Irish Rail approaches the last stop?

Judgement Day

Internal correspondence that I have seen today would suggest major retrograde retrenchment is coming down the line for the whole IE network.

Apparently among proposals being considered by CIE/IE management are the following:

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.
2) The total discontinuation of Fastrack from 31/3/09.
3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.
4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

If the trains could be driven from CTC I am sure that it would be considered. A totally unmanned rail system operated, where only absolutely essential, by cheap foreign labour and outside contractors is the appalling scenario that CIE/IE are considering!

:eek::eek::eek:

DWCommuter

Judgement Day wrote: »

Internal correspondence that I have seen today would suggest major retrograde retrenchment is coming down the line for the whole IE network.

Apparently among proposals being considered by CIE/IE management are the following:

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.
2) The total discontinuation of Fastrack from 31/3/09.
3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.
4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

If the trains could be driven from CTC I am sure that it would be considered. A totally unmanned rail system operated, where only absolutely essential, by cheap foreign labour and outside contractors is the appalling scenario that CIE/IE are considering!

:eek::eek::eek:

For some reason they got it into their heads that running a slimmed down, rationalised network with multiple outsourcing (think catering) was the way to go. Its not. The recession will change the playing field for many, but of course Irish Rail are probably still implementing strategy based on the nation being so engrossed in getting rich quick in a booming economy, that it will take them 10 years to realise and adapt to the changing landscape. As in, were skint again. Remember it took them years to get a handle on the fact that there was cash for investment. By the time they got with it, we had a half arsed Cork service, a DMU frenzy, trains from all over the planet and a customer service policy based on people too busy to care. All wrong, misguided and lagging behind any kind of consumer sentiment.

Victor

Judgement Day wrote: »

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.

Not necessarily bad. Thers many a time I've seen several staff wandering around a train, but no customer service or ticket checking. I think there should be someone there to welcome you onboard and help you and deal with any problems or questions you have. I look forward to seeign this implement on Cork-Dublin services first, seeing as they already have people wearing train host uniforms.

2) The total discontinuation of Fastrack from 31/3/09.

How big is the business and did it cover the numbers of staff involved - note the time used by staff dealing with packages is exactly teh tiem they are needed for assisting passengers and for safety duties.

3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.

To be welcomed - one of rail's boasts is that it is safe. moderns ystesm are substantially safer than legacy systems. Bridges are fundmentally safer than level crossings.

4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

It seems that internet sales are eating into booking office sales. To be honest, I'd prefer to see 3 ticket machines and a customer service agent on the concourse / platforms than two ticket agents, one permanently hiding in the back office.

If the trains could be driven from CTC I am sure that it would be considered.

Isn't this theoretically posssible with the DART?

A totally unmanned rail system operated, where only absolutely essential,

Is there a problem with this?

by cheap

I think even they know "Pay peanuts, get monkeys".

foreign labour

Is that begrudgery or bigotry? I think there is some agreement we signed up to where we accept foreign wor4kers in exchange for us being able to work in other countries and sell our products there. Somtehing called the EU/EEA I think.

Judgement Day

Victor - are you a Moderator, a Troll or are you after Barry Kenny's job?

You have an answer for everything. I will revert to Fastrack as it is my pet gripe and I could monopolise the entire Boards.ie with discussion of the other items.

Fastrack involved few extra staff, other than those employed at Dublin termini and possibly Cork. Even in these places the parcels were, until recently, dealt with by the left luggage staff until they too were dispensed with. At rural locations the still extant depotman/signalman dealt with Fastrack as part of their duties. Now they are still employed but with little or nothing to do except polish the new ticket vending machines and sleep - some saving there. On trains the parcels were dealt with by the guard now also largely dispensed with. So, all in all, Fastrack was a service that should have cost little or nothing to operate given that most of the staff were/are already in place. Even in its badly run down state Fastrack was carrying 800,000 items per annum the last time I saw figures for it.

To justify their existence the railways need to maximise their revenue and Fastrack if properly run should have been contributing to this.

