unrelated crap

Snickers Man

phog wrote: »

BTW, his name Kidney not Kickney in case you didn't realsie, it's not too difficult to check his name in the irfu website if you weren't sure.

Sheesshh. Sense of humour deficit or what?

Mind you, the person with the best sense of humour in Irish rugby at the moment is whatever muppet gave Ronan O'Gara the man of the match award against Argentina.

WTF was that about?

He was ****e today. Giving away penalties, kicking to nowhere. Missing his goals.

Dear Santa,

Please can we have a new out half for Christmas.
Preferably a good young one.
We'll be good for a whole year.
Promise.

Valentia

The big question with Declan is whether he has the guts to get rid of the over rated players who have not performed in 3 years yet are treated as some sort of deities. It's pretty obvious the 1st changes needed are in personnel. Then the attitude will change.

anonymous_joe

Anyone else worried by the lack of substitutions...?

Stev_o

old boy wrote: »

there was a fair bit of hoofing at the arms park yesterday, i wonder why clubs in ireland bring in so many coaches with all the talent thats littering this forum

Hence why Wales lost Brian Moore didnt need to say it any clearer.

JuliusFranco

Not so sure the backs would have opened Argi up, they don't seem to have much bite at the moment.

Either way, it's just too early to tell how Kidney is going to get on.

Some changes need to be made but they're no reason to doubt Kidney's ability to make them.

Speaking as someone from Connaught and hence kinda neutral, it saddens me that there appears to be such a rift between Munster and Leinster that cannot be put aside for the greater good, ie Ireland.

What I'm talking about is that some changes need to be made but there is some notion that a balance between Leinster and Munster has to be maintained.

For example, the captaincy needs to be taken from BOD and given to either POC or ROG(tho after Saturday, I'm not so sure about ROG) and furthermore BOD needs to be moved to 12 if not to 22. That hasn't happened because of politics. It would take a brave coach to drop BOD in favour of Munster's Keith Earls (it would take a brave manager anyway but you get my point).

After the Mun vs NZ match, I was just amazed with the amount of begrudging from Leinster supporters. It was a special one off match with a special performance from Munster, and since when did Leinster people care what George Hook had to say. O'Gara's comments re passion etc were clearly directed at everyone on the Irish team. Why Leinster supporters chose to take more personally goes back to this rivalry.

A winning rugby team needs to have 22 players working for each other and as one. Against this backdrop I think it's hard for an Irish team to do that. This Leinster bias against Kidney is not productive.

Oh, and to keep some semblance of balance to this post, George Hook and Munster supporters who slag of Leinster for being big girls need a good telling off or at least a strongly worded letter.

Munster_Gal

I agree with juliosfranco ... I think when it comes to the Irish rugby team... Munster supporters and Leinster supporters all need to get over themselves. ( me included!!!) We could have a world class side if there wasn't so much bias and slagging.

Ireland do need the passion of the supporters behind them, it clearly works for Munster and I think Leinster supporters need to start seeing Kidney for what he is now... Ireland Coach...Not Munster!!!!

The Irish squad have a huge amount of potential and I think we all just need to be patient and supportive in whatever Kidney and the team decide to do.

RugbyFanatic

JuliusFranco wrote: »

For example, the captaincy needs to be taken from BOD and given to either POC or ROG(tho after Saturday, I'm not so sure about ROG)

POC can't even make good lineout decisions and you want him as captain? POC is a great player but he is not the most level headed in the game. ROG should never get anywhere near the captaincy he regularly goes missing in big games and looks like he wants to be somewhere else. Dreadful choice.

and furthermore BOD needs to be moved to 12 if not to 22. That hasn't happened because of politics. It would take a brave coach to drop BOD in favour of Munster's Keith Earls (it would take a brave manager anyway but you get my point).

It would take a brave coach to drop BOD for Earls because it would be a completely idiotic decision. BOD is far, far superior to Earls currently. In a few years Earls could possibly reach BOD's level but not yet. Ridiculous idea BOD was one of our best players vs NZ and at the WC he is a big game player.

After the Mun vs NZ match, I was just amazed with the amount of begrudging from Leinster supporters. It was a special one off match with a special performance from Munster, and since when did Leinster people care what George Hook had to say. O'Gara's comments re passion etc were clearly directed at everyone on the Irish team. Why Leinster supporters chose to take more personally goes back to this rivalry.

