is there an all out gangland war going on?

pebbles21

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0120/coldwinters.html

another one shot dead this evening after 3 last night and countless others in the last few weeks

tribulus

Meh

Pen1987

Countless others?

I didn't notice any more than normal to be honest...

Biggins

It was expected if its related to a previous recent shooting!

Kiera

Hopefully no innocent people get shot and they all just shoot each other. No loss tbh.....

pebbles21

Pen1987 wrote: »

Countless others?

I didn't notice any more than normal to be honest...

ok not countless sorry but a spate of shooting

pebbles21

Biggins wrote: »

It was expected!

any idea who it was biggins?

brendansmith

Hmmmm, I see whats goin on here.

Nehaxak

Yes is the answer but it's been going on for a while. The recession (strangely enough) has made it all the more worse by fueling greed among drug dealers (drug pushing thrives in such times) who are trying to control wider area's outside of what they were used too, which then eventually leads to tit for tat killings until enough are dead or scared enough to move on elsewhere with their pushing.

Also a factor is that a significant amount of "political" underworld figures where also arrested in the past few weeks, who kept things generally in check around Dublin at least. So now that they're off the scene for a while, a power stuggle ensues to gain control of the void left otherwise mostly untouchable.

Would be easy to blame the Gardaí for not doing much about it but they've neither the competence, training, resources or support to deal with it either so not their fault. Not saying they're incompetent, I'm just saying they don't have significant actual current competence in their staff/force to deal with the problem in a proper manner and enough time and resources (as well as man power) to dedicate to dealing with it.

Might take a couple of famous nobodies/models to die before they get support again.

m83

To answer your question, you seek someone with a greater level of intellect than me.

JIZZLORD

i blame society!

The_Minister

Nehaxak wrote: »

Also a factor is that a significant amount of "political" underworld figures where also arrested in the past few weeks, who kept things generally in check around Dublin at least. So now that they're off the scene for a while, a power stuggle ensues to gain control of the void left otherwise mostly untouchable.

Thats one of the big ironies - the better the guards do in fighting these people, the more people die.

TheNog

Nehaxak wrote: »

Yes is the answer but it's been going on for a while. The recession (strangely enough) has made it all the more worse by fueling greed among drug dealers (drug pushing thrives in such times) who are trying to control wider area's outside of what they were used too, which then eventually leads to tit for tat killings until enough are dead or scared enough to move on elsewhere with their pushing.

Also a factor is that a significant amount of "political" underworld figures where also arrested in the past few weeks, who kept things generally in check around Dublin at least. So now that they're off the scene for a while, a power stuggle ensues to gain control of the void left otherwise mostly untouchable.

Would be easy to blame the Gardaí for not doing much about it but they've neither the competence, training, resources or support to deal with it either so not their fault. Not saying they're incompetent, I'm just saying they don't have significant actual current competence in their staff/force to deal with the problem in a proper manner and enough time and resources (as well as man power) to dedicate to dealing with it.

Might take a couple of famous nobodies/models to die before they get support again.

The problem with trying to put these people in prison is the necessary proof to do it. Although some have been caught red-handed such as Liam Keane, the majority of criminals dont get caught in the act. The only alternative available then is a long investigation and for a successful investigation you need statements from people in the know. Statements and people who will stand up in court and here is the problem. The people in the know of a scrote are either too afraid to stand up or are involved with the scrote.

People and their families have been intimidated in the past with their lives. So the question is

"If you saw a murder and could identify the culprit, would you stand up in court and give evidence if you and your family have been threatened?"

