Mustang.. should I, shouldn't I?

doubtfir3

I've been interested in restoring a car fir a number of years and am (finally!) at a point where I can start to plan properly for it.

My ideal car would be a mustang - the 1967 Fastback could be the favourite, but I was wondering if I could get some opinions on whether or not I should go ahead with it.

I know that many people advise a Beetle or Mini as a first car, but I like to aim high and am prepared to spend 2 years working on this if needed - I want to do as much of the work as I can myself so am more than prepared to stick with it for the long haul!

Opinions and/or advice appreciated.

Thanks

Gary ITR

doubtfir3 wrote: »

I've been interested in restoring a car fir a number of years and am (finally!) at a point where I can start to plan properly for it.

My ideal car would be a mustang - the 1967 Fastback could be the favourite, but I was wondering if I could get some opinions on whether or not I should go ahead with it.

I know that many people advise a Beetle or Mini as a first car, but I like to aim high and am prepared to spend 2 years working on this if needed - I want to do as much of the work as I can myself so am more than prepared to stick with it for the long haul!

Opinions and/or advice appreciated.

Thanks

How handy are you? If you already know your way around an engine and are good with a welder then go ahead. Thing is a mistake on a '67 Mustang would be far more costly than on a Beetle/Mini

doubtfir3

I know a certain amount but would be very far from an expert I fear

I am quite handy, and like working on projects so think I would enjoy it and perhaps most importantly am not afraid to admit when I'm beaten and will look for assistance.

The beetle might be a better option, but I think I'll do a little more research first and will see what is around!

Thanks

gunhappy_ie

what do you think of ford capris ? They sort of have that look but go for handy money. Mate of mine has 2 sittin in has garden in need of a little repair. 1 standard and the other has uprated big brakes and a 2.1 pinto that is pushin some nice power.

PaulK_CCI

I sell/import classic cars into Ireland, and to be honest, restoring a car always turns out to be far more complex and costly than initially thought. Sure it sounds tempting to pick up a car for little money, spend a winter on it and then take it out to shows and have people admiring it, but the reality is that the cost of restoration nearly always is double what you had initially anticipated. and usually involves a lot!!!! more work. The other reality is that you would end up with a car, that generally is not on par with a professionally restored example and usually there are still lots of things to be done/not right.

A 67 Fastback is a nice thought, but make no mistake, a Salvageable but needing total restoration 67/68 Fastback project car is still going to set you back 10+ PLUS!!!! I know, because I sell properly restored Fastbacks, and Mustangs that need a bit of TLC. Even the ones with TLC will be 20+ plus, even after the credit crunch

So if you're still keen on restoring a car, go for a car that is as good as it can be, needing more TLC rather than restoration. It's a lot more gratifying and positive, than finding out the one horror after the other if you go for a complete restoration project. Too many people have tried before, and gave up somewhere half way...

S.I.R

having done some research in the American market...


10K gets you a nice 65/69 mustang ( minus import costs, vrt, importing company charges, interior, nice wheels, but fundamentally its a mustang )


learn welding first before you think of restoring anything... its almost Always vital.

dr_gonza_attorney

its true what people are saying about the costs
you could calculate the cost of a classic car and multiply it by 4 or 8 times to actually get it on the road.
do you have a garage well ventelated and plenty of workin space.
spare parts cost a fortune
it makes more sence finantially to buy a car already restored plus were in a recession but the old mustangs still seem to hold thier value

Johnboy Mac

PaulK_CCI wrote: »

restoring a car always turns out to be far more complex and costly than initially thought.

but the reality is that the cost of restoration nearly always is double what you had initially anticipated. and usually involves a lot!!!! more work. The other reality is that you would end up with a car, that generally is not on par with a professionally restored example and usually there are still lots of things to be done/not right.


quote]

+1

Oh, so very true.

The old saying is: ''buy the very best you can afford''

Buy a solid, straight & complete car that may only require general servicing and light/minor repairs and say a repaint. Thus the car is a driver straight off and paint work can be carried out by a professional when time & money allow. This way you can spread costs. Look at importing from the U.S.. Some shabby classics there with faded paint but complete and rust free. See Ebay. You also my get a holiday out of too.

doubtfir3

OK, thanks for the advice and comments.

