TT. Best way to approach

Esroh

Having a go at a club 10TT tonight.Did 1 last year and blew up after going out to fast with a tailwind.
I would be classed as a stayer. Any advice on how to pace it to break the 30 mins.

Muller_1

You want to start at about 80-90% just so you don't go into oxgen debt after 1st KM you should be flat out. Make sure to do a good warm up, you need to get your heart rate up before you start.

Chips Lovell

You in the Orwell/IRC/Stagg etc league Esroh? Looks like we might be going to the same TT tonight.

It'll be my first TT this length, so I probably don't have much advice to give. What Muller said was pretty much what I was planning on doing.

Shame about the rain. I thought it would be a bit clearer today.

Esroh

No. way over west in Westernlakes/Coveywheelers league.Sun is shining here
My biggest prob is I have a lung function prob which will kick in holding effort. Was wondering if I can do it by going above and below 20mph at dif miles or do I have to try and stay above it and hope not to die to much

Chips Lovell

What are the chances. Good luck tonight.

Lumen

I have no TT experience but am reading up on the theory of this stuff, so thought I'd share. Take with a pinch.

On a perfectly flat course you want to be running consistently around threshold power (maximum effort you can sustain for an hour). Introducing variability hurts your average power, and wastes energy as going faster is progressively less efficient.

However, on a hilly or windy course you want to put extra effort in uphill and with a tailwind, as in these situations you have lower "airspeed" so can go into defecit and gain extra speed without wasting it against the wind, and pay it back downhill or into a headwind.

On a single hill TT, try and avoid puking/passing out before the finish line.

Also, your HR lags power/effort. There is no benefit in going into defecit initially in an attempt to get your HR up, unless that happens to fit with the criteria outlined above.

Happy to be corrected on all this.

biker_joe

having won one or two TT's in my time .....jayus I am sounding old for 36 !!

TT's are about position, comfortable gear you can turn at TT cadence, and keeping an eye on your HR, so you can monitor effort. It would be good if you know your Lactate threshold hold HR, so you can keep your HR around here, if you go over this marker for too long, you will blow up, ie the legs will fill with lactic acid and you will have to slow up !

It's very important to warm-up well, if I were doing a ten i would do a 30min warm-up getting my hr up to 80 -90% ( sweating !! ) towards the end of the warm-up !
Also here's a good tip for gaining a couple of seconds on your close rivals, start with your weakest leg forward, so your first full revolution of the cranks is with your stronger leg .... then ride as hard as you can til the END !!!

Biker Joe.

Esroh

Well I followed your advice.Warmed up well,Got up to what felt like max !!!!. And just tried to keep it up
28.46 big improvment on this time last year 32.35
For a fella who only 2 years on the go and regards Biker Joe as a young fella I quite chuffed

biker_joe

well Esroh
Glad to help, and keep up the good work ! over 2mins of any time is a great achievement !!! So roll on the next TT !!!!!!!!

Biker Joe

LDB

I did my first proper TT last night, 10 miles also.
I was told that I should be finishing with nothing left but I found it difficult to know how to pace myself in order to do that, so having a HR monitor seems to be the thing to do.

I think for TT's (and racing in general) a bit of experience / practice does a lot of good. I will definitely have a better idea next time.

I also realised that I am utterly crap at cornering, I almost went through a round a bout instead of taking a left ... scary moment!

Esroh

Thanks Joe
Next step is TOI 09
For a fella who gives you 10 years there aren't many TTs left

zzzzzzzz

Did my first 10 mile tt this evening out in batterstown. Had a choice between going first or going 20th or so and I wanted to get it over with so went off first...

Got a decent warm up in beforehand, but didn't want to miss my start or delay the start or anything like that so I basically ended up standing around for about 10-15 mins getting cold while I waited for people to sort stuff out.

My aim going in to it was to do it in under 30 mins and not get caught by anyone behind which I managed to do so I'm happy enough - 28.04 in the end (I think... somewhere in the early 28s anyway.)

