God says Kill your enemies!.

Sean Templar

Instead of all this piss ant turn the other cheek crap.Would not a more aggressive "jesus in the temple" type of christianity be the way to attract the youth.It seems to work for the muslims.I am currently reading the bible(quarter way through,its a long term project) and i am especially attracted to the old testiment kill all your enemies (god says)type senario ,women and children included.Now that the templar brotherhood have been exonerated(by papal decree),is it not time to revive their type of overt ,unapolagetic christianity.IE through military force protect christians,protect christian holy places and kill enimies of christ?.

Mena

Well this certainly could get interesting...

/popcorn

Soul Winner

Sean Templar wrote: »

Instead of all this piss ant turn the other cheek crap.Would not a more aggressive "jesus in the temple" type of christianity be the way to attract the youth.It seems to work for the muslims.I am currently reading the bible(quarter way through,its a long term project) and i am especially attracted to the old testiment kill all your enemies (god says)type senario ,women and children included.Now that the templar brotherhood have been exonerated(by papal decree),is it not time to revive their type of overt ,unapolagetic christianity.IE through military force protect christians,protect christian holy places and kill enimies of christ?.

In what way does it work for Muslims?

jhegarty

The crusades are over. Move on.

Fanny Cradock

You seem entirely miss Jesus' point if you distil part of his message as 'piss ant turn the other cheek crap'. We have had quite enough of Christendom, thank you very much.

CDfm

Sean Templar wrote: »

Instead of all this piss ant turn the other cheek crap.Would not a more aggressive "jesus in the temple" type of christianity be the way to attract the youth.It seems to work for the muslims.I am currently reading the bible(quarter way through,its a long term project) and i am especially attracted to the old testiment kill all your enemies (god says)type senario ,women and children included.Now that the templar brotherhood have been exonerated(by papal decree),is it not time to revive their type of overt ,unapolagetic christianity.IE through military force protect christians,protect christian holy places and kill enimies of christ?.

Christianity doesnt preach being a walkover. Neither does it preach wholesale slaughter.New covenant and all that.

I dont think you have to be apologetic to be a Christian but we are let down by some interest groups that portray us that way.

We are also let down by such interest groups - such as the Pro -Life movement that overly play the Catholic Card and exclude other religions and individuals that may wish to participate. We are not all Legion of Mary/Adoration Chapel Types so why stereotype.

Church sacraments -baptism,communion and confirmation are devalued by lax practices.

We dont defend the right to teach catholicism in Catholic schools.

We have become a Wussy pushover religion.

Burgo

Kill Em All Let God Sort Em Out!

:pac:

Fanny Cradock

If you have a point, Burgo, then make it.

Sean Templar

Soul Winner wrote: »

In what way does it work for Muslims?

Check out the web,see for youself,unprecedended numbers of young muslims are been attracted to jihad/holy war( yes i know jihad means struggle for gods cause :but only when it suits).British muslims are traveling to iraq to kill british soldiers.I am not getting at muslims,in case that's what you think this is about.I admire their strength of conviction,their willingness to fight and die for their religion.It seems to strike a cord with their youth.Our youth seem to be apathetic,listless,uninterested in their religion.Lets face it for a young male,give your brother christian a hug ,and lets be friends with the bastard trying to kill you does'nt really cut it.I'am saying lets be more "old testiment" ie:fight for our beliefs,protect our people and our religion.Kill our enimies,wipe the fcukers out like god told the jews to do to their enemies in the old testiment.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

Check out the web,see for youself,unprecedended numbers of young muslims are been attracted to jihad/holy war( yes i know jihad means struggle for gods cause :but only when it suits).British muslims are traveling to iraq to kill british soldiers.I am not getting at muslims,in case that's what you think this is about.I admire their strength of conviction,their willingness to fight and die for their religion.It seems to strike a cord with their youth.Our youth seem to be apathetic,listless,uninterested in their religion.Lets face it for a young male,give your brother christian a hug ,and lets be friends with the bastard trying to kill you does'nt really cut it.I'am saying lets be more "old testiment" ie:fight for our beliefs,protect our people and our religion.Kill our enimies,wipe the fcukers out like god told the jews to do to their enemies in the old testiment.

