A Challenge!!!!!!!!

seannash

okay so this is a challenge to some of the members on this forum.

make a dance track and place your efforts on the dancemusic forum for review from dance music enthuasiasts.
im not doing this to create a bigger divide but more as a put your money where your mouth is thing.
id like for it to be done in good fun but also to maybe to show a few of the people who claim "its only dance music" that its not as easy as you would think.
im looking for someone who has no experience wit dance music but experience with more traditional recording methods to do this.

So,any takers??:pac:

DamagedTrax

i'd be interested to hear what they can come up with.. after all its not "real" music, is it lads? :pac:

ICN

seannash wrote: »

okay so this is a challenge to some of the members on this forum.

make a dance track and place your efforts on the dancemusic forum for review from dance music enthuasiasts.
im not doing this to create a bigger divide but more as a put your money where your mouth is thing.
id like for it to be done in good fun but also to maybe to show a few of the people who claim "its only dance music" that its not as easy as you would think.
im looking for someone who has no experience wit dance music but experience with more traditional recording methods to do this.

So,any takers??:pac:

Hopefully "8 bar loop-itis" wont strike! LOL

seannash

ICN wrote: »

Hopefully "8 bar loop-itis" wont strike! LOL

i have suffered from this many a time.:D

studiorat

Why the dance music persecution complex, sean?

Four-Percent

studiorat wrote: »

Why the dance music persecution complex, sean?

They're all against us!

seannash

studiorat wrote: »

Why the dance music persecution complex, sean?

its just from recent posts in a few threads,particluarly the one stated by gordon.
i personally would love to see some people try and make a dance track,they might actually have a bit more respect for the people who work in this genre after they try it

dav nagle

Would someone please post me a link to this Dance forum I can't find it and I am dying to see where all these arguements and fight have been happening?

Neurojazz

Like i said a while ago... just stick a mike in a dustbin and start kicking it...

seannash

dav nagle wrote: »

Would someone please post me a link to this Dance forum I can't find it and I am dying to see where all these arguements and fight have been happening?

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055564532

some genuine reasons being posted in there

dav nagle

seannash wrote: »

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055564532

some genuine reasons being posted in there

Nice one I couldn't find the thread! Much apreciated.

seannash

dav nagle wrote: »

Nice one I couldn't find the thread! Much apreciated.

(sean eagerly awaits an angry dav nagles return):D

tman

Fantastic idea... After reading some of the comments in Gordon's thread, I'd love to hear the results when people put their money where their mouth is

PaulBrewer

Here Sean, that's not a challenge ?

Programme up a sequencer at 120 bpm? Go on with ya!!


Now, HERE'S a challenge ...

Get the Dancey Lads to do a ROCK track !


(Just to be clear, I'm of course joking )

seannash

PaulBrewer wrote: »

Here Sean, that's not a challenge ?

Programme up a sequencer at 120 bpm? Go on with ya!!


Now, HERE'S a challenge ...

Get the Dancey Lads to do a ROCK track !


(Just to be clear, I'm of course joking )

i knew someone would say that.in all fairness us dancey lads never claim a rock track is easy to make like some rock chaps make out;)

besides i havent heard many rock chaps on here who make good rock tracks either:D:D:D
(runs off)

PaulBrewer

seannash wrote: »

besides i havent heard many rock chaps on here who make good rock tracks either:D:D:D
(runs off)

Right Answer !

jtsuited

seannash wrote: »

besides i havent heard many rock chaps on here who make good rock tracks either:D:D:D
(runs off)

eh you've heard my stuff?

seannash

jtsuited wrote: »

eh you've heard my stuff?

ha ha ha you did send me your best song in fairness.
still have that on my ipod.when your famous im going to bribe you with it:D

still awaiting the album you promised:p

Aridstarling

Three power chords and a hook, bam, rock song.:p

I might post a song once I get my laptop back in action, though I'm not exactly new to the whole "dance" music making.

Gordon

The sooner people realise that it's not about 'us and them', the sooner things move forward.

I'm not ready to post any of my attempts yet

frobisher

Gordon wrote: »

The sooner people realise that it's not about 'us and them', the sooner things move forward.

I'm not ready to post any of my attempts yet

Plus one on both counts!!

