Demonic infestation...

Darragh29

Has anyone ever heard of this??? I have a relation to who is of the view that she is suffering from some sort of a negative paranormal influence in her life that she has done some reasearch on and now believes this negative influence that she feels is operating upon her life circumstances to bring her what we would generally subscribe to being bad luck...

She also believes that this influence was somehow, "summons" onto her by another person, known to both of us, who had reason in the past to wish her family ill and who we both know for sure dabbles in the occult... Apparently this infestation began in her life some years ago after she was given a gift (a box of books), from this other person and she is believes that there was some sort of a hex or a curse attached to this box of books.

She gave me a book that she read that she got on amazon.com, it was written by a priest called Gabrillle Amorth who is the top exorcist at The Vatican, which seems to back up a lot of what she is saying, in that the author says that this can happen and it is possible and that often if not always, the curse or hex is attached to an object and the object must be burned as part of a process to get rid of this infestation.

I don't quite know what to make of this relations claims, only that some of what has happened in her life, I personally feel that you would be unlucky to encounter the same set of events if you lived for ten lives...

Just wondering has anyone else encountered anything like this or has anyone any opinions on it???

Also, there is no observable paranormal activity here, but what is happening is that it would appear that this relation is suffering from consistently bad luck or else there is something else going on.

6th

Where I've heard of things like this I've also heard of objects that the affected can use to absorb the negativity. Heard to explain but lets say they take an object close to them. Stick it in a jar and bury the jar in the ground somewhere. The energy that is directed at the person is then redirected to teh object and causes no one any bother.

So weird I know but sure the whole situation must sound crazy to most?

Darragh29

It sounds crazy to me, according to her and this is stated in the book she gave me a lend of, these objects have to first be blessed and then burned.

Basically she believes now that an evil spirit is influencing her life in a negative way and this is impacting on things that are happening to her that should not be happening. I dunno...

Not The Real Scarecrow

sounds to me like she is bringing the bad luck on her self by falling into the false belief of curses.Most magik is based on actually getting the person to believe that you have some special ability and that you have the power to influence them.Once the victim buys into this they begin (in the case of curses) to believe that negative things will occur in their life, creating a sort of self fufiling prophecy.The best advice I could give you is to try and reassure the family member that there is no curse( I know this is a very difficult thing to do, especially with older folk who are stuck in their ways), if she comes to realise this and start having a more positive outlook , things may start looking up for her.
Of course failing that, if she is religious a ceremony such as a blessing or a cleansing may help her to believe that said curse is destroyed and allow her to move on with her life hopefully leaving behind all negativity.
On the demon infestation, the first time I heard this term was by the Warrens(Idiots and fraudsters) in the 80's, ever since then it seems that similar fraudsters and obviously religious types, that have plenty to gain by stirring up a demonic panic, have used the term.In my experience I have never once came across any demonic activity where I would use the term infestation.
I truely wish your relative well and I hope that you find a solution as I am all too aware of how circumstances like this can be traumatising and have negative effects on friends and family, as well as the individual.If there is anything that I can help you with, just pm me and I'll get back to you asap.

Oryx

I would never post here and say, yup, youve deffo got yourself an infestation there... even if I thought there was something in it. Because part of the reason that curses work is because the victim believes them, and will apply that belief and negative perception to their lives. Anything bad that does happen will be blamed, and you almost begin to look for negative things that might occur. Whether its there, or whether its not, the more you think of it, the more you feed the fear.

Now, thats not to say your relative doesnt have a problem of some sort, and I cannot say whether its down to a hex on some books, or simple bad luck. But the easiest thing to do is to build her own defences within her own psyche. And funnily enough that has little to do with actual spells or paranormal effects. But it works. Get the books, if she still has them, and shred them, burn them or otherwise destroy them. With glee. Then get mad with 'it'. She should tell herself that noone has the right to mess with her, that she is not standing for it, and they can feck off. Mentally throw the badness right back at em. She needs to realise that the only defence she needs is right within her, she has the immense power to repel anything bad such as a hex. If she has a faith or belief system, draw on that for assistance.

Whether you believe this mental attitude to be a psychological tool, or the use of psychic energy or angels or whatever, is irrelevant, as long as whatever way she uses it, it gives her the strength within to believe this curse will no longer affect her. And it really cannot, if she no longer allows it to.