Mod Note
I gather that we are are all adults here, and I'm not especially precious when it comes to people uttering a few ****'s, but the manner in which you are doing it is unacceptable. Read the charter and stop cursing or you get infracted.


Ok, now that we have that out of the way, I honestly don't know where you are getting this rubbish from. Have you understood nothing of Jesus' message of love that runs throughout the NT?

Also, it would be great if you didn't try and sensationalise the actions of a handful of British Muslims, nor attempt to draw an parallels with the wider Islamic population.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

You seem entirely miss Jesus' point if you distil part of his message as 'piss ant turn the other cheek crap'. We have had quite enough of Christendom, thank you very much.

I read it(turn the other cheek) as don't go looking for trouble.But certainly the message i get so far from the old testiment,is do'nt bend over and take it up the ass either.Fight for God ,make no apologies,fight for your religion and kill the unbelievers.I know we can go all nancy and water everthing down in the bible,to lets be friends and dance into the sunset holding hands crap.All i'm saying is why not take it all the way as the jews did in the old testiment.Its not easy,its not popular,its not politically correct,so fcuking what ,lets do it!.Lets not apologise for our religion ,lets be more aggressive against our enemies ,as god told the jews to be in the old testiment.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Read the charter. Stop cursing or you get infracted.

I honestly don't know where you are getting this rubbish from. Have you understood nothing of Jesus' message of love?

Apologies but had already cursed before i read your post.
but in a way your post reinforces what i'am saying.
So what if i curse,it dose'nt mean i'am any less a christian than you.
Or that your interpetation of christianity is the right one.

Fanny Cradock

OK, let's do this the hard way. Have a yellow.

::Edit::

The warning was already issued before your apology. It's not going away now.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

Apologies but had already cursed before i read your post.
but in a way your post reinforces what i'am saying.
So what if i curse,it dose'nt mean i'am any less a christian than you.
Or that your interpetation of christianity is the right one.

If you break the charter you can then be infracted. It has nothing to do with me attempting to say that you are a bad Christian. However, I would seriously question if you really 'get it' when you start calling the precepts laid out by Christ (he is the important bit in Christianity don't ya know :pac:) as crap.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

OK, let's do this the hard way. Have a yellow.

As i said i had already posted before i saw your warning.I stopped cursing when i saw your warning.If your being fair you will remove it.Unless your taking what i said personally.Or is only your brand of christianity allowed?.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

As i said i had already posted before i saw your warning.I stopped cursing when i saw your warning.If your being fair you will remove it.Unless your taking what i said personally.Or is only your brand of christianity allowed?.

I'm not rescinding, nor will I discuss it further. So I suggest you take it on the chin and move on.

CDfm

jhegarty wrote: »

The crusades are over. Move on.

But you must admit there is a grain of truth here.

From the outside Christianity/catholicism is portrayed as old fashioned and is not contemperary. Lots of people dont know what it stands for and loads of resources are wasted.

I regularily post in A&A if I want to get the skinny on stuff like stem cell research and stuff like that. Only that I have an interest I would be waiting and would be dealing with biased and sometimes erroneous and contradictory soundbites from Catholic interest groups.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

If you break the charter you can then be infracted. It has nothing to do with me attempting to say that you are a bad Christian. However, I would seriously question if you really 'get it' when you start calling the precepts laid out by Christ (he is the important bit in Christianity don't ya know :pac:) as crap.

I'am saying its all down to interpetation,turn the other cheek,does'nt mean bend over.It just means do'nt go looking for trouble.thats what i'am saying.

CDfm

Sean Templar wrote: »

As i said i had already posted before i saw your warning.I stopped cursing when i saw your warning.If your being fair you will remove it.

Its your debate - why dont you participate without the whinging.

JimiTime

Sean Templar wrote: »

As i said i had already posted before i saw your warning.I stopped cursing when i saw your warning.If your being fair you will remove it.Unless your taking what i said personally.Or is only your brand of christianity allowed?.