I certainly realise that this could be a 20k project but also realise that maybe I don't have the skills required to properly complete this project.. yet

I guess its worth considering a "tlc" car which I can work with rather than a complete rebuild as you suggested Paul - thanks for the advice.

Based on my desire to still work on restoring a car, what would peoples advice be for a "first car"?

I still want the mustang, but guess that will be on my list - just not the one I'll restore.

mustang68

doubtfir3 wrote: »

I still want the mustang, but guess that will be on my list - just not the one I'll restore.

Good idea I think, I drive a solid 68 and keeping it on the road and sorting out the minor things is tricky, parts arrive quick from the US but we have no access to 2nd hand scrap parts here and its a killer. Get something that you can find parts here or in the UK. MGs, beetles etc.

gstonesmx5

Small and British built I think would be the way forward as a first car. Lots of them for sale at the minute. You could get one in need of some tlc, work on it and keep or sell it next year. You then get the experience and the fun out of it and are ready for the next car on your list (the mustang). On the other side you could find out you think restoration work is a load of pants and that you want a finished car from someone or that fishing is more your thing but at least you had a go.

Best of luck with the decision.

PaulK_CCI

doubtfir3 wrote: »

OK, thanks for the advice and comments.

I certainly realise that this could be a 20k project but also realise that maybe I don't have the skills required to properly complete this project.. yet

I guess its worth considering a "tlc" car which I can work with rather than a complete rebuild as you suggested Paul - thanks for the advice.

Based on my desire to still work on restoring a car, what would peoples advice be for a "first car"?

I still want the mustang, but guess that will be on my list - just not the one I'll restore.

I would definitely advise you not to sink your teeth in a project like a Fastback. From a Restoration point of view, a Mustang is a reasonably easy project, with almost ALL components available off the shelf, for reasonable prices, and mechanics, running gear, is simple, straightforward and not too complicated!!! However, strangely enough, the "Fastback" is about double the value of a Coupe, whereas the car is, apart fromt the tapering roofline, otherwise completely the same!! So engines, suspension, interior components, etc are identical. A reasonable to ok project Coupe, needing TLC is about 9-12k, with project cars for full restoration around around 5-9k. So if that budget sits about right, a Mustang Coupe wouldn't be too bad a choice to restore, and once you've managed to get some practice on the coupe, you could venture on a Fastback and 'not make the same mistakes again, that you made on the coupe' ...

Personally I wouldn't waste too much time in looking at the US, unless you have good contacts and opportunties to check cars out/have them checked out. A car advertised as needing a TLC is very easily a Full blown restoration, and you need someone expert to make sure it is what it is made out to be. I know a lot of people in the trade, and to be honest, the best of the bunch is usually always creamed off for the trade. At the moment, there is usually plenty of cars around here in Europe for reasonable prices (if you consider cars coming from US are liable for VAT and Import duties!!!), ranging from perfect cars to project cars...

Abelloid

Beetle might be the easiest - you can lift the body off the chassis and remove the engine and gearbox without even drafting mates in to help.

Parts are very easy to find, and most are cheap.

..but it's no match for a Mustang.

corktina

if you are happy with your skill levels and depth of pocket....then DO IT!

I cant think of much better than a Ford with a V8 (unless its a Big Mac.:)..)