Nevyn

Well if she believe that then set up an appointment with her parish priest.

6th

Sabotage wrote: »

Where I've heard of things like this I've also heard of objects that the affected can use to absorb the negativity. Heard to explain but lets say they take an object close to them. Stick it in a jar and bury the jar in the ground somewhere. The energy that is directed at the person is then redirected to teh object and causes no one any bother.

So weird I know but sure the whole situation must sound crazy to most?

Weird memory flash: I think the jar thing involves piss and nails. For Serious.

faceman

Ive have always found it difficult to accept "curses" working if the receiver doesnt follow the same faith or doesnt believe in them. In saying that perhaps a curse can hext the environment that the receiver occupies rather than the receiver themselves.

What kind of events are occuring? Are they localised to the home etc? Unfortunately the psychological element has a big part to play too. i.e. associating negative events with a curse etc.

can you give us some detail on how it all came about and what has been happening?

Darragh29

The fly in the ointment that appears to be reinforcing this relations belief in this curse or infestation or whatever you want to call it, is another incident that happened many years ago, which this other person was involved in and said to another relation of ours that he knew something fatal was going to imminently happen to one of his children, who died tragically soonafter the remark was made.

I understand the points that have been made regarding the belief in a curse can effectively give it legs and it becomes self fulfilling and starts running on its own steam, but with the information above, it's not a simple case of de-constructing the framework of fear that is holding this belief together, as we have another family member who also believes that this person has put some sort of a hex or a curse on the family and this family member associates this person with a death in the family that this person predicted. This death was a young person, not an old person who was on their last legs or anything like that...

I'm sorry if the above is hard to read with me referring to this person and that person... Hope it is understandable...

Nevyn

Sabotage wrote: »

Weird memory flash: I think the jar thing involves piss and nails. For Serious.

What you are talking about is commonly referred to as a 'witches bottle',
basically it's a physic and energetic decoy.

Serious if she is christian at all get her to talk to her local priest.

DANNY22XX

Piss and nails ,,,preist,,look just advise her to see a shrink first ,,,or if she is on medication to find out what the side effects are,,,,you cant blame everything on a box of books,,,,so if anything goes bad the books are to blame,,
If she was handed Harry Potter ,,,would she blame voldemore,,,Seek medical Advice,,Hexes in my opinion is cause by the individual not a curse,,
I did an investigation were the person had the same kinda of problem so,with another team i was a guest with the team ,,,and yes everything demonic ,,,she was advised by a local christian priest to cast the demons out,,,etc,,,to cut a long story short i asked to see her medication and i checked the side effects and paranioa was the side effect on 3 of her medications she changed the meds and guess what ,,,no more demons,,,YAY
To me personally there is no such thing as Demons only inner Demons,,,
Get your relation to seek professional help,

faceman

Darragh29 wrote: »

I understand the points that have been made regarding the belief in a curse can effectively give it legs and it becomes self fulfilling and starts running on its own steam, but with the information above, it's not a simple case of de-constructing the framework of fear that is holding this belief together, as we have another family member who also believes that this person has put some sort of a hex or a curse on the family and this family member associates this person with a death in the family that this person predicted. This death was a young person, not an old person who was on their last legs or anything like that...

The words of Max Von Sydow may offer some solace to you when he was interviewed about The Exorcist movie. (He played Fr Merrin) The interview is on the Fear of God documentary.

Basically they asked the cast and crew in interviews if they believed the film was cursed etc etc. Most people said yes or possibly. However Max Von Sydow offered a different viewpoint. He said that if you make a film about the devil and someone dies, a curse is presumed. Make a love story and people die, no one bats an eye lid. He also went on to say that the film was shot over 18 months as opposed to 3 months with most films. People will die anyway! He's an atheist.

kshiel

I am sorry to hear this is happening to your relative, its never a nice situation to be in, and I am sure you are trying to be the best advisor you can be right now, I would agree with some points given here already.

I wouldn't tell her to perform any rituals herself as I would feel it may lead her deeper into the belief of a curse anyway. If she has faith in a religion I would sugguest for her to talk to her priest and seek councelling from him or her GP which ever she feels comfortable with.

