Are there any people who are finding it hard to enjoy this F1 season?

Go Harvey Go

Before the 2009 Formula 1 season started I expected that it would be a great one - what with the aerodynamic changes to the cars and the reintroduction of slick tyres, potentially leading to more overtaking and possibly a more level playing field.

But in the first five races, Jenson Button and the new Brawn team have virtually swept all before them - and Ferrari, McLaren and Renault have been pretty much nowhere.

And there's been a whole load of bickering over things like the attempted change in deciding the drivers' championship, Brawn's rear diffuser, and the budget cap for all teams, as well as McLaren and Lewis Hamilton finding themselves in hot water at the Australian GP.

Consequently I have so far found myself unable to enjoy this season.

I've found this shift of power from Ferrari and McLaren to Brawn and teams like Red Bull and Toyota to be too sudden for my liking - and now I kind of miss having Ferrari and McLaren at the front of the grid. And I hate it when politics threaten to overshadow what's happening on the track.

I know some people are going to disagree with me, thinking "oh it's great that Brawn are doing so well and Ferrari and McLaren are doing crap" - but is there anyone out there who does feel the same as me?

robinph

Well Ferrari and McLaren will come back at Brawn/ Red Bull/ Toyota before the season is done. If Ferrari and McLaren had been scampering off into the distance early in the season do you think any of the other teams would then be able to catch up to the same extent?

vectra

Go Harvey Go wrote: »

Before the 2009 Formula 1 season started I expected that it would be a great one - what with the aerodynamic changes to the cars and the reintroduction of slick tyres, potentially leading to more overtaking and possibly a more level playing field.

But in the first five races, Jenson Button and the new Brawn team have virtually swept all before them - and Ferrari, McLaren and Renault have been pretty much nowhere.

And there's been a whole load of bickering over things like the attempted change in deciding the drivers' championship, Brawn's rear diffuser, and the budget cap for all teams, as well as McLaren and Lewis Hamilton finding themselves in hot water at the Australian GP.

Consequently I have so far found myself unable to enjoy this season.

I've found this shift of power from Ferrari and McLaren to Brawn and teams like Red Bull and Toyota to be too sudden for my liking - and now I kind of miss having Ferrari and McLaren at the front of the grid. And I hate it when politics threaten to overshadow what's happening on the track.

I know some people are going to disagree with me, thinking "oh it's great that Brawn are doing so well and Ferrari and McLaren are doing crap" - but is there anyone out there who does feel the same as me?

I am behind you 100%

Today I thought it was gonna shaek up a bit with Massa in the boil and Kimi making up several places at the start.

ah well
I will live in anticipation and wait for Monaco even though it is not one of Kimi's favourites

Go Harvey Go

robinph wrote: »

Well Ferrari and McLaren will come back at Brawn/ Red Bull/ Toyota before the season is done. If Ferrari and McLaren had been scampering off into the distance early in the season do you think any of the other teams would then be able to catch up to the same extent?

Probably not, TBH - whenever Ferrari and McLaren have been head and shoulders above the rest in the first few races of the season, they've tended to keep it that way right up to and including the last race. This was certainly the case in 2000 and again in 2007.

And I suppose it wouldn't have been any better if they'd been wiping the floor with the opposition in these first five races...

What I expected before this season started was that Ferrari and McLaren would still be at the front, but very closely pursued by Renault and BMW Sauber, themselves closely followed by Red Bull and Toyota.

I did expect Brawn to be some bit competitive, given how they impressed in pre-season testing - but no way in the world did I expect them to win four of the first five races. And I certainly did not expect Ferrari and McLaren to plunge down the grid either, or for Renault and BMW Sauber to also struggle.

Slutmonkey57b

Brawn are certainly not running away with it. If it weren't for bad luck and some poor judgement, I firmly believe the Red Bulls would be in front.

amacachi

LIGHTNING wrote: »

I dont understand what people want from a F1 season. People give out that Ferrari/McLaren are dominating the sport. Then a brand new team that are complete underdogs just days from going belly up come in and they are now flying. The expected teams like BMW are nowhere. Drivers that some people thought were past it are doing what we know they can do.

