Irish in the ZLM Tour ?

biker_joe

ZLM Tour - Arjaan de Schipper Trofee - 1.Ncup

Netherlands, April 18, 2009


Anyone know what happened the lads yesterday ?



38 Sean Downey (Irl) Ireland

DNF Philip Lavery (Irl) Ireland
DNF Stephen Halpin (Irl) Ireland
DNF Sam Bennett (Irl) Ireland
DNF Aaron Buggle (Irl) Ireland
DNF Ronan Mc Laughlin (Irl) Ireland

King Kelly

biker_joe wrote: »

ZLM Tour - Arjaan de Schipper Trofee - 1.Ncup

Netherlands, April 18, 2009


Anyone know what happened the lads yesterday ?

38 Sean Downey (Irl) Ireland

DNF Philip Lavery (Irl) Ireland
DNF Stephen Halpin (Irl) Ireland
DNF Sam Bennett (Irl) Ireland
DNF Aaron Buggle (Irl) Ireland
DNF Ronan Mc Laughlin (Irl) Ireland

.....discovered that beating C's Vets & Juniors in Ireland does not a top class European rider make........?

biker_joe

Well, not wanting to say that in my original post ! I think a couple of those have at least won one or two A races. But I suppose 90% of us racing here are part-timers, these are full timers ..... time to see the careers office back at school ?

Biker Joe

King Kelly

Yeah it was only a tongue in cheek reply. If i had 10% of those boy's talent I'd be well satisfied!

It's just a major step up from competition in Ireland to go race against the best young talent in Europe. Fair play to them -its by taking part in these top class events they'll improve.

biker_joe

i know it was tongue in cheek reply, but probably what most people are thinking I'm afraid ! Anyways let's hope they at least finish next time !!

RobFowl

Downey was only 14 seconds behind and the winner was one of the British academy boys (full time set up based in Tuscany with coaching and structured training etc)
Also Taylor Phinney was in the mix , he of the World pursuit tile and silver in the Kilo. One of the hottest prospects around.
IMO it's good to see CI sending under 23 teams to these sort of events. The team is a young one and can only benefit from the experience. Would have prefered to see a few more finishing though !!

waluigi

hi i was just browsing and saw this i wasnt gona bother really but i did...i rode that race and have never rode anything near that standard or in the crosswind conditions,got caught in to far back and got shelled while doing 60 kph,along with some new zeland lads lithuainians and a few russians..it is always funny to hear guys like urselfs put a negative spin on things when you havnt a ****ing clue what is was like!!riding races in ireland does not prepare you for that and id bet if you were to find out how many of the other nations had rode races like that this season id bet they all have!you cant ****in walk before you can crawl..think of that next time before you critisize a team with 4 first year seniors in there first udr 23 race of that standard:mad:

Esroh

http://www.irishcycling.com/publish/news/art_3797 did actually give an explaination.
Waluigi keep us up to date with the rest of your trip

biker_joe

hey waluigi
What do you what us to say ? well done for not finishing ??? If you can't hack it now, what makes you think you will next season, when you will be competing against all the lads that finished the race, and will get stronger !

And we all saw that other nations were in race, cos the results were on cyclingnews.com, every half decent cyclist knows that you always ride in the top third of the bunch !!!!

If you can't hack it, go and get a JOB !

Biker Joe.

zzzzzzzz

biker_joe wrote: »

hey waluigi
What do you what us to say ? well done for not finishing ??? If you can't hack it now, what makes you think you will next season, when you will be competing against all the lads that finished the race, and will get stronger !

And we all saw that other nations were in race, cos the results were on cyclingnews.com, every half decent cyclist knows that you always ride in the top third of the bunch !!!!

If you can't hack it, go and get a JOB !

Biker Joe.

Hold the phone - you're being way too harsh here.

So they didn't finish their first race at that level of competition - saying that "if they can't hack it in their first race, they won't be able to hack it next year" is flawed logic to say the least!

Also, I don't think he's asking for the career advice that you seem to be doling out - he's just looking for people to show some support for a team full of undoubtedly great prospects for the future of irish cycling. Or even at least not to talk so negatively about them based on their first race at that level!

Home:Ballyhoura

I actually heard that only 60 out of 160 riders finished the race! Also, the Irish boys were caught towards the back due to one of their riders had to drop back for a spare wheel, and this was when the echelons started forming and they were just unlucky. Sean Downey said it was the hardest race he had ever ridden due to those fierce crosswinds. Fair play to them, at least give them the respect they deserve.

