Minimising bruising

Boston

I bruise quiet easily and after 6 weeks of Judo I've marks all over. I'm wondering if you guys could recommend any vitamins or creams which would help with the healing process?

Raze_them_all

Arnica i think is what it's called

Pingu

Up your vitamin C intake will reduce the amount you bruise, and applying a Vitamin K cream to the area can speed up the reduction of the bruise.

Boston

Thanks lads.

macaroni+cheese

apparently being beat with a bag of oranges doesn't leave bruises

Boston

My knee in your solar plexus and your elbow up around you ear will, in all likelihood, leave you bruised however.

macaroni+cheese

also: being suffocated with a pillow doesnt leave a mark

note: if you are the person doing the suffocating, you might get beat.

macaroni+cheese

that would leave a bruise.

Killme00

macaroni+cheese wrote: »

apparently being beat with a bag of oranges doesn't leave bruises

I think you mean a bar of soap in a sock

or getting hit with a phonebook


This cant be true

Nothingcompares

But you would leave them smelling of oranges.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Boston wrote: »

I bruise quiet easily and after 6 weeks of Judo I've marks all over. I'm wondering if you guys could recommend any vitamins or creams which would help with the healing process?

You'll get used to it and the bruising will stop... Then you'll miss 'em, wear them like little medals!.

Seriously, after awhile you won't bruise. And if I've to guess, your worse brusing will be around your chest and arms?.

Boston

Yep. I've already noticed less bruising now compared to when I started as I improve break falls and rolling (I'm still terrible at rolling in and out of movements). Most the the bruising in the arms seems to be as a results of over egger newbies (like myself) pinching the triceps and biceps. The Chest and shoulder stuff seems to be caused by improperly trying to do throws.

Jason Mc

do ballet..

Boston

Its not a flexibility issue, more a mental block about rolling

arybvtcw0eolkf

Boston wrote: »

Yep. I've already noticed less bruising now compared to when I started as I improve break falls and rolling (I'm still terrible at rolling in and out of movements). Most the the bruising in the arms seems to be as a results of over egger newbies (like myself) pinching the triceps and biceps. The Chest and shoulder stuff seems to be caused by improperly trying to do throws.

Its not even pinching, believe it or not before you took up Judo - YOU WERE SOFT!.. Now your getting 'ard

In the book 'Angry White Pyjamas' the author describes the process of harding up pretty good.

I'm returning to Judo tonight after a two month break (if you remember I broke a rib), and although I don't bruise anymore, tomorrow I'll be damned sore.

Your probably over the blister on your fingers and tops of your toes stage now?. Thats a horrible period to go through with Judo, and worse in a club (Portmarnock) where you do alot of grip fighting (rips your fingers apart) or a club with lots of ground work (rips the tops of your toes apart).

ColinJennings

Boston wrote: »

Its not a flexibility issue, more a mental block about rolling

I think the point was that judo is a martial art, so you need to expect some bruising.

Although I remember two of my students (sisters) comming up to me after a class and telling me that their principal asked them if everything was all right at home as thier arms always had bruises on them.

Boston

Mairt wrote: »

Its not even pinching, believe it or not before you took up Judo - YOU WERE SOFT!.. Now your getting 'ard

In the book 'Angry White Pyjamas' the author describes the process of harding up pretty good.

I'm returning to Judo tonight after a two month break (if you remember I broke a rib), and although I don't bruise anymore, tomorrow I'll be damned sore.

Your probably over the blister on your fingers and tops of your toes stage now?. Thats a horrible period to go through with Judo, and worse in a club (Portmarnock) where you do alot of grip fighting (rips your fingers apart) or a club with lots of ground work (rips the tops of your toes apart).

Ah yes, the blisters, they where fairly annoying but not that. I'd spent many summers working on building sites growing up so my hadns, while soft these days, didn't get too messed up. The feet where actually fine (years of wearings army boots).

ColinJennings wrote: »

I think the point was that judo is a martial art, so you need to expect some bruising.

Yep, and I fully accepted that going in. Probably I'm one of the few newbies whose not been scared away (where did all the women got ?). But at the same time I'm getting odd looks around the office and at home, kinda like Ed Norton's character in flight club.

Khannie

Boston wrote: »

But at the same time I'm getting odd looks around the office and at home, kinda like Ed Norton's character in flight club.

Haha. My forearms used to be one large bruise from holding Thai pads. Probably for months! Haven't had one in a long time now though. I did get some funny looks around the office too. Amazing how sensitive office folk are to a bit of rough and tumble. If only they could see my shins.

ColinJennings wrote: »

Although I remember two of my students (sisters) comming up to me after a class and telling me that their principal asked them if everything was all right at home as thier arms always had bruises on them.

HAHAHA. Classic.

Nothingcompares

Back in the day I used to get finger print like bruises around my arms. I suppose on a child it would look as if someone took them by the arm very forcibly.

Kila

I would avoid arnica unless you're trying to get rid of a particular bruise in a hurry. It's very effective for making bruises disappear quickly, but I've found that it seems to make the area more susceptible for future bruising for a while afterwards.

tallaght01

Realistically, there's nothing you can do for bruising. By it's very nature, you can't just make blood under the skin disappear.

I wish I could do. I've a massive shiner on me right now. I've a job where black eyes don't leave such a good impression, so it's a pain in the arse.

Kila

Not necessarily true. Arnica does work - it has a sound basis in biology and I've seen it work with my own eyes.