Think I ate a bit too close to the start - was almost puking at one point near the end.

There was some confusion at the first corner - probably down to my inexperience as well as not knowing the roads out there at all, but I came across a marshall and he didn't point to the corner or anything so I assumed I was to go straight on - looked at him as I went passed and managed to say "STraIght??!" and he said "Oh no - up that way!" but i'd missed the corner. I'm sure that only lost me a couple of seconds though so no big deal. Thinking about it now though, there's obviously no reason for him to be on a corner unless I'm to turn...

Anyway - a couple of Km up that road I started to doubt that the guy was actually a marshall - started thinking "jesus, if that was a builder standing at the side of the road he could be pulling the piss out of me, sending me to the back arse of nowhere..." :pac: I put my doubts aside anyway and continued on... Funny thinking about it now.

Time Trials are fcuking tough.

Tonto - how'd you get on in the end? was thinking about hanging on for you but had to get going.

Chips Lovell

Hi Aidan,
I figured you headed on home alright. Not the night for standing around. The weather was fierce nasty.

26.58 for me. I was a bit disappointed as I thought I was capable of much better, but I think I overdid it on the training in the past few days. I felt lousy all day and didn't really settle in to it once I got going. I also did a lot of stupid stuff such as ride on the hoods way too much because I just didn't feel comfortable. I was targetting this one as one I could probably get points from. I'll see when they put the times up if I did enough.

I did put a minute and a half into the guy who started two minutes ahead of me though. He showed up on a Cervelo P3 with a Zipp disc, TT helmet, the works.

It turned out quite an eventful evening for me. I got chased by a Rottweiler while warming up (I'm not kidding and its the second time in about six months I've been chased by one), forgot to bring lights for the journey home and then came close to bonking on my way home. I owe a debt of gratitude to Dan from Orwell who sheparded me back into town on his light bedecked bike and gave me all his food.

xz

I have my first TT next Thursday, 7.5 miles, so I have been reading this thread with great interest

zzzzzzzz

My Name is Mario wrote: »

Hi Aidan,
I figured you headed on home alright. Not the night for standing around. The weather was fierce nasty.

26.58 for me. I was a bit disappointed as I thought I was capable of much better, but I think I overdid it on the training in the past few days. I felt lousy all day and didn't really settle in to it once I got going. I also did a lot of stupid stuff such as ride on the hoods way too much because I just didn't feel comfortable. I was targetting this one as one I could probably get points from. I'll see when they put the times up if I did enough.

I did put a minute and a half into the guy who started two minutes ahead of me though. He showed up on a Cervelo P3 with a Zipp disc, TT helmet, the works.

It turned out quite an eventful evening for me. I got chased by a Rottweiler while warming up (I'm not kidding and its the second time in about six months I've been chased by one), forgot to bring lights for the journey home and then came close to bonking on my way home. I owe a debt of gratitude to Dan from Orwell who sheparded me back into town on his light bedecked bike and gave me all his food.

I reckon you'll be in with a shout in the DMS next week as well.

Was starting to get dark by the time I finished - it must've been dark before the end of it. How many people turned up?

Did anyone on boards make it out to the race last week? Must've been a short enough race with it getting dark and all.

Chips Lovell

aidan.offbeat wrote: »

I reckon you'll be in with a shout in the DMS next week as well.

Was starting to get dark by the time I finished - it must've been dark before the end of it. How many people turned up?

And how long was the race last week? Must've been short enough

I think the weather made it even darker. One of the guys who finished after me had his lights on.

Not sure if I'll be in contention next week. The Brittas circut is a bit lumpy for me.

I think there was around 40 out last night. Not bad considering the weather.

zzzzzzzz

My Name is Mario wrote: »

I think the weather made it even darker. One of the guys who finished after me had his lights on.

Not sure if I'll be in contention next week. The Brittas circut is a bit lumpy for me.