RobFowl

http://www.cyclingnews.com/road.php?id=road/2009/apr09/zlmtour09

76 finishers out of 130 starters

Looking at the route there was a lap of 15k at the end so they probably pulled out anyone not within a few minutes of the bunch.
If you missed the split probably weren't let finish

waluigi

biker joe.... if you think you can just throw a few 1st years into a race like that and always get results and finish you need to get your head of of your arse and you obviously havnt a ****ing clue!! so yur logic is if your not winning world class races as an undr 23 when your only 18 your should pack it in...thats probly why your on this site bull****ing because you could never do anything yourself..you negative piece of ****...go suck a lemon...o and how many world cups did you win or finish?hahaha im off thanks aidan.offbeat...you understand;)

biker_joe

Results - 180km

1 Luke Rowe (GBr) Great Britain 4.13.58 (42.525 km/h)
2 Vojtech Hacecky (Cze) Mixed Team 0.02
3 John Degenkolb (Ger) Germany 0.06
4 Elia Viviani (Ita) Italy
5 Taylor Phinney (USA) US National Team
6 Marko Kump (Slo) Slovenia
7 Andrei Klyuev (Rus) Russian Federation
8 Siarhei Papok (Blr) Belarus
9 Alexander Kristoff (Nor) Norway 0.09
10 Timofey Kritskiy (Rus) Russian Federation
11 Jens Debusschere (Bel) Belgium
12 Ronan Van Zandbeek (Ned) Netherlands A
13 Dennis Kreder (Ned) Netherlands A
14 Yuriy Agarkov (Ukr) Ukraine
15 Daniel Ania Gonzalez (Spa) Spain
16 Gregory Joseph (Bel) Belgium
17 Raymond Kreder (Ned) Netherlands A
18 Kanstantsin Shkredau (Blr) Belarus
19 Jarl Salomein (Bel) Belgium
20 Frederique Robert (Bel) Belgium
21 Lars Jun (Ned) Netherlands A
22 Jonathan Mcevoy (GBr) Great Britain
23 Wesley Kreder (Ned) Netherlands A
24 Jose Carl Lara Arjonilla (Spa) Spain
25 Ablay Shugaipov (Kaz) Kazakhstan
26 Chris Barton (USA) US National Team
27 Mihdi Olamaei (IRI) Mixed Team
28 Alex Dowsett (GBr) Great Britain 0.14
29 Mathieu Simon (Fra) France
30 Andrea Palini (Ita) Italy
31 Stefan Vreugdenhil (Ned) Netherlands B
32 Bjorn Selander (USA) US National Team
33 Philip Nielsen (Den) Denmark
34 Andrei Krasilnikau (Blr) Belarus
35 Clinton Avery (NZl) New Zealand
36 Cole House (USA) US National Team
37 Rusell Hampton (GBr) Great Britain
38 Sean Downey (Irl) Ireland
39 Thomas Riber-Sellebjerg (Den) Denmark 0.20
40 Maxim Kumilevski (Blr) Belarus 0.23
41 Marcel Kittel (Ger) Germany 0.25
42 Blaz Furdi (Slo) Slovenia
43 Andrea Guardini (Ita) Italy
44 Sebastian Hans (Ger) Germany
45 Alexander Petrovskiy (Rus) Russian Federation 1.01
46 Niki Byrgesen (Den) Denmark 1.33
47 Ole-Jorgen Jensen (Nor) Norway 1.43
48 Angel Sanchez Martin (Spa) Spain
49 Vegard Laengen (Nor) Norway 1.46
50 Mantas Bliakevicius (Ltu) Lithuania 1.49
51 Jimmi Soerensen (Den) Denmark 1.51
52 Artsiem Malinouski (Blr) Belarus
53 Ramunas Navardauskas (Ltu) Lithuania 1.54
54 Arnaud Courteille (Fra) France
55 Emmanuel Van Ruitenbeek (Ned) Netherlands B
56 Jure Zagar (Slo) Slovenia
57 Oleksandr Martynenko (Ukr) Ukraine
58 Iurii Golovchenko (Ukr) Ukraine
59 Sven Jodts (Bel) Belgium
60 Christoph Pfingsten (Ger) Germany
61 José Conçalves (Por) Portugal 2.01
62 Peter Jan Polling (Ned) Netherlands B 3.15
63 Giacomo Nizzolo (Ita) Italy
64 Stafano Borchi (Ita) Italy
65 Marco Cunha (Por) Portugal
66 Loïc Desriac (Fra) France
67 Gorka Izagirre (Spa) Spain
68 Jonathan Perdiguero (Spa) Spain 4.45
69 Temur Mukhamedov (Uzb) Mixed Team
70 David Hesselbarth (Ger) Germany