I just finished my first song with Logic only. It's a summery piano pop song. Million miles form dance or electronic!!

ZV Yoda

seannash wrote: »

okay so this is a challenge to some of the members on this forum.

make a dance track and place your efforts on the dancemusic forum for review from dance music enthuasiasts.
im not doing this to create a bigger divide but more as a put your money where your mouth is thing.
id like for it to be done in good fun but also to maybe to show a few of the people who claim "its only dance music" that its not as easy as you would think.
im looking for someone who has no experience wit dance music but experience with more traditional recording methods to do this.

So,any takers??:pac:

Seannash... I think that's a great idea & I'm going to throw my hat into the ring on this one. I don’t have a lot of time for a “them vs. us mentality” since it’s all music to me. I haven't been on the new dance forum yet either, so not sure what sort of comments are being made. I'm doing it purely as an exercise in “trying something new”.

I'm what you'd call a traditional musician (drums & guitar mostly). I usually work with a singer & guitarist/keyboardist. We write our own stuff, which is what is loosely termed pop/rock. So, I’ll take up your challenge in the best possible spirit. I’ll work on this as a solo side project & will start putting something together over the next week or so.

Note: I have absolutely no credentials to suggest I’d even know where to start, but sure that’s the fun. In terms of technical recording, I’ve had my home set up for just over a year, so am a newbie to engineering/production. In terms of any knowledge of dance music, I’ve probably 500 CDs in my collection (most of which were accumulated from the late 80s onwards, so there’s a hint to my age ). I’d safely say you could count the number of dance/electronica ones on 2 hands (namely Leftfield, Massive Attack, Faithless & The Orb).

So, here goes…

seannash

ZV Yoda wrote: »

Seannash... I think that's a great idea & I'm going to throw my hat into the ring on this one. I don’t have a lot of time for a “them vs. us mentality” since it’s all music to me. I haven't been on the new dance forum yet either, so not sure what sort of comments are being made. I'm doing it purely as an exercise in “trying something new”.

I'm what you'd call a traditional musician (drums & guitar mostly). I usually work with a singer & guitarist/keyboardist. We write our own stuff, which is what is loosely termed pop/rock. So, I’ll take up your challenge in the best possible spirit. I’ll work on this as a solo side project & will start putting something together over the next week or so.

Note: I have absolutely no credentials to suggest I’d even know where to start, but sure that’s the fun. In terms of technical recording, I’ve had my home set up for just over a year, so am a newbie to engineering/production. In terms of any knowledge of dance music, I’ve probably 500 CDs in my collection (most of which were accumulated from the late 80s onwards, so there’s a hint to my age ). I’d safely say you could count the number of dance/electronica ones on 2 hands (namely Leftfield, Massive Attack, Faithless & The Orb).

So, here goes…

fantastic man.hopefully youll be able to tell us hurdles and differences you encountered.id like to say try make a tech house track.those sort of tracks have melody but still are sparse enough in there construction.but ill leave that up to you.
if you log onto beatport itll give you a flavour for the latest dance music thats doing the rounds at the moment.
thanks a million man.looking forward to hearing your efforts:)

DamagedTrax

seannash wrote: »

if you log onto beatport itll give you a flavour for the latest dance music thats doing the rounds at the moment.

or go elsewhere if you wanted to hear the latest dance music thats actually good and isnt total derivative "me too" crap!

studiorat

Just actually got the gist of this thread now, with that hard to read thing an all.
Ok, I'll have a bash time permitting. Probably sound like something from 1988 though.

seannash

DamagedTrax wrote: »

or go elsewhere if you wanted to hear the latest dance music thats actually good and isnt total derivative "me too" crap!

:pac::pac::pac:

ZV Yoda

I had a listen to Beatport... I had no idea there were so many genres of dance music.

Rather than me try to put together a specific type/genre of track (for the purposes of this exercise, it'd take me too long to figure our the subtleties of each genre) I'll just listen to a variety of dance music this week and you can tell what (if any!) genre it is when I'm finished.

How's that?

If I somehow tried to blend some acoustic drums/guitar & maybe some vox, does that mean I've missed the point? I'm not sure I'd know how to put a track together if I didn't have a basic guitar rhythm/chords to start with.

seannash

ZV Yoda wrote: »

I had a listen to Beatport... I had no idea there were so many genres of dance music.

