"Docklands" WTF??

Degsy

I noticed a few ads in the Metro this morning for an "exciting new development in the heart of Dublin"
Here's the blurb
"Canon Hall is a striking new development comprising of only sixty one homes situated in a prime location on the corner of Sherriff Street and East Road in the heart of the Dublin Docklands, Dublin’s most vibrant city quarter. Canon Hall represents city living at its very best. The world renowned International Financial Services Centre is literally next door, as is O2 Arena where world class performers can be enjoyed on a weekly basis. Irelands first purpose built conference centre is currently under construction at Spencer Dock. The €400m Convention Centre is one of the finest landmark buildings ever planned for the capital city and is scheduled to open in September 2010. The building will extend to over 990,000 square feet with the Royal Canal linear park to the city side of the building. The Centre will include a 2,000-seat conference facility. Opposite this the Samuel Beckett Bridge is currently under construction. It will link the Northside and Southside of the city over the River Liffey in the Dublin Docklands. Construction commenced in May 2007 and will continue until the end of 2009. The Luas extension is well under way and will serve residents of Canon Hall providing easy access to the city centre."


Fair enough untill you see the accompanying maps.
It lists the name of every street northside and southside within a mile of it but doesnt give the name of the street that its actually on ie Sherrif st.
This is an attempt to decieve people who might not be from dublin into thinking there's an area actually called Docklands and its not,in fact on Sherrif St at all.
It wouldnt be half as bad but these places arent cheap either,240 grand for a one bed apartment!

Even when the going is bad the property developers and estate agents are trying to pull a fast one.

_blank_

If anyone actually pays 240k for a one bed apt they deserve to end up on Sheriff Street tbh.

Clowns.

ET_Citywest

It's like the apartments at Northern Cross(?), on the Malahide Road. Mention Malahide, but not Darndale.

_blank_

Northern Cross, I just moved out of there.

Always gave "The Darndale Hilton" as my destination to taxi drivers.

Degsy

Has nobody told these estate agents that nobody is buying anywhere?
The cost of all the ads must nearly bankrupt the fools.Good thing too.

dumbyearbook

Degsy wrote: »

This is an attempt to decieve people who might not be from dublin into thinking there's an area actually called Docklands and its not,in fact on Sherrif St at all.
It wouldnt be half as bad but these places arent cheap either,240 grand for a one bed apartment!

Even when the going is bad the property developers and estate agents are trying to pull a fast one.

But there is an area called Docklands? and 'Docklands train station' is just off Sherriff St. Property ads tend to add a bit of sales talk to their ads nothing actually wrong with it.

See map or at www.dublindocklands.ie

Mingey

http://www.property.ie/property-for-sale/Canon-Hall-Docklands-Dublin-1/428684/

This place? I't not on the bad part of Sheriff st, it's the pretty much uninhabited part. And it is situated right beside the docklands. Still though, wouldn't pay the asking price at all.

spurious

Degsy wrote: »

Here's the blurb
"Canon Hall is a striking new development comprising of only sixty one homes situated in a prime location on the corner of Sherriff Street and East Road i

It states at the start where it is.

BendiBus

Degsy wrote: »

Here's the blurb

"situated in a prime location on the corner of Sherriff Street and East Road in the heart of the Dublin Docklands."

...but doesnt give the name of the street that its actually on ie Sherrif st. This is an attempt to decieve people...

In fairness they make it very clear where it is.

And to both yourself and the advertiser, the spelling is Sheriff

Degsy

spurious wrote: »

It states at the start where it is.

But the name Sherrif st is ommited completely from the accompanying map.

Earth Worm Jim

These are very close to my own house, they are situated right at the crossroads of sheriff street lower,upper,east road and new wapping street..

These were built and finished by 2006 and went on the market for 480k for a one bedroom in April 06........ they are finished to a very high standard and are not in the worst part of the "docklands"... in 07 they droped the price to 435k for a one bed........

I was only speaking to someone in the know recently and they commented that they will go cheaper than the 238k that they are now at..... I have also heard that they may be "bought" by the Corpo if they don't sell or maybe just they remainder that don't sell... there is also 20% social and affordable in that development, I think there is 80 or 90 appartments in total...

Another thing to "look" out for is that they are planning a 8 storey full social housing block just accross the road at the new wapping street side of sheriff street......

