.

I'd prefer not to be connected to the UK at all at all, we should be self sufficient.

cavedave

ckc123

Rujib1 - do you think that the west of ireland should become one huge wind farm? With the benefits only going to a few landowners and mainly huge corporations?

While were going for strawmen do you think 50% of species should die due to global warming?

Shiny

Funsterdelux wrote: »

Well, I'd be trying here to satisfy everyone here Positron, you know, the Pro-nuclear and the anti-nuclear parties.

I'd prefer not to be connected to the UK at all at all, we should be self sufficient.

Don't worry about it.

When we increase our renewable energy resources past a certain point
we would have the opportunity to export our excess electricity over
the inter-connector.

Look at Denmark. They have multiple interconnector's allowing them to
run solely on wind most of the time while exporting any excess to Norway
and Sweden at a lower cost.

Conclusion, Interconnecter = WIN.


Edit:

Isn't there a map designating areas into 3 categories of scenic beauty for the
building of Wind Farms, ie you wouldn't be allowed build in category 1 areas.
I will have a look for this now.

Macha

Funsterdelux wrote: »

I'd prefer not to be connected to the UK at all at all, we should be self sufficient.

Interconnection, even a European supergrid, is vital to the success of renewables. The larger the grid the less energy storage is required.

Also the larger the grid, the lower the cost (and price) of energy. Not only because of smaller energy storage requirements but also by having more flexibility to even out the troughs and peaks of demand vs supply.

Funsterdelux

Ah I agree, I just think that it'll be tinted with non-renewable energy.

but sure comprimises

ckc123

I am not opposed to wind farms. I just believe that there needs to be a coherent, well researched national plan for their development.

Macha

ckc123 wrote: »

I am not opposed to wind farms. I just believe that there needs to be a coherent, well researched national plan for their development.

Anything that exists on should be available here:

http://www.sei.ie/Renewables/Wind_Energy/

whatisayis

Shiny wrote: »

Don't worry about it.

When we increase our renewable energy resources past a certain point
we would have the opportunity to export our excess electricity over
the inter-connector.

Look at Denmark. They have multiple interconnector's allowing them to
run solely on wind most of the time while exporting any excess to Norway
and Sweden at a lower cost.

Conclusion, Interconnecter = WIN.


Edit:

Isn't there a map designating areas into 3 categories of scenic beauty for the
building of Wind Farms, ie you wouldn't be allowed build in category 1 areas.
I will have a look for this now.

Denmark have approx 4700 wind turbines. Wind energy usage was:
2005 13.6%
2006 10.3%
2007 13.0%
In addtion, co2 emissions rose by 36% in 2006 due to the reliance on fossil fuels as back up power due to the inconsistancy of wind. Because of this, as of October 2009, Danish wind generators which produce power in periods of low demand will have to pay 20c/kwh for their power to be added to the grid . The UK have also increased taxes for onshore wind farms recently. Probably as a result of these measures, Vestas, the Danish turbine manufacturer, have announced 1900 job cuts in Europe due to the fall off in demand. Wind farms are huge investments, subsidised by the tax payer and if, as is already happening in Denmark and the UK, the government start diluting their profits, don't be too surprised if all these wind farm proposals slip quietly away.

As regards the map designating wind farm appropriate sites, the EU have recently ruled that the environmental impact assessments utilised by Irish councils are 'deficient' in that they do not take proper account of the environmental impact of the proposals. They have even gone as far as recommending officials from the EU should be seconded to Ireland to ensure proper adherence to the EU habitats and wildlife directives. Most wind farm applications for the west coast are on upland bog areas which are protected under EU law but Ireland has yet to realise this and is facing fines by the ECJ if they do not soon do so.

Shiny

It is for these reasons that I am very hopeful that the spiritofIreland project
(Particularly the storage element) goes ahead.

whatisayis

Shiny wrote: »

It is for these reasons that I am very hopeful that the spiritofIreland project
(Particularly the storage element) goes ahead.