Sids Not

TBH..if you have to ask then i think you know the answer by now....Having said that, if its your first project and you have a shed load of money ,you'll probably make a better job of it than some "old hands" might...parts will have to be sourced from the uk or states, theres lots of clubs/forums and i've found most guys are sound and willing to share their know-how....If youre handy with tools thats a good start..plenty of owners ,classic or new out there who dont have a clue about their cars....at least if you do all/most work yourself you can be proud of that fact..trial and error make the world go 'round .....DO IT....;)
If you dont go for the 'stang you'll regret wasting all your time and effort for a car that you dont really want...

doubtfir3

Sids Not wrote: »

TBH..if you have to ask then i think you know the answer by now....Having said that, if its your first project and you have a shed load of money ,you'll probably make a better job of it than some "old hands" might...parts will have to be sourced from the uk or states, theres lots of clubs/forums and i've found most guys are sound and willing to share their know-how....If youre handy with tools thats a good start..plenty of owners ,classic or new out there who dont have a clue about their cars....at least if you do all/most work yourself you can be proud of that fact..trial and error make the world go 'round .....DO IT....;)
If you dont go for the 'stang you'll regret wasting all your time and effort for a car that you dont really want...

Its really heartening to get advice like this.. I would be happy to work on something else, but of course would always "WANT" the mustang instead.. but of course have seen your site Paul and your auctions on carzone etc so can only bow to the master on this also..

I can certainly see your comments and words of caution.. last thing I want to do is mess up a more expensive build.. but in the back of my head is that fact that I'd be so proud of work done on my mustang too.

I think I'll go visit the classic car show in April and will have a bit more of a nose around before I take a leap!

The beetle does sound tempting though as an initial tester car..

hmmm..

airnwater

How about this ?



http://www.carzone.ie/search/Ford/Mustang/Fastback/200911192097717/advert



A clean Mustang at a Beetle price & with Beetle fuel economy...

ready to go without all that graft !

Kevin_Herron

I remember this car from when it used to be parked on Drumcondra Road beside the Skylon Hotel.

Its a cracking car. Spotless inside and out.
And an excellent first time yank.

carchaeologist

Sids Not wrote: »

If you dont go for the 'stang you'll regret wasting all your time and effort for a car that you dont really want...

This is important,you have to want it to keep the enthusiasm going..bit like a woman really..if shes not your type you will lose interest,no matter how much time you spend underneath her!!:p

Sids Not

carchaeologist wrote: »

This is important,you have to want it to keep the enthusiasm going..bit like a woman really..if shes not your type you will lose interest,no matter how much time you spend underneath her!!:p

True..but you can spend more time fettling her to make her the way You want her....but you'll always look at other models and wonder "what if.."..:)

gstonesmx5

Sids Not wrote: »

True..but you can spend more time fettling her to make her the way You want her....but you'll always look at other models and wonder "what if.."..:)

Two classic quotes, well done.

If you want a fastback and thats all then thats all that will do then go for it. We spend long enough working and getting cash together that we should be able to spend it on what we want without guilt or fear of what if.. . If we cock up and and buy the wrong car its our own fault but we can get over it. All it means is we have work at it to get it the way we want it.

Stuff the recession Grrrrrr. Ok rant over, I feel so much better now.

In brief GET THE STANG.

MercMad

There is a lot of wisdom, advice and encouragement in the above posts.

Personally if you do not posses welding and paintwork skill and equipment, and dont have several years of patience then I would advise anyone against a full resto.

A Mustang is a simple car to work on with a huge parts network, I wouldn't be put off just because its a large Yank V8. If you want a Mustang then a Beetle wont tick the box.

Maybe you should settle for a less than perfect car, one that can be improved upon whilst being enjoyed, and avoid the thought that you must have it "perfect".

You can always change it if you see the Fastback of your dreams and can purchase it.

Tke the plunge, what can go wrong ?? Just decide on a budget, stick to it, buy the car with the best bodywork/bodywork history and do the mechanicals yourself. I would avoid eBay cars unless you can inspect prior to purchase.

Personally I would buy the best Coupe I could instead of a rusted Fastback.

knipex

I had the same dream and have restored a couple of cars and kit cars.

Every single time I swear never again and 12 months after finishing I buy another resto project.

If you can mig weld (and I mean mig weld 0.8m sheet metal not heavy steel work then go for it.

If not then buy a welder (get a small Clarke unit something like the TE150 on gas with a bottle of argosheild, lovely little welder, cheap and easy to get parts for. Buy a couple of cheap spurious panels from a motor factors and get practicing. Buy an autodarkening helmet (you can get a decent one for around €80), a decent pair of gloves and overalls, a spare roll of 0.6mm wire, and a handful of shrouds and tips.. Join a mig welding forum like http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/

If you are not able to weld and have no bodyshop experience then start smaller. Mini's are fun to work on and easy but unlikely to be your taste.