I will not go on as I feel that you cannot possibly be serious with your other points and were only trying to wind me up! I have studied CIE closely for almost 30 years and I assure you that they haven't the slightest idea what they are doing and care less. :mad:

Run_to_da_hills

Judgement Day wrote: »

4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

The swing away from the ticket offices to online booking is already happening amd they are doing this cleaverly by penalising you for purchasing your ticket at an office.

With suburban networks the use of registered smart cards topped up on line, on your mobile phone or at retail touch pads removes the necessity of any ticket office. Only drawback of both systems is that they will leave digital fingerprints.

Judgement Day

Yeah I can really see that catching on with the OAPs and other technophobes. What about the security factor - who wants to wait about at a lonely, unmanned station with only the ticket machine to protect them from druggies/drunks and assorted scumbags? I lived on the Limerick Jn./Waterford line for some years - my local station was unmanned and there was no way of even knowing if the train was ever coming or had been cancelled, derailed or whatever. Eventually after much complaining a public phone was installed with a notice stating that if it rang to please answer it as it might be information about your train - I jest not!

CIE - Can Ireland Endure

DWCommuter

In Dublin terms at Connolly and Heuston fastrack had approx. 13 staff (counter staff, loaders and office. In Connolly, counter staff doubled as loaders.) Let me break it down further. As of today connolly has 3 counter staff in its depot. Loading is shared. One person works the site office. Heuston has 5 counter staff, 2 loaders and 2 office staff.

If anyone thinks that the closure of fastrack is a good thing in these recessionary times, then think again. Apart from it being an obvious additional (with little outlay) revenue earning service for Irish Rail, it was also a very cheap, popular and effective method of sending small goods. Once its gone, businesses are faced with no alternative same day city to city service (at that cost) and will inevitably end up paying more or simply not functioning in an as efficient manner. I do work for one particular German company that have been in Ireland since the 1930s and they are devastated by this announcement as they relied on it to cost effectively dispatch parts to railheads for collection by engineers.

How big is the business and did it cover the numbers of staff involved - note the time used by staff dealing with packages is exactly teh tiem they are needed for assisting passengers and for safety duties.

That kind of statement is obviously from someone who chooses to either ignore the economic realities or just hasn't got any idea of how something as simple as fastrack works and has worked to assist the boom that this country enjoyed. It is a customer service factor. Most customers (and I speak from experience) were individuals or small businesses shipping very small parcels on trains that were going somewhere anyway. Staffing was minimal in major termini as it didn't require many anyway. However the refusal of Mullingar and Wexford station staff to handle fastrack from a railcar (as in take it off the train themselves) didn't help matters. (Were back to eliminating train guards again Judgement Day) If you don't know the detail Victor, then try not to comment. In some areas you may be out of your depth.

L1011

I would presume the ending of FastTrack is just another means to the end of having a passenger ONLY railway. The systematic death of rail freight - ably assisted by refusing to operate Foynes, disconnecting the Cork freight depot, etc - is of course the main part...

Mint Sauce

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The swing away from the ticket offices to online booking is already happening amd they are doing this cleaverly by penalising you for purchasing your ticket at an office.

some times you have no choice but buy the over priced ticket from the office, get the trian from sligo a few times a year, last time i checked, this route could not be brought on line

:mad:

DWCommuter

MYOB wrote: »

I would presume the ending of FastTrack is just another means to the end of having a passenger ONLY railway. The systematic death of rail freight - ably assisted by refusing to operate Foynes, disconnecting the Cork freight depot, etc - is of course the main part...

I guess fastrack was the final solution in IEs railfreight decimation. But it wasn't freight as such. Ironically it was the method to reduce the need for freight trains in the early 70s and to encourage people to send goods by passenger trains. They used to charge extra for it!!!!

Run_to_da_hills

Judgement Day wrote: »

Yeah I can really see that catching on with the OAPs and other technophobes. What about the security factor - who wants to wait about at a lonely, unmanned station with only the ticket machine to protect them from druggies/drunks and assorted scumbags? I lived on the Limerick Jn./Waterford line for some years - my local station was unmanned and there was no way of even knowing if the train was ever coming or had been cancelled, derailed or whatever. Eventually after much complaining a public phone was installed with a notice stating that if it rang to please answer it as it might be information about your train - I jest not!

