Obama 1.... Pirates 0

norbert64

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7996087.stm

there may be a slight rankle that ''certain folk'' could exploit though, namely

US forces apparently took advantage of the fact one of the pirates was negotiating on the USS Bainbridge when the incident happened.

O'Coonassa

The Pirates took another Yank vessel yesterday me hearties. I think that puts them ahead again. Who are people rooting for in all of this? Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

Manic Moran

"Obama?" Not "US Navy?"

It seems to me that the local team on the spot took advantage of an opportunity as opposed to having received a 'Go' from NCA.

NTM

Lirange

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Rag-tag band of half starved Africans

Given the loot they've been hauling off I'm sure they can afford a sandwich.

O'Coonassa

Lirange wrote: »

Given the loot they've been hauling off I'm sure they can afford a sandwich.

Mmmm maize meal and sorghum sangwiches. Delicious.

Latchy

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Who are people rooting for in all of this? Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

Why cant those rag tag half starved africans buy a lotto ticket like everybody else instead of blaguarding everybody ?

Lirange

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Mmmm maize meal and sorghum sangwiches. Delicious.

Or the fish market in Mogadishu.

silverharp

an amusing peace I came across


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=102961315


NPR.org, April 10, 2009 · Pirates are getting a bad rep. Every month we hear more news of the Somali pirates' depredations, most recently involving an attack on an American crew. To be sure, these pirates deserve our condemnation. They're thugs and the world would be better without them.

But we shouldn't let our condemnation of modern pirates spill over, unchecked, onto their more colorful, and socially contributory, early 18th-century forefathers. These Caribbean pirates, men like Blackbeard, "Black Bart" Roberts, and "Calico" Jack Rackam, were also watery thieves. But unlike their Somali successors, they didn't only take something out of the world. They gave the world something of value, too.

Historical pirates were harbingers of some of contemporary civilization's most cherished values, such as liberty, democracy and social safety. At a time when the legitimate world's favored system of government was unconstrained monarchy, Caribbean pirates were practicing constitutional democracy. Before setting sail each would-be pirate crew drew up and agreed to a set of written rules that governed them. These rules regulated gambling, smoking, drinking, the adjudication of conflicts and, in some cases, even prohibited harassing members of the fairer sex.

Pirate constitutions established democratic governance for their roguish commonwealths. Crewmembers elected their captains by popular vote and democratically removed captains who dared to misuse their power. Because of this surprising system, far from tyrannical, the average 18th-century pirate captain was a dutiful, elected executor of his constituents' will.

Pirates understood what James Madison pointed out in the Federalist Papers: that the most important check on leaders' use of power is society's ability to select them. Pirates recognized this, and implemented it, more than half a century before Madison put pen to paper.

Pirates created an early system of social insurance and enshrined this in their law. Sea dogs injured on the job received workers' compensation from the crew's common purse — five pieces of eight for the loss of an arm, 10 pieces of eight for the loss of a leg, and so on. A maimed pirate didn't have to worry about a work-sustained injury leaving him without a bottle of rum to spit in.

Pirates also embraced racial tolerance well before their legitimate counterparts. Centuries before the civil rights movement, the ACLU, or the Equal Opportunity Act, some pirates already had adopted a policy of hiring black sailors in their crews. England didn't abolish slavery until 1772. In the United States slavery persisted until 1865, and blacks didn't enjoy equal rights as citizens, politically or in the workplace, until even later than this. Some pirates, however, extended suffrage to their black crewmembers and subscribed to the practice of "equal pay for equal work," or rather, "equal pay for equal prey," in the early 1700s.

Modern pirates can't lay claim to helping pioneer liberty, democracy and equality. But early 18th-century pirates can. In this way, historical sea scoundrels contributed something to the world worth as much as, and possibly even more than, what they took out. So go ahead, say "arrgh!," "avast!" and "shiver me timbers" without guilt. It's OK to impersonate, and even praise, pirates.

Peter Leeson is an economics professor at George Mason University and author of The Invisible Hook: The Hidden Economics or Pirates.

O'Coonassa

silverharp wrote: »

Modern pirates can't lay claim to helping pioneer liberty, democracy and equality.

LOL so they've already got all those things in Somalia have they? A pirate is a pirate me hearties, and good luck to them!

SeanW

O'Coonassa wrote: »

The Pirates took another Yank vessel yesterday me hearties. I think that puts them ahead again. Who are people rooting for in all of this? Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

I'm sure your fine words will come as cold comfort to the victim-crews on those ships - and their next of kin!

O'Coonassa

SeanW wrote: »

I'm sure your fine words will come as cold comfort to the victim-crews on those ships - and their next of kin!

AFAIK all the killing has been done by the anti-Greenpeace terrorists and the Yanks in order to avoid paying the ransom.

SeanW

Bless your innocence - you do realise there's no such thing as "the" ransom? Every ransom payment only teaches the pirates that they can easily get money this way, and finances further hostage takings?

Congratulations to those Navy snipers :pac: it's the only way to deal with hostage takers.

Nodin

SeanW wrote: »

I'm sure your fine words will come as cold comfort to the victim-crews on those ships - and their next of kin!

Well "relatives". No hostages have been killed up to this point, thankfully.

SeanW

Nodin wrote: »

Well "relatives". No hostages have been killed up to this point, thankfully.

It's only a matter of time ...

allthedoyles

I believe these Somali chaps killed by US snipers were aged 17-19 . They probably have been using guns , since early childhood .