Anyone looking at these appartments should be looking at the 2/3bed houses in East Wall, you can get one needin work for around 210k, and with that you will have a front and back garden plus you won't have to pay a "service charge" every year just to live in your own house........

Degsy

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Anyone looking at these appartments should be looking at the 2/3bed houses in East Wall, you can get one needin work for around 210k, and with that you will have a front and back garden plus you won't have to pay a "service charge" every year just to live in your own house........

Yup.And not to mention the perpetual problems of noise from next door,having to buy a parking space,not being allowed to put a satelllite dish,no chance to extend,limited scope for alterations etc etc.

Earth Worm Jim

One thing I would say about these appartments is that they are huge and a lot better built than the "premium" ones in Spencer Dock which is only 50yards from them and closer to the "worse" part of sheriff street (though they have a wall around them to keep you safe from the "NATIVES"........)

Wishbone Ash

Here's a pic (a few months old) of the development in question for those unfamiliar with the area.

Pic taken on Sheriff Street Upper facing west - New Wapping Street up ahead on left, East Road up ahead on right.

PaulieC

what would annoy me is the description of the area as 'vibrant'. it's dead around there every night

Peewee_lane

Not true, the Green Room piano bar opened in December at the top of Upper Sheriff Street, in the Liffey Trust Centre. The National Preforming Arts are located in the centre as well as Walmer Holistic College and John Egans butchers opened this week.

The Castleforbe Apartments round the corner are lovely and I think this is great more apartments are going in, I play piano in the bar and the customers from the apartments in the surrounding areas are all professionals and really nice people I might add.

Im all for this, the street is alive at the weekends with the NPAS and the Bar is doing well too.

lostexpectation

is that yuppie enough for ya, the areas cleansed

it does say it in the first line, but that i saw it today in the paper and the map has a glaring omission.

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

Not true, the Green Room piano bar opened in December at the top of Upper Sheriff Street, in the Liffey Trust Centre. The National Preforming Arts are located in the centre as well as Walmer Holistic College and John Egans butchers opened this week.

Would that be the liffey trust that replaced the "protected building" that spontaneously combusted just as the area was being redeveloped??

And the fancy "piano bar" that’s empty every night?? By the way how much is a pint in that place?? So in your reckoning a piano bar, butchers and performing arts centre are making this area VIRBRANT?

The Castleforbes Apartments round the corner are lovely and I think this is great more apartments are going in, I play piano in the bar and the customers from the apartments in the surrounding areas are all professionals and really nice people I might add.

Them apartments went for 450k plus, how much they worth now? When you say the "professional people" are really nice, would that be appose to the people who live in the local houses, many who were born and raised in the area? How many customers does that bar get, I only ever saw 5-10 people in it? The fancy bars around the NCI don't seem to do much business or make that area VIRBRANT, sure more than half the NEW businesses are already closed...

I’m all for this, the street is alive at the weekends with the NPAS and the Bar is doing well too.

You are all for what exactly? That street is dead NOW, and it’s Saturday Night!!

Not being pessimistic or anything but these flats (canon hall) are being sold at half there original price, 2 yr after they were originally put on the market (for 480k a 1bed).. And I don't think a piano bar, butchers and a Performance arts centre would be MAJOR attractions to an area..

Anyone looking at these apartments should seriously consider looking at houses around the area, they would be better to live in and more than likely hold some value, I would be worried if I had bought in one of these new vibrant areas, like castleforbes, Island Key, the light house, Cannon Hall etc as the value of them has plummeted over the last while, not a big deal if you plan on living there but it will be a good 10yr before they will be worth what they were asking when they were selling of the plans...

Take Island Key or the light house developments, the 1st phase went at around 380k, 2nd phase went cheaper and the 3rd phase is cheaper again.. Now that isn’t very encouraging to someone looking for a new home, does it??

SoupyNorman

Going to view this development at the weekend, the build quality and finish looks impressive.

The arguments made about the area dont bother me much really, I will look at the security in place. Ive been renting in Dublin for two years and I currently live in a nice apartment in a not nice part of the city...however once night falls I wouldnt venture out, except in my motor.

Bottom line is, atm I'm paying 1 and 1/2 times in rent what I'd pay on a mortgage for a 250k property. The prices have dropped dramatically and still falling, I'm in no rush to buy and am fairly happy to sit back. They would'nt get an offer over 250k off me for the two-beds in this development and if they all sell no skin off my nose e.t.c but if possible I want the developers on their knees looking for buyers.