CIE - Can Ireland Endure

When the system is in full swing I can imagine there will be a zero tolerance policy enforced.

Just as in the London transport system all unmanned stations will be covered in CCTV with panic buttons along the platforms. Anyone caught abusing the system or causing trouble could have their registered smart card privelages revoked and could be denied future travel. London is now almost 80% Oystercard and at that are most are registered.

L1011

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

When the system is in full swing I can imagine there will be a zero tolerance policy enforced.

Just as in the London transport all stations will be covered in CCTV with panic buttons along the platforms. Anyone caught abusing the system or causing trouble will have their registered smart card privelages revoked and could be denied future travel.

A panic button is sod all use at a traditional Irish station, in the back of nowhere vaguely near the place its named after. Hit it and someone might arrive in a few hours, maybe.

That said, NIR managed to cope with mostly unmanned stations even with their more 'difficult' social issues up there.

Judgement Day

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

When the system is in full swing I can imagine there will be a zero tolerance policy enforced.

Just as in the London transport all stations will be covered in CCTV with panic buttons along the platforms. Anyone caught abusing the system or causing trouble will have their registered smart card privelages revoked and could be denied future travel.

Ho, bloody Ho,ho ....you can't be serious! Would this be like the Govts. zero tolerance policy on crime or 'the last sting of a dying wasp'? :mad:

lostinsuperfunk

IE don't advertise Fasttrack very much any more. I'd say a lot of people don't even know it's still running. It could be a real winner. As far as I know, no other courier will ensure next-day (let alone same-day!) intercity delivery if the dispatch is after 4pm. And the dismal service An Post provides these days makes it even more attractive.

Easy way to close something down: stop promoting it, then when business drops off, point out that it's no longer profitable

Run_to_da_hills

Judgement Day wrote: »

Ho, bloody Ho,ho ....you can't be serious! Would this be like the Govts. zero tolerance policy on crime or 'the last sting of a dying wasp'? :mad:

MYOB wrote: »

A panic button is sod all use at a traditional Irish station, in the back of nowhere vaguely near the place its named after. Hit it and someone might arrive in a few hours, maybe.

That said, NIR managed to cope with mostly unmanned stations even with their more 'difficult' social issues up there.

You will not be able to access the platform without touching in your smart card / National ID so they will know who exactly who you are (Unless you decide to scale down a wall or get in through the tracks) By that time the CCTV and Infrared would have set off alarm bells and alerted the authorities.

One only has to look at the up and coming system in the UK and those that operate it and see how close to a zero tolerance police state.

Nostradamus

Judgement Day wrote: »

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.

That's a good idea. Better to have active staff on the train itself as it is running. I like this idea a lot.

Judgement Day wrote: »

3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.

So no more early train from Sligo having to stop and blow the horn at the LC gates south of Ballymoate station and an oul biddy in her dressing gown being awakened out of bed and running out in her slippers to open the gates. Be a shame to see such time honoured traditions come to an end...

Judgement Day wrote: »

4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

If the trains could be driven from CTC I am sure that it would be considered. A totally unmanned rail system operated, where only absolutely essential, by cheap foreign labour and outside contractors is the appalling scenario that CIE/IE are considering!

:eek::eek::eek:

Sounds like a good move. But knowing CIE this will take 25 years to implement.

Nostradamus

MYOB wrote: »

I would presume the ending of FastTrack is just another means to the end of having a passenger ONLY railway. The systematic death of rail freight - ably assisted by refusing to operate Foynes, disconnecting the Cork freight depot, etc - is of course the main part...

Fasttrack is more of a passenger train product.

The railfreight thing is just weird. Apparently IE get offered all kinds of grants to haul railfreight and customers are looking to use it. But IE management basically tell them to go away. It is really weird. From what I was told there is even some EU railfreight capital grant to help pay for sidings to industry and freight wagons and still they ignore it.

A private railfreight company is the way to go - but the CIE rail unions would never allow that. Rail freight lobby groups such as IRN would always support the train driver unions over implementation of a private rail freight operator if it came down to that choice as they depend on CIE train drivers to let them get good photos of locos or haul trainspotter specials on the Limerick Rosslare line so they can stick their heads out of an old carraige window which means everything to them. So in other words railfreight in Ireland is finished.