71 Morten Kruse Brink (Den) Denmark
72 Mark Langlands (NZl) New Zealand
73 Ricardo Vilela (Por) Portugal 4.58
74 Jean Lou Paiani (Fra) France 5.05
75 Jonathan Dufrasne (Bel) Belgium 6.34
76 Nico Keinath (Ger) Germany
DNF Alexis Bodiot (Fra) France
DNF Boris Zimine (Fra) France
DNF Petr Ignatenko (Rus) Russian Federation
DNF Andrey Solomennikov (Rus) Russian Federation
DNF Marco Coledan (Ita) Italy
DNF Maurice Vrijmoed (Ned) Netherlands A
DNF Andrew Fenn (GBr) Great Britain
DNF Mathias Kristensen (Den) Denmark
DNF Nik Burjek (Slo) Slovenia
DNF Dejan Bajt (Slo) Slovenia
DNF Jan Tratnik (Slo) Slovenia
DNF Roman Chuchulin (Ukr) Ukraine
DNF Rostyslav Mykhaylov (Ukr) Ukraine
DNF Vadym Chumachenko (Ukr) Ukraine
DNF Marius Kukta (Ltu) Lithuania
DNF Gediminas Kaupas (Ltu) Lithuania
DNF Algirdas Mockus (Ltu) Lithuania
DNF Egidijus Juodvalkis (Ltu) Lithuania
DNF Austin Caroll (USA) US National Team
DNF Ignacio Silva (USA) US National Team
DNF Brad Carter (NZl) New Zealand
DNF Eliot Crowther (NZl) New Zealand
DNF Tom David (NZl) New Zealand
DNF Matthew Sillars (NZl) New Zealand
DNF Vegard Breen (Nor) Norway
DNF Ole Haavardsholm (Nor) Norway
DNF Artur Surhanau (Blr) Belarus
DNF Nikolay Slonov (Kaz) Kazakhstan
DNF Yevceniy Nepomnyachshiy (Kaz) Kazakhstan
DNF Vadim Izotov (Kaz) Kazakhstan
DNF Jaco Venter (RSA) Mixed Team
DNF Gabor Kasa (Srb) Mixed Team
DNF Paavo Paajanen (Fin) Mixed Team
DNF Marco Coelho (Por) Portugal
DNF Carlos Baltazar (Por) Portugal
DNF Fábio Coelho (Por) Portugal
DNF Ion Pardo Abarzuza (Spa) Spain
DNF Philip Lavery (Irl) Ireland
DNF Stephen Halpin (Irl) Ireland
DNF Sam Bennett (Irl) Ireland
DNF Aaron Buggle (Irl) Ireland
DNF Ronan Mc Laughlin (Irl) Ireland
DNF Michael Vingerling (Ned) Netherlands B
DNF Nick Stöpler (Ned) Netherlands B
DNF Roy Eefting (Ned) Netherlands B

( More than 60 finishers, less than 160 starters )

Ok Lads I take it all back, the Irish lads did well, I hope that they fair better
in their next race.
I hope that they are n't too hurt by my comments, sure I am only a fred on the boards.ie
here. Sorry lads.

Biker Joe .

biker_joe

waluigi wrote: »

biker joe.... if you think you can just throw a few 1st years into a race like that and always get results and finish you need to get your head of of your arse and you obviously havnt a ****ing clue!! so yur logic is if your not winning world class races as an undr 23 when your only 18 your should pack it in...thats probly why your on this site bull****ing because you could never do anything yourself..you negative piece of ****...go suck a lemon...o and how many world cups did you win or finish?hahaha im off thanks aidan.offbeat...you understand;)

But a piece of **** ah here !

dave2pvd

waluigi wrote: »

biker joe.... if you think you can just throw a few 1st years into a race like that and always get results and finish you need to get your head of of your arse and you obviously havnt a ****ing clue!! so yur logic is if your not winning world class races as an undr 23 when your only 18 your should pack it in...thats probly why your on this site bull****ing because you could never do anything yourself..you negative piece of ****...go suck a lemon...o and how many world cups did you win or finish?hahaha im off thanks aidan.offbeat...you understand;)

Don't let them drag you down, mate. There will always be armchair experts out there, ready to dole out criticism from on-high. Don't waste your energy on them.