I'll post after my viewing with further details...

Peewee_lane

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Would that be the liffey trust that replaced the "protected building" that spontaneously combusted just as the area was being redeveloped??

The bakers that went in on the ground floor had an accidental fire, yes, it took 6 years to rebuild.

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

And the fancy "piano bar" that’s empty every night?? By the way how much is a pint in that place?? So in your reckoning a piano bar, butchers and performing arts centre are making this area VIRBRANT?

A pint of Guiness is €4.50, and its not empty every night, there is a steady flow of people from the apartments next to us that pop in. I think that the NPAS does make the area vibrant with parents and students at the weekend. The street does be packed with parents waiting to collect their kids.

Also Id like to add that we're just doing soup and sandwiches at the moment and that we're getting a chef in starting some time this month.

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Them apartments went for 450k plus, how much they worth now? When you say the "professional people" are really nice, would that be appose to the people who live in the local houses, many who were born and raised in the area? How many customers does that bar get, I only ever saw 5-10 people in it? The fancy bars around the NCI don't seem to do much business or make that area VIRBRANT, sure more than half the NEW businesses are already closed...

Recession?

Actually some of the regulars are really cool couples from Mayor Street who've lived in the area all their life. The locals who have lived in the area all their lives are sound, the professionals are the ones who come in late for a pint on their own, men in suits. As for only seeing 10-5 people in, Friday nights there has been 15-35 in the bar, Saturdays are packed and Sundays have been brilliant.

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

You are all for what exactly? That street is dead NOW, and it’s Saturday Night!!

Everyones off watching the match? Im all for the apartments and them being sold.

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Not being pessimistic or anything but these flats (canon hall) are being sold at half there original price, 2 yr after they were originally put on the market (for 480k a 1bed).. And I don't think a piano bar, butchers and a Performance arts centre would be MAJOR attractions to an area..

But they are ammenities added to the area.

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Anyone looking at these apartments should seriously consider looking at houses around the area, they would be better to live in and more than likely hold some value

tbh, its a stones throw away from the city centre and I can understand anyone wanting to live in the city centre but not wanting to be slap bang in the midst of traffic, etc taking this apartments.

Anyway, it was only my two cents, you read as if you're really angry about my views, I think apartments coming down in price is great for couples, professionals, etc that couldnt get on the housing market.

You have to understand this, those apartments at that price is great now because when the Point village is finished in 2010 and the Hotel and Dunnes Stores goes in, that area will be vibrant. The luas is going right down to the O2 also. I see the potential in the area, buying an apartment there now will be worth something in a few years due to its proximity to the O2, and being able to rent it out to people coming up from the country for a concert.

Peewee_lane

And as for my comment of the street being alive, I retract that, its not exactly as alive as Temple Bar, etc, but we do get taxis pulling up with people in them coming in for a nose.

Peewee_lane

Degsy wrote: »

This is an attempt to decieve people who might not be from dublin into thinking there's an area actually called Docklands
QUOTE]

I dont understand, what do you mean? http://www.dublindocklands.ie/

http://www.dublindocklands.ie/index.jsp?p=123&n=484

Outside the Hotels on the quays, theyve banners and painted signs calling it the docklands?

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

And as for my comment of the street being alive, I retract that, its not exactly as alive as Temple Bar, etc, but we do get taxis pulling up with people in them coming in for a nose.

You are getting me wrong, I live in the area and hope all the proposed developments, appartments and businesses succeed and contribute to the area, the main point I was making was these apartments were actualy cheap for what they are, these were built to a VERY high standard and were originaly valued at 480k for a 1 bed, they are WELL better built, bigger and nicer than the Spencer dock development which is closer to the "worse" part of sheriff street and cost 400k plus yrs back.... I said a house in the area would be a better option, which it is if you think about it??

Now to be honest, knowing whats going on in the area at the moment it will take yrs before the place becomes VIBRANT but its heading that way, might be longer than originaly proposed but it will happen and the fact these apartments are cheaper is a good thing, my house lost halve its value in the last while but I am not selling, my house is my home so I don't worry bout market values...

As for the liffey trust, the liffey trust was ( or should have being) a protected building, and it was burned down, then demolished and rebuilt, its not the original building (which is a shame as it would have added to the area more as the original building) the same goes for cahills printers and the candle factory which were all demolished or burnt just as the place was being developed..