The cars are finally back to slicks and all the silly aero aids have been banned.

What more can they do? Maybe force the drivers to some sort of exhibition show at the end of the race to entertain the crowd?

I'd love to know as well. People are still giving out that it all comes down to the car rather than the driver and crap like that. Or "put them in identical cars". They do that in A1GP and it doesn't make it much closer than F1.

One thing I will say is that I firmly believe the most wins system would've added a little spice to things and made making up a position a lot more valuable than it is right now.

enzo7

LIGHTNING wrote: »

What more can they do? Maybe force the drivers to some sort of exhibition show at the end of the race to entertain the crowd?

yep:D

ah no im gutted ferrari are in such a state!! in general i think the season started off well it was good to see brawn doing so well but now im just bored!! its hard to see anyone but brawn+button winning the championship. but ill prob still watch it and complain about it but its only coz ferrari arent winning.

SoupyNorman

Go Harvey Go wrote: »

Are there any people who are finding it hard to enjoy this F1 season?

Not in the slightest.

vectra

amacachi wrote: »

I'd love to know as well. People are still giving out that it all comes down to the car rather than the driver and crap like that.

Well
Proof of the pudding was in the eating this weekend
Even Jenson Button remarked about the massive job Ferrari had done
what did they do?
Modify/redisign some of their chassis and add a DIFFUSER

I think that evened them up a bit.;)

tifosi 1

I am enjoying F1 this season. Being a Ferrari fan it can be hard to watch at times but overall its been good. A lot of Ferrari fans must have short memories as it was only 2005 that they had a horrible year. The only reason this year appears worse is because their are more than 2 teams that are competitive and bagging all the points.

Hopefully after Monaco the field will catch Brawn and Red Bull.

ART6

Not being a supporter of any team, I am happy to see Brawn and Red Bull come surging up the ratings. Anything that stops an F1 race being just another procession behind Ferrari one year or Maclaren the next is good to me. OK, so Brawn are streets ahead at the moment, but I'd bet that will not continue indefinitely. The other teams will at least shorten the odds and then maybe we'll see some great racing.

smooch71

I have to say I'm enjoying the season so far even though it's being dominated by one team (man?). I'm a Ferrari fan and it's heartbreaking to see them in the state they're in but that's the way it goes. Ferrari, McLaren BMW et al have no one to blame but themselves.

Somebody needs to explain that point to Lewis Hamilton, that a good car isn't his by right. This season has been a serious wake up call for him and that's refreshing to see.

I think it's only a matter of time before Red Bull start to haul in Brawn and close the gap a little. I thought Williams and Toyota would be right up there too but they seem to be fading a little. Toyota need to put Alonso in the car!

There has rarely been a season where you don't have at least onne dominant team and this year is no different. But the positives are there too, we are seeing more overtaking, maybe not as must as everyone hoped but at least it's heading in the right direction.

mikedragon32

This has been the most interesting season for years, what's not to enjoy?

McLaren getting found out yet again for their slick tricks?

Ferrari discovering that without the assistance of their own test track and testing programme that their car is, at best, mid pack with no immediate sign of redemption?

The KERS connundrum?

All the big boys having a strop because two of the minnows got the jump on them with the rear diffuser?

On and off circuit this has been a great season to date.

(Ferrari fan BTW, but Raikonnen should never have been put into one of their cars, he doesn't have that passion, so good to see that he may not see out the season)

Biro

Go Harvey Go wrote: »

Before the 2009 Formula 1 season started I expected that it would be a great one - what with the aerodynamic changes to the cars and the reintroduction of slick tyres, potentially leading to more overtaking and possibly a more level playing field.

But in the first five races, Jenson Button and the new Brawn team have virtually swept all before them - and Ferrari, McLaren and Renault have been pretty much nowhere.

And there's been a whole load of bickering over things like the attempted change in deciding the drivers' championship, Brawn's rear diffuser, and the budget cap for all teams, as well as McLaren and Lewis Hamilton finding themselves in hot water at the Australian GP.

Consequently I have so far found myself unable to enjoy this season.

