The Lions selection

People reckon the Lions team will be all Welsh with a few Irish thrown in for good measure.

I was thinking,what happens if we win the grandslam?
Their players perform well as a team but alot are not outstanding individuals,they also seem to grow in a Wales shirt and do nothing for the Ospreys.


If Ireland won,could we expect the team to be mostly Irish with a few welsh thrown in?

No one has mentioned it in the media yet,which im surprised about.

Otacon

I think the usual suspects will make it on the squad, BOD, POC, Wallace. I think Kearney is a shoe-in for full-back and O'Leary will probably make the reserves.

ROG has to pick up his game for the last few 6N games. I think he will make the squad but a first team spot is up for grabs, which Jones is looking likely to get. Other than that, Fitz and Ferris may make the cut, with perhaps Haze getting a final call. That is eight in my view who deserve places, of course theirs more I would like to see but I think that is more to do with me being Irish!

barnesd

Here's my opinion, based on current form:

On the plane - BOD, POC, Kearney.

Very likely - DOC, Wallace, Heaslip.

Decent chance, if they play well for the rest of the 6N - ROG, Fitz, Ferris, Hayes, maybe Bowe.

zAbbo

Definites: BOD, Kearney, Fitzgerald, D.Wallace, POC, DOC, Heaslip
Possibles: ROG, Ferris, TOL, Hayes

I don't think ROG will make the squad, unless he has a spectacular end to the season, Jones, Hook & Cipriani will make it.

sm.org

Though not the most popular with some on here Jerry Flannery is a shoe in and a real possibility of starting the first test.

LeeroyJones

still too early to call-the business end of the 6 Nations and Heineken Cup still to come, although many postions are either certainly between the Irish and Welsh. That match will throw up so many head-to-heads

O'Connell-Jones
Wallace-Williams
Powell-Heaslip
O'Gara-Jones
BOD-Shanklin
Fitzgerald-Halfpenny......the 2 young wingers
Bowe-Williams......the 2 Ospreys
Kearney-Byrne

just to name a few!

Having said that POC and BOD must be certainties - barring injury..

I've heard most people reckon that Byrne has the 15 shirt, but Kearney certainly is on a par at least on current form, perhaps they'll shift kearney out onto the wing-he's a better full-back but he can do a job on the wing better than if they put Byrne there.

mikedragon32

LeeroyJones wrote:

perhaps they'll shift kearney out onto the wing-he's a better full-back but he can do a job on the wing better than if they put Byrne there

I've never fully understood this logic. If Byrne (rightfully) gets the nod at 15, you'd be sacrificing a better natural wing just to shoehorn Kearney into the team. I've no doubt he'd do well on the wings, but when you've got natural talent like Shane Williams, Bowe and Fitzgerald who are fantastic wingers, aren't just depriving one them of a place on the team?

If Kearney is playing, he must play 15. If Byrne is in better form, so be it. Kearney can make a great impact from the bench, if needs be.

Does anyone care to venture as to who the English Lions might be?

Stupido

Does anyone care to venture as to who the English Lions might be?[/quote]

British Airways flight staff??

Stev_o

mikedragon32 wrote: »

I've never fully understood this logic. If Byrne (rightfully) gets the nod at 15, you'd be sacrificing a better natural wing just to shoehorn Kearney into the team. I've no doubt he'd do well on the wings, but when you've got natural talent like Shane Williams, Bowe and Fitzgerald who are fantastic wingers, aren't just depriving one them of a place on the team?

If Kearney is playing, he must play 15. If Byrne is in better form, so be it. Kearney can make a great impact from the bench, if needs be.

Does anyone care to venture as to who the English Lions might be?

Lewsey, Armitage......eh Flutey (though really he shouldn't be even considered), Sackey, Sheridan or Vickery (has actually done something half decent in a English shirt in his last outing) oh and possibly Monye? Oh i forgot, on recent form Ellis will travel and is in the draw to start.

I really can't see alot of players being selected from the actual England set up but i can see McGeech pick some players from the Premiership ala 1996.