Oh come off it mate! You came in here telling us that we should wipe out our enemies, and held Islamic Jihadists up as an example as conviction to religion. Its nothing to do with FC's 'brand' of anything, and everything to do with what seems to be a very extreme, dangerous view being delivered in a very course way. Whatever you want to call yourself, you aint no 'brand' of christian, if you just disregard well erm, Christ.

And FYI: Christ did not have to go through what he did. He went through torture, humiliation and finally death! One of his last sentances was then, 'forgive them father, for they know not what they do.' So it seems that when he said 'turn the other cheek' and 'Love' your enemy, he meant it!

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

I'am saying its all down to interpetation,turn the other cheek,does'nt mean bend over.It just means do'nt go looking for trouble.thats what i'am saying.

It seems to me that you were saying something entirely different.

You are rooting for an aggressive form of Christian theocracy. I believe such a thing would be disastrous and quite apart from the foundations of Christianity. As for turning the other cheek = bending over. There difference between the passiveness in Jesus' message (one that I would argue still allows Christians to fight an injustice) and your version of Christianity that seeks to 'kill the enemies of Christ is stark.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

I'm not rescinding, nor will I discuss it further. So I suggest you take it on the chin and move on.

I have no problem taking it on the chin,my point is i can take that and a lot more.But been a christian does'nt mean i have to like it or forgive your ass(not according to the old testiment*).The reason i'am not cursing is because its the rules of this forum,as a christian i can curse as much as i like once i don't take GOD's name in vain.And i never do.


*Of course that might change when i get to the new testiment

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

It seems to me that you were saying something entirely different.

You are rooting for an aggressive form of Christian theocracy. I believe such a thing would be disastrous and quite apart from the foundations of Christianity. As for turning the other cheek = bending over. There difference between the passiveness in Jesus' message (one that I would argue still allows Christians to fight an injustice) and your version of Christianity that seeks to 'kill the enemies of Christ is stark.

Stark does'nt mean i'am wrong.And how can you say it would be disastrous, christianity is dwindling away to nothing.Church attendances in the so called 1st world are vitually nil.Churches are reducing the amount of services each sunday,My own church has only two masses on sunday and never reaches more than 30% capacity.
No i disagree with you,i like my own more aggressive christianity as per the old testiment.I think its the way to go.
I'am sorry but i won'nt be responding anymore,because although you talk of turning the other cheek.The reality is you will probably give me another infringment because you do'nt like what i'am saying.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

I have no problem taking it on the chin,my point is i can take that and a lot more.But been a christian does'nt mean i have to like it or forgive your ass(not according to the old testiment*).The reason i'am not cursing is because its the rules of this forum,as a christian i can curse as much as i like once i don't take GOD's name in vain.And i never do.


*Of course that might change when i get to the new testiment

I don't really care if you curse like a trooper or not. The point is that it is not acceptable here, especially when you use it to describe the foundations of the thing you say you believe in. So lets just us leave it behind us and move on. OK?

We then seem to have polar opposite understandings of what the Christian message is. If you are interested in hearing a message of hope and of grace - these are two concepts central to the Christian message - then you could do worse then listening to these three talks by N.T. Wright (scroll down the page a bit).

JimiTime

Sean Templar wrote: »

i like my own more aggressive christianity as per the old testiment.

Though I think you quite bleightantly misrepresent the OT, I'll also point out that there is no such thing as 'Old testiment Christianity'. Maybe you should try to get Israeli Citizenship, convert to Judaisim and also join the Zionist movement. That would probably serve your political aspirations.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

Stark does'nt mean i'am wrong.And how can you say it would be disastrous, christianity is dwindling away to nothing.Church attendances in the so called 1st world are vitually nil.Churches are reducing the amount of services each sunday,My own church has only two masses on sunday and never reaches more than 30% capacity.
No i disagree with you,i like my own more aggressive christianity as per the old testiment.I think its the way to go.
I'am sorry but i won'nt be responding anymore,because although you talk of turning the other cheek.The reality is you will probably give me another infringment because you do'nt like what i'am saying.