Rather than me try to put together a specific type/genre of track (for the purposes of this exercise, it'd take me too long to figure our the subtleties of each genre) I'll just listen to a variety of dance music this week and you can tell what (if any!) genre it is when I'm finished.

How's that?

If I somehow tried to blend some acoustic drums/guitar & maybe some vox, does that mean I've missed the point? I'm not sure I'd know how to put a track together if I didn't have a basic guitar rhythm/chords to start with.

yeah man that sounds good.id be more inclined to say try and maybe mimic something you hear but its totally up to you.as long as it works on a floor im sure anything you put in it would be fine

seannash

studiorat wrote: »

Just actually got the gist of this thread now, with that hard to read thing an all.
Ok, I'll have a bash time permitting. Probably sound like something from 1988 though.

excellent man.

DamagedTrax

seannash wrote: »

yeah man that sounds good.id be more inclined to say try and maybe mimic something you hear but its totally up to you.as long as it works on a floor im sure anything you put in it would be fine

id go the opposite way and suggest you just do what comes to you naturally. we'll invent a new genre for you.. one more cany hurt, afterall theres already 5000,000,000 :pac:

seannash

DamagedTrax wrote: »

id go the opposite way and suggest you just do what comes to you naturally. we'll invent a new genre for you.. one more cany hurt, afterall theres already 5000,000,000 :pac:

no id agree if he was doing this for anything other than an experiment id say add what you like and do what you like but seeing as how this would be an experiment to make something comparable to a modern dance track(drum programming,melody,synth sounds,buildups etc)id say pick something we can objectively compare it to.
instead of the person saying that they "wanted" a particular sound id much prefer them to say i was trying to copy this track and this is what mine sounds like.
all in good fun mind you:):)

ICN

Free samples to download @ Goldbaby.

808 kicks / Claps & lots more.. Might get you started if you have no drum machine sounds.


http://www.goldbaby.co.nz/freestuff.html

Seziertisch

I think something like this would be better if it challenged members of the forum (regardless of their genre) to have a no. 1 in at least 12 countries (not including the Benelux countries) ...

ZV Yoda

Seziertisch wrote: »

I think something like this would be better if it challenged members of the forum (regardless of their genre) to have a no. 1 in at least 12 countries (not including the Benelux countries) ...

I'd assume that's what most folks around here are already hoping to do within their own genres!

I'm doing this to try something different musically than I otherwise would. I’ve already organised for a friend who likes old skool house to send me her fave tunes as inspiration.

I am sure of 2 things though:
1. My effort will not reach no.1 in any country
2. No matter what, I will have learned something new

So, is anybody else going to give this a bash? Maybe we’ll end up with a Boards MP summer dance album that we can pump out at the much discussed MP meet?

fitz

If I've time I'll try and do something, but not making any promises.

seannash

fitz wrote: »

If I've time I'll try and do something, but not making any promises.

dont you dabble in dance music already man.
was looking for people who havent tried it before.
but its up to you

seannash

ZV Yoda wrote: »

I'd assume that's what most folks around here are already hoping to do within their own genres!

I'm doing this to try something different musically than I otherwise would. I’ve already organised for a friend who likes old skool house to send me her fave tunes as inspiration.

I am sure of 2 things though:
1. My effort will not reach no.1 in any country
2. No matter what, I will have learned something new

So, is anybody else going to give this a bash? Maybe we’ll end up with a Boards MP summer dance album that we can pump out at the much discussed MP meet?

yep noones asking for a no 1.also just want to say maybe oldschool house isnt a good reference source.id say most producers are more competant than the dance music producers back in the late 80,s early 90,s.
certainly we have better software available to us.
also these songs havent aged well for the most part and copying one might make your track sound dated.just some food for thought,excited to see how you get on:)

DamagedTrax

seannash wrote: »

also these songs havent aged well for the most part and copying one might make your track sound dated.just some food for thought,excited to see how you get on:)

????? they sound farkin classic!!!

dude, let people do what they want and see where it goes to, theres no point in telling people to copy a certain style.. thats hardly a big challenge is it?

fitz

seannash wrote: »

dont you dabble in dance music already man.
was looking for people who havent tried it before.
but its up to you