Most people wouldnt and I couldnt blame them. Remember these guys are complete and utter physco's and will do anything to protect them, their money and their patch.

utick

Kiera wrote: »

Hopefully no innocent people get shot and they all just shoot each other. No loss tbh.....

i dont think there were innocents killed but there was a security guy shot in dublin yesterday aswell in a botched robbery

TheNog

utick wrote: »

i dont think there were innocents killed but there was a security guy shot in dublin yesterday aswell in a botched robbery

Unfortunately thats not entire true. The most recent ones below:

Anthony Campbell
http://www.independent.ie/other/gangland-victim-was-an-innocent-bystander-1117047.html

Shane Geoghan
http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/national-news/limerick-gangland-victim-to-be-laid-to-rest-1534763.html

AskYerMa

who ****in cares, aslong as innocent ppl aren't gettin killed, let these scumbags shoot each other........

utick

TheNog wrote: »

Unfortunately thats not entire true. The most recent ones below:

Anthony Campbell
http://www.independent.ie/other/gangland-victim-was-an-innocent-bystander-1117047.html

Shane Geoghan
http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/national-news/limerick-gangland-victim-to-be-laid-to-rest-1534763.html

oh i know there have been inocents killed alright and you could probably add many more to the 2 you mentioned but i think he was asking just about last night

AskYerMa

yes i was just talking about them last nite, its sick that that poor young lad who was the plumber was shot dead for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, but by in large its gangland murder on another gangland member... leave them to it i say

utick

Pen1987 wrote: »

Countless others?

I didn't notice any more than normal to be honest...

apparently was 10 people shot in the last 2 weeks, not countless but quite a few

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0121/1232474671090.html

TheNog

utick wrote: »

oh i know there have been inocents killed alright and you could probably add many more to the 2 you mentioned but i think he was asking just about last night

sorry didnt see the other post

Slunk

Whats making things worse is the fact these people cannot shoot properly. I heard on the news he was shot four times in the head and was taken to hospital where he later died. What are they shooting with. Water pistols? Surely he was able to tell his assosiates who it was and put the hit out on them before he died.

Same in Tallaght, two others in the car were injured, so they know who shot them, so revenge attacks should be expected. And in Summerhill not so long ago, one of the people shot lived for a few days then died. He must have known the shooters as he was in a car with them.

gurramok

Its getting to be like scenes out of The Wire out there!

Victor

Kiera wrote: »

Hopefully no innocent people get shot and they all just shoot each other. No loss tbh.....

Even if "guilty" people get shot, those people have families and neighbours.

Slunk

What about that bloke who was shot in Tallaght. Says in the paper he was known to Gardai as a thug who was into burglary, imtimidation and random attacks on people. He broke a womans jaw. He like to act the hard man. What about all the people and their families who have been victim to his thuggery?? People like this are scum, their families must know what they are like and although I have some sympathy for his parents, if he was out of control, its not an awful lot. Better off dead that inflicting more misery on decent people

Deadzone

Victor wrote: »

Even if "guilty" people get shot, those people have families and neighbours.

Should have thought about them before they decided to get involved.

mountainyman

Victor wrote: »

Even if "guilty" people get shot, those people have families and neighbours.

So what? Unless the neighbours or family are hurt in the crossfire. I feel sorry for the neighbours but their own families should have nothing to do with them.

It is terrible about Shane Geoghan.

Victor

mountainyman wrote: »

So what? Unless the neighbours or family are hurt in the crossfire. I feel sorry for the neighbours but their own families should have nothing to do with them.

So a baby should disown its parents / wider family?

Shiny

Victor wrote: »

So a baby should disown its parents / wider family?

No, but if its scumbag Father is shot and killed, wouldn't it at least
reduce the possibility of it going up to be a similar scumbag too?

Relevant

Even if these guys only kill each other, what about the gardai who have to respond to the calls and investigate the murders? They have no choice in it so is it ok that they have to put themselves in danger?

mountainyman

Victor wrote: »

So a baby should disown its parents / wider family?

No babies have been killed in the current violence. The mother shouldn't be with a criminal though.

tbh

Shiny wrote: »

No, but if its scumbag Father is shot and killed, wouldn't it at least
reduce the possibility of it going up to be a similar scumbag too?

eh no. It would dramatically increase the possibility.

mountainyman

Relevant wrote: »

Even if these guys only kill each other, what about the gardai who have to respond to the calls and investigate the murders? They have no choice in it so is it ok that they have to put themselves in danger?

