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Animal & pet issues.
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24-12-2008 7:00pm#1
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Bond 007 is a woman?!
Excellent.
Yes she is.
Ah no, I know that and really don't mind, just very confused by the whole thing really.an infraction is nothing other than a tap on the knuckles, take it and learn not to use language like that again and im sure you'll be grand0 -
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She never claimed to be thatalan dunne 27 wrote: »Didn't know Bond was a lady.
but did say
I am but 1 lovely woman who gets tired0 -
Same here.I am but 1 lovely woman who gets tired
Make it two.
In all honestly... not all travellers treat their dogs like shíte... Thats making generalisations.
Believe it or not, there is a few good travellers out there.
It's like saying all black people rob banks.
or that all white people love sun holidays.0 -
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Join Date:Posts: 29920
There are of course rules about PMs etc but they tend to be decided and implemented by the admins. We dont look at people's PM's (its actually quite hard to do) but if we have a PM of a serious nature relayed to us by the recipient, we'll definitely take action.
By the way, your off-thread dealer of "rescue" animals was dealt with by me. Sorry if I didnt keep you in the loop but then, I dont have to.
You were infracted which is barely more then an automated PM to let you know of some issue the mod had with something you wrote. This, is a ridiculous over reaction.
DeV0 -
helena.ryan wrote: »Mod gives an infraction for "swearing" then changes the charter to suit.
I seem to remember swearing was always prohibited by the Animals & Pets charter.
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It's nice to know it was dealt with, and you don't have to let me know, but then, having put so much time into trying to get something done, while getting not so nice phone calls from this person, I'm sure you can imagine, a post shortly after by a mod of the forum saying "she doesn't care" and telling people NOT to PM her was a bit of a shock to say the least. I would have thought that reporting suspected illegal activities was something boards would like to encourage?.
By the way, your off-thread dealer of "rescue" animals was dealt with by me. Sorry if I didnt keep you in the loop but then, I dont have to.
You were infracted which is barely more then an automated PM to let you know of some issue the mod had with something you wrote. This, is a ridiculous over reaction.
An infraction may be nothing, and as I said I don't really care about it, I had intended to bring up the topic of moderation in the forum for a while now, the infraction was the push for me.
Regular members are posting less and less, I have a PM from a regular who will not post there anymore, telling me why. They said I could put it up, but I wont. Needless to say, I am not the only person in the forum who has found the moderating a bit lacking.0 -
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100% agree, thats why I'm not posting the PM. I just wish the people who privately agree with me would post.
My whole point is the forum is a busy one, and cannot be easy to moderate. Moderating, when it is done, is always hours if not days after the post is posted. In other forums, such as your own Nerin, moderating is constant.
Surely getting bothered by swearing, then changing to charter to justify it, is a waste of the mods time when it could be better used to weed out the posts which are genuinely offensive to the users of the forum.
Bond has described herself as very tired & posts very little in the forum. Maybe she needs some help, someone who posts in the forum regularly and has an actual interest in the forum, who maybe is already a moderator of another forum?0 -
helena.ryan wrote: »100% agree, thats why I'm not posting the PM. I just wish the people who privately agree with me would post.
My whole point is the forum is a busy one, and cannot be easy to moderate. Moderating, when it is done, is always hours if not days after the post is posted. In other forums, such as your own Nerin, moderating is constant.
Surely getting bothered by swearing, then changing to charter to justify it, is a waste of the mods time when it could be better used to weed out the posts which are genuinely offensive to the users of the forum.
Bond has described herself as very tired & posts very little in the forum. Maybe she needs some help, someone who posts in the forum regularly and has an actual interest in the forum, who maybe is already a moderator of another forum?
I get where youre both coming from,once again emotion and text their flavour on the internets.
My advice to you helena is report stuff using the report post function,this way everyone sees it and its transparent,ie-mods,cat mods and smods.
As for the charter,its more a guideline than rulebook,we learned hard and fast on the noc forum that you can't plug every loophole.
Basically a mod can decide outside a charter what is and isn't acceptable,act,and then change the charter if they wish.0 -
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Yep it's hard to have an online disagreement isn't itI get where youre both coming from,once again emotion and text their flavour on the internets.
My advice to you helena is report stuff using the report post function,this way everyone sees it and its transparent,ie-mods,cat mods and smods.