I hear a pint of lager is 6 euro in that new pub??

Wishbone Ash

Degsy wrote: »

an attempt to decieve people who might not be from dublin into thinking there's an area actually called Docklands

It is in the area under the remit of the Dublin Docklands Development Authority, hence the reason why it is referred to as the 'Docklands'.

Peewee_lane

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

I hear a pint of lager is 6 euro in that new pub??

It certainly is not 6 euro..

Why dont you come down some day and I'll show you around?

As for the original building, it was bought by the present owner and it was his do what he wanted with. I never knew that it was a protected building and I'll ask him about that tomorrow.

Mingey

Is there a photograph of the listed NPAS predecessor? What was the history of the building?

Peewee_lane

I spoke to management here this morning, this building was never 'protected' as Earth Worm Jim implied in his earlier post.

The history of the building was that it was an old warehouse with a basement full of stagnant water.

It looked well from the front apparently, but it was burned down by a fire in a bakery on the ground floor.

Peewee_lane

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Would that be the liffey trust that replaced the "protected building" that spontaneously combusted just as the area was being redeveloped??

http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/1102/fire01_av.html?1,null,200,http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/1102/6news/6news56_5a.ram

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

I spoke to management here this morning, this building was never 'protected' as Earth Worm Jim implied in his earlier post.

The history of the building was that it was an old warehouse with a basement full of stagnant water.

It looked well from the front apparently, but it was burned down by a fire in a bakery on the ground floor.

As for the liffey trust, the liffey trust was ( or should have being) a protected building, and it was burned down, then demolished and rebuilt, its not the original building (which is a shame as it would have added to the area more as the original building) the same goes for cahills printers and the candle factory which were all demolished or burnt just as the place was being developed..

I did state it was a protected building or it should have been (and if it wasn't, it was not far off becoming one, some "old buildings" in that area date back to the 1700's)... And maybe discribing it as "an old warehouse with a basement full of stagnant water" would be a little incorrect, would it not?? I am sure when it was built it was not "an old warehouse with a basement full of stagnant water", I am sure if you look into the history a bit more you may find that out, it was a new building at some stage, it was one of the oldest building in that area, and while it may not have being protected it was a nice old building which should have been restored to it former glory before being demolished and replaced IMO..

Maybe its just because I am from the area but, after seeing the likes of the liffey trust, Rathbornes Candle factory, Cahills printers, wiggins teape etc all either burn down or be knocked down, looks like they are not for the benefit of the "history" of the area... Knocking down historic building whether they be "protected" or not and replacing them with concrete and glass box's ain't adding to the area at all. now thats my opinion (plus many others).....

Anyone from that area would know what I am talking about as we see these changes happening around us, and we would have known what it was like before the influx of spar shops, fancy apartment blocks (some ugly box's) and office blocks..... Also if you look around down that way now, most of the redevelopment has just stopped dead and a lot of these "sites" will be just that "sites" for the forseeable future.....

Peewee_lane

Well it wasnt a protected building and you gotta move with the times worm man!

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

Well it wasnt a protected building and you gotta move with the times worm man!

So Piano Bars, Performance Arts Centres and spar shops is the future of the docklands??

And as for moving with the times, if you take a walk round the Docklands you can see most "sites" are stagnent, shut, closed not VIBRANT new communities.. So we are not moving at all, might even be going backwards at this stage........

lostexpectation

are you talking about the building with decorative doorway, that was destroyed, that church beside croke park wasn't protected either do you think it was right to drive a jcb through it peewee man?

Wishbone Ash

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

after seeing the likes of the liffey trust, Rathbornes Candle factory, Cahills printers, wiggins teape etc all either burn down or be knocked down, looks like they are not for the benefit of the "history" of the area... Knocking down historic building whether they be "protected" or not and replacing them with concrete and glass box's ain't adding to the area at all. now thats my opinion

But what was demolished to build Rathbournes, Cahills, Wiggins Teape etc? Life goes on and 'progress' is made whether we like it or not.

If Chichester House was protected, we wouldn't have the Parliament House (BOI) on College Green. If Cork House was protected, we may never have had the Royal Exhange. The Kings Inns were demolished to build the Four Courts and a monastery where Trinity College now stands.