Try a Capri, similar to Mustang, can be got cheap, parts are plentiful and if you make a balls of it then you have not thrown away a big lump of cash. Get to know a bodyshop, ask questions. The alternative (and the way i went) buy a good(ish) Westfield or other quality kit car. They can be got cheap, you can have fun driving them and then start upgrading and learning.

It will frustrate the hell out of you but the satisfaction you get when you are driving a car you rebuilt is fantastic.

Its a great hobby but addictive and expensive. You will not make your money back when you sell.

Sids Not

Example here..£10,000..You can see from the ad that there needs (fairly) serious cutting and welding, so if you're after a car for around that price ,expect to do this kinda work to it....anything less, and looks like a bargain..walk away...;)

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/963328.htm

Big Nasty

airnwater wrote: »

How about this ?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Ford/Mustang/Fastback/200911192097717/advert

A clean Mustang at a Beetle price & with Beetle fuel economy...

ready to go without all that graft !

Are you kidding me lads? That's not a muscle car! :eek:

Big Nasty

Sids Not wrote: »

Example here..£10,000..You can see from the ad that there needs (fairly) serious cutting and welding, so if you're after a car for around that price ,expect to do this kinda work to it....anything less, and looks like a bargain..walk away...;)

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/963328.htm

That's more like it - I've seen much worse resto projects. Would be a decent buy at £8.5 / £9k, and only because it's a fastback. I wouldn't pay £4k for a coupe in similar condition.

Kevin_Herron

MCMLXXV wrote: »

Are you kidding me lads? That's not a muscle car! :eek:

I dont think anybody was talking about a muscle car??

And you strictly speaking your Trans Am isnt either!

Sids Not

Kevin_Herron wrote: »

I dont think anybody was talking about a muscle car??

And you strictly speaking your Trans Am isnt either!

MEEEEE..YOWWWWWW...:eek:

doubtfir3

Sids Not wrote: »

Example here..£10,000..You can see from the ad that there needs (fairly) serious cutting and welding, so if you're after a car for around that price ,expect to do this kinda work to it....anything less, and looks like a bargain..walk away...;)

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/963328.htm

I like that one alright.. I think I'm going to sit tight on this one for a short while - we're moving things around at work in preparation for a new building so will have plenty of space in the old warehouse once its done.

Think I'll do a little more research and hit some shows etc - will look at trying to get my hands on one in 2/3 months time.

Thanks for all the feedback though - greatly appreciated!

Big Nasty

Kevin_Herron wrote: »

I dont think anybody was talking about a muscle car??

And you strictly speaking your Trans Am isnt either!

Correct and right - she's a Pony!

Big Nasty

doubtfir3 wrote: »

I like that one alright.. I think I'm going to sit tight on this one for a short while - we're moving things around at work in preparation for a new building so will have plenty of space in the old warehouse once its done.

Think I'll do a little more research and hit some shows etc - will look at trying to get my hands on one in 2/3 months time.

Thanks for all the feedback though - greatly appreciated!

citywest show on this weekend dude - will be a few yank tanks there!

Sids Not

doubtfir3 wrote: »

we're moving things around at work in preparation for a new building so will have plenty of space in the old warehouse once its done.

Thanks for all the feedback though - greatly appreciated!

Any room in there for a small one matey....;);)

buttsoirl

this one.... http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/963328.htm

popped up on ebay about 4-5 weeks ago,.. I thought it looked like a nice car.. needed work but a runner.. I rang and spoke to the chap who brought it in from the states, very honest fella...... said the car needs a LOT of TLC.... and even though he was a welder it was too much for him. he said even down to the chassis legs are gone at the back.... he had those as extra's to be sold on... strangely enough the price of this car is the ebay price plus the extra body panels.... mmmm

methinks this is ye olde lemon