I agree. I think the storage element is an excellent idea however I also think that the dependance on wind power will be the stumbling block. The inevitable objections to the wind farms (2500 turbines along the west coast?) from both Irish people and the EU will delay this project for years.
Also, I would question the future ability to export the power. All EU countries are developing alternative power sources - so who will be the customers in 10 years time?

Macha

whatisayis wrote: »

Denmark have approx 4700 wind turbines. Wind energy usage was:
2005 13.6%
2006 10.3%
2007 13.0%

I don't see what's wrong with these figures. No one expects wind to supply all of our electricity - there are other renewables.

whatisayis wrote: »

In addtion, co2 emissions rose by 36% in 2006 due to the reliance on fossil fuels as back up power due to the inconsistancy of wind. Because of this, as of October 2009, Danish wind generators which produce power in periods of low demand will have to pay 20c/kwh for their power to be added to the grid . The UK have also increased taxes for onshore wind farms recently. Probably as a result of these measures, Vestas, the Danish turbine manufacturer, have announced 1900 job cuts in Europe due to the fall off in demand. Wind farms are huge investments, subsidised by the tax payer and if, as is already happening in Denmark and the UK, the government start diluting their profits, don't be too surprised if all these wind farm proposals slip quietly away.

Wind needs large investment but the economics of wind power are undeniable. Read this document, if you're interested:

http://www.ewea.org/fileadmin/ewea_documents/documents/publications/reports/Economics_of_Wind_Main_Report_FINAL-lr.pdf

Vestas's lay-offs could very well be a symptom of the economic crisis, rather than any long-term issues with the wind industry.

whatisayis wrote: »

As regards the map designating wind farm appropriate sites, the EU have recently ruled that the environmental impact assessments utilised by Irish councils are 'deficient' in that they do not take proper account of the environmental impact of the proposals.

Ireland's EIAs are crap for every type of development. They're seen by local authorities as just another form to fill out and they're really just going through the motions.

whatisayis wrote: »

Also, I would question the future ability to export the power. All EU countries are developing alternative power sources - so who will be the customers in 10 years time?

With the concept of a European supergrid (with the possible inclusion of CSP from North Africa) we will be exporting renewables at times when supply is down in other countries. For example in March of this year on one day, wind was supplying 33% of Ireland's electricity and the interconnectors were going into reverse, sending the power up north.

Here is an article on the supergrid:

http://www.davidstrahan.com/blog/?p=198

Shiny

Yeah I also think wind alone would be a problem as I don't think
it alone will have the ability to keep the proposed storage topped
up despite taking their average capacity into account.
I like the idea of a combination of wave, wind and possibly
tidal in some locations.

In terms of exporting power I don't think it would be on a
very large scale (ie less than 1GW) which is small compared
to the UK peak demand of around 90GW. They can then use
this energy to reduce their carbon emissions. We have the
advantage of not having to curtail wind production as the
penetration increases.

maniac101

Oldtree wrote: »

What we have at this point in time as landscape (scenery) in certain parts of ireland is generally considered asthetically beautiful and worth preserving as it now stands. Turbines are can be pleasing things to look at in the right location, but Ireland is not flat and the contrast of a turbine in a flat landscape is a very different thing to the contrast of a turbine in an asthetically beautiful landscape or an SAC. (No offence intended to the dutch landscape.) and it would appear that a number of councils agree with this notion, thus scenic views and aspects preserved in development plans. That is not to say that space has been made available within development plans for wind power development.

I agree. Pursuing wind energy at the expense of the environment defeats the purpose of renewables. We should promote the development of wind energy in less environmentally-sensitive areas where wind conditions may not be as favourable. This would require an upward revision of the feed-in tariffs currently on offer to wind developers. Simply put, we need to be prepared to pay more for our electricity if we want to have sustainable wind energy.

taconnol wrote: »

Interconnection, even a European supergrid, is vital to the success of renewables. The larger the grid the less energy storage is required.

Also the larger the grid, the lower the cost (and price) of energy. Not only because of smaller energy storage requirements but also by having more flexibility to even out the troughs and peaks of demand vs supply.