Wishbone Ash

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

These were built and finished by 2006 and went on the market for 480k for a one bedroom in April 06

They were still under construction in 2007!

Earth Worm Jim

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

But what was demolished to build Rathbournes, Cahills, Wiggins Teape etc? Life goes on and 'progress' is made whether we like it or not.

If Chichester House was protected, we wouldn't have the Parliament House (BOI) on College Green. If Cork House was protected, we may never have had the Royal Exhange. The Kings Inns were demolished to build the Four Courts and a monastery where Trinity College now stands.

1865 - East Wall Road (Dublin Petroleum Stores): In the 1860's John G Rathborne purchased a site on Dublin's North Lotts, which had been earmarked for a Cattle Market. The proposal never got off the ground and the Cattle Market was relocated from Smithfield to Aughrim Street/ Prussia Street. John G. constructed an extensive storage facility on the East Wall Road called "the Dublin Petroleum Stores". He also registered the name John G. Rathborne Limited with the Companies Office.

The last member of the Rathborne dynasty to run the factory was Henry Burnley Rathborne.
1925 - East Wall Road: In 1925 the firm re-located to its East Wall Road site, where a new factory was constructed and completed in March of that year. Shell kept on the manager and office manager of Henry B. Rathborne, and they remained with the firm until after the Second World War, Stanley Kay Sloan retiring in 1945 and Dermot Reilly Sidford retiring in 1946.

The Wiggins Teape building was built in 1931 for the Gallaher tobacco group. The EIS that accompanies the planning application states that "a number of similar buildings were built in Dublin at this time, due to the operation of protective tariffs on tobacco [John Player & Son in Glasnevin, H D Wills on the South Circular Road]... It was originally named Virginia House, but the changing economic conditions of the 1930s meant a transfer of ownership to Fry Cadbury, who renamed it Alexanda House... The building was acquired by Wiggins Teape in 1965 and renamed Gateway House."

The facade to East Wall Road includes one of the earliest known uses here of reconstituted stone, and for that reason alone would be of importance. But Stevenson was also steeped in classical architecture and this is evident in the skillful massing, composition and detail of the facade - the design of which, it appears, may even have been ordered by the use of regulating lines or proportioning systems.

Most of the land these building were built on was reclaimed land, and destined for cattle yards etc, any building was an improvement to that, these buildings replacing them now ain't an improvement?

Earth Worm Jim

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

They were still under construction in 2007!

Them apartments were finished in april 06.... and a mysterious fire in 07 brought the builders back in... I know this for a fact........

Wishbone Ash

Are these not the apartments in question - taken from the end of New Wapping Street?

Earth Worm Jim

Yes thats them.......... them apartments were on the market in 06, I personaly viewed one........ I had to live with that site, the builders for many years, it was a trailer yard before that and a Protestant church (Saint Barnabases(sp) church) and graveyard before that, demolished over 30 odd yr back (another historical building)...

If you are getting at why the building looks like its under construction in your pic, well the main (high building) was to be 8 storeys (thats what the first planning application was) and was completed in early 06 (maybe even earlier) and then it went to 9/10/11 and it may even be 12 or 13 storeys now.. It still looks like it needs finishing/snagging but they were available to purchase and view in april 06......

Peewee_lane

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

But what was demolished to build Rathbournes, Cahills, Wiggins Teape etc? Life goes on and 'progress' is made whether we like it or not.

If Chichester House was protected, we wouldn't have the Parliament House (BOI) on College Green. If Cork House was protected, we may never have had the Royal Exhange. The Kings Inns were demolished to build the Four Courts and a monastery where Trinity College now stands.

Agreed! Life goes on... this is an enterprise centre, not a lapdancing club or firearms deppo...

lostexpectation wrote: »

are you talking about the building with decorative doorway, that was destroyed, that church beside croke park wasn't protected either do you think it was right to drive a jcb through it peewee man?

Eh? JCB? I never said anything to that extent or whether or not it actually is right to demolish a building because it looks pretty or pleases the locals.

I inquired this morning in work about the original building and found that it had a decorative stone image on the front, but that every brick from the place was torn down individually and sent to a salvage yard, so no JCB was driven through at high speed and the original stone was used again. (The back of the building went on fire and there was a section to the front that was okay, but unsafe).

I know nothing about a church beside Croke Park..

My last say on all of this is....meh.