I think there was around 40 out last night. Not bad considering the weather.

It's a bit lumpy alright but if it stays together you'll hammer us in a sprint I reckon.

blorg

aidan.offbeat wrote: »

Did anyone on boards make it out to the race last week?

I was marshalling, think I saw smithslist. Race started on time (quite a few guys arrived late, it was very windy.) Was over before it got dark.

Chips Lovell

Who does Smithlist ride for?

smithslist

I was marshalling, think I saw smithslist. Race started on time (quite a few guys arrived late, it was very windy.) Was over before it got dark.

yeah that was me, i was delayed at the start and the scratch started ahead of me so i was chasing them down for the 2 laps.

Good marshaling work Blorg

There was 41 riders for the TT last nite, I did around 25'20ish, anyone know the winners time?

Raam

What kind of warm ups do folk do before these while waiting around? I was trying to actually stay warm as it was freezing, for me anyway. Do you put in a few hard efforts to get the heart pumping or just keep it ticking over?

Lumen

What's the level of equipment like at these TTs?

i.e. proportion of standard road bikes, road bikes with clip-on aerobars, TT bikes.

zzzzzzzz

Lumen wrote: »

What's the level of equipment like at these TTs?

i.e. proportion of standard road bikes, road bikes with clip-on aerobars, TT bikes.

There were a few TT bikes around alright, and a couple of clip-on aero bars but I'd say the vast majority were on standard road bikes.

Someone said to me the other day that more than half the field at the Gorey TT last weekend were on standard bikes.

LDB

Lumen wrote: »

What's the level of equipment like at these TTs?

i.e. proportion of standard road bikes, road bikes with clip-on aerobars, TT bikes.

I think only two at my TT had the full TT bike. Majority were on road bikes and just adjust the set up accordingly.

Raam

Lumen wrote: »

What's the level of equipment like at these TTs?

i.e. proportion of standard road bikes, road bikes with clip-on aerobars, TT bikes.

I think there was one chap with tri bars at the Swords one. The course wasn't suitable for a typical TT bike.
Everyone had regular road bikes.

smithslist

Raam wrote: »

The course wasn't suitable for a typical TT bike.
Everyone had regular road bikes.

one person from Orwell crashed out due to not able to control the TT bike on the course, person was ok at the finish but with the twisting circuit and wind it was extra difficult to control the bike.

Lumen

Cool. I read some accounts of TTs in the UK and US where almost everyone turns up on hard core machinery, which makes it a bit difficult to compare times if you're on a standard road bike.

Chips Lovell

smithslist wrote: »

I did around 25'20ish, anyone know the winners time?

Nice time. I checked the sheet when I finished and the fastest time then I think was over 23 minutes. A few fast guys finished after me though.

Raam wrote: »

What kind of warm ups do folk do before these while waiting around? I was trying to actually stay warm as it was freezing, for me anyway. Do you put in a few hard efforts to get the heart pumping or just keep it ticking over?

I basically just kept riding until it was nearly time to start, up and down the road. I put in a hard effort when that bloody dog chased me I can tell you.

Lumen wrote: »

What's the level of equipment like at these TTs?

i.e. proportion of standard road bikes, road bikes with clip-on aerobars, TT bikes.

It's a bit of a mix. The scratch guys and a few others will usually show up on TT rigs with disc wheels. Then its a mix of ordinary road bikes or people using clip-ons and/or aero helmets. I meant to get clip-ons myself but left it too late.

smithslist wrote: »

one person from Orwell crashed out due to not able to control the TT bike on the course, person was ok at the finish but with the twisting circuit and wind it was extra difficult to control the bike.

Yikes. Didn't hear about that. I actually went slower than I did in the 25 mile TT last year. Circuirt was way more technical and a bit hillier.

Junior

Best advice I was given regarding a TT is let the pain come to you. You should head out at near max, and it should feel easy, you should be thinking that you can go harder, but don't, keep the pace level and high it's on the turn that you need to feel that pain coming to you.

smithslist

My Name is Mario wrote: »

Nice time. I checked the sheet when I finished and the fastest time then I think was over 23 minutes. A few fast guys finished after me though.

