Best Pizza Franchise?

spadder

I am looking into opening a Take-out / delivery Pizza shop in the West, I have, what I believe to be a good location in mind.

Has anyone had experience with dealing with any of the big Pizza Franchises?

Thanks

YellowSheep

Hi Spadder
If you really want to go down the franchise route, which I think is crazy, the best is to write to all of the available franchises and ask them for terms and conditions and than compare. Alternatively write your own manual or get somebody for short term to do it for you, which will safe yo the ongoing franchise fee. Cheers Oliver

spadder

YellowSheep wrote: »

Hi Spadder
If you really want to go down the franchise route, which I think is crazy, the best is to write to all of the available franchises and ask them for terms and conditions and than compare. Alternatively write your own manual or get somebody for short term to do it for you, which will safe yo the ongoing franchise fee. Cheers Oliver

I know that some food franchises can be quite crippling, I have had some companies trying to sell me daft franchise ideas, but when it comes to Pizza, I think people like brand recognition. I really want to have a brand, I understand I have to pay a premium for that recognition. I have another business which keeps me busy so I want a turnkey solution.

YellowSheep

Yeap, you are absolutely right. Thats what franchises are for. But in the current environment, I believe, if you have a good pizza product you will not need brand recognition. My sons only want their pizza from a small operator also the big ones are just around the corner. Its all about the product. Anyway thats a decision OP has to make. Cheers Oliver

fmcc

Just be sure to check out the actual franchisees that are up and running allowing for locations and footfall etc and see how its working out for them? would they do it over? that will tell you a lot more than the company trying to sell you the franchise.

Bandara

YellowSheep wrote: »

Hi Spadder
If you really want to go down the franchise route, which I think is crazy, the best is to write to all of the available franchises and ask them for terms and conditions and than compare. Alternatively write your own manual or get somebody for short term to do it for you, which will safe yo the ongoing franchise fee. Cheers Oliver

Franchise companies will not give you T&Cs until you sign a confidentiality agreement.

They have people beating down their doors trying to open franchises.

Bandara

spadder wrote: »

I know that some food franchises can be quite crippling, I have had some companies trying to sell me daft franchise ideas, but when it comes to Pizza, I think people like brand recognition. I really want to have a brand, I understand I have to pay a premium for that recognition. I have another business which keeps me busy so I want a turnkey solution.

Fully agree with you, I spent a huge amount of time looking into this area last year. Its a savagely competitive area and the franshises have it completely wrapped up. Unless your going to tie your takeaway business into a resturant setup your never going to survive.

Not enough people are going to bother to give some new takeaway pizza company a try when they are getting bombarded with very cheap deals from the big guys. Even if you are the nicest pizzas around your going to need one serious amount of cash in the bank to get you through the first year before the word gets out to sufficent people to let you actually turn a profit.

I met with all the big companies, Four Star and Apache are perceived as the cheap options and their stores are quite low budget looking in my opinion and that was also the impression I took from the research we did. Dominos is the daddy of them all, very slick higher setup costs that all the others but they really have no interest in opening stores in anywhere iother than the few places they have no exposure in. If your thinking of a Dublin or a big city store forget it, they won't want to know. PHQ (previously the disaster that was Godfathers) have a really great new image but imo their loyalty fees and advertising take was way to high to justify that of a new launched concept with no proven track record.

All in all I was actually shocked out how little there is to be made in them. The only way to really make money is to have multiple sites.

A decent Pizza site doing say €14k a week will only make you about 60k a year which is a complete waste of time and an extremely bad investment imo. The risk of failure is very high and they are very time intensive to run, you cannot take your foot off the gas at all or takings absolutely plummet.

As an aside the most superior Pizza franchise in this county has let to be promoted correctly. Papa Johns Pizza is really a superb setup, the menu is more adult than all the others and the quality of the product is top class. I looked at taking the entire franchise on myself but it was snapped up by the SuperMacs guys a few years back and they have opened a few company stores but not done much with it.

If you want any details just ask, as I said I really went through this in detail last year. Be aware, securing locations is a bloody nightmare though, no one wants a pizza place opening up near them.

Just be careful with it, there are loads of existaing sites available at the minute that the companys are trying to dump onto franchisees, for example the PHQ unit in Fairview/Clontarf has been offered around the place and has been FULLY FITTED OUT and ready to go for close to 3 YEARS now. And no one has ever taken it. Theres a good reason for this.

YellowSheep

Hammertime wrote: »

Franchise companies will not give you T&Cs until you sign a confidentiality agreement.

They have people beating down their doors trying to open franchises.

Sorry you are wrong. most of the stuff you actually can pick up from their web-sites. But if I am wrong, than just sign CA and of you go.

murphaph

Hammertime wrote: »

A decent Pizza site doing say €14k a week will only make you about 60k a year

Very interesting. Roughly where does the rest of the €728,000 go each year? You've clearly looked into this a lot HT-I was under the mistaken notion that a Dominos would make a mint as they seem to make sure not to overlap and steal business of each site. I would agree that making 60k a year from such a turnover is a bad deal but I still expect an explosion of such franchises as people grasp at ideas to spend their redundancy money on. Any idea on what type of fast food is the most profitable overall?

YellowSheep

murphaph wrote: »

Any idea on what type of fast food is the most profitable overall?