I have only once PM'd a mod of the forum about something, and then it was sent to all the mods of the forum to get an issue I had dealt with, and in fairness to richie, he said he had been away and did look after it straight away.
My issue is not with being told or not being told that this was looked after. My issue is this: I thought it was important that you know about this, I tried to get someone to talk to me about it. Was ignored until you came back from holiday and changed the charter, I got a few calls from the person concerned, dealt with that, logged on shortly after to see a public post saying that the mod of the forum doesn't care what happens via PM.Helena.
Ive been away from boards for Xmas and just came back to this.So Ill answer this as best I can.
Firstly the issue with the poster "scamming" rescue animals was sorted out between myself and the Devore.It was kept off the forum for various reasons which I will not go into with you as its none of your business.
Should I not have brought the issue up in the first place?
I have a personal issue?Secondly--You seem to have some personal issue with the way moderating is done on the Animals/pets forum.
You expect the mods to sit and wait till something happens 24/7??
Theres this little thing called "real life" that sometimes makes it a bit hard to get to a pc.
As for issues in the forum--I feel that the forum pretty well moderates itself and I dont have to interfere that much in what happens there.. I have nothing personal against any of the mods of the forum.
As for a forum moderating itself? should the forum moderate itself, isn't that what moderators are for? I don't think you should sit at your pc 24/7, which is why I suggested another mod, who actually posts there.
It actually does, it's difficult to know what is and isn't allowed when the charter is not very clear, or when the charter is perfectly clear and the moderator goes against it.Edit--Apologies it does say that equipment is not allowed to be sold.As far as Im concerned it was always allowed to be sold so Im going to change that in the charter.
I hope this satisfies your concerns.
Richie.
Thank you for the long post.0 -
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No. See?helena.ryan wrote: »Yep it's hard to have an online disagreement isn't it
Actually, we're there for when that fails.As for a forum moderating itself? should the forum moderate itself, isn't that what moderators are for? I don't think you should sit at your pc 24/7, which is why I suggested another mod, who actually posts there.
I read it quite a bit, and I'm down as a moderator... If you want, I can take a more active part in the forum. Be very careful what you ask for.
Clarity is relative to the reader. It's as clear as it needs to be, as it's not a rule book as I have already told you. It's a guide.It actually does, it's difficult to know what is and isn't allowed when the charter is not very clear, or when the charter is perfectly clear and the moderator goes against it.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 10286
Talleshin thanks for that--No need to respond now:D
Seriously though and I said this in my other post--I really prefer not to mod the forum too harshly as it does seem to run quite smoothly without it.
Helena if you want Ill start modding it a bit more harshly and infract for every breach of charter and god help me if them redneck hunters come back and start a shooting their mouths off about shooting fluffy bunnies again (sarcasm before some hunters complain about me)0 -
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What do you mean? When richie got back from hols he didn't ignore it, but until he was back, the other mods of the forum ignored what I was saying. They were all gone, for about 2 weeks, at the same time?If a tree falls in a forest, and nobody is there, is it being ignored?Ideally, moderators should have to do nothing whatsoever. It's not an ideal that often happens, but it is the ideal.
But they managed to be active enough to infract you so clearly this isn't an issue. Ah but it is, and this is my whole point, how do they have time to do that when regular posters are leaving the forum due to the lack of moderating? Again, I will point out, the infraction is not bothering me as much as the fact that an infraction was given for something very small when other, more important issues are being ignored.
I mean a constructive disagreement without picking up on tones. Like sarcasm in text etc.No. See?.
And it has done but lately things have not been going so smoothly. I post regularly, I've gotten to know a few of the regular posters. I genuinely care about the forum, and it has not been the same lately.Seriously though and I said this in my other post--I really prefer not to mod the forum too harshly as it does seem to run quite smoothly without it.Helena if you want Ill start modding it a bit more harshly and infract for every breach of charter and god help me if them redneck hunters come back and start a shooting their mouths off about shooting fluffy bunnies again (sarcasm before some hunters complain about me) Not more harshly, just a bit more hands on and in perspective on what is and is not important. Why infract for every breach? What about the ones that are a genuine problem, like cruelty or abusive posts etc.
I'm not complaining about "bunny shooters" at all.