I thought it was a bit hypocritical of ROG of all people to be talking about passion seeing as when the game isn't going his way he doesn't want to know about it. In the WC he just didn't seem to care same against NZ.





Kidney is a man not known for appeasing so you can be in no doubt that if he thought an entire Munster 15 for Ireland would be the way forward then he would do it but the fact is he hasn't

as an aside lets judge the players who have played well vs those that played poor

Good AI :
BOD (Leinster)
Fitzgerald (Leinster)
Kearney (Leinster)
Ferris (Ulster)
Bowe (Ospreys)
Wallace (Munster)

Bad AI :
DOC (Munster)
ROG (Munster)
Horan (Munster)
Quinlan (Munster)
Best (Ulster)

Average AI
Heaslip (Leinster)
O'Leary (Munster)
Flannery (Munster)
Dempsey (Leinster)
POC (Munster)

Other than Wallace no Munster played exceptionally well so this notion that Ireland needs MORE Munster players just doesn't hold weight in my eyes.

and that is not provincial bias by the way these are the cold hard facts.

Blured

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

and that is not provincial bias by the way these are the cold hard facts.

Cold Hard Facts based on your opinions, which means that they are not facts

FACT

RugbyFanatic

Blured wrote: »

Cold Hard Facts based on your opinions, which means that they are not facts

FACT

Are you saying my ratings are wrong?

Is it not a fact that ROG,DOC,Horan,Quinlan and Best had terrible AIs?

Valentia

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

Good AI :
BOD (Leinster)
Fitzgerald (Leinster)
Kearney (Leinster)
Ferris (Ulster)
Bowe (Ospreys)
Wallace (Munster)

Anyone who has Tommy Bowe in the "good" column shows a complete lack of understanding of the game. Tommy has been the worst defender I have seen in decades in an Irish jersey. There are a few more peculiar choices there too but the Bowe example is reason enough to ignore the rest of your post.

Blured

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

Are you saying my ratings are wrong?

Is it not a fact that ROG,DOC,Horan,Quinlan and Best had terrible AIs?

Thats not my argument - its more a case of your ratings can not be judged to be fact as they are just your opinion.

As said above - Bowe wouldnt be in Valentias "good colunm" - I would move Dempsey to Bad - DOC to Average, etc. Its just an individuals opinion and therefore not a fact

D.S.

Valentia wrote: »

Anyone who has Tommy Bowe in the "good" column shows a complete lack of understanding of the game. Tommy has been the worst defender I have seen in decades in an Irish jersey. There are a few more peculiar choices there too but the Bowe example is reason enough to ignore the rest of your post.

+ 1 - Bowe never was nor never will be an international winger. How he is in the team still is unbelievable. He does not have international pace, and doesn't have anything else in the tank that brings him up to international level..

Serenity Now!

Valentia wrote: »

Anyone who has Tommy Bowe in the "good" column shows a complete lack of understanding of the game. Tommy has been the worst defender I have seen in decades in an Irish jersey. There are a few more peculiar choices there too but the Bowe example is reason enough to ignore the rest of your post.

So you know while a number of qualified, excellent coaches and captains don't? :rolleyes:

Goodluck2me

phog wrote: »

Most of our games against the Pumas are hard fought games and I think it was decided to put the ball behind them and force them to make errors. I'd take a 17 -3 win over the likes of Argentina any day regardless of what way our backs play.

BTW, his name Kidney not Kickney in case you didn't realsie, it's not too difficult to check his name in the irfu website if you weren't sure.

We were the first team to score a try against them in 3 matches, and they are ranked 4th in the world, a 17-3 is a very good win.

Sundy wrote: »

The problem i had have is there doesnt seem to be a convincing game plan. The first thing kidney should be doing is implementing his game plan.

how would you know if there was wasn't a convincing game plan? I hate this rubbish, it's just over-generalised mouthing off for the sake of it.

thehighground

Serenity Now! wrote: »

So you know while a number of qualified, excellent coaches and captains don't? :rolleyes:

Well, his captain didn't think much of him on Saturday judging by the earful he gave him!

old boy

being a captain does not give the divine right to give earfulls, a real good captain should never be heard giving earfulls, there is more to being captain than that, think back to the world cup where stringer made the pass to no one, as o driscoll was not there to recieve it, he then started giving stringer an earfull, forgetting the first law of turnovers , get back on D, help defend, and recover the ball,

Sundy

goodluck2me wrote: »

We were the first team to score a try against them in 3 matches, and they are ranked 4th in the world, a 17-3 is a very good win.

how would you know if there was wasn't a convincing game plan? I hate this rubbish, it's just over-generalised mouthing off for the sake of it.

