Cjc 1295 + ghrp6

Nowler

Restoring Growth Hormone

"It has been argued that the age-dependent decline in sex steroid, Growth Hormone, and IGF-I production is nature’s way of protecting us from cancer and heart disease, but a far more likely scenario is that once we reach our reproductive capacity, nature begins programming us for death."- Roy G. Smith, Ph.D. Director, Huffington Center on Aging; Professor, Department of Molecular & Cellular Biology; former Vice President for Basic Research at Merck Research Laboratories, Merck & Co
Such programming begins as the second decade of life draws to a close, the negative consequences of which become more noticeable with each passing year.

We begin to experience a steady decline in immune function. (1,2) Our bodies increase production of glucocorticoids (catabolic hormones) and cytokines (inflammatory) which negatively impact metabolism, bone density, strength, exercise tolerance, cognitive function, and mood. (3,4–8)

The hormones of sex, dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA), Growth Hormone (GH), and Insulin-like Growth Factor (IGF-1) are positively correlated with the health and well-being of the body in general and the specific functioning of metabolism, the cardiovascular system, the musculature skeletal system, cognitive function & the immune system. However these hormonal levels naturally decline as we age and as a consequence those systems necessary to maintain optimal health decline as well. (1-4,9)

"Hence, if we wish to maintain quality of life during aging we must oppose nature." - Roy G. Smith, Ph.D.
A progressive decline in lean body mass, atrophy of its component organs & reduction in their function and increased deposition of adipose tissue mass characteristic of the aging human body result partially from the body's diminished secretion of growth hormone. (10-13) These negative changes resulting from growth hormone deficiency have been shown to be reversible by replacement doses of growth hormone. (14-21)

Growth Hormone is a vital anabolic hormone whose positive stimulatory effects on protein synthesis (particularly in the liver, muscle, bone, cartlidge, spleen, kidney, skin, thymus, and red blood cells) and on lipolysis (the breakdown of fat stored in fat cells) contributes greatly to growth, repair & well-being. (10)

Growth Hormone (GH) secretion is primarily regulated by the release of two peptides, Growth Hormone-Releasing Hormone (GHRH) and Somatostatin. The hypothalamus region of the brain releases these hormones in response to signals from the central nervous system. GHRH once released makes its way to the receptors on the somatotrope cells of the pituitary gland below the brain where it stimulates Growth Hormone release.

Somatostatin once released makes its way to the receptors on the somatotrope cells of the pituitary gland below the brain where it inhibits Growth Hormone release. (15)

The primary physiological action of somatostatin is to inhibit synthesis and release of GH. (16-19) The primary physiological action of Growth Hormone-Releasing Hormone (GHRH) is to stimulate synthesis and release of GH.

The end product of this cascade, Growth Hormone (GH) once secreted exerts its effect in the body as a whole both directly and indirectly through its initiation of Insulin-like Growth Factor (IGF-1) synthesis in the liver. IGF-1 in turn exerts its effect in the body and its rise in turn begins to inhibit any further GH release.

Growth Hormone (GH) is released periodically within the body in a controlled pulsating fashion. This periodic pattern plays an important role in transmitting the GH "growth, repair & well-being" message to tissue. A review of several studies involving GH replacement in GH-deficient animals reveals the biological significance of episodic secretion. These studies conclude that GH released in a pulsatile pattern is far more efficient in improving mammalian growth and repair than the method of GH administration by constant infusion.

In males GH pulses occur approximately every three (3) hours, a frequency that appears across most mammals. The secretion bursts are preceded and followed by almost undetectable levels of plasma GH.

In females however GH pulses occur more frequently and the base level of plasma GH remains higher than males who have fewer GH pulses but the amplitude of which are more pronounced.

GH pulse amplitudes are increased during slow wave sleep such that particularly in males, most GH secretion occurs at night. (22)

Growth Hormone secretion is highest during the growing years of youth and early adulthood. In humans the secretion rate starts to noticeably decrease during the third decade of life and strongly decreases during the fourth decade of life. As we age the daytime secretory pulses diminish first, while the sleep associated GH pulse persists and diminishes gradually.



Nudging Nature


Growth Hormone levels may be increased either by exogenically administering Growth Hormone or by administering Growth Hormone-Releasing Hormone which then endogenically stimulates the somatrope cells of the pituitary to secrete additional Growth Hormone. The primary advantage of GHRH is that GH ends up being released in physiological conformance to the body’s natural biorhythm. This biorhythm is pulsatile.

Studies have concluded that endogenous Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) is the principal regulator of pulsatile GH secretion in humans and that continuous GHRH infusion augments pulsatile GH release. Whereas exogenic administration of GH raises overall GH levels but has no effect on amplifying the pulses.