I don't understand your point.
It is the job of the guards to put themselves in danger. I respect them for it and I despise those guards who won't.

I respect the men who investigate gangland murder. I would be happy enough to let gangsters kill each other.

Wagon

tbh wrote: »

eh no. It would dramatically increase the possibility.

Yeah, we call those 'revenge killings'. Such bull****. It'll never end until it escalates to the point that there is one night of holy war in which so many of them die. Or it'll never end, which i think is more likely.

Relevant

mountainyman wrote: »

I don't understand your point.
It is the job of the guards to put themselves in danger. I respect them for it and I despise those guards who won't.

I respect the men who investigate gangland murder. I would be happy enough to let gangsters kill each other.

People are condoning gangland war. The more killings that are tolerated the greater danger gardai are in.

ToxicPaddy

pebbles21 wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0120/coldwinters.html

Shot 6 times in the head, they were making sure he was dead anyway.. :eek:

ben bedlam

Let all the gangland scum and filth wipe each other out. They are lowlive degenerates, subhuman trash that are nothing but a drain on our courts and prisons.

Victor

mountainyman wrote: »

The mother shouldn't be with a criminal though.

Thats not something a child can control.

mountainyman wrote: »

I don't understand your point. It is the job of the guards to put themselves in danger. I respect them for it and I despise those guards who won't. I respect the men who investigate gangland murder. I would be happy enough to let gangsters kill each other.

Sure, but do you think they and the medical staff like having to deal with these things?

shane86

Shot 6 times in the head, they were making sure he was dead anyway

He was still alive when they got him to hospital :eek: Fcukin hell, he must have been like the Russian Tony and Chris from the Sopranos took to the forest!

After Anne Doyle announced it as the fourth murder of the year already, it showed the scene, including a signpost to a place called Kilshane.

Thats an omen, I cant get out to Oz fast enough :pac:

az2wp0sye65487

I have abolutely no sympathy for any of the scum who are involved in criminal activities, and get killed for it.

However, there are always people affected by these killings on a wider scale who may not have had any involvement in any wrong-doing. Not to mention cases of mistaken identity etc. where innocent people are murdered.

I'm starting to get more worried about public safety seeing as how these scumbags don't seem to have any regard for anyone's life. They wouldn't hesitate in turning their gun on any of us for the slightest thing.

I'm also starting to worry for my own personal safety, as last night I was stopped by Gardaí (albeit at a checkpoint near this shooting) and quizzed before being let on my way. This has happened on other occasions in the past when there have been murders etc. in a certain area. I was 'stopped' by a passing Garda car so they could get a better look at me before saying 'no; wrong person' and driving off.

What I'm getting at is if the Gardaí can mistake me for one of these scrotes then whats to say I won't be the next person who is supposidly "in the wrong place at the wrong time" and mistaken for one of the scumbags involved in a fued etc. When I mentioned being stopped to colleagues they said: "Ah sure they probably thought you were ******, you do look a bit like him!"

Snowie

i think they should leave them at it and the last guy to be alive gos to jail

CPT. SURF

You know it crumbles that way
least thats what they say when you play the game
but God forbid you ever had to wake up to hear the news
then you really might know whats it like to have to lose

Yeah then you really might know whats its like

rossie1977

Kiera wrote: »

Hopefully no innocent people get shot and they all just shoot each other. No loss tbh.....

all shoot each other?? that will never happen, they are like weeds, for every one you pluck 5 will rise in its place

Kiera

rossie1977 wrote: »

all shoot each other?? that will never happen, they are like weeds, for every one you pluck 5 will rise in its place

Well one can only hope, Rossie.

Victor: What about the families of the people they are killing with their drugs? I honestly couldnt careless about these guys killing each other.

greatness is me

haha yes ther is a war.. so lets all go get guns and kill brian cowell and take over the goverment

metallidude

By irish standards.. yes, maybe. But for me, no there isn't really anything.. The number of people getting shot at is still very low.