The thymol derivatives concentrated in the plants roots have been clinically shown to be effective vasodilators of subcutaneous blood capillaries. Arnica preparations used topically have been demonstrated to act as an anti-inflammatory and assist normal healing processes by facilitating transport of blood and fluid accumulations through a dilating action of subcutaneous blood capillaries.

Basically, it helps to dilate the capillaries running just under the surface of your skin (the ones which will be damaged after impact, and will show as bruising). This means that fluid, clots, and blood which might otherwise "pool" in the area move more freely through the area, minimising bruising.

However, it can make the area more susceptible to worse bruising in the aftermath (just the area itself, though, if you apply it topically in a cream or ointment). I'd avoid ingesting it, to be honest - unless you're taking it orally under medical supervision, you're putting yourself at risk. The plant contains a toxin called helanin that can affect you badly if you ingest too much of it - too much taken orally can make you really ill (gastroenteritis, internal bleeding in the digestive tract, etc). The cream is pretty safe, I'd take any oral supplements under advisement. It is possible to take it orally, but the concentrations and dilutions have to be very carefully controlled to avoid the above side effects.

jim o doom

Dude the bruising will stop on it's own after a while - I was do kenpo & got heavily bruised for a wee while - at the start, but your body will become conditioned against it & the bruising will more or less stop - bar the odd super hard bruise causing hit/fall/whatever..

jim o doom

Nothingcompares wrote: »

Back in the day I used to get finger print like bruises around my arms. I suppose on a child it would look as if someone took them by the arm very forcibly.

I get that the odd time on my bicep from people grabbing the bicep instead of my shirt. But Ill get used ot it

tallaght01

Kila wrote: »

Not necessarily true. Arnica does work - it has a sound basis in biology and I've seen it work with my own eyes.

The thymol derivatives concentrated in the plants roots have been clinically shown to be effective vasodilators of subcutaneous blood capillaries. Arnica preparations used topically have been demonstrated to act as an anti-inflammatory and assist normal healing processes by facilitating transport of blood and fluid accumulations through a dilating action of subcutaneous blood capillaries.

Basically, it helps to dilate the capillaries running just under the surface of your skin (the ones which will be damaged after impact, and will show as bruising). This means that fluid, clots, and blood which might otherwise "pool" in the area move more freely through the area, minimising bruising.

However, it can make the area more susceptible to worse bruising in the aftermath (just the area itself, though, if you apply it topically in a cream or ointment). I'd avoid ingesting it, to be honest - unless you're taking it orally under medical supervision, you're putting yourself at risk. The plant contains a toxin called helanin that can affect you badly if you ingest too much of it - too much taken orally can make you really ill (gastroenteritis, internal bleeding in the digestive tract, etc). The cream is pretty safe, I'd take any oral supplements under advisement. It is possible to take it orally, but the concentrations and dilutions have to be very carefully controlled to avoid the above side effects.

People are free to use what they want for bruising. But arnica has never been shown to work. If you have seen it work yourself, then fine. That's cool. I have no beef with arnica.
But the flipside is that the studies where people were given arnica cream or a dummy cream showed no differences in bruising resolution between the two groups.

If it was an anti-inflammatory....many anti-inflammatories make bleeding worse, and vasodilation can make bruising worse.

Some bigger studies would be nice, but as things stand arnica is still just one of those ointments that people sell without any proof they work.

Rob Carry

Take a course of iron tablets - galfer or some other brand. I used to get those big horrible purplish bruises that go all sorts of horrible colours before disappearing, but for months after taking a one or two week course I hardly bruise at all.

Nothingcompares

tallaght01 wrote: »

But arnica has never been shown to work.

I've heard arnica dismissed as a nonsense herbal remedy before but it's amazing how widespread its usage is. It was recommended to me by a physio before for bruising on my wrists.

tallaght01

Nothingcompares wrote: »

I've heard arnica dismissed as a nonsense herbal remedy before but it's amazing how widespread its usage is. It was recommended to me by a physio before for bruising on my wrists.

I agree. If it doesn't work then someone is making a killing out of selling ****e.

BUt the studies havent shown a difference compared to when you give someone a dummy cream. BUT those studies haven't been big enough to completely rule out any benefit. But in the trials done so far it's not shown to be effective.

If it had been, the mainstream drug companies would be on it like a hot snot.

Kila

Would any of you care to share the titles, authors, and journals in which you've found these studies? I'd be interested to read them as a counterpoint to a number of studies that I have found myself.

I would also like to point out that even though homoeopathic remedies are often discounted, and even often proven to be ineffective, this does not mean that all homoeopathic remedies are - St. John's Wort is a case in point here.

Nothingcompares

Yes perhaps a discussion on the Biology/Medicine forum with references would be beneficial to all.

tallaght01

Agreed. If it's gonna get mental scientific, let's take it over to biology+medicine.
Kila, if you start a thread quoting some studies we'll maybe change our minds.
I'm on holiday in Fiji at the mo, so I've no access to journals. But the most recent arnice trial I read was in the Journal of Dermatology (though, actually, it might no be...sorry, holiday brain on at the moment) this year. Don't know the issue or date, but you'll be able to pubmed it.

But the good hting about having this discussion on biology+medicine is that A) it won't bore everone, and the people there will be able to comment on the quality of the trials you're going to reference. Because there's a world or difference being able to quote a study and it being a GOOD study.

But everyone there would definitely be interested in hearing about studies showing a benefit from arnica, because there certainly hadn't been any convincing studies in the earlier part of this year, so maybe there's been soething in the last few months.

See ya on the dark side :P

Kila

Sounds like a good plan, I'll re-find the papers I read about it previously and throw them up for all to see - it would be interesting to get a scientific/medical perspective on the whole thing.