Getting a Gaggia, but which one? and from where?

jebuz

Hi friends of the roasted bean variety,

I have decided I love coffee enough to go for a Gaggia machine. From reading around here the general consensus seems to be that the Gaggia's are worth the extra few bob in the long run, I'm no expert but I think that's what you would all tell me anyway, so let's do it.

I have a budget of say 250 - 300 euro and It seems all the bargains are online. I have a gaggia MM grinder, I know some of you would spit on me now that I've said that, but the plan is to get the machine first and then perhaps in January or February I will upgrade the grinder to the MDF or something. Believe me, I need a machine more than a grinder, I have an espresso machine I got in dunnes about a year ago, it's not worth talking about.

So after looking at some of the online resources on the forum, here are some options for me:
Baby - http://www.coffeeitalia.ie/new_gaggia_coffee_machine_abs_baby.php - €259 + free shipping
Classic - http://www.coffeeitalia.ie/proddetail.php?prod=gaggia-classic - €309 + free shipping

I read some people had problems with coffeeitalia.ie so I also tried italy-outlet.co.uk

Espresso Colour - http://www.italy-outlet.co.uk/en/i/cat55/product667460.html - €199 + €15 delivery
Classic - http://www.italy-outlet.co.uk/en/i/cat55/product63956.html - €289 + €15 delivery

both seem quite similar on price, but would anybody recommend who to buy from, and which one is best value? I'm edging towards the classic there's not much price difference between both, but are the extra features worth it, would the baby suffice my needs? (basically 1-2 coffee's day)

Any other comments or advice really appreciated.

Thanks

Victor_M

Hey jebuz, the Gaggia classic seems to be the beginners espresso machine of choice, I have one and most of the posters on here either have or had one at some stage.

House of Fraiser in Dundrum had 50% off the classic (off there original price anyway) 2 weeks ago when I was out there, 230 or 280 can't remember which but cheaper than any of your online options. Give them a call and ask about it.

On the grinder issue, don't put that on the long finger, A good grinder and a bad espresso machine will yield better results than the other way around, you can have the greatest espresso device on the market, if the coffee is not ground correctly and consistently you will never get a decent shot out of it.

Have a search through the forum there are plenty of suggestion for good grinders in the 150 - 250 range, I have the MDF and can recommend it but there are other cheaper options out there, just make sure you get one at the same time as the coffee machine so you have some chance of producing decent coffees.

Even with the right equipment there is a learning curve involved, which takes time, patience and a few/loads of wasted shots of coffee while you are tweaking the grinder settings to get the flow rate just right, but it's hugely rewarding when you get it down and can knock out espresso's, lattes and cappuccino's that would put your local parasitical American coffee chains to shame!

RE*AC*TOR

Machine useless without a decent grinder - will produce dreck. No point buying a machine withouth having the grinder to go with it.

In any case, of those options, I'd go with the Classic, I've heard the OPV is not as easy to adjust on the Baby.

jebuz

I know you feel very strongly about this Reactor, but is the MM grinder actually so bad it would render a gaggia classic useless? I just can't get my head around the emphasis on the grinder.

Again I'm no expert but why would gaggia produce such a rubbish grinder if it wasn't worthy of producing a decent coffee. The grind looks ok to me, grinds looks even and course, but then again I've never had another grinder and I wouldn't pay attention to anything I say . I do value your opinion though as you seem to be one of the more informed enthusiasts on the forum and I won't ignore the fact that a good grinder is essential, just have a little trouble understanding why.

As I said I will look at a grinder after Christmas if money allows, but I will probably just go for the classic for the moment, I'm positive it will be an improvement on the machine I have currently.

@Victor: thanks for the reply, I rang House of Frasier in Dundrum but no reply, I might pop out this week sometime and see if that deal is there because it sounds like a great offer. I also look forward to this learning curve you speak of...I just hope it curves upwards

Update: just got through to HoF, all the Gaggia's are sold out it's a bloody conspiracy

RE*AC*TOR

Basically the burrs on the MM are not sharp and are more akin to crushing plates.

Espresso is entirely dependent on an even consistent grind. The MM just does not produce this. Good burr grinders have sharp burrs that cut rather than crush the beans.

As to why Gaggia produce this grinder - Gaggia do lots of things that aren't in the best interest of quality, like putting a panarello device on the steam wand, or setting the OPV pressure too high. The grinder fills a gap at a certain price point for a grinder that people are willing to spend.

The grinder thing is nearly always something people don't get starting out with home espresso. A lot of people (myself included) start off with buying bricks of preground stuff from the supermarket. My next step was a whirly blade "grinder", and then fortunately I had the good sense to bypass the likes of the Krups GV2 and the MM to buy an MDF. That's when I started producing tasty stuff from my espresso machine.

jebuz

Ok I see what you mean now, thanks for clearing that up. Just on that point of OPV pressure, with the gaggia classic, can you adjust the pressure to the ideal 9 bar for espresso's?

So how do you feel about these "bricks" of preground coffee, I've tried a few on occasion and found them to be quite nice, some not so nice, you get what you pay for really. How would they compare to fresh beans ground on an MM? which would you go for if you were in my shoes? There's also the gaggia pods you can use, any experience with those?

RE*AC*TOR

You can adjust the OPV on the Classic fairly easily. There's a few threads on here discussing it. Without a pressure gauge you can estimate it, with a pressure gauge you can nail it down.

The bricks are (a) stale, and (b) not the correct fineness. If someone held a gun to my head I'd probably drink what the MM produced, but if I had only those two to choose from I'd consider giving tea a larger share of my time.

I've only used Illy pods (on a Gaggia) and my experience was they were just as stale as the ground stuff. If you want to go the pod route, you'd probably be as well off going for a nespresso, reports suggest they do pods better than most (faint praise).

I'm trying not to be too discouraging, you can get a decent grinder for STG£100 in the Iberital MC2 (happydonkey). You can of course go ahead and get the Classic, but don't expect the Classic to turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. The coffee that comes out is only as good as the coffee that goes in, and with espresso, the quality of grind is paramount.

jebuz

Hey Guys,

I ordered the Gaggia classic from italy-outlet.co.uk (netrade.ie) mainly because it was a decent price including delivery and I saw they had a base in Cork.

I placed the order exactly one week ago, and chose paypal payment. They said they would prompt me for a payment when they are ready to ship, I thought that might have taken 2-3 days max. I emailed them on wednesday for an update but no response, has anybody had any bad experience with these guys? or maybe they're just busy with the Christmas period...i ho ho hope so...very sorry about that.

jebuz

[Snipped] There doesn't seem to be any negative comments about italy-outlet.co.uk, I guess time will tell...