Judgement Day

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You will not be able to access the platform without touching in your smart card / National ID so they will know who exactly who you are (Unless you decide to scale down a wall or get in through the tracks) By that time the CCTV and Infrared would have set off alarm bells and alerted the authorities.

One only has to look at the up and coming system in the UK and those that operate it and see how close to a zero tolerance police state.

It will certainly create lots of employment. Just how many more Gardai do you think will be needed? I can just see the Gardai racing down to the local station lights flashing, sirens wailing, guns blazing because somebody has accessed the station platform without using a smart card! Incidentally, I had no idea that we were due to get a National ID card in Ireland. Maybe CIE know something that the rest of us don't.:D

Judgement Day

Nostradamus wrote: »

That's a good idea. Better to have active staff on the train itself as it is running. I like this idea a lot.




You don't appear to understand what I meant. Ticket checkers are already on the trains and will be dispensed with further reducing staffing levels. I think you mean ticket barrier staff and they will always be needed to help passengers negotiate the non-working automatic turnstile/barriers - see Connolly Station.

Nostradamus

Judgement Day wrote: »

Nostradamus wrote: »

That's a good idea. Better to have active staff on the train itself as it is running. I like this idea a lot.




You don't appear to understand what I meant. Ticket checkers are already on the trains and will be dispensed with further reducing staffing levels. I think you mean ticket barrier staff and they will always be needed to help passengers negotiate the non-working automatic turnstile/barriers - see Connolly Station.

So you are saying both train hostesses and ticket collectors will be on a train?

Judgement Day

NO JUST THE RAIL HOST or/HOSTESS!
Great for passenger safety and security?:)

I am away to bed this thread is doing my head in.

Nostradamus

Judgement Day wrote: »

NO JUST THE RAIL HOST or/HOSTESS!
Great for passenger safety and security?:)

I am away to bed this thread is doing my head in.

I really can't see how this is so bad.

Run_to_da_hills

Judgement Day wrote: »

It will certainly create lots of employment. Just how many more Gardai do you think will be needed? I can just see the Gardai racing down to the local station lights flashing, sirens wailing, guns blazing because somebody has accessed the station platform without using a smart card! Incidentally,

The authorities don't need to be present, once they have you on record from CCTV footage or digital fingerprints they can kick down doors later.

They have also the option of cutting you off from society by blocking your smart card and denying travel and purchasing rights until you hand yourself in. I could see the wearing of hoodies being banned on public property in the near future.

Judgement Day wrote: »

I had no idea that we were due to get a National ID card in Ireland.

I think at this stage we can say the "National ID" or "Euro ID" by its proposed correct title I would put it is inevitable and is only a matter of when and not if. .

Nostradamus

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The authorities don't need to be present, once they have you on record from CCTV footage or digiital fingerprints they can kick down doors later.

They have also the option of cutting you off from society by blocking your smart card and denying travel and purchasing rights until you hand yourself in. I could see the wearing of hoodies being banned on public property in the near future.

None of this is good - not worth handing over our civil liberities to keep skangers off public transport.

Victor

Nostradamus wrote: »

A private railfreight company is the way to go - but the CIE rail unions would never allow that. Rail freight lobby groups such as IRN would always support the train driver unions over implementation of a private rail freight operator if it came down to that choice as they depend on CIE train drivers to let them get good photos of locos or haul trainspotter specials on the Limerick Rosslare line so they can stick their heads out of an old carraige window which means everything to them. So in other words railfreight in Ireland is finished.

Interesting argument. But surely other operators give oppurtunities to photograph other liveries?

Run_to_da_hills

Nostradamus wrote: »

None of this is good - not worth handing over our civil liberities to keep skangers off public transport.

Unfortunately our neighbors in the UK are buying Oyster for the sake of up to a 75% reduction in tube fares. A single zone one journey off peak is 4 quid, the same journey with oyster is only 1.50

There is also special offers of free travel, capped day and weekend travel using Oyster and more again if you have your photo on the card. One can see why 80% of the population fall for it despite all the track & trace implications . The banks have also cashed in on them and are offering them for dual purpose credit and debit cards.