For Scotland id assume the two Evans brothers will travel,Hines if fit,Ford and Murray and possibly one of their backrow but that's all up in the air in the moment.

redmca

All depends how big will the squad be.
Sir Clive had between 45 and 50 all told in NZ. Madness !!

Zzippy

Stev_o wrote: »

Lewsey, Armitage......eh Flutey (though really he shouldn't be even considered), Sackey, Sheridan or Vickery (has actually done something half decent in a English shirt in his last outing) oh and possibly Monye? Oh i forgot, on recent form Ellis will travel and is in the draw to start.

I really can't see alot of players being selected from the actual England set up but i can see McGeech pick some players from the Premiership ala 1996.

For Scotland id assume the two Evans brothers will travel,Hines if fit,Ford and Murray and possibly one of their backrow but that's all up in the air in the moment.

Did you forget Cipriani?

Crash

redmca wrote: »

All depends how big will the squad be.
Sir Clive had between 45 and 50 all told in NZ. Madness !!

Anything i've read has been to the effect that Geech wants a 35-38 man travelling squad or so.

jdivision

Do you mean the starting team or the squad? Most of the Irish team will travel, along with Wales and a scattering of English and Scottish players.

Stev_o

Zzippy wrote: »

Did you forget Cipriani?

Nope that's a call that really is up in the air. Think the real problem is that Geech doesn't have the luxury of picking a very bulky number 10 who is solid in defence.

Chucky the tree

jdivision wrote: »

Do you mean the starting team or the squad? Most of the Irish team will travel, along with Wales and a scattering of English and Scottish players.

I thought this until I actually went through it.


1. Horan - NO
2. Flannery - Yes
3. Hayes - No
4. DOC - No
5. POC - Yes
6. Ferris - No
7. Wallace - Yes
8. Heaslip - Yes
9. TOL - no
10. ROG - No
11. Fitz - Yes, could easily not make it though
12. Wallace - No
13. BOD - Yes
14. Bowe - Yes
15. Kearney - Yes

bleg

o callaghan definitely and o gara would make it. not so sure about fitz or bowe though

sock puppet

bleg wrote: »

o callaghan definitely and o gara would make it. not so sure about fitz or bowe though

Tour or start? Bowe should tour seeing as he can cover wing, centre and fullback.

edit: Fitz can too actually but I think if it was between them Bowe would get the nod.

Chucky the tree

I'd have the two Welsh OH's ahead of him and then it'll depend how Cipriani does aswell. DOC could easily end up going though.

Stev_o

Why would DOC go? There's many better 2nd rows around at the moment.

Serenity Now!

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I'd have the two Welsh OH's ahead of him and then it'll depend how Cipriani does aswell

Hook ahead of O'Gara?? lmao!

Yeah,but do you think if we win the grandslam more of our players will go?

That seemed to be the talk of the media when they presumed Wales would walk it again,thus most of the Lions would be Welsh.

Surely if we won the grandslam then we should have at least the same amount of players as wales in the team?

For what its worth I think

Bod,Kearney,Rog,Poc,Doc,Fitz,Ferris,Heaslip,Wallace,Bowe,Best,Flannery will tour.

Geordan murphy could tour aswell,if he is in fine form for Leicester.

Keith Earls could also go as the uncapped player.

Serenity Now!

Ford Abundant Throwback wrote: »

Yeah,but do you think if we win the grandslam more of our players will go?

I don't care. Never bothered much with the whole Lions idiom much myself. Enjoy it as a tour and enjoyed the 2001 series but thats about it really. Would prefer to see the individual nations touring themselves instead really.

I won't mention the 'GS' word right now either. There are three very tough encounters to go in this 6N.

razorblunt

I think McGeechan will throw in a few club players as well, possibly Lewsy to cover across the back.

Cuchulain

Serenity Now! wrote: »

I won't mention the 'GS' word right now either. There are three very tough encounters to go in this 6N.