Great to see CI sending espoir teams overseas again - it seems like ages since the last time. I think this should have been done a month ago, mind you; the season is already well underway and the fast riders have gotten even faster.

Don't disappear; it would be great to hear more accounts of you and your teammates' exploits. In fact, would you mind going into a bit more detail about the ZLM Tour?

Remember, what doesn't kill you will make you stronger!

waluigi

if comments like that were to hurt me i wouldnt make it anywere!get your facts straight and dont critize others for something you couldnt do...apology accepted

Chips Lovell

Anyone who's ever seen spring races in the Low Countries will know that those crosswinds can be brutal. Once the echelons get going the field can be blown to bits in a matter of seconds. So I wouldn't be making any judgements about the lads from this one. This was a step up for them, but they are fine young riders and I'm sure we're going to be hearing a lot more from them.

biker_joe

waluigi
We do want to see you guys Finishing !!! of course we do... maybe I was just as disappointed as you guys to see aload of DNF's beside the Irish names ..... and no comments are meant in a personal nature.

There are some of us on here that do have plenty of experience and have ridden hard races ( and no race is easy ) and there are hard races here in Ireland, there is one on this Sunday, the Tour of Ulster and the RAS ! they are hard and fast races, I hope this espoir team get to ride these, as international Seniors/pro lads come to these races, making them very difficult indeed ! So I am not an Armchair expert ! I habe been in the line-outs !

Biker Joe

spongebobsquare

well here ar some more fine irish freds voicing their misguided uninformed opinion , I also rode the race , what makes any one here think they can judge that team , half the italian team are from liquigas the other s rode for either isd or amore vita , the dutch a squad is the rabobank continental squad the american team has a world champion almost world record holder and all the riders either rode for trek livestrong or bmc bissel pro teams .
what makes me think i can reach that standard next year ?? strength idiot a year older year stronger this is an endurance sport that takes time , training patients and intelligence which explains why you are writing ****e about this level of sport and we are racing and trying to acheive at it , look at the list of dnf , micheal vingerling holland _ world junior scratch race champion 2008 first year senior aswell .....if this transition is so easy why didn a few of you guys apply for high performance directorand well u could just fix all are problems u seem to have the answers , and whats this about the whole team being fulltime I am in college as well as one of my other team mates , so why dont you guys post your real names and all ur fantastic international results

blorg

@waluigi/spongebobsquare- it's good to see you commenting here, not often we have people posting competing at your level.

I think if you read back over the comments you will see most people wishing you well and understanding how difficult it is.

Thanks for the posts and any personal report on what the race was like for you would be much appreciated by us Freds*

*if the definition of a Fred includes someone whose equipment vastly exceeds their talent, then I am most definitely a Fred

spongebobsquare

lads lets look at the bigger picture ,

we arrived over on the friday , after not sitting on the bike since the tour of munster because of the weather at home 2 sessions on the rollers was all that was had the level is not comparable with anything at home forget the ras its a mans stage race not a flat one day in holland ,

the peloton had ridden full time since the start of the year in races well over their level to bring them on we hadnt , but thats no excuse we just havint matured or come to that standard yet it remains to be seen if we even will , but each of use trains and looks toward future goals to be frank i dont care what any of the negative people on here or in cycling in ireland think they are usually the people who havint got a clue , fair play to sean he rode brilliantly but he was in south afric with the uci squad racing and training for 6 weeks the rest of the squad werent , we were at the top level in europe as juniors so given 3 years we will be back up there , but then there is the pro level its like school u become top of senior infants senior school, secondary school, college .we learnt alot on sunday about are preperation are ability to ride in the bunch and fight for places and im sure we will utilise these as we move forwards over the coming years have the intelligence to look 5 years ahead and not back one race and forward another and decide hmmmmm these guys on boards dont think i can make it suppose il give up >? thanks for everyone who supported us and follows us week in week out with encouragement

in edition- i forgot to mention andy fenn dfn- last year junior paris roubaix winner we are all just starting out on the road to success , be it the irish lads or any other country support cyclists worldwide

zzzzzzzz

Are yous still over in europe and have you any more races on the agenda while you're there?

biker_joe

Spongebob,

It's good to see that you and wailgu are now here ! and can give us such honest reporting on the event ! We now have a full picture of what went on and what you are up against, I started this thread not cos I or anyone else wants a slagging match, but I wanted to know happened ? I am sure that you guys will learn and become stronger !