Thanks, had no chance of winning from the start, but its good to know wat was the winning time.

Lumen wrote: »

Cool. I read some accounts of TTs in the UK and US where almost everyone turns up on hard core machinery, which makes it a bit difficult to compare times if you're on a standard road bike.

Over in the uk is crazy, there more into TT than here, look at their history of riders boardman and g.obree.

pgibbo

Esroh wrote: »

Well I followed your advice.Warmed up well,Got up to what felt like max !!!!. And just tried to keep it up
28.46 big improvment on this time last year 32.35
For a fella who only 2 years on the go and regards Biker Joe as a young fella I quite chuffed

Well done Eshroh. A few mates of mine were racing that last night. Do you know if the results are posted anywhere or what the winning time was? It's just a tad too far to get to for me from work in Galway on a weekday. The likes of these races must really stand to folks when it comes to triathlons.

Shame there doesn't seem to be anything similar in Galway.

Chips Lovell

smithslist wrote: »

Over in the uk is crazy, there more into TT than here, look at their history of riders boardman and g.obree.

There's a real tradition of time trialling in the UK because for years road racing was banned by the police. Indeed, I saw recently that they are still having problems, with a few big races recently closed down by the cops.

Raam

My Name is Mario wrote: »

There's a real tradition of time trialling in the UK because for years road racing was banned by the police. Indeed, I saw recently that they are still having problems, with a few big races recently closed down by the cops.

That's a good time you got at your TT Tonto/Mario.

I've only been half following this thing with the UK. Is it on the grounds of safety that they are unwilling to give permission or is it to do with cost?

lukester

My Name is Mario wrote: »

..for years road racing was banned by the police. ...they are still having problems, with a few big races recently closed down by the cops.

Why?

Chips Lovell

Raam wrote: »

I've only been half following this thing with the UK. Is it on the grounds of safety that they are unwilling to give permission or is it to do with cost?

I'm not intimately acquainted with the issue myself, but as far as I can see it is just differing attitudes by law enforcement. The cops here and on the continent see racing a worthwhile sporting activity that justifies minor traffic disruption. Indeed, you'll often see the police themselves helping out at cycling events. In the UK they traditionally been far less tolerant.

I read that the recent race cancellations were down to riders drifting onto the right hand side of the road during some earlier races.

lukester

My Name is Mario wrote: »

as far as I can see it is just differing attitudes by law enforcement. The cops here and on the continent see racing a worthwhile sporting activity that justifies minor traffic disruption. Indeed, you'll often see the police themselves helping out at cycling events. In the UK they traditionally been far less tolerant.

I read that the recent race cancellations were down to riders drifting onto the right hand side of the road during some earlier races.

That's depressing. I used to live in the UK, and the cops there are a lot more anal.

smithslist

My Name is Mario wrote: »

I read that the recent race cancellations were down to riders drifting onto the right hand side of the road during some earlier races.

must congratulate the work they do here within Ireland for it, fair play to them.

My Name is Mario wrote: »

I read that the recent race cancellations were down to riders drifting onto the right hand side of the road during some earlier races.

Happens sometimes here, we are lucky that its not enforced more here. But some races we are warned that if you do cross the white line u are disqualified.

zzzzzzzz

My Name is Mario wrote: »

I'm not intimately acquainted with the issue myself, but as far as I can see it is just differing attitudes by law enforcement. The cops here and on the continent see racing a worthwhile sporting activity that justifies minor traffic disruption. Indeed, you'll often see the police themselves helping out at cycling events. In the UK they traditionally been far less tolerant.

I read that the recent race cancellations were down to riders drifting onto the right hand side of the road during some earlier races.

I was reading about that in the UK alright.

The minor traffic disruptions are tollerated over here a lot more than over in the UK alright - with the exception being the Phoenix park races.