GS???
Oh the Grand Slam.

twinytwo

LeeroyJones wrote: »

still too early to call-the business end of the 6 Nations and Heineken Cup still to come, although many postions are either certainly between the Irish and Welsh. That match will throw up so many head-to-heads

O'Connell-Jones
Wallace-Williams
Powell-Heaslip
O'Gara-Jones 50/50 here
BOD-Shanklin... Still cant see BOD not getting the 13 shirt playing **** he is still the best 13 in the NH
Fitzgerald-Halfpenny......the 2 young wingers
Bowe-Williams......the 2 Ospreys
Kearney-Byrne... Kearney is the complete package, is a 21/22 twice the player byrne is, plus byrne can defend worth a damn

just to name a few!

Having said that POC and BOD must be certainties - barring injury..

I've heard most people reckon that Byrne has the 15 shirt, but Kearney certainly is on a par at least on current form, perhaps they'll shift kearney out onto the wing-he's a better full-back but he can do a job on the wing better than if they put Byrne there.

.

twinytwo

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Hook ahead of O'Gara?? lmao!

+1

ScholesyIsGod

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I thought this until I actually went through it.


1. Horan - NO
2. Flannery - Yes
3. Hayes - No
4. DOC - No
5. POC - Yes
6. Ferris - No
7. Wallace - Yes
8. Heaslip - Yes
9. TOL - no
10. ROG - No
11. Fitz - Yes, could easily not make it though
12. Wallace - No
13. BOD - Yes
14. Bowe - Yes
15. Kearney - Yes

Are you serios? Ferris is a shoe in for the tour and if his forms holds up he will be in the test XV.

DOC will go as well, POC, Alun-Wyn Jones and Nick Kennedy are ahead of him but he's next in line and there will definitely be 4 second rows brought.

As for ROG its between him and Jones for the starting place in the test side. How you can say they wont even make the tour is beyond me.

Rog will tour but Hook,Cipriani and Jones will be ahead of him.

No one rates him outside of Ireland and the media over here are so blinkered they think he is the top 3 in the world.
Hes a good player at what he does but hes also extremely limited.Can kick territory and goals but not alot else.

he is also doing his best in this six nations not to get picked.

I agree re Ferris and Doc.

ScholesyIsGod

Jones and possibly Hook ahead of him is a fair enough point but Cipriani on current form doesnt even warrent a place on the tour imo. As for ROG himself i dont agree that he's not rated outside of Ireland. He's one of the best in world rugby at getting his backline going his passing is his biggest strength at the moment and he definitley doesnt get credit for it.

His big downfall is his defence its the one thing that could lead to Jones getting the nod ahead of him.

But i do agree with you that his 6N form hasnt been the best so far but im sure he'll get it together for England.

nacho libre

It will be interesting to see how Joe Worsley does on Saturday. if he is as effective against Ireland as he was against Wales then one of the Irish back row may miss out on selection for the lions.

I think only two irish players are certain to be on the lions starting sheet. If ireland are still unbeaten going into the Welsh game then the performance of both full backs in that game could settle the issue of who starts at full back for the Lions.

Sparky14

Ford Abundant Throwback wrote: »

Rog will tour but Hook,Cipriani and Jones will be ahead of him.

No one rates him outside of Ireland and the media over here are so blinkered they think he is the top 3 in the world.
Hes a good player at what he does but hes also extremely limited.Can kick territory and goals but not alot else.

he is also doing his best in this six nations not to get picked.

I agree re Ferris and Doc.

McGeech will bring either Hook or Cipriani not both, if Flood or Geraghty get some game time they could come into contention. ROG and Jones will def tour as the 2 experienced OHs leaving 1 space for the others to fight over. O'Gara can do as much as Jones with ball in hand, granted he can't tackle to save his life.

Someone else mentioned T'OL travelling, can't see how that would happen when Phillips, Blair, Ellis and most likely Peel & possibly Care would be ahead of him.

ScholesyIsGod

ScholesyIsGod wrote: »

As for ROG himself i dont agree that he's not rated outside of Ireland

Who rates him?
NZ,Aus,SA,Wales,France fans and media dont rate him.