I've found this shift of power from Ferrari and McLaren to Brawn and teams like Red Bull and Toyota to be too sudden for my liking - and now I kind of miss having Ferrari and McLaren at the front of the grid. And I hate it when politics threaten to overshadow what's happening on the track.

I know some people are going to disagree with me, thinking "oh it's great that Brawn are doing so well and Ferrari and McLaren are doing crap" - but is there anyone out there who does feel the same as me?

It's your McLaren that are causing the politics to become involved! No harm for them to be at the back.
I can't understand how you think the new teams got their good fortune "too fast". Good fortune can never happen too fast!

enzo7

mikedragon32 wrote: »

(Ferrari fan BTW, but Raikonnen should never have been put into one of their cars, he doesn't have that passion, so good to see that he may not see out the season)

agree!! i dont think his going anywhere till the end of the year at the earliest so i tink we will hav to suffer on:(.

if red bull can get there act together it will me more intresting for sure, im just moaning because its the first time in over 20yr my fav driver/team doesnt look like it going to win a race :mad:

EvilMonkey

Maybe if someone in Brawn gave McLaren the plans of the car they could build a car that could survive at the front. :pac:

steviec

mikedragon32 wrote: »

This has been the most interesting season for years, what's not to enjoy?

McLaren getting found out yet again for their slick tricks?

Ferrari discovering that without the assistance of their own test track and testing programme that their car is, at best, mid pack with no immediate sign of redemption?

The KERS connundrum?

All the big boys having a strop because two of the minnows got the jump on them with the rear diffuser?

On and off circuit this has been a great season to date.

(Ferrari fan BTW, but Raikonnen should never have been put into one of their cars, he doesn't have that passion, so good to see that he may not see out the season)

Well said. It's been a great season so far and a real breath of fresh air.

I'd also add that Brawn aren't dominating as much as the results would seem either - Red Bull have looked like the faster car in the last two races but tactics worked out in Brawn's favour. If the Malaysian GP hadn't been stopped when it did then Brawn may not have won there either - Red Bull were looking much faster when it started raining and would have overtaken them. And of course if the rain had come a little earlier, Brawn wouldn't have won either because they were running behind Williams for much of the race.

Button may have 4 wins out of 5, but he's worked very hard for them (although Rubens' strategy in the last race was hard to swallow) and it's been a great season to watch.

Hephaestus

Are there any people who are finding it hard to enjoy this F1 season?


Nope, I'm enjoyin it.

Nice to see a talented driver (JB) who's struggled for years tasting some success.

+ I have to admit that I find seeing Hamilton as one of the "monkeys @ the back" quite amusing!

vectra

Hephaestus wrote: »

Are there any people who are finding it hard to enjoy this F1 season?


Nope, I'm enjoyin it.
I have to admit that I find seeing Hamilton as one of the "monkeys @ the back" quite amusing!

Be Careful
I am enjoying the same thing
BUT
I did say that on another forums recently and got Banned for being Racist. :eek:

Then again it was a British guy that Banned me

amacachi

Heh, I was going to report the post for being "racist" but I wasn't sure if the mods would get the joke. :P

Desmondo2000

I think its been a great season so far I love seeing Ferrari having a hard time Kimi doesnt seem to care anymore

mrmac

I think it's been a great start to the season.

I especially like the fact that JB is doing so well, that Ross Brawn now has his own team, and that Vettel is starting to get the finger out! I've always felt that these guys are real stars.

I look forward to every race, hoping that JB continues his run. That Ross Brawn keeps his team on top, by being prepared to change his strategy, depending on how the race develops (genious!). That Vettel starts rewarding ME for my faith in him, lol,

lovinit

As a ferrari fan no I am not enjoying this season but it seems to be more even this time round. I see Hamilton is whinging again about not being given a proper car to drive, even though he gave it 100% this time - so ungrateful:pac:. Overall its nice to see guys like Webber and Button being given a chance.:)

vectra

Desmondo2000 wrote: »

