Phone Masts - Your Opinion??

curious-pup

Hi all, just wondering what the general opinion on phone masts is. Personally, I am slightly wary of them even though I know it makes no sense seeing as I spend a lot of time on the phone, but I am just interested to hear what you all think, thanks

projectmayhem

Can't remember the figures (or measurement thereof) but they broadcast at quite low frequencies to come under Irish law. You could probably live under one and have no problems at all. I believe your standard household microwave is far more dangerous then these towers.

One issue is that when people protest them and have them removed, the mobile phone companies simply replace them with far more relays on the corners of streets, which are probably far worse because there ends up being more of them. But hey, you can't see them so they're obviously not there

I think the number 1 problem with them is that they're ugly, so people's views of them aren't going to be too nice.

biko

I like them. Without them my phone would work.

towel401

in a few years satellite phone technology will have improved and there will be no need for them anymore except for local repeaters

opr

towel401 wrote: »

in a few years satellite phone technology will have improved and there will be no need for them anymore except for local repeaters

lol

Opr

Fratton Fred

although they are reputd to be fairly safe (Although I wouldn't go climbing up them kids!!) I think there should be a certain amuont of responsibility as to where they positioned. for example away from schools etc.

Generally though, people don't care about the health issues, its got more to do with nimby ism when they oppose them.

I would have no problems living near one, as long as it was positioned correctly and the company had done all it can to position in it not only a responsible position, but also mede it fit in with its environment.

Jonathan

I sure hope the gardai like them. Denis didn't give them much choice really.

oscarBravo

Every year ComReg spend quite a lot of time and money doing field strength surveys at the boundary fence of every single transmitter site in the country. In all cases (with one exception, which wasn't a mobile phone site, and was rectified immediately) the field strength was measured at several orders of magnitute below the accepted safe limit, which itself is conservative.

Also, being near a cell site means your handset - your source of maximum exposure to mobile phone radiation - can transmit at its lowest power setting, so the closer you are to a cell site, the safer you are (assuming you're concerned about safety).

seanybiker

they dont bother me at all. They do a job so there grand

Walkman

I think they are great. Without them I wouldnt be cake to post this from my phone :-D

cgarvey

towel401 wrote: »

in a few years satellite phone technology will have improved and there will be no need for them anymore except for local repeaters

Yes, because they, just like satellite "broadband" providers, will be able to bend the laws of physics.

towel401

cgarvey wrote: »

Yes, because they, just like satellite "broadband" providers, will be able to bend the laws of physics.

in soviet russia the laws of physics bend you!

mk6705

Walkman wrote: »

I think they are great. Without them I wouldnt be cake to post this from my phone :-D

Nice predictive text .
Personally I f**king love masts. It may be to do with my radio enthusiasm, nut if a mast were to be built behind my house tomorrow I'd be delighted and would probably spend many hours looking at it. As for the power levels, masts in the GSM 900 band can broadcast 2W, while those in the GSM 1800 band can push 1W. Not sure about 3G masts....Commercial FM broadcasts would push anywhere from 50W to 160KW (in Ireland). So really, I would consider mobile masts quite insignificant and I'm not running in fear from my radio either.

krudler

Heres one for ye, working in customer care i had a woman ring in one day irate that her texts wouldnt send to lack of coverage in her area and she had a lot to send as she was organising something, the reason? she was part of a commitee trying to organise a protest over...a mast!

byte

krudler wrote: »

Heres one for ye, working in customer care i had a woman ring in one day irate that her texts wouldnt send to lack of coverage in her area and she had a lot to send as she was organising something, the reason? she was part of a commitee trying to organise a protest over...a mast!

Haha, priceless!

barnicles

A question:
Why are there phone masts built at Garda stations?

projectmayhem

barnicles wrote: »

A question:
Why are there phone masts built at Garda stations?

Because there's a Garda station in every district in the country. Also, I would imagine there's less chance of them being broken into.

Jonathan

barnicles wrote: »

A question:
Why are there phone masts built at Garda stations?

Because Denis O'Brien did a deal with them.

mk6705

barnicles wrote: »

A question:
Why are there phone masts built at Garda stations?