I would agree with orxy on all her points, its too vague for anyone here to make a real judgement call so your own logic will have to interpet these reposnes. I would try and get her to understand that no one can take her power unless she is willing to give it, and she does need to get mad and pissed off and bloody down right angery at this and push it away with everything she has and POINT BLANK REFUSE IT TO ALLOW ANY INFLUENCE ON HER OR HER FAMILY and hold this thought with healing in her own mind. It sounds like a simple one but in reality you know its not the case when you are trying to convince someone they have their own power.

I wish you the best of luck with this and I do hope she comes to see her own value and self worth and power.

r3nu4l

Thaedydal wrote: »

Serious if she is christian at all get her to talk to her local priest.

Excuse my ignorance Thaed but do Pagans believe it's possible to become possessed by a spirit? If so, are there Pagan rituals that can remove the spirit (like exorcism)? Or is that what the witch's bottle is for?

Yup, if she's a Christian she should go to her local clergy for a blessing. Can I ask if this idea is recent? If so, has this person been watching the drama 'Apparitions' on BBC television?

In my experience most 'bad luck' is the result of a negative mental attitude. The 'bad' things are amplified beyond proportion while good things seem less important. If props such as bottles of pee and nails or blessings from a clergyperson help to restore a positive attitude then it can't do any harm.

Nevyn

r3nu4l wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance Thaed but do Pagans believe it's possible to become possessed by a spirit?

Pagan is a very broad term that covers a lot of different belief systems.
Most of them do have that belief.

r3nu4l wrote: »

If so, are there Pagan rituals that can remove the spirit (like exorcism)?

Again differing belief systems have ways of casing out and ways of calling in 'spirits'/'enties'/'deities'.

r3nu4l wrote: »

Or is that what the witch's bottle is for?

A Witches bottle is like decoy of the person so that any 'physic' attacks end up directed at the bottle and not the person.

r3nu4l wrote: »

Yup, if she's a Christian she should go to her local clergy for a blessing. Can I ask if this idea is recent? If so, has this person been watching the drama 'Apparitions' on BBC television?

In my experience most 'bad luck' is the result of a negative mental attitude. The 'bad' things are amplified beyond proportion while good things seem less important. If props such as bottles of pee and nails or blessings from a clergyperson help to restore a positive attitude then it can't do any harm.

Some times a bit of psychodrama is needed to end the drama.

Oryx

(With apologies to those who DO know about witchcraft::))

I dont know a whole lot about Wicca or witchcraft, but I came across this, and its always stayed with me: The rule of three. Its something I have mentioned to people who are afraid of another person cursing them or wishing them ill (often but not always associated with demonology or vaguely with witchcraft). That whatever you wish or send to another, will return to you threefold. (An effective demonstration is pointing your finger at someone, the other three fingers of your hand point back at you).

It can be affirming and give strength if a 'victim' can tell themselves that the person they believe is inflicting harm on them, is themselves being weakened by their own ill will. They are not so powerful as they seem, they have a weakness. Its hard to explain here, but anyone Ive mentioned it to has definitely been helped by this. Its the beginning of finding their own strength to, as ksheil says, fight back and find their own power. And again, if this has basis in some kind of wiccan fact, fine. If its simply a mental trick to get you out of a negative mindset, thats cool too. As long as it works for the person.

I mentioned it and it has been said again, getting mad is necessary. In real life if someone is trying to harm you by some real and visible means, you generally do tend to get angry and refuse to take it. We fight back by whatever means we need to, you go and face them, call the police, or a solicitor. Whatever, you combat them. This is no different, except most of the battle is done inside the victims own head. The mental attitude is summed up by Howard Beale in Network:

'I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!':)

Nevyn

Best line ever in dealing with anything I have say comes from the movie Labyrinth.
"You have no power over me" you have to mean it and know it.

faceman

Thaedydal wrote: »

Best line ever in dealing with anything I have say comes from the movie Labyrinth.
"You have no power over me" you have to mean it and know it.

There are plenty of women who wouldnt mind David Bowie possessing them!