I love seeing Ferrari having a hard time Kimi doesnt seem to care anymore

your bubble could be burst over the next few races.
Not including Monaco as that never seems to go well for Ferrari
Watch out after that though.
As for Kimi not caring anymore?
I would love to know where this came from
I have followed Kimi since before he came to F1.
I have yet to witness him getting worked up or looking like he cared.
Hence the name "iceman"

Biro

vectra wrote: »

your bubble could be burst over the next few races.
Not including Monaco as that never seems to go well for Ferrari
Watch out after that though.
As for Kimi not caring anymore?
I would love to know where this came from
I have followed Kimi since before he came to F1.
I have yet to witness him getting worked up or looking like he cared.
Hence the name "iceman"

It came from the fact that when he bothered to race, he won the championship in half a season. Since then Massa has out done him almost consistantly.

antodeco

This season (whilst one sided to a certain extent) is a big difference from the previous seasons. I would be happy if there were 4 or 5 teams competing in every race (which will have to eventually happen). If only it could rain in every race

vectra

Biro wrote: »

It came from the fact that when he bothered to race, he won the championship in half a season.

I dont remember that??
what year did that happen?

I do remember he won the Drivers championship in 2007 at the last race

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

I dont remember that??
what year did that happen?

I do remember he won the Drivers championship in 2007 at the last race

maybe he ment he did feck all for the first half of the season and when ham and alonso started their fighting he thought to him self if i bother racing i could steal this from those 2 muppets:D:D.

EvilMonkey

enzo7 wrote: »

maybe he ment he did feck all for the first half of the season and when ham and alonso started their fighting he thought to him self if i bother racing i could steal this from those 2 muppets:D:D.

He won in Australia didn't he?

enzo7

EvilMonkey wrote: »

He won in Australia didn't he?

ah i was only jokeing i thought kimi had a great yr in 07 and fully deserved his title.

ODD-JOB

They're all god-damn customer teams that are winning the races !!!

Surely the works teams wont share the same quality engine upgrades throught-out the year ??

vectra

enzo7 wrote: »

maybe he ment he did feck all for the first half of the season and when ham and alonso started their fighting he thought to him self if i bother racing i could steal this from those 2 muppets:D:D.

It is you that would be the muppet to think that way
Remember
It was Michael Schumacher chose Kimi to be his successor

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

It is you that would be the muppet to think that way
Remember
It was Michael Schumacher chose Kimi to be his successor

lighten up it was a joke!! i already said i thought kimi did a good job in 07, oh schumacher choose kimi did he:rolleyes:,i wish he had that much influence on ferrari. its a pity kimi doesnt show half as much passion as his fans do defending him, he might not been in this mess now.

Samurai

haven't enjoyed f1 since jordan left

vectra

enzo7 wrote: »

oh schumacher choose kimi did he.

I challenge you to prove me wrong on this one.

Biro

It's blatently obvious that Kimi's mind is off the ball. How else would you explain that the most talented driver out there is producing consistantly half-assed results? Massa isn't better than Kimi, but last year he had no problem beating Kimi for practically the whole season. This season so far we're seeing the same thing. One or two laps of genious, then nothing. Last year we had nothing on Friday, nothing on Saturday, nothing for half a race on Sunday then all of a sudden fastest lap, fastest lap, fastest lap - all too late. What's the story with that?

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

I challenge you to prove me wrong on this one.

if schumacher had that much influence at ferrari ,kimi would hav been sacked by now. unless schumacher is helping massa out abit ,the longer his outperforming kimi (the apparent fastest driver in f1) the highter his reputation will rise. in that case great decision schuey:D

ART6

Biro wrote: »

It's blatently obvious that Kimi's mind is off the ball. How else would you explain that the most talented driver out there is producing consistantly half-assed results? Massa isn't better than Kimi, but last year he had no problem beating Kimi for practically the whole season. This season so far we're seeing the same thing. One or two laps of genious, then nothing. Last year we had nothing on Friday, nothing on Saturday, nothing for half a race on Sunday then all of a sudden fastest lap, fastest lap, fastest lap - all too late. What's the story with that?