Should I not have bothered reporting the scam? All I got was hassle from it, personal abuse from the boardsie in question, one mod saying she doesn't care and then today another saying it's none of my business.
Surely, if a poster knows of or suspects something illegal going on, they need to report it and be assured that it is being looked after? I did not want to know what was happening, just that it was being looked after, I thought it was when the charter was changed. I sent a PM thanking them for looking after it.
Then Bond posted saying she doesn't care and people were not to PM her about the forum or what happens via PM(I can't remember the exact phrasing but basicially this was the jist). That is not right. I could very easily have not bothered reporting this scam, in fact it would have saved me a lot of heart ache to not report what had happened to me IRL with this poster and the fact it could easily happen with other forum users.
I'm not disputing that.Clarity is relative to the reader. It's as clear as it needs to be, as it's not a rule book as I have already told you. It's a guide.0 -
Actually, I was on 'holiday' at the time.helena.ryan wrote: »What do you mean? When richie got back from hols he didn't ignore it, but until he was back, the other mods of the forum ignored what I was saying. They were all gone, for about 2 weeks, at the same time?
One poster so far... maybe... according to you. Kindly post the username (they said it was okay.) I'd like to look at their Reported posts. Ah but it is, and this is my whole point, how do they have time to do that when regular posters are leaving the forum due to the lack of moderating?
And I'm telling you: Stuff that you think is small will be enforced, stuff you think is major will be ignored. Why? Because the moderation has to be flexible, and you're not the best judge of what should/shouldn't be enforced. Why does it go against the charter? Because it has to be flexible; the charter is a template. The core issue here is that you're confused by what is/isn't enforced. There isn't much we can do about that except suggest that you keep watching and finding out until you get a better grip on the situation.Again, I will point out, the infraction is not bothering me as much as the fact that an infraction was given for something very small when other, more important issues are being ignored.
Keep reporting posts, and you'll get feedback when / where possible. Don't expect much. I only respond to the more obvious abuses. The reported posts for A & PI are often insane. So much is "offensive to the users of the forum" it's unreal.
I know. See.I mean a constructive disagreement without picking up on tones. Like sarcasm in text etc.
ED: Looking through Reported Posts: Two reports took ~1 day to be acted on (These were around Christmas, mind you). Otherwise, reported posts are dealt with within hours (Quite often within minutes.) It seems like we're covered for moderation. Moderators don't need to post in threads; in fact, for every one of you complaining a mod doesn't post enough, there are ten complaining they post too much and several PM'ing that they're leaving because of it,etc.)0 -
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LOL - check out this post complaining about sexism against dogs...
And don't forget that I was reported for posting a photo of my dog with an ERECTION!.
I'm not getting involved too much in this thread as I won't be using the Animals and Pets forum again, or at least until such a time that the listed Moderators there begin to play an active and positive role in the forum again.
Rules are inconsistantly enforced, despite the forums charters giving an air of zero tolerance towards members breaking them. Now I consider 'rules are for the obdience of fools and the guidence of wisemen (& women these days :rolleyes: ) but don't come accross as having a zero tolerance policy and then enforcing the rules 'carte blanche.
This leads to a lack of confidence in the Mods from the people who have a real and genuine interest in using the forum.
Now it can not be disputed that the Moderators of the Animal and Pets forum have taken their eye off the ball in recent months, thats not to say their bad people or bad moderators as real life HAS to take precedence over your internet lives.
But its got to the stage there now that people with genuine concern's for their animals risk personal redicule and attack for posting quiries pertaining to their animals health, welfare and well being.
That has to be addressed IMO, and it has to be addressed immediately.As for regulars leaving because of lack of moderation--I dont see any of them posting in this thread.
***cough*** :P0 -
helena.ryan wrote: »What do you mean? When richie got back from hols he didn't ignore it, but until he was back, the other mods of the forum ignored what I was saying. They were all gone, for about 2 weeks, at the same time?
Helena you are really beginning to annoy me now! You keep claiming I was doing nothing! WRONG WRONG & WRONG! This was being dealt with off board in private with the admins & Smods. At the time of this incident you kept pming me persistantly & I told you politely to use the reported post function & you were I would entertain any further pm's on the matter with you!