Yeah, as jmccrohan suggests, O2 have a deal, first made by Denis O'Brien. There mustn't be a very good pattern of Garda stations down here though, because I'm repeatedly told O2 coverage is ****e here. And I'm pretty sure it is too. Still, i guess it was a good starting point for coverage.

ProjectC

Adro947 wrote: »

Yeah, as jmccrohan suggests, O2 have a deal, first made by Denis O'Brien. There mustn't be a very good pattern of Garda stations down here though, because I'm repeatedly told O2 coverage is ****e here. And I'm pretty sure it is too. Still, i guess it was a good starting point for coverage.

well the main advantage would be indoor coverage and town coverage

example here in west cork o2s coverage say 2 km outside bandon wudnt be the greatest however intown youd have signal in a basment!!

su_dios

Despite what the tests say... would you put one on your roof if paid the nice fee for hosting it and providing appearance wasn't going to be an issue here.

I certainly wouldn't.

byte

Excellent coverage, and get paid for it?! :eek: Where do I sign?

drunkmonkey

krudler wrote: »

Heres one for ye, working in customer care i had a woman ring in one day irate that her texts wouldnt send to lack of coverage in her area and she had a lot to send as she was organising something, the reason? she was part of a commitee trying to organise a protest over...a mast!

lol, I had the same, when are X network going to improve the coverage in our area? ha ha, there not, you shouldn't have objected...:)

opr

I remember hearing a good one about Meteor in their early days when the coverage they provided was beyond bad. I am sure its an old wifes tale but i thought it was pretty funny.

They had 2 or 3 portable phone masts that the would drive around the country. Basically if the got a few complaints about coverage in the same area they would send one of these off to this place and park it up for a couple of days to provide better coverage and then move it off to appease more complaints in another area when it was needed

Opr

congo_90

byte wrote: »

Excellent coverage, and get paid for it?! :eek: Where do I sign?

Stick it on me roof I'm lucky to get signal!

opr wrote: »

I remember hearing a good one about Meteor in their early days when the coverage they provided was beyond bad. I am sure its an old wifes tale but i thought it was pretty funny.

They had 2 or 3 portable phone masts that the would drive around the country. Basically if the got a few complaints about coverage in the same area they would send one of these off to this place and park it up for a couple of days to provide better coverage and then move it off to appease more complaints in another area when it was needed

Opr

I'll rob that van and also park it on my roof just in case the mast ever breaks down

digiman

It is possible to get a small cell site installed in your house. It basically is a reciever on the roof that tunes into a nearby cell site and it amplifies this signal in your house given you greater coverage.

I work in this industry and have seen a few reports from operaters showing them doing tests at different points and they do be several times lower than the recommened levels.

As someone said before, I wouldn't be to worried about general mobile operator equipment. I would be a lot more worried about broadband companies like Irish Broadband, Clearwire, Digiweb etc as they are using different types of technoloiges to GSM operators.

oscarBravo

su_dios wrote: »

Despite what the tests say... would you put one on your roof if paid the nice fee for hosting it and providing appearance wasn't going to be an issue here.

Like a shot, and without a moment's hesitation.

digiman wrote: »

It is possible to get a small cell site installed in your house. It basically is a reciever on the roof that tunes into a nearby cell site and it amplifies this signal in your house given you greater coverage.

Unless installed by one of the licenced operators, almost certainly illegal in this country.

I would be a lot more worried about broadband companies like Irish Broadband, Clearwire, Digiweb etc as they are using different types of technoloiges to GSM operators.

And generally operating at a fraction of the transmit power. What is it about the fact that the technology is "different" that makes it more worrying?

digiman

oscarBravo wrote: »

Unless installed by one of the licenced operators, almost certainly illegal in this country.

O2 install them.

oscarBravo wrote: »

And generally operating at a fraction of the transmit power. What is it about the fact that the technology is "different" that makes it more worrying?

Well maybe this is "in my head" but anytime I've been working on a tower or roof that had Irish Broadband or Clearwire I used to get mild headaches which I never noticed when these operators were not on the sites.
I'm no expert in antannes anyway but this is just what I have noticed. MW would be my expertise!!

Walkman

digiman wrote: »

O2 install them.

As do 3.

towel401

oscarBravo wrote: »

Like a shot, and without a moment's hesitation.