Stoner

sounds like this woman is in a bad way, and some sort of action is needed, be that from a doctor, priest etc. I don't like the sound of it TBH, I always get a strange vibe off people in this situation, I've met a few and, this is difficult to say, but they all seem to have an answer for any suggestion you have for them, they dismiss advice and demand buy in , and I have left them thinking "this person seems to resist attempts to deal with this"

"the priest wouldn't listen to me"
"the doctor thinks I'm mad"

I've only encountered a few of this type of situation, but in each case the person seemed to demand that whoever was going to take care of the situation for them, had to believe their "story" in full. Therefore this wont work with a priest or a doc IMO.

Was there not a similar post about this a few years back, something about a picture frame?

Like I said I'm far from an expert, but an expert is required IMO, and the person has to be willing to put their weight behind the "cure" and be willing to consider that they themselves are at least part of the problem and that they could be wrong about some of their thoughts on the subject.

faceman

^ Very good point

Darragh29

Just to give another bit of background, this relation has never been particularly religious, probably what you would call a lapsed Catholic, but recently she has started going into churches (not to go to mass regularly although I understand she has been at mass recently enough), but to light candles, and pray.

She also feels that whatever it is that she believes is influencing negative events that are happening to her, can sometimes come into a church with her and make her feel uncomfortable and cause her to get upset and leave, but there is one particular church that she goes into that she belives this entity cannot come into, because of a statue of one particular saint that is in the church that the entity is afraid of and cannot come near.

I've been down at her house recently for a long talk with her about this whole matter and I've just listened. I've also been on high alert for any kind of other explanation for this, like signs of drug taking, bottles of whiskey/alcohol in the bin, etc, but have not found any reason to think this is the cause of the problem here...

I've asked her to keep a log/diary of incidents that she believes are associated with this curse or negative entity...

I'm just in listening mode at the moment and pondering the whole thing, it's hard to know what to make of it to be honest...

Darragh29

Also I've suggested acquiring a statue of this particular saint that she says this entity is afraid of, and putting it in the house...

The-Star

Hi. Your message posted is a very serious issue and your Aunt needs help as this type of energy sent to her will bring her down. This is what I work at removing this type of energy. It can be done in a few moments and she will know it is gone. A curse is what you are talking about is done as easily as two people talking about another in a bad way and energy goes to the person that they have been gossiping about.
It is true that you should not buy second hand books. Who had read them before you? and what energy have they put into them?
Please free to contact me if you need any help in removing this block.
Best of luck!!!

kshiel

The-Star wrote: »

Hi. Your message posted is a very serious issue and your Aunt needs help as this type of energy sent to her will bring her down. This is what I work at removing this type of energy. It can be done in a few moments and she will know it is gone. A curse is what you are talking about is done as easily as two people talking about another in a bad way and energy goes to the person that they have been gossiping about.
It is true that you should not buy second hand books. Who had read them before you? and what energy have they put into them?
Please free to contact me if you need any help in removing this block.
Best of luck!!!

Why not buy second hand books because you dont know who had them before you....... I dont get this statement....... you would be living in a very parnoid world if we worried about this stuff and would more than likely attract or generate that enery for yourself without anyone ever having to try and send it...if you lived by this rule alone you would in most certainly create the very enviroment around you, you wish not to be there..

Gillo

The-Star wrote: »

Hi. Your message posted is a very serious issue and your Aunt needs help as this type of energy sent to her will bring her down. This is what I work at removing this type of energy. It can be done in a few moments and she will know it is gone. A curse is what you are talking about is done as easily as two people talking about another in a bad way and energy goes to the person that they have been gossiping about.
It is true that you should not buy second hand books. Who had read them before you? and what energy have they put into them?
Please free to contact me if you need any help in removing this block.
Best of luck!!!

Any good deals on magic beans?

On a more serious note, I'm curious about the books, if I'm reading your posts right (and I'm jet lagged at the moment), your relative has an received books from someone who has a "grudge" against them, I'm assuming the person had this grudge before they gave the books? Also what are the books about?

Has your relative tried talking to this person? Chances are it's not going to help, but I may well help bring more information to light, perhaps if you offer to go along "to support" your relative you'll be able to find out a lot more information about what may be going on.

What's the statue which the "demon" is afraid off?

After reading everything that you were talking about there, honestly this just reminds me of those people who buy medical books learn the symthoms and then go to the doc.

In not saying anything is wrong its clearly a cry for help and i think the "demonic infestation" is an excuse for the way she is acting .