More electronica than dance, though as I said the Jt, I'm not up to speed on the lingo...

seannash

DamagedTrax wrote: »

????? they sound farkin classic!!!

dude, let people do what they want and see where it goes to, theres no point in telling people to copy a certain style.. thats hardly a big challenge is it?

well thats the point. is it hard?
for the point of the challenge i think its better.like if someone decides to add a crazy guitar solo that simply doesnt work you cant really criticise it as they might just say"yeah i was going for a kind of jimi henderix meets prodigy meets fatboyslim vibe and then how can you criticise it.

if people want to do this as a personal experiment and a chance for them to do something different,cool
if people are interested in taking up the challenge(and i was more looking for the ones with the stance of"its only dance music how hard can it be")i think they should have a more defined aim.

ill leave it at that,its up to the people who decide to undertake it.

(oldschool is crap btw :D:D)

DamagedTrax

seannash wrote: »

well thats the point. is it hard?
for the point of the challenge i think its better.like if someone decides to add a crazy guitar solo that simply doesnt work you cant really criticise it as they might just say"yeah i was going for a kind of jimi henderix meets prodigy meets fatboyslim vibe and then how can you criticise it.

if people want to do this as a personal experiment and a chance for them to do something different,cool
if people are interested in taking up the challenge(and i was more looking for the ones with the stance of"its only dance music how hard can it be")i think they should have a more defined aim.

ill leave it at that,its up to the people who decide to undertake it.

(oldschool is crap btw :D:D)

but surely (to me anyway) the whole ethos of dance music is to try to go somewhere that hasnt been touched on before. ok it doesnt exactly work all the time but the other option is everyone making clickity clickity mnml.. and if that happens I WILL GO POSTAL.

no offence mnml guys but im sick of hearing a woodblock on the 16ths, with the groove quantize turned up and a multi-tap with varying delay sizes over it :mad:

seannash

DamagedTrax wrote: »

but surely (to me anyway) the whole ethos of dance music is to try to go somewhere that hasnt been touched on before. ok it doesnt exactly work all the time but the other option is everyone making clickity clickity mnml.. and if that happens I WILL GO POSTAL.

no offence mnml guys but im sick of hearing a woodblock on the 16ths, with the groove quantize turned up and a multi-tap with varying delay sizes over it :mad:

nope your dead right thats the exciting thing about it but for the sake of the challenge you need an aim.
like if someone came on here and did an all acoustic instruments track with feck all compression and no buildups he can turn around to us and say hes trying to do a live sounding dance track.thats cool and all but how would you rate it.it mightnt work on a floor.you need something to measure it against

this challenge was for people claiming that current dance music was easy to make and required no skill.so i wanted them to make a modern dance track for comparison.

fitz

seannash wrote: »

well thats the point. is it hard?
for the point of the challenge i think its better.like if someone decides to add a crazy guitar solo that simply doesnt work you cant really criticise it as they might just say"yeah i was going for a kind of jimi henderix meets prodigy meets fatboyslim vibe and then how can you criticise it.

if people want to do this as a personal experiment and a chance for them to do something different,cool
if people are interested in taking up the challenge(and i was more looking for the ones with the stance of"its only dance music how hard can it be")i think they should have a more defined aim.

I don't really agree with your premise Sean.
You've said how dance music has so many different forms, yet your telling us that we have to limit which one we go with...

With "general" music production, a great producer who deals with Indie bands isn't necessarily gonna make a great Metal producer.
Same with electronic music.

If you're looking at this as a way to say "I told you so...it's not easy to create a good dance track" you're only speaking to a couple of people here, and judging the rest of us a little unfairly.

Personally, I'm gonna start with a blank canvas (as I usually do with any track) and see what comes.

seannash

fitz wrote: »

I don't really agree with your premise Sean.
You've said how dance music has so many different forms, yet your telling us that we have to limit which one we go with...

With "general" music production, a great producer who deals with Indie bands isn't necessarily gonna make a great Metal producer.
Same with electronic music.

If you're looking at this as a way to say "I told you so...it's not easy to create a good dance track" you're only speaking to a couple of people here, and judging the rest of us a little unfairly.