Wishbone Ash

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

well the main (high building) was to be 8 storeys (thats what the first planning application was) and was completed in early 06 (maybe even earlier) and then in went to 9/10/11 and it may even be 12 or 13 storeys now.. It still looks like it needs finishing/snagging but they were available to purchase and view in april 06......

Ah, that explains it as that picture was taken on the 26th October 2007 at 10.26am.

Peewee_lane

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

So Piano Bars, Performance Arts Centres and spar shops is the future of the docklands??

And as for moving with the times, if you take a walk round the Docklands you can see most "sites" are stagnent, shut, closed not VIBRANT new communities.. So we are not moving at all, might even be going backwards at this stage........

But, what do you think about the forthcoming O2 development, Hotel, shopping with a large Dunnes Stores, luas line? For or against? Surely these are good additions? The luas line will increase people traffic too.

Piano Bars, Preformance Art Centres and Spar Shops are just additions, they surely are not the "future(!)" of the docklands! Lmao! But the NPAS surely gives all the kids a chance to do singing, dancing and drama?

Im interested in what would you like to see, do you not want the Spar, etc?

Wishbone Ash

Peewee_lane wrote: »

I know nothing about a church beside Croke Park..

lostexpectation is referring to the demolition of a (Methodist?) church near Croke Park last year. DCC had omitted to 'list' it even though it would have merited 'listing'. There was a bit of controversy about it and a thread here at the time.

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

Agreed! Life goes on... this is an enterprise centre, not a lapdancing club or firearms deppo...



Eh? JCB? I never said anything to that extent or whether or not it actually is right to demolish a building because it looks pretty or pleases the locals.

I inquired this morning in work about the original building and found that it had a decorative stone image on the front, but that every brick from the place was torn down individually and sent to a salvage yard, so no JCB was driven through at high speed and the original stone was used again. (The back of the building went on fire and there was a section to the front that was okay, but unsafe).

I know nothing about a church beside Croke Park..

My last say on all of this is....meh.

The bakery was at the front of the building, where the fire was?? And if it was just a warehouse with stagnent water in the basement why would they

every brick from the place was torn down individually and sent to a salvage yard

Also that stagnent water came from the tunnels that are under the quays, infact they go under the liffey, as far as dublin castle, custom house and maybe even the pheonix park, now to me thats historical..

Peewee_lane

No, when the building was purchased originally, it was a warehouse, old and the basement had to be pumped out because of the water.

They then turned it into the Liffey Trust Centre, due to the fact that there was 75% unemployment in the area at the time. They helped people from the area develop business plans, companies, etc, all free of charge.

They are still doing this, they just added a bar in on the corner. The NPAS moved in on top to brand new studios and offices, a butchers who was in the original building before the fire took a slot again and a business from Raheny, Walmer Holistic College took a slot too.

Its not about moving forward and creating a cement image, its still all about promoting employment and business in the area, which they sought to do in 1984.

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

No, when the building was purchased originally, it was a warehouse, old and the basement had to be pumped out because of the water.

They then turned it into the Liffey Trust Centre, due to the fact that there was 75% unemployment in the area at the time. They helped people from the area develop business plans, companies, etc, all free of charge.

They are still doing this, they just added a bar in on the corner. The NPAS moved in on top to brand new studios and offices, a butchers who was in the original building before the fire took a slot again and a business from Raheny, Walmer Holistic College took a slot too.

Its not about moving forward and creating a cement image, its still all about promoting employment and business in the area, which they sought to do in 1984.

Don't talk to me about creating employment in the area, NONE of them sites even offer LOCAL EMPLOYMENT, even though they had a 20% local employment clause in the planning permission.. Infact the local communities had to picket the DDDA and some of these sites to stress that fact...

Also I attended lots of these "community consultations" where we we told there would be jobs for everyone, like cleaning, labouring and security... Not a thing about office jobs in these big companies opening these massive buildings.. I know 15 local lads who have trades that are in Austrailia now, and I know lots of locals that have degree's and these "Consultants" offer cleaning work or security jobs...

Could you name any local people who have benefited from the New or Old Liffey Trust?? Who from the locality owns any of these businesses, or even employed by them?? And I know what it was supposed to be for and went to all the meetings... And its not for free, the tax payer pays for it AFAIK..

Peewee_lane

Earth Worm Jim wrote: »

Could you name any local people who have benefited from the New or Old Liffey Trust?? Who from the locality owns any of these businesses, or even employed by them??