Infact im pretty sure I posted an article here at the start of the 6 nations,where a saffer journalist said he is Irelands biggest weaklink.
He cant tackle,offer no attacking threat,he can pass and kick and thats it.

Ruan Pienaar,SA's 3rd choice out half utility player can do that.

I fully accept that we would be ****ed without him and he has lead Munster to 2 heineken cups playing his type of game but on the international stage he is average.

Sparky i would tend to agree with your thoughts on him bringing either hook or Cipriani,although hook can play 12 aswell,so he might be brought as a 12.
personally I rate Cipriani very highly and think the media in England has done their best to ruin him.

anonymous_joe

Hmmm.

Ignoring bias as much as possible here:

1. Horan - No. Not going to happen. Scottish, Welsh or English prop here
2. Flannery - Potentially. Wales and Scotland have good hookers too.
3. Hayes - Squad and no more.
4. DOC - No. Alun Wyn Jones or Nick Kennedy will get in ahead of him.
5. POC - Yes. Potential captain, probable starter.
6. Ferris - Squad. Ryan Jones would start ahead of him.
7. David Wallace - Squad at least. M. Williams is a big rival.
8. Heaslip - Squad at least. Andy Powell or him depending on who wins 6N.
9. TOL - Unlikely. Mike Blair, Peel, Philips, Danny Care, Foden, a host of talents available here.
10. ROG - Too weak at defending. Would be targeted. Will be no 2 or 3.
11. Fitz - Squad player, can play centre, wing or fullback.
12. P. Wallace - No
13. BOD - Yes. Probable starter, potential captain.
14. Bowe - Unlikely unless we win GS.
15. Kearney - Likely in the squad, depends on who wins 6N to see who starts.

Again, I think a lot of players depend on the 6 Nations. Scotland could get the front row, with a mix of Irish and Welsh for the second row and back row.

I can see the half-backs being Hiberno-Welsh, dependant on the results of the tournament. A good performance or two from Blair in either the ML or 6 Nations could see him parachuted in, even as captain. If Johnny Wilkinson recovers from injury I might even see him being picked as starting 10.

In the backs the likelihood is predominantly Hiberno-Welsh again, with whoever finishes best in the 6 Nations dominating. Can see the Evans brothers being in the mix, squad at least, as well as some of the English fliers, that is Sackeys, Cuetos, etc.

thehighground

Ford Abundant Throwback wrote: »

Who rates him?
NZ,Aus,SA,Wales,France fans and media dont rate him.

Well, the French, NZ, SA, Welsh fans or media are not picking the team.:D

We all know you don't rate ROG Goose, but as far as I know Geech rates him as he played him in the last Lions Tour in every mid-week game and they won them all.

Last time Wasps played Munster in Thomond, can't remember whether it was Geech or Edwards, but the comment was that "ROG just gave a masterclass in OH play. I felt like standing up and applauding him even though it was against my team."

Gatland capped ROG as a 21 year old - so must have seen something there.

As for SH media not rating them - they only rate their own, for goodness sake. And if they didn't rate ROG, why did the French media do all that stirring about his private life before the world cup? Some might come to the conclusion that they rated him so highly, they wanted him off his game

btw, last November from reading media interviews, the only Irish players that Richie McCaw seemed to rate were ROG & POC.

It would seem to me that Geech, Edwards & Gatland rate ROG. Add in that he has toured with the Lions before, has been on the winning side against the Boks, I think he will be there along with Stephen Jones. Another two places up for grabs (Cipriani possibly as he can also play FB).

I'm sure Geech will also be aware that the Irish forwards are being coached by the former Bok world cup winning coach, Gert Smal who picked out POC & DOC in particular for praise recently.

“Paul O’Connell is a machine,” said Smal at the team’s hotel in Cork yesterday. “I rate him very highly, and definitely one of the best locks in world rugby. Donncha, then, is very much like Bakkies – he’s the grafter, he does the dirty work. Not a lot of people see the amount of work that he puts in when cleaning rucks and making turnovers. Now and then he does get the opportunity to carry ball, and give us a little bit of forward momentum.