From what I hear it's becoming increasingly difficult in recent years to get permission to close the road for the races in the summer. Is it really that difficult for motorists to go around the park?

zzzzzzzz

lukester wrote: »

That's depressing. I used to live in the UK, and the cops there are a lot more anal.

In fairness, the English nation as a whole is a lot more anal. They love their rules, they do.

No offense intended, btw.

some of their rules are great - for example standing to the right on escalators!

biker_joe

it's funny that the Park, which was given to the "People Of Dublin" for leisure use, is not allowed be used for Sports, because of Motorists !! I say ban cars from the Park altogether !!
I have raced in the park numerous times and there is nothing like it ! ( except the Stephen Roche Crit ) and it's such as shame that they can't run them again !
Also it would be a great place to run a TT along the ave ? has there ever been a TT run there ?

Biker Joe.

Lumen

aidan.offbeat wrote: »

In fairness, the English nation as a whole is a lot more anal. They love their rules, they do.

Judging by the number and tone of helmet/RLJ/footpath threads on this forum, I must beg to differ.

Chips Lovell

The roads are in a state in the Park at the moment. Was tempted to take a few photos last night. You wouldn't believe some of the potholes.

zzzzzzzz

biker_joe wrote: »

it's funny that the Park, which was given to the "People Of Dublin" for leisure use, is not allowed be used for Sports, because of Motorists !! I say ban cars from the Park altogether !!
I have raced in the park numerous times and there is nothing like it ! ( except the Stephen Roche Crit ) and it's such as shame that they can't run them again !
Also it would be a great place to run a TT along the ave ? has there ever been a TT run there ?

Biker Joe.

It's gas alright - they should just level it and build a shopping centre if they're not going to let people use it. IT'S A PARK, not the m50!!

smithslist

biker_joe wrote: »

I have raced in the park numerous times and there is nothing like it ! ( except the Stephen Roche Crit ) and it's such as shame that they can't run them again !

+1, am missing them as they were a great event, they were tough thou. Remember the last stage of the RAS used to be held there.

biker_joe wrote: »

Also it would be a great place to run a TT along the ave ? has there ever been a TT run there ?

Good q, I dont think there has being and dont remember it ever happing.

ROK ON

I live just outside the park and would welcome any traffic restrictions in the park. Castleknock is a nightmare at evening rushhour as cars clog up the entry and exit to the park.

Big issue is that for folks who live in Carpenerstown/Porterstown/CLonsilla, they really have only two ways of driving home from town (via Chapelizod Hill or Via the Park and castleknock). Until other roads are widened (eg Chapelizod/Navan Road/Castleknock) then the most effective drive home route is via the park.

As for TT's in the park, the road in Chesterfield avenue is in a bad way, as is the road behind the zoo adjacent to Blackhorse avenue. There are craters, as opposed to potholes in many sections.
I cycle thru the park every day nearly, and it is hard at commuting pace, it would be lethal at 40km/h +.

biker_joe

lets get the CARS OUT and RE-TARMAC ........... this country is a poxy Joke !:mad:

Biker Joe

Anger vented for today anyways !:mad:

72hundred

The one and only 10 mile TT that I did was in Limerick the day before the huge flooding last summer. Time was 25.48

It was €10 for each TT, and they were on weekly. Is the normal charge?

zzzzzzzz

The times from the Batterstown TT are up on the usher site:

http://www.irishroadclub.com/

Chips Lovell

2nd for me. Looks like you were 3rd. The winner in our group put in a savage time: 25.11

zzzzzzzz

My Name is Mario wrote: »

2nd for me. Looks like you were 3rd. The winner in our group put in a savage time: 25.11

Really? Out of how many, 3? :pac: Don't have excel on this computer...

Chips Lovell

aidan.offbeat wrote: »

Really? Out of how many, 3? :pac: Don't have excel on this computer...

Nope. 8 people from our category were racing last night.