In the UK vandalism has dropped by up to 75% from school kids since they introduced registered Oyster along with CCTV cams on busses. The advantages of smart card travel for the transit companies and the authorities are enormous so you can see why they are offering us such a juicy carrot.

Nostradamus

Victor wrote: »

Interesting argument. But surely other operators give oppurtunities to photograph other liveries?

Just a weird loyalty thing for some reason. Most of them are also members of the IRRS which is filled with former train drivers. There is this strange CIE staff idolisation cult among the train spotters.

JayeL

Re Fastrack, I'm a regular user of the service and got a letter from Gerry Conlon, manager of Fastrack, announcing the closure of the service from 31/3/09, so it's definitely happening.

I was happy with them until last year, they don't seem to have any concept of customer service and I just felt like I was annoying them with my business. Pity, there's no quicker way to get parcels from one urban centre to another but IE appeared uninterested.

corktina

daftest posts ive seen for a long time....on the one hand people complain of IE not being as good as it could be and on the other complaining when they do something about it..

.i'm with Victor on most points and additionally can I point out that OAP's will have no trouble with booking online....it's not neccessarily an Ageist thing to suggest but it is a fact they have free travel!

L1011

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I could see the wearing of hoodies being banned on public property in the near future.

Never going to happen in a semi-Nordic country. Would also require banning old ladies from wearing shawls; never going to happen in a Catholic country.

Run_to_da_hills

MYOB wrote: »

Never going to happen in a semi-Nordic country. Would also require banning old ladies from wearing shawls; never going to happen in a Catholic country.

I never mentioned the old one wearing a shawl, I'm talking of the notorious hoodie. I believe they are already banned at the Crescent shopping center in Limerick and I am sure most other shopping centers will follow, Tesco UK bans them in supermarkets throughout the Uk. Most banks, post offices and government buildings request the removal of head gear including motorcycle helmets. All it takes is an atrocity involving someone wearing a hoodie.

Judgement Day

corktina wrote: »

daftest posts ive seen for a long time....on the one hand people complain of IE not being as good as it could be and on the other complaining when they do something about it..

.i'm with Victor on most points and additionally can I point out that OAP's will have no trouble with booking online....it's not neccessarily an Ageist thing to suggest but it is a fact they have free travel!

Another well thought out response. Why don't you try addressing some of the points raised?

L1011

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I never mentioned the old one wearing a shawl, I'm talking of the notorious hoodie. I believe they are already banned at the Crescent shopping center in Limerick and I am sure most other shopping centers will follow, Tesco UK bans them in supermarkets throughout the Uk. Most banks, post offices and government buildings request the removal of head gear including motorcycle helmets. All it takes is an atrocity involving someone wearing a hoodie.

irrelevant. They cannot ban some people from covering their head (but not their face) without banning ALL people from doing the same. Which includes auld wans in their shawls, muslim women, nuns...

bk

Judgement Day wrote: »

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.

I don't see the problem, on the Cork train I've always wondered why they have both and thought it was inefficient.

I think it will be good that the host checks tickets, it will give the host the opportunity to speak to and welcome each passenger on board.

Judgement Day wrote: »

2) The total discontinuation of Fastrack from 31/3/09.

Yes, this is a pity.

Judgement Day wrote: »

3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.

This is a very good thing IMO.

Judgement Day wrote: »

4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

Hardly surprising, but I agree for security reasons there should still be some presence at stations.

MOH

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The swing away from the ticket offices to online booking is already happening amd they are doing this cleaverly by penalising you for purchasing your ticket at an office.

With suburban networks the use of registered smart cards topped up on line, on your mobile phone or at retail touch pads removes the necessity of any ticket office. Only drawback of both systems is that they will leave digital fingerprints.

Eh, we're talking about Irish Rail here. Given the quality of their current annual tickets, and their website, they're a long way from implementing anything like this.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

When the system is in full swing I can imagine there will be a zero tolerance policy enforced.

Just as in the London transport system all unmanned stations will be covered in CCTV with panic buttons along the platforms. Anyone caught abusing the system or causing trouble could have their registered smart card privelages revoked and could be denied future travel. London is now almost 80% Oystercard and at that are most are registered.