Unless installed by one of the licenced operators, almost certainly illegal in this country. And generally operating at a fraction of the transmit power. What is it about the fact that the technology is "different" that makes it more worrying?

GSM repeaters. you can buy them on ebay for about 200 eur. less even

and you're not going to get in trouble for running one because the signal from them isn't strong enough to be picked up from outside the building. what might be illegal is the VoiP to GSM gateways which are basically a separate GSM network in a box

i think multi storey car parks install gsm repeaters, as do lots of other buildings like that. I don't think they are all installed by legally licensed operators. its usually people who own the buildings that install them.

i dunno what it is with this place but everyone seems to have the idea that its illegal to unlock an iphone, install a gsm repeater and that you need to wait till a phone comes out on a certain network before you can buy one. even if it was illegal to use a GSM repeater nobody is ever going to even notice that you're running one.

rebel.ranter

Adro947 wrote: »

As for the power levels, masts in the GSM 900 band can broadcast 2W, while those in the GSM 1800 band can push 1W. Not sure about 3G masts....Commercial FM broadcasts would push anywhere from 50W to 160KW (in Ireland). So really, I would consider mobile masts quite insignificant and I'm not running in fear from my radio either.

Your figures are for 900/1800 are for the phone, base stations pump out 20W, 3G can be 20/30W depending on location. Power affects capacity in the 3G world.

I know for certain that a good number of sites are tested annually, and not just by ComReg. Any test result I have seen has always shown them to be many times below the permitted levels of NIR.

If there is going to be any health implication in the future it will be as a result of excessive hand held use.
Think about it, a 2W transmitter (your phone) about 2 inches from your brain, or a 20W transmitter (mast) up on a hill or building. Which sounds like it is going to be more dangerous?
(Also the power density falls off as a function of the distance squared.)

Another thing to consider is that a phone will reduce it's transmitting output power the closer it is to the mast (built in power control to save battery life & reduce interference potential). So you are better potentially better off if you make a call close to a Base Station.

So love those masts!

rebel.ranter

towel401 wrote: »

GSM repeaters. you can buy them on ebay for about 200 eur. less

You can get in trouble for installing a GSM repeater, it is illegal. Illegal for the following reason, the mobile phone companies pay a license fee (quite substantial ones) to operate exclusively in the paid for band.
By installing a repeater you are broadcasting illegally. In fact those EBay 900GSM ones repeat all operator GSM 900 bands, so you'll be peeing off all the operators.

towel401 wrote: »

and you're not going to get in trouble for running one because the signal from them isn't strong enough to be picked up from outside the building.

One other thing to remember is that a repeater transmits too, it has to to get the uplink signal back to the base station.

towel401 wrote: »

even if it was illegal to use a GSM repeater nobody is ever going to even notice that you're running one.

I tested out one of those EBay ones, they are cheap & nasty with poor power control. I would also imagine that the reliability would not be 100% meaning you could cause degradation to the operators network. This would lead to investigation, then lead to ComReg getting involved. Similar to GSM jammers, some of these have been confiscated by ComReg.

towel401 wrote: »

i think multi storey car parks install gsm repeaters, as do lots of other buildings like that. I don't think they are all installed by legally licensed operators. its usually people who own the buildings that install them.

This is also incorrect, operators install them or employ approved 3rd parties to install them.

rebel.ranter

opr wrote: »

I remember hearing a good one about Meteor in their early days when the coverage they provided was beyond bad. I am sure its an old wifes tale but i thought it was pretty funny.

They had 2 or 3 portable phone masts that the would drive around the country. Basically if the got a few complaints about coverage in the same area they would send one of these off to this place and park it up for a couple of days to provide better coverage and then move it off to appease more complaints in another area when it was needed

Opr

Definitely an old wives tale!!! With Base stations it is definitely not a case of just rolling it in! The tasks involved are quite complex.
Yes there are portable masts, they are generally used for concerts or can be put in place while a permanent solution is being pursued.
The worst thing a network can do is provide coverage & then take it away. They would do everything in their power to maintain coverage in an area once it is provided.

towel401

rebel.ranter wrote: »

You can get in trouble for installing a GSM repeater, it is illegal. Illegal for the following reason, the mobile phone companies pay a license fee (quite substantial ones) to operate exclusively in the paid for band.
By installing a repeater you are broadcasting illegally. In fact those EBay 900GSM ones repeat all operator GSM 900 bands, so you'll be peeing off all the operators.