The interview with Kimi on Sunday suggested that he has lost his enthusiasm and will not be driving next season. That's a great shame since Ferrari and Mclaren will bounce back sooner or later, and four or even five highly competitive teams would make for some great F1 instead of the past history of McLaren/Ferrari processions. Kimi would contribute greatly to that if he could regain his motivation.

vectra

enzo7 wrote: »

if schumacher had that much influence at ferrari ,kimi would hav been sacked by now. unless schumacher is helping massa out abit ,the longer his outperforming kimi (the apparent fastest driver in f1) the highter his reputation will rise. in that case great decision schuey:D

Schumacher DID have that sort of influence on Ferrari when he was their No.1
Now it is different though.
As for Helping Massa.. Dont tell me you didnt know that he tutured Massa all through last season..!!
I thought you knew what you were on about :rolleyes:

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

As for Helping Massa.. Dont tell me you didnt know that he tutured Massa all through last season..!!

yes he helped him with his driveing/setups ect. everyone knows that hence he challanged for the title lastyr. my point was maybe he helped massa in the boardroom too by encouraging the kimi move, and if he did it was a great decision!!

maybe you should take you own advise and not pick out 1 word in a post and turn it into an argument.

vectra

Biro wrote: »

It's blatently obvious that Kimi's mind is off the ball. How else would you explain that the most talented driver out there is producing consistantly half-assed results?

OK
My view about Kimi.
( Just my thoughts..Not an argument or anything )

The Ferrari car does not suit Kimi's driving style.

Hakinen advised Kimi NOT to move to Ferrari in 2007 but to stay with McLaren and he would become world Champ.
Had he stayed I would have no doubt in my mind that he would have walked away with the title in 07 & 08.
Now that this years McLaren has fell flat on its face Kimi would be struggling big time.
I only wonder would all the people that run him down now have the same feelings in that scenario.

I say give him time
This car is coming along nicely and we will see Kimi back at the top of his game again

enzo7 wrote: »

yes he helped him with his driveing/setups ect. everyone knows that hence he challanged for the title lastyr. my point was maybe he helped massa in the boardroom too by encouraging the kimi move, and if he did it was a great decision!!

maybe you should take you own advise and not pick out 1 word in a post and turn it into an argument.

oops.
Please accept my apologies.
I honestly did not see where you put BOARDROOM in your original post.

ScumLord

This is the best season in a long time, F1 had become a farce. Now there's so many good drivers that could be battling it out if the field was more even. I hate seeing one driver run away with it, I'd love to see other drivers winning there's plenty there that deserve wins.

I don't understand why you'd say a seasons bad just because your team isn't winning. I want to see a race.

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

OK
My view about Kimi.
( Just my thoughts..Not an argument or anything )

The Ferrari car does not suit Kimi's driving style.

Hakinen advised Kimi NOT to move to Ferrari in 2007 but to stay with McLaren and he would become world Champ.
Had he stayed I would have no doubt in my mind that he would have walked away with the title in 07 & 08.
Now that this years McLaren has fell flat on its face Kimi would be struggling big time.
I only wonder would all the people that run him down now have the same feelings in that scenario.

I say give him time
This car is coming along nicely and we will see Kimi back at the top of his game again

im not saying im agreeing with you here personnel i think his a lazy git who has zero intrest in f1 and only turns up, to pick up the check, but if he can win the championship in 07 car that doesnt "suit his style", then whats his excuse for 08.

but fair enough i for 1 will give him a chance because he does hav the talent to turn things around lets hope he actually wants to.

vectra

enzo7 wrote: »

im not saying im agreeing with you here personnel i think his a lazy git who has zero intrest in f1 and only turns up, to pick up the check, but if he can win the championship in 07 car that doesnt "suit his style", then whats his excuse for 08.

but fair enough i for 1 will give him a chance because he does hav the talent to turn things around lets hope he actually wants to.

07 the car was more suited to him in the latter part of the season.
08 at the start of the season he was fairly happy with the car as it was basically the same car he won in 07 with, BUT as the season progressed and Ferrari modified the car it sort of went away from him and he was not happy nor comfortable with it anymore..