Yes, cos Ireland has a great record in zero tolerance.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

There is also special offers of free travel, capped day and weekend travel using Oyster and more again if you have your photo on the card. One can see why 80% of the population fall for it despite all the track & trace implications .

Ah yes, your eternal 'tracking' argument. I've an Oyster card. My gf has one too. We'd be in London maybe 3 times a year, but it saves a bomb on transport. Walk up to counter, pay cash, buy card, use card in turnstile. How exactly am I being tracked? You got a link to any special offers that are cheaper with your photo on the card?

Run_to_da_hills

MOH wrote: »

Eh, we're talking about Irish Rail here. Given the quality of their current annual tickets, and their website, they're a long way from implementing anything like this.

Once they have eliminated cash through on line purchases and pre paid smart cards they can then work towards registration. They can offer the usual carrots like security if your card gets lost or stolen, further discounts in travel, "reverse" usage like the ability to purchase items of up to e10i at top up stations, usage of JC Decaux bicycles etc. It has taken the UK and other cities throughout Europe less than 5 years to reach this level.

MOH wrote: »

Yes, cos Ireland has a great record in zero tolerance.

Forget about our past record, we are well on the slippery slope towards the Euro Police superstate through the gradual and subtle erosion of all our civil liberties as I have already mentioned in numerous posts. Data and police records are already universally shared across borders and law and order will subsequently follow.

Transit companies will have their own private contracted authorities and they will be just as ruthless as those found abroad. We are already hearing of zero tolerance fines being issued for those found not having a valid tickets. In the old days one could talk your way out of it with a CIE inspector and pay the normal fare. or you were simply booted off the bus / train.

MOH wrote: »

Ah yes, your eternal 'tracking' argument. I've an Oyster card. My gf has one too. We'd be in London maybe 3 times a year, but it saves a bomb on transport. Walk up to counter, pay cash, buy card, use card in turnstile. How exactly am I being tracked? You got a link to any special offers that are cheaper with your photo on the card?

Take a close look next time you purchase an unregistered Oyster card, you will more than likely be photographed to death by an array of CCTV at the vending machines, if they don't get you there they will get you at the touch pad or as you touch in next time you board a bus. There is no escape from Big Brother in London.

Currently the Metropolitan Police must apply for permission to make an Oyster card inquiry. No doubt this will soon change and they will be allowed live access just as live access has being granted to the authorities on all urban Congestion charge ANPR cams.

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23440524-details/Police+make+3,000+requests+for+data+from+Oyster+cards/article.do

dowlingm

re: Fastrack.

While it is a useful service for some that's not a case to retain it. It would have been nice to see IE offer it reinvent the service in conjunction with an operator like Purolator or as a federated service with local courier companies in different parts of the country, with minimal IE staff involved at any point in the process - sort of like the catering arrangements.

re: Ticket checkers
The reason ticket checkers are needed is because some stations don't have checkers at the gate. Surely some services will still require revenue protection on-train to stop people travelling free between one halt and another?

re: Signal cabins/LCs
Signal cabins: only of interest to spotters surely? Let's hope the elimination of manned crossings won't prompt more cars being parked on the line because IEHR are a gang of incompetents.

re: Booking offices
I think the problem for those seeking to retain booking staff is that there has been a persistent history of (a) rudeness and/or (b) inability to produce valid but uncommon journey tickets in many stations. While some staff do go above and beyond, it takes a special type of character to deal with the often dopey questions one might get at an IE ticket desk, and the IE recruitment procedure seems to slam square pegs into these round holes.

corktina

Judgement Day wrote: »

Another well thought out response. Why don't you try addressing some of the points raised?

I did....

L1011

dowlingm wrote: »

re: Ticket checkers
The reason ticket checkers are needed is because some stations don't have checkers at the gate. Surely some services will still require revenue protection on-train to stop people travelling free between one halt and another?

Cynics view - if they can't buy tickets, IR can claim the halts are under utilised and close them...

Victor

Run_to_da_hills and everyone else, can we try to stick to the points at hand?

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Take a close look next time you purchase an unregistered Oyster card, you will more than likely be photographed to death by an array of CCTV at the vending machines, if they don't get you there they will get you at the touch pad or as you touch in next time you board a bus. There is no escape from Big Brother in London.