Again saying that maybe she does honestly believe it is a demon but thats the last thing you look at. I would suggest consulting a doctor first.

Darragh29

Where will I start here... Ok, firstly, this girl is a cousin of mine in her late twenties, not an aunt as someone suggested.

The issue with the books, she believes that this other older family member, (who is now in his 70's but is a belligerent eccentric character who has stated that he was into the occult in bygone years), has put some sort of a curse on her by somehow directing or calling down onto her, a negative entity that has she believes has now attached itself to her and is the cause of several recent problems in her life. She sees the books as having been used almost as a sort of vehicle for this process, like as if the man above attached this negative spirit or presence to the books he gave her and when she accepted them and opened them, she unwittingly took this presence into her home with the books. The books are occult books. I suppose you could say that she believes that the books themselves are or were haunted by this negative presence that is now attached to her and follows her around.

Somtimes she feels this presence is very near and she appears to be distressed by it, other times she feel it is away somewhere and this is not really on her mind at all.

I was over with her last week and we were in her kitchen drinking tea and chatting away and we both heard a noise upstairs, (house was empty except for the two of us). It sounded like a gust of wind blowing through an attic, I didn't put any importance on it, but she insisted it was this presence moving around upstairs and said if I listened carefully, I would probably hear it "whispering" or "hissing". I had my dog with me who didn't seem bothered by anything. I didn't hear any whispering or hissing, but I wouldn't like to be living like this. I'm staying over there next week to try to put this whole thing to bed. She has broadband & a laptop so I'll drop a post here when I'm staying over and we'll see how things go...

Darragh29

Where will I start here... Ok, firstly, this girl is a cousin of mine in her late twenties, not an aunt as someone suggested.

The issue with the books, she believes that this other older family member, (who is now in his 70's but is a belligerent eccentric character who has stated that he was into the occult in bygone years), has put some sort of a curse on her by somehow directing or calling down onto her, a negative entity that has she believes has now attached itself to her and is the cause of several recent problems in her life. She sees the books as having been used almost as a sort of vehicle for this process, like as if the man above attached this negative spirit or presence to the books he gave her and when she accepted them and opened them, she unwittingly took this presence into her home with the books. The books are occult books. I suppose you could say that she believes that the books themselves are or were haunted by this negative presence that is now attached to her and follows her around.

Somtimes she feels this presence is very near and she appears to be distressed by it, other times she feel it is away somewhere and this is not really on her mind at all.

I was over with her last week and we were in her kitchen drinking tea and chatting away and we both heard a noise upstairs, (house was empty except for the two of us). It sounded like a gust of wind blowing through an attic, I didn't put any importance on it, but she insisted it was this presence moving around upstairs and said if I listened carefully, I would probably hear it "whispering" or "hissing". I had my dog with me who didn't seem bothered by anything. I didn't hear any whispering or hissing, but I wouldn't like to be living like this. I'm staying over there next week to try to put this whole thing to bed. She has broadband & a laptop so I'll drop a post here when I'm staying over and we'll see how things go...

hiorta

It really sounds as though this lady would benefit from a visit to see a doctor.

Please advise her to consider this as a first step.

Notions of 'demons' attaching to her are frightening, of course, but rationality usually deals with it quietly and effectively.
Words like 'occult' are used to hint at 'sinister' doings, but a look at the dictionary for both, should allay fears.

So many fears can be the result of tiredness, poor diet, worry or stress, but are without other foundation. Imagination then gets to work.

As far as material objects 'containing' demons (psychometry) and what have you, I've never yet met anyone who was worried about handling or obtaining money, which must be ultra contaminated by such beasties.

I am not saying its not negative energy. I actually do believe there is a link between depression and negative energy. But i am not going to jump straight to Paranormal as soon as something happens.
But lets be rational. A doctor first.

kshiel

When you are depressed or feeling this kinda fear I am sure her own energy is wearing down and in general crap.

Has she gone to a doctor and explained this yet? Or would you be able to convince her to go to one, or even discuss these happenings and situation with your own doctor and obtain advice on how best to help her.

You cannot bear all of this responiablity, are there other family members on which you can call on to help with this horrible situation. I really think the quicker this girl gets help the better for all involved and to me its time to do what needs to be done.