Point 2 - Richie & I were in fact away at the time - however I take my computer & check in even when I am on holiday in America - therefore I am often watching but can late to respond due to the time difference!helena.ryan wrote: » Ah but it is, and this is my whole point, how do they have time to do that when regular posters are leaving the forum due to the lack of moderating? Again, I will point out, the infraction is not bothering me as much as the fact that an infraction was given for something very small when other, more important issues are being ignored.
What members are leaving??? No one has complained to myself & as far as I know (again I am not Derek Acorah) Hellraiser or Karoma.helena.ryan wrote: »I mean a constructive disagreement without picking up on tones. Like sarcasm in text etc.
I have no problem with constructive disagreement - just have a problem with members badgering people who disagree with them! People tend to forget there are very real people attacked to each & every post - they all have feelings - shouting & abusing people hurts. I know the saying that sticks & stones will brake my bones but names with never hurt me - but sadly us humans are often more fragile than that.helena.ryan wrote: »And it has done but lately things have not been going so smoothly. I post regularly, I've gotten to know a few of the regular posters. I genuinely care about the forum, and it has not been the same lately.
Explain please. Apart from Mairt who has expressed his dissatisfaction.helena.ryan wrote: » Not more harshly, just a bit more hands on and in perspective on what is and is not important. Why infract for every breach? What about the ones that are a genuine problem, like cruelty or abusive posts etc.
I am online most days & am often watching - I post when members ask questions that I can answer. - I too get annoyed with the members who think their opinions are the only ones that count. Ask questions about exotics & I will respond.helena.ryan wrote: »I'm not complaining about "bunny shooters" at all.
The hunters thread caused horror & outrage a few months ago.helena.ryan wrote: »Should I not have bothered reporting the scam? All I got was hassle from it, personal abuse from the boardsie in question, one mod saying she doesn't care and then today another saying it's none of my business.
Again for the record this was dealt with by the mods & admins off board! I was not in a position to keep you in the loop - I can not access pm's therefore what goes on is NOT MY BUSINESS - contact admins if you a problem in this area! If a member is nasty in a pm - you can of course forward it to me & I will admin on your behalf.
I can only deal with members who break the charter - that's it I am not god! I am a mere moderator!
Surely, if a poster knows of or suspects something illegal going on, they need to report it and be assured that it is being looked after? I did not want to know what was happening, just that it was being looked after, I thought it was when the charter was changed. I sent a PM thanking them for looking after it.helena.ryan wrote: »Then Bond posted saying she doesn't care and people were not to PM her about the forum or what happens via PM(I can't remember the exact phrasing but basicially this was the jist). That is not right. I could very easily have not bothered reporting this scam, in fact it would have saved me a lot of heart ache to not report what had happened to me IRL with this poster and the fact it could easily happen with other forum users.
I'm not disputing that.
I basically told you to hit the REPORT POST BUTTON - that way it goes to all mods & not just me. Read my earlier points cause I am sick of repeating myself.0 -
As moderators? They're doing what needs to be done as I've pointed out. You have access to the Reported Posts forum and can check it for yourself.I'm not getting involved too much in this thread as I won't be using the Animals and Pets forum again, or at least until such a time that the listed Moderators there begin to play an active and positive role in the forum again.
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Now it can not be disputed that the Moderators of the Animal and Pets forum have taken their eye off the ball in recent months...
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If you want them posting as posters, then tough. That's up to them, but don't go mixing the two up.
Only some of the charter implies a zero tolerance stance really, if you read it properly and so far they have implemented in a 'zero tolerance' manner, hence the infraction that helped kick-start this whole thing. So, post some examples. Have you read through this thread? We have explained that matters were dealt with away from the eyes of users, we don't mean to sound prickish about some of it as it may come across, but sensitive matters had to be dealt with quietly behind the scenes, otherwise, we have countered any argument of inconsistency or lack of moderation that has so far been put forward; maybe not to the satisfaction of particular posers, but they may never see beyond themselves. Nothing much that we can do about that except to try and patiently continue to explain.Rules are inconsistantly enforced, despite the forums charters giving an air of zero tolerance towards members breaking them. Now I consider 'rules are for the obdience of fools and the guidence of wisemen (& women these days :rolleyes: ) but don't come accross as having a zero tolerance policy and then enforcing the rules 'carte blanche.0 -
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