“So it’s very much the same kind of combination that we had with the Boks but I have to rate them both very highly.”

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2009/0220/1224241484296.htmlmomentum.

I can see the Lions getting picked a lot on key partnerships that are already working well together. Gatland worked on that principle by picking the entire Ospreys when he didn't have too much time to prepare for the 6Ns last year.

themont85

This would be my Lions tour party if selected it right now imo;

Props

Its South Africa, its gonna be attritional. Plenty of props will be needed. I'd go for- Sheridan(England), Vickery(England), Jenkins(Wales), Jones(Wales), Murray(Scotland), White(Eng)

Hookers
Myers(Eng), Flannery(Ire), Rees(Wales)

2nd Rows
POC(IRE), Shaw(England), DOC(Ire), A-Wyn Jones(Wales), Kennedy(Eng)

Back Row
Ferris(IRE), Powell(Wales), Heaslip(Ire), Wallace(Ireland), Jones(Wales), Taylor(Scotland), Haskell(Eng)

Scrum Halfs
Blair(Scotland), Ellis(Eng), Philips(Wales)

Out Halfs
ROG(Ire), Jones(Wales), Hook(Wales)

Centres
BOD(Ire), Roberts(Wales), Flutey(Eng), Darcy(Ire)

Wings
Williams(Wales), T Evans(Scotland), Bowe(Ire), Halfpenny(Wales), Fitzgearld(Ire)

FB
Kearney(Ire), Byrne(W)

8 English
14 Welsh
11 Irish
4 Scots

Tbh looking at my squad it worries me. I could pick a very good first 15 and bench but imo the quality is diluted as you go down particulairly at second row. The Welsh pair are decent but Gough imo is a poor mans DOC. Simon Shaw is a bolter, because he is old and not in the England squad. But he plays for Wasps, which will count, he is very aggresive and good for a tour in SA I think. Nick Kennedy is in but I think he is very one dimensional ie lineout superb but the rest?! i can't believe people don't think DOC will travel, who else is there? He has experience plus a great combo with POC.

Out half is another area of concern, ROG has been dismal recently but he should hopefully improve for the tour. Cipriani's form has gone walkies and its difficult to justify his selection despite his Wasps links, he will travel though if he improves-he has the talent but atm he's a no no for me. Jones and Hook are solid players with Jones the form 10 as of late but tbh it worries me that we don't have a commanding 10.

In the back row i believe we have great depth. I picked both the Irish back row along with 2 of the Welsh cos they are the form units atm. I didn't pick Worsley because although he put in a MoM performance vs Wales, imo Wales made him look great by just punching Roberts straight at him. He could make it easily though.

Darcy at centre is controversial but imo he is a better all round player than Shanklin who doesn't offer much different than Roberts who is in pole position for 12. Again like Cipriani, Henson needs to stay injury free and get into form.

The back 3 is looking decent witht the flyers Evans and Williams going along with the all round skills of Fitz, Halfpenny and the 2 FBs.

Still quite worried though.

Stev_o

@Mont id doubt D'Arcy would travel and from a Irish perspective i wouldn;t want him to travel that last thing he needs is to be sent on a tour where the likely hood of some SA'er in the damaging his hand is too great of a risk at this moment in time. Id say put in Max Evans or Armitage in his place.

ScholesyIsGod

Thats a good squad.

Id make a few changes though. I dont think theres any place for Julian White on the tour if Matt Stevens didnt have drug problems he'd still be retired.

As for the back row Martyn Williams will definitely be on the plane, i think Powell is very one dimensional he was found out a bit against England id leave him at home. Id give Barclay a place instead of Julian White i think 5 props would be plenty.

In the backs Delon Artmitage deserves a spot on current form.

thomond2006

Steve Borthwick for Captain :D:D

Seriously, I can't wait for the very biased English media to blast Geech for not picking their "inspirational":rolleyes: captain, even in the squad.