Sure let you know what's your plan for the year, and what the espoir's team plan is, and we'll keep an eye an out, I for one will support you guys in whatever way I can here on boards.ie for starters .....

Biker Joe

DirkVoodoo

Lads, you don't need to try and justify yourselves here. If you pop over to the soccer forum you will see people giving out about Steven Gerrard and saying what pass he should/should not have made or reasons why he should probably never go out to the nightclub ever again.

Unfortunately you are in the spotlight now as up and coming riders and this is something you have to live with. I am not envious by any means, I only ride for fun and would have neither the ability nor the discipline to succeed as a pro.

At the same time you can't attack people for having an opinion on a sport that they love and watch, it's a very fundamental part of spectatorship that you can share opinions on a public forum such as this, no one was personally directing any attacks at you, sending nasty letters to your homes, etc. You will see the same said of the big pros like Valverde, Cavendish, etc. around here, it doesn't mean that they have any less respect for them, just that they are as passionate as any other fan and come here to share opinions and "armchair" views.

I'm sure everyone here wishes you the best and is proud that Ireland can produce such talented riders, but they are also entitled to comment.

Anyway, best of luck!

ROK ON

FAO the 2 lads on the Irish Team

(1) The very best of luck with your current training and future racing careers.

(2) I think that in any sport, up and coming athletes should clearly target tough challenges. You will find out nothing about yourself if you dont. Clearly this was a tough challenge. Hopefully it will be used as that and that you can benefit from it. Don't allow it to get to you (easier said than done).

(3) Dont mind the website critics/praise. The internet exists, and there will always be comentators. (A page never refused ink and all that . . .).
You do you need to feel a glow from priase or pain at criticism by a complete randomer.

(4) My advice (wellmeaning), would be in a vane mentioned by Dirkvoodoo. That is, I am not sure that it is useful to your sporting careers to be reading what internet commentators have to see about your perfomances (be they good, bad or indifferent). We are all human, and can hurt from some of what is said about us (or become self satisfied about other things that may be said.)

In saying that, it must be very very frustrating to have someone comment on your efforts. Whether the comment is accurate or not, the person making it is entitled to make it - and you are entitled to set the record straight.

I am a complete Fred, and happy at that. I am also happy that cycling is making what seems to me to be a bit of resurgence in Ireland. I hope that all our promising riders only get stronger and over achieve on their goals.

petethedrummer

blorg wrote: »

@waluigi/spongebobsquare- it's good to see you commenting here, not often we have people posting competing at your level.

I agree, as long as noone asks them to the next hill time triall challenge.

Raam

petethedrummer wrote: »

I agree, as long as noone asks them to the next hill time triall challenge.

How will we get better unless we have someone to chase?!

Chips Lovell

Raam wrote: »

How will we get better unless we have someone to chase?!

Only a problem for you. The rest of us are chasing you.

TinyExplosions

blorg wrote: »

@waluigi/spongebobsquare- it's good to see you commenting here, not often we have people posting competing at your level

+1 one to that, it's great to have people 'in the know' around that can tell us what it's really like. Don't listen to the detractors, as DirkVoodo said, on a message board there's always folk whining.

Personally, I think competing in races like this is great, and a DNF is no shame at all.

Now, can we interest you guys in some Boards Jerseys in our next round of orders...

petethedrummer

Raam wrote: »

How will we get better unless we have someone to chase?!

By drinking more Powerade.

How much would I have to drink to improve my time by 30%?

Gavin

petethedrummer wrote: »

By drinking more Powerade.

How much would I have to drink to improve my time by 30%?

One bottle of blue and two bottles of orange.

Chips Lovell

petethedrummer wrote: »

By drinking more Powerade.

How much would I have to drink to improve my time by 30%?

Surely you should be drinking 30 per cent more?