In general I would agree. However, interconnection doesn't get around the issue of import dependency. Today may be easy to envisage a situation where energy is freely traded across interconnectors among friendly countries. In a scenario where energy becomes very scarce, these free market forces will almost certainly break down and countries will act "in the national interest". If we're serious about wind (i.e. in excess of 40% of electricity generation) we need to develop our own storage capabilities. SpiritOfIreland proposes one possible solution that merits a closer examination.

Macha

maniac101 wrote: »

In general I would agree. However, interconnection doesn't get around the issue of import dependency. Today may be easy to envisage a situation where energy is freely traded across interconnectors among friendly countries.

There is a huge difference between import dependency on countries within the EU/Europe and dependency on countries like Iraq/Saudi Arabia. The energy politics are entirely different.

We will never be self-sufficient with our energy, even if we fill every valley with concrete, and by blocking ourselves off, we also miss out on the opportunities to export renewable electricity.

maniac101 wrote: »

In a scenario where energy becomes very scarce, these free market forces will almost certainly break down and countries will act "in the national interest". If we're serious about wind (i.e. in excess of 40% of electricity generation) we need to develop our own storage capabilities. SpiritOfIreland proposes one possible solution that merits a closer examination.

It's an interesting idea but you talk about the environmental impact of wind turbines. This project is off the charts!

I think microgeneration (not including small urban wind turbines-waste of time) and technologies like V2G are far more promising.

whatisayis

ckc123 wrote: »

There are wind turbines in my back yard already, and this proposal would have our house surrounded by them - where does it stop?

I have just been looking up SAC/NHA areas in Clare and Mount Callan is included as a NHA. Have they already built a wind farm there?? Also, besides the 30 families involved, what is the reaction from others living there? It would be interesting to know what is the opinion of those who will be directly affected by this proposal.

whatisayis

taconnol wrote: »

It's an interesting idea but you talk about the environmental impact of wind turbines. This project is off the charts!

I think microgeneration (not including small urban wind turbines-waste of time) and technologies like V2G are far more promising.

Sorry if this is going off thread but I had never heard of V2G technology before and it sounds really promising. Is it like a transformer attached to your car and home electrical point?

maniac101

taconnol wrote: »

There is a huge difference between import dependency on countries within the EU/Europe and dependency on countries like Iraq/Saudi Arabia. The energy politics are entirely different.

Your response addresses a different issue. This has nothing to do with the Saudis or Iraq. If there's a severe shortage of energy worldwide, don't expect our friendly neighbours to allow us free market access to energy across the interconnectors.

We will never be self-sufficient with our energy

"Never" stretches to infinity. Infinity is beyond my comprehension. I admire your ability to see that far into the future!

even if we fill every valley with concrete, and by blocking ourselves off, we also miss out on the opportunities to export renewable electricity.

No one here has suggested this. As I said, I'm in favour of interconnectors, but we would be foolish to rely on them as means of freely trading electricity in times of severe energy shortages.

It's an interesting idea but you talk about the environmental impact of wind turbines. This project is off the charts!

Not sure which project you're referring to; the project that's the subject of this thread or the SoI project. As you know, all forms of electricity generation have an environmental impact. It's a matter of finding ways to minimise the impact. You've said yourself the EIA procedure for the Clare project is inadequate. As well as the justified misgivings of some members of the public regarding the SoI project, there has been so much irrational and biased opposition to SoI from vested interests that it will ensure that the environmental impact of the proposal will be subjected to far more rigorous scrutiny before it ever becomes a reality (which is a good thing of course). Suggesting that either project is "off the charts" without any access to a scientific and impartial environmental impact assessment is a little unfair, imo.

I think microgeneration (not including small urban wind turbines-waste of time) and technologies like V2G are far more promising.

"more promising" than ...?

Macha

whatisayis wrote: »

Sorry if this is going off thread but I had never heard of V2G technology before and it sounds really promising. Is it like a transformer attached to your car and home electrical point?

Vehicle-to-grid technology allows each electric vehicle to act as a small battery for the grid. The technology allows the electricity supplier (or the involved 3rd party demand management company) to reverse the direction of the electricity flow out of your car battery and into the grid.