How is that generalised mouthing off. The game plan may have been convincing on paper but it sure wasnt on the field. We played a scrappy game for 60 minutes. Very little structred attack worked. The decent break tommy bowe made in the first half came from an off the cuff move that he decided to run back rather than kick.

If you figured out the game plan ireland were play and could see how it was working please share it with us.

Chucky the tree

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

as an aside lets judge the players who have played well vs those that played poor

Good AI :
BOD (Leinster)
Fitzgerald (Leinster)
Kearney (Leinster)
Ferris (Ulster)
Bowe (Ospreys)
Wallace (Munster)

Bad AI :
DOC (Munster)
ROG (Munster)
Horan (Munster)
Quinlan (Munster)
Best (Ulster)

Average AI
Heaslip (Leinster)
O'Leary (Munster)
Flannery (Munster)
Dempsey (Leinster)
POC (Munster)


and that is not provincial bias by the way these are the cold hard facts.

Funniest thing I have ever read on this forum.:pac:

RugbyFanatic

The only thing funny is people calling for more Munster players in the set up when other than Best all the players who were terrible this AI were Munster players whilst other than Best all our top performers were from elsewhere.

Maybe we should stop looking to Munster and look elsewhere is all I am saying? Horan should be dropped, DOC should be dropped, Quinlan should be dropped.

I'd liken to see Ferris ahead of Quinlan, when fit Cullen ahead of DOC and anyone ahead of Horan.

That is actually less Munster players but I feel it will be better for Ireland it seems that people here want Munster players starting on the basis that the more Munster men the more passionate the team become or something which just simply isn't true.

Valentia

Serenity Now! wrote: »

So you know while a number of qualified, excellent coaches and captains don't? :rolleyes:

Imagine that! Absurd indeed............

Podge_irl

JuliusFranco wrote: »

For example, the captaincy needs to be taken from BOD and given to either POC or ROG(tho after Saturday, I'm not so sure about ROG) and furthermore BOD needs to be moved to 12 if not to 22. That hasn't happened because of politics. It would take a brave coach to drop BOD in favour of Munster's Keith Earls (it would take a brave manager anyway but you get my point).

It would take a suicidal manager. Earls has had what, one game in the centre for Munster? He's not anywhere remotely near BOD at the moment. Good prospect, and could be challenging Fitz's position soon perhaps (I imagine he will be challenging for centre in the 6N and there is a decent chance we'll see Earls/Fitz at some point if BOD comes off), but BOD is still the best centre Ireland have available.

I think people severely over-estimate the effect of "politics" in the Irish squad. For one, I doubt the players or management give a crap what nonsense supporters spout. There is also no inherent bias in the IRFU for or against one province, only one man selects the team. I happen to think Kidney plays favourites too often and can't see past some players, but I don't think its politics or any such nonsense, I just think he happens to like certain players - a huge number of coaches do the same thing. There was plenty of complaining in Wales when Gatland selected the whole bloody Ospreys team - this is not a peculiarly Irish phenomenon.

Chucky the tree

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

The only thing funny is people calling for more Munster players in the set up when other than Best all the players who were terrible this AI were Munster players whilst other than Best all our top performers were from elsewhere.

Maybe we should stop looking to Munster and look elsewhere is all I am saying? Horan should be dropped, DOC should be dropped, Quinlan should be dropped.

I'd liken to see Ferris ahead of Quinlan, when fit Cullen ahead of DOC and anyone ahead of Horan.

That is actually less Munster players but I feel it will be better for Ireland it seems that people here want Munster players starting on the basis that the more Munster men the more passionate the team become or something which just simply isn't true.

It was the whole "These are my opinions, they are fact" that had me laughing. I'd still have Quinlan in the squad and I thought DOC played well against Agrentina for what his usually performances have been, I wouldnt argue with Cullen when fit though.

Horan is ****ing awful, but I have no clue about front rowers coming through(baring we dont seem to have many).

Crash

To prove a point, this was split off from the Declan Kickney thread. A thread of 48 posts yielded 22 off topic posts. Can you all please TRY and make this forum readable again, its becoming ridiculuous.