One other thing to remember is that a repeater transmits too, it has to to get the uplink signal back to the base station.


I tested out one of those EBay ones, they are cheap & nasty with poor power control. I would also imagine that the reliability would not be 100% meaning you could cause degradation to the operators network. This would lead to investigation, then lead to ComReg getting involved. Similar to GSM jammers, some of these have been confiscated by ComReg.


This is also incorrect, operators install them or employ approved 3rd parties to install them.

so who makes the good, high quality repeaters that won't cause any trouble on the network?

rebel.ranter

towel401 wrote: »

so who makes the good, high quality repeaters that won't cause any trouble on the network?

Powerwave make a good quality repeater. There are other manufacturers out there too that have high standards. The EBay one even came with a dodgy power supply

ednwireland

byte wrote: »

Excellent coverage, and get paid for it?! :eek: Where do I sign?

worst place to get a signal is underneath a mast mate of mine lived in a block of falts with a mast on top in london had terrible mobile coverage

Fratton Fred

There are loads of different options available now. Companies that have large offices can have indoor cells, these look like smoke alarms and work off a base station in the basement of the building, this hugely improves indoor coverage. You can also get street Level Micros. Not sure if these are in use in Dublin, but I know that Vodafone did a deal with a pub chain to put hundreds (if not thousands) in London, Birmingham and Manchester. These sit on the front of the building like an alarm box and again, feed into a small base station in the building.

With regards mobile sites, these are used for either temporary coverage, ie concerts, sporting events etc or if a site has had a major failure. They can be set up in a couple of days and run off a generator. The only problem is, put a big metal mast in the middle of a concert and people will climb up them to get a better view!!

As for the Garda stations, are these GSM/3G base stations, or are they for the Tetra network that is going in?

mk6705

Fratton Fred wrote: »

As for the Garda stations, are these GSM/3G base stations, or are they for the Tetra network that is going in?

They'd be O2's GSM/3G base stations. I presume by the tetra network you mean the new digital Garda communications system, they'd be there too I guess.:)

worst place to get a signal is underneath a mast mate of mine lived in a block of falts with a mast on top in london had terrible mobile coverage

Are you sure it was his network? :P

byte

ednwireland wrote: »

worst place to get a signal is underneath a mast mate of mine lived in a block of falts with a mast on top in london had terrible mobile coverage

Yes, you'd be right there. Directly underneathh or directly above would probably be dead zones.

kirving

Sure in town mobile panels are painted to look like brick work or whatever color the building is. The ones that look like trees are brilliant too, noone notices them so they dont complain. Although steel fencing around a steel tree looks strange from the bottom of them!

Fratton Fred

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Sure in town mobile panels are painted to look like brick work or whatever color the building is. The ones that look like trees are brilliant too, noone notices them so they dont complain. Although steel fencing around a steel tree looks strange from the bottom of them!

They fit them in Lamposts, flag poles, even church steeple now, although the churches are keen on the money, they don't like the thought of pornographic material going through a mast on their premises!

rebel.ranter

Adro947 wrote: »

They'd be O2's GSM/3G base stations. I presume by the tetra network you mean the new digital Garda communications system, they'd be there too I guess.:)

All networks now have access to the Garda masts & any OPW building.

ironictoaster

I don't know what to think of them tbh. I remember they caused havok where I live as they attempted to put a 3G mast outside my school.

http://www.briangreene.com/bhg/category/mobile/

projectmayhem

creggy wrote: »

I don't know what to think of them tbh. I remember they caused havok where I live as they attempted to put a 3G mast outside my school.

http://www.briangreene.com/bhg/category/mobile/

They do realise that there are about 6 relays (smaller towers) in pubs and a certain supermarket nearby which are probably worse then just having 1 tower.

I remember a protest there with oul wans standing around with signs and no less then two of them were using their mobiles to chat to people.

towel401

rebel.ranter wrote: »

Powerwave make a good quality repeater. There are other manufacturers out there too that have high standards. The EBay one even came with a dodgy power supply

Lol that isn't surprising. this sort of ****e from guangdong is usually quite bad. i bought a phone battery from there that wouldn't last an hour, counterfeit CF cards, etc.