Personally, I'm gonna start with a blank canvas (as I usually do with any track) and see what comes.

well yes i was looking specifically at a few people.i made it quite clear it was a put up or shut up challenge.
i see exactly what your saying though but lets say you go and make a track.there might not be any sort of figuring out on your part.like if you wanted to copy a technique used in a particular track youll have to figure it out and try and recreate it.but if your left to your own devices you might just fall back on what you already know.
i think people are kinda missing the point of this.i definitely encourage people to try new things but i made no mistake that this was a bit of a "told you its not that easy" challenge.
i would have been very interested to hear how someone with a traditional recording background would figure out how professional(loose term) dance musicians did there tricks and techniques and here in would lie the new experiences part and also if they thought there was alot more to making a dance track than many would believe.
i figured people would have been honest and maybe said something like fair enough its a bit trickier than i thought to copy a gui borrato track.
i might as well rename this thread into make a dance track and leave it at that.
wether im right or wrong i hope youd see why id like to keep a goal in mind.
basically id like to avoid people making a rock track with a 4/4 beat behind it

fitz

I get what you're saying Sean, but I think you'll be disappointed tbh.

Personnally, if I tried to replicate a specific dance track, I know it'd suck. Same as if I tried to replicate a specific rock track, I'm pretty sure it'd suck. You gotta put yourself into tracks, and that might result in me putting some live instrumentation into a dance track...

The technique side of things, imo, can get really clever with dance. Some really clever uses of sidechaining that you wouldn't always find in rock. I wouldn't for a second say that it's easy to put together a really good dance track. It's certainly easier to make bad electronic music than it is to make bad rock music...but that's no indicator.

I know what you're setting out to prove with this thread is valid...the guy who mixed my album is an experimental head for god sake! His own stuff is class, and I've seen first hand how much time and effort he put into his compositions. Massive amount of work involved.

I reckon with the majority of people here you're preaching to the choir. But, I'll set out to make the kind of tune you're talking about, and see where it goes. If that involves a guitar, so be it. If you end up with a load of glitchy noise though...tough! :P

DamagedTrax

basically id like to avoid people making a rock track with a 4/4 beat behind it

and if they do we'll all just point at them and laugh

seannash

fitz wrote: »

I get what you're saying Sean, but I think you'll be disappointed tbh.

Personnally, if I tried to replicate a specific dance track, I know it'd suck. Same as if I tried to replicate a specific rock track, I'm pretty sure it'd suck. You gotta put yourself into tracks, and that might result in me putting some live instrumentation into a dance track...

The technique side of things, imo, can get really clever with dance. Some really clever uses of sidechaining that you wouldn't always find in rock. I wouldn't for a second say that it's easy to put together a really good dance track. It's certainly easier to make bad electronic music than it is to make bad rock music...but that's no indicator.

I know what you're setting out to prove with this thread is valid...the guy who mixed my album is an experimental head for god sake! His own stuff is class, and I've seen first hand how much time and effort he put into his compositions. Massive amount of work involved.

I reckon with the majority of people here you're preaching to the choir. But, I'll set out to make the kind of tune you're talking about, and see where it goes. If that involves a guitar, so be it. If you end up with a load of glitchy noise though...tough! :P

ah in fairness it was a bit of a knee jerk reaction to some comments but now that its got a few people interested im interested to hear peoples experiences.
id still prefer to have a synth based production as the end result but it doesnt look like its going to happen.
who knows maybe from an experienced guy such techniques might not be as hard as they seem to us dance music guys.also would love to see if the experience from a traditional recording background will have as much crossover uses in regard dance music production.

jtsuited

tbh, any aul eejit can make a crap dance track OR a crap rock track.

btw, i have found the best resource for writing songs.....ever.........

:p:p

DamagedTrax

hahaha.. was just watching that episode last night..

nearly pissed myself when the mafia beat joe until his legs were useless

jtsuited

DamagedTrax wrote: »

hahaha.. was just watching that episode last night..

nearly pissed myself when the mafia beat joe until his legs were useless

was the best episode ever. you see the beethoven bit????

seannash

jtsuited wrote: »

tbh, any aul eejit can make a crap dance track OR a crap rock track.

btw, i have found the best resource for writing songs.....ever.........

:p:p

thats awesome