I would suggest Pizza/Pasta and Asian. A good Chinese, even with decent chicken, can achieve a 15% to 20% food cost comparing to 30% to 35% and even more in some cases.
The bottom line is that if you know what you are doing you do not need a franchise but if you want a higher security with your investment you need to go the franchise route. I have seen both go under, because of Muppet operators and I have seen both making a very good living.

Bandara

YellowSheep wrote: »

Sorry you are wrong. most of the stuff you actually can pick up from their web-sites. But if I am wrong, than just sign CA and of you go.

The stuff on the websites is just the blurb to get people excited.

Trust me, I was nice and excited when I saw all the website stuff, when I actually met them all my excitement dimmed somewhat, they really ride you for loyalty fees and advertising fees, and the transparancy of where these fees go wasn't exactly to my liking.

I can't understand how anyone could go into it after doing their sums, hell of a lot of work with a hell of a lot of risk and nothing like the return you need to make is worth risking.

Pizzas is a tough bloody business. I was really surprised what I got into it in detail.

(as for signing the CA they don't just give it to you, they have to be fairly happy that you have the money to go ahead and that you are someone they want to deal with, as I said they get bombarded by people with redundancy money etc) You;d swear it was the national secrets they are so protective of them, one group let me read the agreement in the room but not take it away with me, I could make notes but that was it!

DubTony

murphaph wrote: »

... I still expect an explosion of such franchises as people grasp at ideas to spend their redundancy money on.

YellowSheep wrote:

I have seen both go under, because of Muppet operators and I have seen both making a very good living.

And therein lies the biggest problem of all. Inexperienced people taking the plunge and expecting the money to roll in. This happened in the early 80's when every Tom, Dick and Harry thought he could open a newsagent / sweet shop / grocery store with his redundancy money. Places were run by two 16 year olds and a dog (I kid you not. My local newsagent had a golden labrador sitting under the counter. When I asked why, I was told that the customers thought it was cute :eek:). It got to the point where there were so many clueless operators going bang that banks started to refuse to loan against a leashold interest.

YellowSheep

So guys. What are we telling Spatter here.

Any business, food or no food related, is tough...especially these days. However it takes a certain person to operate one. And once this person operates under some very strict, but simple guidelines and does not expect a Ferrari in the first couple of years, than I ONLY can advise GO FOR IT. Otherwise stay as an employee, but than again...how safe is that option these days!!!

And Spatter. If you really want to go ahead, why don't we meet all for a pint and get the Pizza Joint up and running. Cheers Oliver

gags89

open a healthier store and start delivering!subway+quiznos are delicious and just as tasty if not tastier and would be a great idea i feel!Its not done in Ireland yet might be a gap for people who are sick of the same burger,chips,chinese,pizza stuff! Kind of like a McDelivery you can get from mcdonalds in Oz.

Lplated

An idea strikes me ... see what ye's think.

A lot of people who either run a business or want to run a business read this forum. Collectively they have a lot to offer in various ways necessary to entrepreneurship.

How about a business started collectively, or co-operatively, from here on Boards?

It would need to be something (like food, thus why i'm sticking it in here), that is general enough that could be supported by many boards users.

The idea would be to plan the business, in toto, on a public forum (think of all the publicity that would generate), and get it up and running.
Obviously a lot would need to be decided, and there would be work in it, but.... your thoughts??

Samurai

from this consumers point of view 4 star is the tastiest! mm

Ivan

Well from THIS consumers point of view, Apache are the tastiest but their services are generally the worst. People barely capable of holding down a simple conversation for a delivery service answering phones, orders getting mixed up or taking too long and just generally poor customer service.

Pretty much the same can be said for all of them. I think dominos are probably the worst in terms of food quality although their service is generally decent.

But if you want my opinion, and I'm sure you dont, then what was said previously is absolutely correct. The difficult part is the quality of your service. I've stopped ordering from Apache and Dominos simply because one has terrible delivery service and the other has awful food quality, respectively. If you want to be successfuly in the food delivery service then it is all about exactly that; your food and your service. If you cut corners you will suffer in the long-run. You can start a mom & pop store but if you keep your quality as high as possible in all respects and damn the margins, you will find that the profits will take care of themselves

blue4ever

No axe to grind here – actually wouldn’t be a big fan of the meal – anyway the thread coincides with Domino's financial results yesterday:

Here are the results for Domino's released yesterday
http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/dominos-profits-up-17pc-to-pound97m-1437871.html

Online sales were the biggest winner and Ireland up 20% y.o.y. – no many companies can boast that. I have it from another ‘independent’ company that their sales have taken off in the last few months as people have decided to stay in a lot more.

Also from dominos today http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/dominos-pizza-plans-to-deliver-10-new-outlets-1643134.html

their expansion plans.

REDZ

http://www.bistrobianconi.ie/

deepriver

1. very tough / competitive industry
2. expect high levels of direct local competition upon opening a new store
3. even tougher if you have to pay franchise fees
4. low profit margins operating a franchise, effectively you are set up to run a store at a managers wage but also except the risk of an owner/but not the profit
5. very poor pizza quality of all the major franchises
6. expect to work extremely hard
7. difficult to manage food & min wage workers
8. commercial rent too high in ireland
9. risk of signing onto a 25 year lease at a high rate