But as you say.
Give him a chance.
I would take a bet he will wipe the floor with Massa this year once Monaco is out of the way.

Biro

vectra wrote: »

07 the car was more suited to him in the latter part of the season.
08 at the start of the season he was fairly happy with the car as it was basically the same car he won in 07 with, BUT as the season progressed and Ferrari modified the car it sort of went away from him and he was not happy nor comfortable with it anymore..

But as you say.
Give him a chance.
I would take a bet he will wipe the floor with Massa this year once Monaco is out of the way.

Your arguement fails though when you take the fastest lap thing into consideration. If the car didn't suit him, he wouldn't be able to get the fastest lap in the race out of it. But he did last year, repeatedly. All of the best drivers distinguish themselves from the very good drivers by the fact that they can go the distance, pushing 100% all the way. The fact that Kimi doesn't do that means one of two things. Either he's not talented enough or he's not hungry enough. I'm opting for the 2nd thing.
The car is an excuse. The best drivers of all time wouldn't let themselves be out done by a team mate because "the car doesn't suit me".

vectra

Biro wrote: »

Your arguement fails though when you take the fastest lap thing into consideration.

Strange how a driver can claim pole in quali and do crap at the race.

Whatever your views on Kimi are.
I still think he would be the one to beat if he were 100% at home with his car

enzo7

vectra wrote: »

Strange how a driver can claim pole in quali and do crap at the race.

Whatever your views on Kimi are.
I still think he would be the one to beat if he were 100% at home with his car

i think biro was talking about fastest race laps not quali.
any driver would be the one to beat if they were 100% at home with their car just look at button, what sets the good and the great drivers apart is they can adapt or at the very least work as hard as they can to make the car more driveable.

anyway lets see what he can do for the rest of the season, i wish i had as much faith in him as you do.

vectra

enzo7 wrote: »

i think biro was talking about fastest race laps not quali.

I understand that but If a driver can pull a massive fast lap out of the bag for Quali then why can that not be repeated in the race?

enzo7 wrote: »

any driver would be the one to beat if they were 100% at home with their car just look at button, what sets the good and the great drivers apart is they can adapt or at the very least work as hard as they can to make the car more driveable.

Agreed.
To an extent.
Webber is 100% at home with his car and Vettel is wiping his A$$ with him in the same car.
If Kimi was 100% at home with his car, Do you think Jenson and Brawn would be smiling now?

Running Bing

Yawn.

Ferrari/McClaren fans bitching because their teams are'nt the best anymore:rolleyes:


I think its been a cracking season so far. Exciting racing, more overtaking, three teams in the thick of it and Ferrari and McClaren still to come on strong (which they will eventually imo).


If you take your black and grey (or Ferrari red) sunglasses off you will see its shaping up to be a great season.

enzo7

in fairness if you look at the top 6 drivers, based on talent alone vettel is the only one who deserves to be there. i started to watch f1 because i loved watching the most talented drivers on the grid competing for drivers titles., at presant the most talented drivers are kimi,alonso, lewis and then massa and vettel, apart from vettel the other 4 are scrambling for the odd pts that cant be good for f1. this season isnt any better than last there is still only 2 teams that look like winning races. If button continues like this he will hav the title wrapped up by mid-season, this championship has 2002 written all over it. nothing exciting about that.

enzo7

LIGHTNING wrote: »

I think thats a bit harsh on the other drivers, Vettel may be a future wc but the likes of Button,Rubens, Kubica, Alonso,Webber are all world class drivers.Even the guys at the back of the grid like Fisi not to mention one of the most succesful champ car racers of al time Bourdais are all outstanding drivers. If you go back to the early nineties their were quite a few fillers on the grid (see below link)

http://www.f1rejects.com/

maybe a little harsh:) alonso was in my top drivers group doe, he was a fantastic champion! i know we need the grid fillers and i dont even mind them winning a few races but winning a drivers world championship should in my view be for the most talanted f1 drivers. there all fantastic racing drivers but some are more talanted f1 drivers than others. my top 5 would be alonso,kimi,lewis,massa,vettel, id prefer to watch them battling for the drivers title.