Obviously this is dependent on agreement from the consumer but there is already similar technology developed for residential customers, such as the EMMA controller from CoolPower:
http://www.coolpower.ie/energycontrol/index.html

The result is cheaper electricity costs for the supplier and therefore cheaper electricity for the consumer.

Basically it's like an energy or mobile phone plan. You sign up to whatever plan you want to but if you agree for your electric car to be used as a battery (during specific times/conditions etc etc), you get your electricity at a cheaper price.

There's a demonstration of the actual technology on this video:

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/03/11/video-pgandes-diesel-hybrid-electric-service-trucks-v2g-plug-in/

Er..at least I'm pretty sure there is. So many blogs out there are too busy (visually speaking).

Macha

maniac101 wrote: »

Your response addresses a different issue. This has nothing to do with the Saudis or Iraq. If there's a severe shortage of energy worldwide, don't expect our friendly neighbours to allow us free market access to energy across the interconnectors.

No it doesn't address a different issue. You're trying to draw comparisons between the sort of energy relations we have with Islamic fundamentalist states like Saudi Arabia, who have a monopoly on the energy source in question and between entering into a system of co-dependency with other members of the EU, with whom we have a very significant level of economic, social and political integration.

maniac101 wrote: »

No one here has suggested this. As I said, I'm in favour of interconnectors, but we would be foolish to rely on them as means of freely trading electricity in times of severe energy shortages.

Well then I think we're singing from the same hymn sheet. I want both interconnectors and developments in storage of renewables in Ireland. I just don't think that with current technology (including SoI proposals), that full independence is possible. Other than that, you're looking an nuclear.

maniac101 wrote: »

Not sure which project you're referring to; the project that's the subject of this thread or the SoI project. As you know, all forms of electricity generation have an environmental impact. It's a matter of finding ways to minimise the impact.

I'm talking about eh SoI project. It has huge levels of embodied energy and destruction of habitat and biodiversity involved.

maniac101 wrote: »

You've said yourself the EIA procedure for the Clare project is inadequate. As well as the justified misgivings of some members of the public regarding the SoI project, there has been so much irrational and biased opposition to SoI from vested interests that it will ensure that the environmental impact of the proposal will be subjected to far more rigorous scrutiny before it ever becomes a reality (which is a good thing of course). Suggesting that either project is "off the charts" without any access to a scientific and impartial environmental impact assessment is a little unfair, imo.

Um...I'm not doing it with no access to data. I'm quite familiar with the SoI proposal. There is no mention of the impact on biodiversity on their website. I'm not against the idea at all, I just want the people making the decisions to be aware of ALL the impacts of the project, not just the anthropocentric ones.

maniac101 wrote: »

"more promising" than ...?

OK "as promising as". happy?

Shiny

maniac101 wrote: »

"more promising" than ...?

VTG would be more promising than micro generation for urban areas.

If a person was buying an electric car it would be a nice way to offset
some of the cost of the car.

It is likely that this person would see a faster return on investment
from VTG as opposed to poor performing wind turbines (urban) and
sub par performance from solar PV (Irish levels of sun).

Oldtree

the following document has maps at the end of it that outlines visually the constraints on wind development in Mayo as well as capasity study results.

See:

http://www.mayococo.ie/en/Planning/DevelopmentPlansandLocalAreaPlans/MayoCountyDevelopmentPlan2008-2014/

about half way down the page

5. Mayo Wind Energy Strategy 2008

Jim Martin

whatisayis wrote: »

I have just been looking up SAC/NHA areas in Clare and Mount Callan is included as a NHA. Have they already built a wind farm there?? Also, besides the 30 families involved, what is the reaction from others living there? It would be interesting to know what is the opinion of those who will be directly affected by this proposal.

The NHA details: http://www.npws.ie/en/NHA/002397/

The area is also a Hen Harrier nesting area and should therefore be sacrosanct from development but, as has already been proved, the government doesn't seem to care and allowed a similar development at nearby Booltiagh which is also a Hen Harrier nesting area!