If SB gets picked for the test team it's because he is England captain and not for form (the what now??) and that would be a big injustice to other players. :mad::mad:

thehighground

thehighground wrote: »

Well, the French, NZ, SA, Welsh fans or media are not picking the team.:D

We all know you don't rate ROG Goose, but as far as I know Geech rates him as he played him in the last Lions Tour in every mid-week game and they won them all.

Last time Wasps played Munster in Thomond, can't remember whether it was Geech or Edwards, but the comment was that "ROG just gave a masterclass in OH play. I felt like standing up and applauding him even though it was against my team."

Gatland capped ROG as a 21 year old - so must have seen something there.

As for SH media not rating them - they only rate their own, for goodness sake. And if they didn't rate ROG, why did the French media do all that stirring about his private life before the world cup? Some might come to the conclusion that they rated him so highly, they wanted him off his game

btw, last November from reading media interviews, the only Irish players that Richie McCaw seemed to rate were ROG & POC.

It would seem to me that Geech, Edwards & Gatland rate ROG. Add in that he has toured with the Lions before, has been on the winning side against the Boks, I think he will be there along with Stephen Jones. Another two places up for grabs (Cipriani possibly as he can also play FB).

I'm sure Geech will also be aware that the Irish forwards are being coached by the former Bok world cup winning coach, Gert Smal who picked out POC & DOC in particular for praise recently.



I can see the Lions getting picked a lot on key partnerships that are already working well together. Gatland worked on that principle by picking the entire Ospreys when he didn't have too much time to prepare for the 6Ns last year.

Why bring Poc or Doc into it?
I said they will probably tour.

Of course gatland capped Rog early,he didnt have an option.He obviously saw more in him than he did Humphreys,that still doesnt make him a good player.

I agree that he will tour,but he will not be on the test team and I dont even know if he will get a game midweek,id pick either Cipriani or Hook.

Wasps are not the springboks,Rog agave a masterclass against a Kid who wasnt allowed to play his game with the best pack in the comp on the front foot.
He is just so limited its unbelievable that people in Ireland cant see this.His best atttributes are things that every outhalf should possess anyway.

I would honestly swap him for Bauxis in the morning if I could.

themont85

Stev_o wrote: »

@Mont id doubt D'Arcy would travel and from a Irish perspective i wouldn;t want him to travel that last thing he needs is to be sent on a tour where the likely hood of some SA'er in the damaging his hand is too great of a risk at this moment in time. Id say put in Max Evans or Armitage in his place.

I just think we need somebody of Darcy or Henson ilk down under. Roberts imo isn't the most diverse player going, he is superb at what he does ie crash and bash for the other backs to show their skills but if the Lions need to change it up those 2 can provide it. Evans is a decent shout but not Armitage, he's a back 3 type really and we need centres. Luke Fitz can cover there but goin down there I wouldn't restrict us.

[Jackass]

My team if it was picked in the morning: (Brackets = possible selection)

1. Jenkins
2. Flannery
3. Vickery
4. A Wynn Jones (O'Callaghan)
5. O'Connell
6. Jones (Ferris)
7. Wallace
8. Heaslip

9. Blair
10. Jones (Hook)
11. Williams
12. Roberts (D'Arcy)
13. O'Driscoll (Shanklin)
14. Bowe (Fitzgerald)
15. Kearney (Byrne)

Captaincy is between O'Connell, Jones, Blair & O'Driscoll

Stev_o

themont85 wrote: »

I just think we need somebody of Darcy or Henson ilk down under. Roberts imo isn't the most diverse player going, he is superb at what he does ie crash and bash for the other backs to show their skills but if the Lions need to change it up those 2 can provide it. Evans is a decent shout but not Armitage, he's a back 3 type really and we need centres. Luke Fitz can cover there but goin down there I wouldn't restrict us.