Yes, Christianity is on the decline in the West - certainly the larger traditions - but the world over it is growing. We are oddly left with the wonderfully ironic situation where other nations (African nations , Asian nations etc.) are now sending missionaries to us! In Ireland we are also seeing a large growth (though admittedly small in comparison to the fall of the RCC) in other Christian denominations. It is arguable that all we are seeing is a correction whereby cultural Christians (which are entirely different from believing Christians) now feel free not to 'practice'. I believe there is hope for Christianity because there is a desire for God.

If you think I gave you the official warning because I don't like what you are saying then you are incorrect. I've already explained why I issued you with it. You broke the charter.

Sean Templar

CDfm wrote: »

Its your debate - why dont you participate without the whinging.

Because according to the moderator its all about forgiveness,Jesus message.I just wanted to see if they really belived that.I said i was sorry,but there was no forgiveness.Kinda proves my point in a round about way.Agressive christianity is the way to go,although alot of people spout turn the other cheek,forgive etc,Deep down they do'nt believe it.Given half the chance they will try to justify any action they can.

My type of christianity is more honest .Worship god,follow the commandments,kill his enemies.As it was in the beginning.


Ps:I know your all going to jump on the do not kill comandment bandwagon.But after moses gave the jews the 10 commandments,God instructed them(the jews) numerous times to kill all their enemies including the children(unbelievers).

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

I don't really care if you curse like a trooper or not. The point is that it is not acceptable here, especially when you use it to describe the foundations of the thing you say you believe in. So lets just us leave it behind us and move on. OK?

We then seem to have polar opposite understandings of what the Christian message is. If you are interested in hearing a message of hope and of grace - these are two concepts central to the Christian message - then you could do worse then listening to these three talks by N.T. Wright (scroll down the page a bit).

If you can tell me were Jesus or GOD said i can't curse i will stop right now.I usually find people just like to add on their own little rules of what they themselves think christianity should be. and not what it is.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

If you can tell me were Jesus or GOD said i can't curse i will stop right now.I usually find people just like to add on their own little rules of what they themselves think christianity should be. and not what it is.

It is quite simple. Each forum has a charter, including this forum.

The charter of the Christianity board

10. No swearing or facsimile therof. I will edit the words out and give warning. Banning will occur if it continues. The English dictionary is quite large and other words can be easily found.

I usually don't mind the odd ****, **** or even a ****. However, that you decided to apply these words to aspects of Christianity was unacceptable. That is why you got the warning. Now please drop it.

Sean Templar

JimiTime wrote: »

Though I think you quite bleightantly misrepresent the OT, I'll also point out that there is no such thing as 'Old testiment Christianity'. Maybe you should try to get Israeli Citizenship, convert to Judaisim and also join the Zionist movement. That would probably serve your political aspirations.

I have no political aspirations,and if you read your Christian bible you will find the old testiment in the front you don't need to be jewish to read it.I just find people choose the bits of the bible that suit them the best.My post is just saying i like the old testiment alot and that there nothing wrong with incorporating the more assertive aspects of our religion.Why should'nt we be strong and aggressive as christians.Christainity in europe and the new world got to were it is today through military force in combination with Gods word.Read some history,it helps people understand how we got to were we are today.

I thought this thread was about religion/christianity,obvisiously i was wrong,its only about your interpertation of christianity and the bits you like.

Sean Templar

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

It is quite simple. Each forum has a charter, including this forum.

The charter of the Christianity board

10. No swearing or facsimile therof. I will edit the words out and give warning. Banning will occur if it continues. The English dictionary is quite large and other words can be easily found.

I usually don't mind the odd ****, **** or even a ****. However, that you decided to apply these words to aspects of Christianity was unacceptable. That is why you got the warning. Now please drop it.

Ok i'am dropping this point,but i just thought of another.Answer me this in the 30 years + that Jesus was on earth as a man with human emotions,it is it your opinion that he never once cursed.When he hit his thumb with the hammer would he have said (bloody hell) or something similar?.

Fanny Cradock

Sean Templar wrote: »

I thought this thread was about religion/christianity,obvisiously i was wrong,its only about your interpertation of christianity and the bits you like.

No, this thread is about your version of Christianity. Something which thankfully hasn't been given too much support. There is a ocean apart from being assertive and the aggressive, offensive Christianity you apparently desire.