My mother is in London at the moment for a funeral. My aunt has a collection of Oyster cards to cover such eventualities. While I'm sure a bunch of auld wans don't create a huge threat, that a bunch of Oyster cards that can never be tracked properly as next month I imagine my cousins will be using the same ones.

corktina wrote: »

can I point out that OAP's will have no trouble with booking online....it's not neccessarily an Ageist thing to suggest but it is a fact they have free travel!

Surely people with free travel passes will be able to swipe in and out - although that does mean barriers at all stations.

MYOB wrote: »

Never going to happen in a semi-Nordic country. Would also require banning old ladies from wearing shawls; never going to happen in a Catholic country.

Perhaps there vould be an approved design?

Run_to_da_hills

Victor wrote: »

Perhaps there vould be an approved design?

Like so.

Victor

Judgement Day wrote: »

Victor - are you a Moderator, a Troll or are you after Barry Kenny's job?

I thought it only fair to respond to this.

Judgement Day wrote: »

are you a Moderator

Yes. I see part of the job title as helping to inform people.

Judgement Day wrote: »

a Troll

While I will occassionally make a jube or joke about, I tend not to troll. Sometimes, I admit, I overdo thigns and flame people.

Judgement Day wrote: »

Barry Kenny's job?

I'm not sure how big the Corporate Communications Department will be given the present cuts, however, no I'm not after the job.

HonalD

Judgement Day, I can't see why a personal attack on Victor is productive - I don't like the idea of people being attacked based on an expressed opinion. That's the whole point of boards, to have a lively discussion! I think.......:)

Judgement Day

HonalD wrote: »

Judgement Day, I can't see why a personal attack on Victor is productive - I don't like the idea of people being attacked based on an expressed opinion. That's the whole point of boards, to have a lively discussion! I think.......:)

I think Victor is big enough to take my light hearted dig at him. No personal slur was intended and I think from his reply he appreciates that. When I attack somebody I get banned and as I value my membership of Boards.ie I tend to restrain myself.

dowlingm

Letter to Indo re: IE revenue protection

Thursday January 08 2009
CIE recently sought new fare increases. Why should they be entitled to increase fares, particularly when it seems that the company regularly fails to collect revenue on the Sligo-Dublin train route?

Perhaps your readers can report similar occurrences of non-collection of fares on other lines. It's not uncommon for hundreds of passengers returning to Dublin to be able to travel without having to pay a fare, due to either unmanned stations, or the absence of a ticket checker on the trains.

Questions must be asked of the management ability and capability at Irish Rail.

In addition to non-fare collection, the management of Irish Rail continue to provide a poor service to paying customers, despite trumpeting the arrival of new modern trains which they boasted would lead to an increase in passenger comfort and satisfaction.

My brother and his six-year-old son, returning to Germany after Christmas, endured a typical Irish Rail experience only this week.

They boarded the new, modern 0943 train from Carrick-on-Shannon to Dublin.

The refreshment trolley didn't attend the carriage so they had nothing to eat or drink on the two-hour trip.

Upon arrival at Connolly, no trolleys were available or visible to transport three heavy bags to Busaras, so my brother had to lug them all the way down the ramp and across the busy intersection at Amiens Street, being careful to avoid trams and speeding cars and still hold on to his young son. What a shambles in 21st Century Irish Rail.

I'd also like to pose a question to Bus Eireann -- why is it that provincial buses (or some of them at least), can't go straight to Dublin Airport rather than Busaras?

Imagine the amount of traffic that would be removed from the roads if Bus Eireann ran services from the country direct to Dublin Airport?

As Gay Byrne used to say, "There's nobody in charge."

JAMES PHILLIPS

LEITRIM

KC61

Perhaps someone should tell Mr Phillips that Bus Éireann have been introducing quite a few services to/from the Airport of late....

Ste.phen

Letter to Indo" wrote:

The refreshment trolley didn't attend the carriage so they had nothing to eat or drink on the two-hour trip.

Is he complaining that there wasn't a carriage, or that they couldn't walk to it? A 2 hour journey hardly seems like a long time to be without food or water, it's not like an airport where they take all your food/liquid from you on the way in!