Relevant

greatness is me wrote: »

haha yes ther is a war.. so lets all go get guns and kill brian cowell and take over the goverment

What did Brian Cowell ever do to you? I'm sure his death wouldn't have much of an impact on the government

Brian Cowell

SAVE_ME.222

The funniest thing about these gangland killings is when adrian kennedy talks about them on his show:

"Ahh jayzziz adrian, he was a lovely youngfella, never bleedin did anythin on anyone"

... apart from the 22 convictions for serious assault, aggravated burglary, etc.

arybvtcw0eolkf

TheNog wrote: »

"If you saw a murder and could identify the culprit, would you stand up in court and give evidence if you and your family have been threatened?"

Tbh if I witnessed a gangland figure being murdered there's not a snowballs chance in hell I'd expose myself and my family to danger by going witness.

I think its also got the stage where anyone in Dublin or Limerick could potentially be a witness to a gangland murder on any given day.

And while I except that its an almost impossible task for the GS to put these animals away I would advocate Army and Garda search teams randoming moving into and locking down whole area's where not a single person or vehicle moves without a complete search for drugs and/or weapons.

Nehaxak

Mairt wrote: »

And while I except that its an almost impossible task for the GS to put these animals away I would advocate Army and Garda search teams randoming moving into and locking down whole area's where not a single person or vehicle moves without a complete search for drugs and/or weapons.

Doesn't work. Already been done in Ballymun (no army but massive teams of armed Gardai). All it ended up doing was piss everyone off that had nothing to do with gangs, drugs or otherwise.
They (the Garda) tried to do similar back in the 80's in Ballybrack and Monkstown farm - didn't work then either, only ended up with gangs of people surrounding cops and egging them on to start shooting, was a complete farce.

The Gardai don't need support from the army, they need resources from the government and support also for those in the communities effected by any part of it all.

A lot of the gangland killings are targetted and not random drive-by LA style crap so some people in the media and elsewhere need to calm themselves down a bit. The Gardai know who is responsible and know everyone involved but they can't be everywhere all the time and that is where resources and support for them from the government comes in to help that.

The defense forces efforts in all of this would be better spent patroling our coasts for inward drug shipments (not fishermen trying to make a living) and at our ports et all backing up customs teams to stop the drugs coming in to the country in the first place. That and possibly backing up Garda on high profile drugs raids on high profile drug dealers, not shoving a gun in the face of some teenager selling a ten spot on a street corner.

uprising

pebbles21 wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0120/coldwinters.html

another one shot dead this evening after 3 last night and countless others in the last few weeks

The media reports that people read are 30%-50% correct, I know this for a fact, I live in the so called murder triangle in Finglas and personally knew all or most of the people who have been murdered here in the past few years including the latest, I'm not into anything like they were alleged to have been involved in whatsoever, I simply grew up with them and knew them from school, being neighbours, hanging around with them when i was younger etc. The so called "DON" gets dragged into every murder that happens in dublin, the papers like to add fiction to fact, weather its deliberate or just being mis-informed from their sources I dont know?.
I believe the latest victim was killed in revenge for a murder in a Finglas pub a few months ago or its possible it was his new buddies that wanted more of the cake, actually there was a rumor that the body found near the airport the week before was his, it turned out to be false, but a week later it came true.
Finglas has no shortage of guns or young fools looking for respect from higher ups, but like all murders, any sniff of who might have been involved plants the seed for the next hit, which will come.
Its a dog eat dog world here, even an argument can lead to a murder its that bad and theres a stockpile of sawn-off shotguns around that have been replaced with glocks as weapon of choice.
Each generation gets more evil than the one before, I remember people around me used to be shocked by a murder, now its just an every other day occurance.
I've seen guns being discharged in public and 15mins later a few squad cars drive by, circle up and down end of story, not reported.

SoWatchaWant

CPT. SURF wrote: »

You know it crumbles that way
least thats what they say when you play the game
but God forbid you ever had to wake up to hear the news
then you really might know whats it like to have to lose

Yeah then you really might know whats its like

There's a forum for people like you. You should post in Matt Holck's poetry thread.

Or you could be explicit... not all of us are bothered to interpret verse after the Leaving Cert.