But you see D'Arcy at the moment is very hesitant at 12 and isn't himself which is understandable but i don't see what he could offer if he was back on form pre break then Roberts would you know? They are both bash'em ups you know? But i do know what you mean that there's a lack of a versatile 12 in the traditional play maker sense with only Flutey being in that mold on form. The only other option would be to move BOD to 12 like in 2001 but again highly doubtful.

themont85

Stev_o wrote: »

But you see D'Arcy at the moment is very hesitant at 12 and isn't himself which is understandable but i don't see what he could offer if he was back on form pre break then Roberts would you know? They are both bash'em ups you know? But i do know what you mean that there's a lack of a versatile 12 in the traditional play maker sense with only Flutey being in that mold on form. The only other option would be to move BOD to 12 like in 2001 but again highly doubtful.

Darcy has more to his game than Roberts. Darcy developed into a 12, he is a natural 13 and is far better in open field play. If Henson is on form though he will go.

BOD was 13 in 2001 was he not with Hendo at 12?

Stev_o

themont85 wrote: »

Darcy has more to his game than Roberts. Darcy developed into a 12, he is a natural 13 and is far better in open field play. If Henson is on form though he will go.

BOD was 13 in 2001 was he not with Hendo at 12?

Actually yeah your right he did play at 13 but stood at 12 alot as well. See honestly i don't think there will be much open play and it will be more brick wall sort of stuff.

Crash

Surprised to see people leaving Armitage out of the back 3 options - i'd put good money on him being on the plane.

anonymous_joe

Going Waterforward wrote: »

Surprised to see people leaving Armitage out of the back 3 options - i'd put good money on him being on the plane.

Depends on how he does.

I put him in my fantasy team at the start of the 6N, expecting fireworks then took him out after the Italy match...

Even more so than the others, he's proved nothing yet internationally (simply because he's so new) so it's harder to gauge him. Also he's English, which wile traditionally a boon, is at the moment a serious downside to a player.

Crash

Really? he was a good investment for mine - got me a try in the Welsh game

I don't think he's playing amazingly, but while we all hear how Geech isn't planning on doing things like SCW, I'd place cash on there being a minimum of 1 English back, and at the moment, it'll either be Sackey or Armitage. Armitage might get the nudge as the younger player. Thats why my bets on him travelling really.

anonymous_joe

Going Waterforward wrote: »

Really? he was a good investment for mine - got me a try in the Welsh game

I don't think he's playing amazingly, but while we all hear how Geech isn't planning on doing things like SCW, I'd place cash on there being a minimum of 1 English back, and at the moment, it'll either be Sackey or Armitage. Armitage might get the nudge as the younger player. Thats why my bets on him travelling really.

I expected wonders from the French against Scotland. I was wrong. :pac:

twinytwo

Ford Abundant Throwback wrote: »

Why bring Poc or Doc into it?
I said they will probably tour.

Of course gatland capped Rog early,he didnt have an option.He obviously saw more in him than he did Humphreys,that still doesnt make him a good player.

I agree that he will tour,but he will not be on the test team and I dont even know if he will get a game midweek,id pick either Cipriani or Hook.

Wasps are not the springboks,Rog agave a masterclass against a Kid who wasnt allowed to play his game with the best pack in the comp on the front foot.
He is just so limited its unbelievable that people in Ireland cant see this.His best atttributes are things that every outhalf should possess anyway.

I would honestly swap him for Bauxis in the morning if I could.

Clearly you are a Rog hater...No player is perfect. How many games have ireland and munster won thanks to his boot. And anyone who would take Hook over O Gara is seriously deluded. Limited? Apart from being not the best of tacklers how is he limited??:rolleyes:

darrenh

if you are from a small country you will never get the respect you deserve because big nations only think their players are the best. Roy Keane comes to mind. he should have won a load of best footballer awards but he wasnt english, italian or brazilian etc etc. I really cant see any problem with ROG either, other than his tackling. If Rog was french or english he would have been hailed as the best ever by their media.
What a stupid comment to make by saying 'I cant understand why in Ireland we dont see how limited he is'.

handsomecake

i think ben foden might get called up as a utility player. he has been phenomenal in the premiership this year.for those mooting kearney as a full back?? ever heard of lee byrne? he is a shoe in. i think cueto will go too.