Upon arrival at Connolly, no trolleys were available or visible to transport three heavy bags to Busaras, so my brother had to lug them all the way down the ramp and across the busy intersection at Amiens Street, being careful to avoid trams and speeding cars and still hold on to his young son. What a shambles in 21st Century Irish Rail.

2 problems I can see here:
1) they appear to be unfarmiliar with the concepts of wheeled luggage, traffic lights, footpaths, and elevators. Also, the ramp hasn't been there in a few years, can we assume he means the escalators?
2) How would luggage carts work exactly if you've to take them out of the building? Would *any* of them be left about 24 hours after they introduced them?
I imagine they'd all end up in George's Dock.

I'd also like to pose a question to Bus Eireann -- why is it that provincial buses (or some of them at least), can't go straight to Dublin Airport rather than Busaras?

As pointed out elsewhere, plenty of bus eireann buses do that, though i'm not sure there's one from Sligo.


Seriously, what was this guy's main problem?

parsi

dowlingm wrote: »

re: IE revenue protection

Crikes. An "Irish-Rail only" experience ?

I'd love to know where in Germany he was going to. Try getting to/from Schoenefeld in Berlin on Public-Transport - if you have bags you'll be carrying them damn things all the way - no baggage trollies in Alexanderplatz and the lifts are weird (went through there a few times with bags, buggies kids & wife..)

Go to Charles de Gaulle and you can't bring trollies onto the CDGVAL and have to lug your own stuff up from the station. Same when you get to Gare de Nord - more lugging. And if you decide to got from Nord to l'Est on foot you have to brave streets with cars ! Thank god for wheelie-bags.

Is it so hard to buy some food in the bloody shops ?

Modern-day travel requires a lot of lugging around and crossing big city streets occasionally and it's much the same everywhere in Europe.

Heisenberg1

Judgement Day wrote: »

Internal correspondence that I have seen today would suggest major retrograde retrenchment is coming down the line for the whole IE network.

Apparently among proposals being considered by CIE/IE management are the following:

1) The elimination of ticket checkers and their replacement, where possible, by train hostesses.
2) The total discontinuation of Fastrack from 31/3/09.
3) Speeding up the closure of remaining signal cabins and manned level crossings.
4) The possible replacement of bookings offices at stations with 'alternative arrangements' - the mind truly boggles!

If the trains could be driven from CTC I am sure that it would be considered. A totally unmanned rail system operated, where only absolutely essential, by cheap foreign labour and outside contractors is the appalling scenario that CIE/IE are considering!

:eek::eek::eek:

i am very intrested in what your saying i have to ask you do you really think that
the entire rail network can? or would be controlled by a computer and have a totally unmanned rail network or be outsourced to a diffrent country i think we are light years away from that or it would never happen more likely the latter that i think from a safety point of view it would be
a disaster i mean whats next planes without pilots joe public would never travel on a train without any driver name one mayor rail company that employs these policys or has plans to in the future to implement them

Victor

luzon wrote: »

a disaster i mean whats next planes without pilots joe public would never travel on a train without any driver name one mayor rail company that employs these policys or has plans to in the future to implement them

Lots of the time Docklands Light Rail is driverless.

Judgement Day

luzon wrote: »

i am very intrested in what your saying i have to ask you do you really think that
the entire rail network can? or would be controlled by a computer and have a totally unmanned rail network or be outsourced to a diffrent country i think we are light years away from that or it would never happen more likely the latter that i think from a safety point of view it would be
a disaster i mean whats next planes without pilots joe public would never travel on a train without any driver name one mayor rail company that employs these policys or has plans to in the future to implement them

It is not a matter of what I believe, it is what is largely happening already. Under proposals, apparently now to be considered, the number of IE staff on an inter-city train will now consist of a driver and a train host/hostess. On the new inter-city railcars I don't what the proposals may be.Many stations are already unmanned and outside contractors are carrying out some permanent way work. Rail catering has also gone to outside contractors. The reference to driverless trains was not a serious comment but a jibe at the CIE/IE management mindset that sees employees as a liability rather than an asset to be maximised!