Soul Winner

Sean Templar wrote: »

Check out the web,see for youself,unprecedended numbers of young muslims are been attracted to jihad/holy war( yes i know jihad means struggle for gods cause :but only when it suits).British muslims are traveling to iraq to kill british soldiers.I am not getting at muslims,in case that's what you think this is about.I admire their strength of conviction,their willingness to fight and die for their religion.It seems to strike a cord with their youth.Our youth seem to be apathetic,listless,uninterested in their religion.Lets face it for a young male,give your brother christian a hug ,and lets be friends with the bastard trying to kill you does'nt really cut it.I'am saying lets be more "old testiment" ie:fight for our beliefs,protect our people and our religion.Kill our enimies,wipe the fcukers out like god told the jews to do to their enemies in the old testiment.

Doesn't that sort of fly in the face of the fact that it is Christian nations which are the most powerful in the world militarily? In terms of ordinary people on the street I might concede your point but if a Muslim nation say Iran, attacked unprovoked say France with conventional weapons say tomorrow what do you think Iran would look like in six months time? On a small scale you are probably correct but on the larger scale you are mightily wrong.

JimiTime

Sean Templar wrote: »

I have no political aspirations,and if you read your Christian bible you will find the old testiment in the front you don't need to be jewish to read it.I just find people choose the bits of the bible that suit them the best.My post is just saying i like the old testiment alot and that there nothing wrong with incorporating the more assertive aspects of our religion.Why should'nt we be strong and aggressive as christians.Christainity in europe and the new world got to were it is today through military force in combination with Gods word.Read some history,it helps people understand how we got to were we are today.

I thought this thread was about religion/christianity,obvisiously i was wrong,its only about your interpertation of christianity and the bits you like.

Best see what our king and Lord says on the matter (Thats Jesus Christ btw). Maybe read the sermon on the mount. i may be totally wrong about this, but you seem to be angry with the world or something? or fearful? Maybe triggered by an event or something? Anyway, if this is the case, don't let it eat you up. Bitterness and anger only consume. As I said, read the sermon on the mount, and the rest of Christs message and life. He free's us with Love and hope, from the shackles of fear. This world will pass away, but his Kingdom will be forever. The wars and squables of this world are petty and foolish. Faith and Hope in Christ is where its at. Seriously man, don't worry about things of this world in such a manner. The Good guys win in the end:)

Fanny Cradock

And check out those links I put up!

Galvasean

Sean Templar wrote: »

I just find people choose the bits of the bible that suit them the best.

Like the way you single out all the violent bits?

Sean Templar wrote: »

Why should'nt we be strong and aggressive as christians.Christainity in europe and the new world got to were it is today through military force in combination with Gods word.Read some history,it helps people understand how we got to were we are today.

So, basically you want to simply overwhelm anyone who disagrees with you by using brute force?

PDN

OK guys, entertaining as this has been, let's stop feeding the troll please.

Phototoxin

turning the other cheek was an insult as apprarntly at the time it would have mean that he'd then have to use his left hand to strike you mean which was a big faux pas and so he looked like a tosser.

I'am saying its all down to interpetation,turn the other cheek,does'nt mean bend over.It just means do'nt go looking for trouble.thats what i'am saying.

CDfm

Phototoxin wrote: »

turning the other cheek was an insult as apprarntly at the time it would have mean that he'd then have to use his left hand to strike you mean which was a big faux pas and so he looked like a tosser.

haha - lessons in double entendre needed here - you need to read it metaphoricaly:D

Phototoxin

CDfm wrote: »

haha - lessons in double entendre needed here - you need to read it metaphoricaly:D

NO, I am actually referring to a facial cheek as opposed to the gluteus maximus!

Jesus in the Gospels basically stuck it to the man but in clever peaceful ways, not only taking the mick out of pharisees but the romans too. Anyone who has this idea of Jesus as some bearded fawning hippie is seriously out of whack!

Sean Templar

PDN wrote: »

OK guys, entertaining as this has been, let's stop feeding the troll please.

Did'nt know what a troll was till i looked it up on wikipedia.But if thats your view i don't mind.