Of course I can! We've two lads in from the area, one from Sheriff Street and one from East Wall, ones managing and the other is our electrician. They're just off the top of my head.

Theres a coffee shop opening soon, maybe some young girls might take a full time or part time job.

You come across as really irrate and argumentative. Its hard to have a chat online when someones being so negative back. This all isnt meant to be getting under your skin on purpose. I understand you're unhappy with the apartments but the Liffey Trust is a positive entity to the area.

Earth Worm Jim

Peewee_lane wrote: »

Of course I can! We've two lads in from the area, one from Sheriff Street and one from East Wall, ones managing and the other is our electrician. They're just off the top of my head.

Theres a coffee shop opening soon, maybe some young girls might take a full time or part time job.

You come across as really irrate and argumentative. Its hard to have a chat online when someones being so negative back. This all isnt meant to be getting under your skin on purpose. I understand you're unhappy with the apartments but the Liffey Trust is a positive entity to the area.

You seem to know the whole plan for the area, do you??

You are far off the mark, I live and work with in the community and have done for a long time, calling me irrate or hard to talk to is not enforcing your view...
I have no problem with the apartments or the liffey trust at all; I just live in the real world and know what’s what.....

You mention 2 people who work there.... Now this is in an area that is supposed to have over 90,000 people working in the area, I know what I am talking about, maybe you should look at the bigger picture and not just what you envisage, you may see some utopia around the area but in reality its very far from it... the PR pitches of these NEW developments are NOTHING like what’s the reality of it.. And that’s coming from someone who knows....

Peewee_lane

I see your point now...what exactly is the delay then in the other new developments? Are you getting any answers at all from them?

Anyways, I know the plan because I work there.

Earth Worm Jim

Are we gettin answers NO.........

Do you know the plan, NO I doubt it as the planners DON'T know the plan, and that a fact, I have seen many and each is pie in the sky as far as I can see, liffey islands, moates, Parisian Walkways, rooftop alotments, etc etc I could go on....... No mention of schools, community centres, health centres, day care centre, play grounds etc etc..

So you can see as a local why we would have a difference of opinions of whats really happening as oppose to what we were promised..

Infact what the new developers PR companies propose when advertising their projects is totaly different to what we were consulted on and promised, its looking like this whole DOCKLANDS thing has just stopped and won't ever be the envisiaged MASTER PLAN for Dublin.. If this is what the future holds, I think we would be better off with the OLD derelict industrial area over the NEW ghost town..

Mingey

Surely the NPAS provides something for the local community? Do the local kids go there?

I can see both sides of this argument, but in all fairness the city is growing, the docklands have remained untouched for a long time. It was bound to happen sooner or later. If anything, at least it will increase your property value in years to come. Especially if you own a 3 bedroom house with front back gardens. Progress is slow at the moment which is understandable but not every has ceased to a shell. The Point Village and Luas will all be ready in 1-2 years, I bet you won't be complaining when they are up & running.

Earth Worm Jim

Mingey wrote: »

Surely the NPAS provides something for the local community? Do the local kids go there?

I can see both sides of this argument, but in all fairness the city is growing, the docklands have remained untouched for a long time. It was bound to happen sooner or later. If anything, at least it will increase your property value in years to come. Especially if you own a 3 bedroom house with front back gardens. Progress is slow at the moment which is understandable but not every has ceased to a shell. The Point Village and Luas will all be ready in 1-2 years, I bet you won't be complaining when they are up & running.

I am not argueing with anyone, just pointing it out from a locals side...

I am all for redevelopment and new amienities, business, jobs etc..

The Docklands masterplan has become a BIG WHITE ELEPHANT at the moment, Not a lot is going on at all... It years behind track and looks as if it will never be what was originaly envisaged... Even the point village, some of that may be in trouble, Dunnes may even pull out of the project and they are the anchor store for the point village....

And if you mean complaining about most developers not abiding by the planning guidelines in area's like local employment (20%), the major businesses in the area Not employing any/many local people, school building projects being yrs behind schedual (even in doubt), noise and dirt polution, and some with a total disregard for people already living in the area.. I am complaining but would you rather I just sit back and say nothing...

As for the value of my home, thats only a number, maybe if we all regarded our houses/apartments as homes rather than investments, the country would not be in the state its in today.....