I think the government is storing up more trouble for itself with future EU action. I would thing they could also be taken to the European Court on this (not to mention many other things!)

Jim Martin

Not sure what is happening with the Slieve Callan project at the moment, Clare Co Co seem to think that they will be dealing with an application which Friends of the Irish Environment say will be submitted late Summer, but I have heard from a usually reliable source that an application has already gone in direct to An Bord Pleanala, thus by-passing local involvement!

I guess it's the old, old story - subterfuge being the name of the game!

whatisayis

Jim Martin wrote: »

Not sure what is happening with the Slieve Callan project at the moment, Clare Co Co seem to think that they will be dealing with an application which Friends of the Irish Environment say will be submitted late Summer, but I have heard from a usually reliable source that an application has already gone in direct to An Bord Pleanala, thus by-passing local involvement!

I guess it's the old, old story - subterfuge being the name of the game!

I think Dick Roche changed the law a few years ago so that projects that are part of the strategic infrastructure of Ireland (or something like that) do not have to go through the council anymore? I had a look at the An Bord Pleanala website where you can view 'new cases' and the only recent one (I could see) for Clare is for retention of permission by Hibernian Wind Power for a wind farm in Lissycasey which is being appealed by, believe it or not, the department of the environment. Maybe they are finally copping themselves on!

Pembily

Wind turbines are the way forward, they are necessary and are way better for all of us than electricity pylons (correct term is a tower) and are way more attractive!!!!

Lately everyone has gone "green" but as has been pointed out, none of us want it in our back garden!!! We live in Ireland, it's an island, its greatest natural resource is wind. We are giving out about the oil Shell are trying to recover, make up yer minds, do ye want proper green or just to give out about everything...

We no longer live in an Ireland where sheep roam free, if we want to live like that we need to go back to living on 100pounds a month for a family of 11...

Wake up and smell the coffee!!!!

I am from Clare, where I live a very important land mark was blocked by a house, it should never have gone up there but there will always be people who can by pass the law and I much prefer to see a wind turbine blocking my view than a house. Wind turbines are USEFUL AND WE NEED THEM!!!!!

Oldtree

these Clare residents do not appear to share your enthusiasm:

http://www.noeastclarewindfarm.net/

BendiBus

Oldtree wrote: »

these Clare residents do not appear to share your enthusiasm:

http://www.noeastclarewindfarm.net/

What??? None of them? They all contributed to putting up a website?

Oldtree

oops copied in the wrong web addy.

I meant these residents:

goto

http://www.clarecoco.ie/ePlan41/FileRefDetails.aspx?file_number=081950&LASiteID=0

and press submissions for a list of the objectors

Birdnuts

Oldtree wrote: »

these Clare residents do not appear to share your enthusiasm:

http://www.noeastclarewindfarm.net/

The bird kill pictures of rare raptors are horrific and would be my main concern with the Clare proposals. In Britain the RSPB has come to an agreement with wind farm developers on the siting of such projects so as to minimize or hopefully eliminate the sort of damage that can occur with poorly cited operations. As is the case in many areas of environemntal protection Ireland is still in the dark ages in comparison. I would be interested if the EIS for this project even covers the whole area of bird strikes or possible mitigation measures??

Pembily

No matter what is it people will always object, it's in our nature!!!! It's quite unfortunate, at least no one can object to my lil 6kW one going in my back garden, yehaw!!!

Oldtree

Birdnuts, If you go to here:
http://www.clarecoco.ie/ePlan41/FileRefDetails.aspx?file_number=081950&LASiteID=0
and press "view scanned files" it may be there as on of the larger documents with the planning application. To view it you would need to download their viewer (dejavu in this case) and probably need broadband as its a big file (which I don't so it would take me over 2 hours to look at a 19mb file.

Oldtree

Pembily, how much was it all told to get up? It will be very interesting to see what you actually get out of the unit. What do you hope to achieve with it?

whatisayis

I saw this link on the infrastructure forum re the SOI proposal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWl2TuHcY6w

This is a presentation by SOI to the Institute of International and European Affairs (IIEA). It shows a map of the proposed wind farm and hydro storage locations.