Something has to be done to protect these ships , on the high seas .

The only 'defence weapon ' that the ships crew have at present are water hoses !

Lirange

What about the French fella that lost his life?

Pics of hijackers with French hostages here

Died in front of his wife and young child.

the_syco

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

Would this be the "rag-tag band of half starved Africans" who already have gotten multi-million ransoms, fine houses, cars, better weapons, etc? So you think they won't get some decent food before they buy the nice house?

lostexpectation

so whats obama going to do about somalia

Overheal

...nothing?

They will know not to fcuk with a US Vessel now though.

O'Coonassa

the_syco wrote: »

Would this be the "rag-tag band of half starved Africans" who already have gotten multi-million ransoms, fine houses, cars, better weapons, etc? So you think they won't get some decent food before they buy the nice house?

You think there is just one crew of pirates? What are fine houses and cars and better security (new weapons) in such a country? Do you know how cheaply you could build the finest house you ever imagined in Africa? I do not know what decent food there is on the horn of Africa, some chicken or some beef if you are lucky and have money perhaps.

Manic Moran

Overheal wrote: »

...nothing?

They will know not to fcuk with a US Vessel now though.

In fairness, I don't really see the difference between this instance and the two prior instances when the French went in. Despite the deaths of pirates on both previous occasions, they still hijacked a third ship, resulting in the deaths of even more pirates and a hostage.

Do you know how cheaply you could build the finest house you ever imagined in Africa? I do not know what decent food there is on the horn of Africa, some chicken or some beef if you are lucky and have money perhaps.

Probably lamb, caviar and lobster. It's one of the strange anachronisms that no matter how dire the situation of any country is, be it mass starvation through outright civil war, there is always a small portion of rich people, frequently warlords, who somehow seem to maintain a certain standard of living, even if it means escorting the lamb in from the airport with a convoy of five Technicals mounted with heavy machineguns.

NTM

Victor

O'Coonassa wrote: »

The Pirates took another Yank vessel yesterday me hearties. I think that puts them ahead again. Who are people rooting for in all of this? Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

This would come across so much better if they weren't taking food aid.

Nodin wrote: »

Well "relatives". No hostages have been killed up to this point, thankfully.

Yes, there have. You would have noted this if you actually bothered to read the article.

Manic Moran wrote: »

Probably lamb, caviar and lobster. It's one of the strange anachronisms that no matter how dire the situation of any country is, be it mass starvation through outright civil war, there is always a small portion of rich people, frequently warlords, who somehow seem to maintain a certain standard of living, even if it means escorting the lamb in from the airport with a convoy of five Technicals mounted with heavy machineguns.

Now, to be fair, Mugabe had to resort to jam-jars when they ran out of fine China during the war in Zimbabwe.

O'Coonassa

Lirange wrote: »

What about the French fella that lost his life?

Pics of hijackers with French hostages here

Died in front of his wife and young child.

Defence Minister Herve Morin acknowledged that it could have been a French bullet that killed Florent Lemacon. If they're admitting that 'it could have been' then it almost certainly was.

Lirange

O'Coonassa wrote: »

If they're admitting that 'it could have been' then it almost certainly was.

Why?

O'Coonassa

Lirange wrote: »

Why?

If the pirates had killed the man you'd have heard all about it by now incessantly. Just look how the French behaved when they murdered Fernando Pireira, with all the denials and truth twisting it took 20 years for Mitterand to fess up about his involvement.

Lirange

Or they could have just lied in the first place.

congo_90

O'Coonassa wrote: »

The Pirates took another Yank vessel yesterday me hearties. I think that puts them ahead again. Who are people rooting for in all of this? Rag-tag band of half starved Africans or multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests?

multi-billion dollar corporate shipping interests ftw.
they probably delivered the screen your reading this on. Damn "half starved africans". Really not our problem but i'm not debating that. My point is we need a better point and shoot policy. Kill the crims- leave the innocents.

O'Coonassa

Lirange wrote: »

Or they could have just lied in the first place.

I'm pretty sure if their gung-ho actions had accidentally wiped out the rest of the witnesses that's exactly what they would have done.

Lirange

Should the wife of the victim state such then you'll be proven correct. Otherwise it's speculation tailored to your slant.

Overheal

Jon finally catches up last night:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=223909&title=the-buc-stops-here

Johnnyjump

These pirates deserve a right fright. Hope they get more than they bargained for.

Pocono Joe

Good old Republican Representative Ron Paul has an answer to the pirate situation (and would probably be cheaper than if the government took action). Utilize a little-known congressional power using the letters of marque and reprisal, a power written into the Constitution that allows the United States to hire private citizens to keep international waters safe. It was used heavily during the Revolutionary War and the War of 1812. Letters of marque serve as official warrants from the government, allowing privateers to seize or destroy enemies, their loot and their vessels in exchange for bounty money. (But… The letters also require would-be thrill seekers to post a bond promising to abide by international rules of war.)

CALLING ALL PRIVATEERS! (does anybody else see a new reality show in this?)

Black Swan

US Navy 2, Pirates 0

Source: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-pirates_15apr15,0,3401260.story

lostexpectation

Victor wrote: »

This would come across so much better if they weren't taking food aid.

food aid or guaranteed payment surplus dumping?

Lirange

lostexpectation wrote: »

food aid or guaranteed payment surplus dumping?

Food aid.