People of all ages naturally continue to possess the ability to secrete GH from stores within the pituitary. Most studies are in agreement on this point. One study in particular examined the effects of administration of GHRH & a Growth Hormone Releasing Peptide on all adult age groups from those in their 20's to those above 75 years of age. They observed substantial increases in GH release as a direct result of administration of GHRH & GHRP-6. This prompted them to conclude, "...that the lack of side-effects & safety of the protocol and the discovered lack of age-related decline in the 'GHRH-GHRP-6-mediated' GH release opens the possibility of using it as a therapeutical tool to revert some deleterious manifestations of aging in man." (23)



Long-lasting GHRH analog CJC-1295


While the studies have demonstrated repeatedly that administration of GHRH does increase GH secretion and amplifies the release pulse there does remain a significant drawback. GHRH has a very short half life, measured in minutes with a fairly short clearance rate measured in hours. (24) While this is a sufficient amount of time to exert a positive effect on GH secretion, particularly if GHRH is administered multiple times a day, the result is less than optimal. (25,26)

It is for this reason that longer-lasting analogs of GHRH were researched and developed. (28) The most effective of which is CJC-1295.

Exposure of native GHRH to blood plasma results in rapid degradation. CJC-1295, a synthetic human GHRH analog avoids rapid degradation by possessing the ability to selectively and covalently bind to endogenous albumin after subcutaneous administration. Albumin possesses a half-life of 19 days in humans and so modified GHRH bound to albumin greatly extends its half-life and duration of action. (27)

In a recent (2006) study "Prolonged Stimulation of Growth Hormone (GH) and Insulin-Like Growth Factor I Secretion by CJC-1295, a Long-Acting Analog of GH-Releasing Hormone, in Healthy Adults", Sam L. Teichman, et al. Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism 91(3):799-805, CJC-1295 was found to result in "sustained, dose-dependent increases in GH and IGF-I levels in healthy adults and was safe and relatively well tolerated, particularly at doses of 30mcg/kg or 60 mcg/kg."

It has been demonstrated repeatedly in various studies that GHRH is effective at instigating GH release and longer acting analogs do increase the overall effectiveness. So it is no surprise that the results of this CJC-1295 study comport with what has been previously demonstrated.

What was unknown was what effect persistent elevation of GH by a long-lasting GHRH analog would have on the pulsatility of release. This was explored in a follow up study, "Pulsatile Secretion of Growth Hormone (GH) Persists during Continuous Stimulation by CJC-1295, a Long- Acting GH-Releasing Hormone Analog", Madalina Ionescu, et al. The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism 91(12):4792-4797.

That study found that pulsatility was not interfered with and was in fact preserved in all subjects both immediately after administration and continuing 7 days post-administration.

This is obviously a very beneficial characteristic to preserve. In fact episodic release appears to be imperative to growth and repair of tissue in mammals.

The study further found that while growth hormone secretion was increased by almost fifty percent there was no increase in pulse amplitude or frequency. All of the increase came from a substantial elevation of trough levels with preserved pulsatility.

One further note of interest is that study participants were all of young age with lower lean body masses which may indicate that GHRH in the form of CJC-1295 is an effective avenue for growth hormone release for those of young age.

The results of the study show that administration of single doses of CJC-1295 remained in high concentration for 7 days with measurable concentration for 14 subsequent days. (29)

This resulted in substantial increases in mean serum GH levels in all dosing groups, which were dose incremental and persisted for up to 7 days.

This chronic elevation in CJC-1295 levels resulted in substantial increases in mean serum IGF-1 levels in all dosing groups, which were dose incremental and persisted for up to 7 days.

The results from a toxicology study wherein 50mcg/kg of CJC-1295 was administered subcutaneously to monkeys for a period of six months found no ill effects and no indication of presence of neutralizing antibodies. They concluded that the Drug Affinity Complex (DAC) a technology that enables covalent binding (conjugation) of a drug to albumin produced no evidence of immunogenic or immunotoxic effects in monkeys. (30)

In summary, although the added Drug Affinity Complex adds complexity and increases the expense of CJC-1295 peptide synthesis, it does add tremendously to both the dosing convenience and the biological activity of GHRH without any identifiable adverse toxicity.





Growth Hormone Secretagogues



In the 1980's three classes of compounds where studied to determine their effect on growth hormone release. These three compounds were:

Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (natural hormone)
Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides (synthetic molecules often termed "GH-Secretagogues")
Opiates (Dermorphin & Benzomorphan)
Individually each class of compound when administered in laboratory rats was found to induce growth hormone release. However when they were all combined growth hormone release dramatically increased.

Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) + Growth Hormone Releasing Peptide (GHRP) was found to induce a large synergistic secretion of growth hormone (GH).

However when the Opiate was combined with GHRH & GHRP the synergy was huge amounting to a release of GH more than double that achieved by the GHRH/GHRP combo alone.


When all three classes of compounds were examined it was discovered that each compound released GH by a mechanism different and distinct from that of the others. Furthermore it was found that these three modes of action accomplished growth hormone release in ways complementing and not interfering with each other.

Unfortunately opiates have several drawbacks. Not withstanding their illegality chronic use is both toxic and addicting with undesirable alterations in normal physiology.

Fortunately we are left with two tools with which we can maximize a synergistic release of growth hormone. These tools have no toxicity and promote desirable alterations in normal physiology.

Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) in the form of its long-lasting analog (CJC-1295) was discussed in the previous article. It is therefore left to this article to discuss Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides (GHRPs) and the human studies that demonstrate synergy between these two compounds (GHRP + GHRH).


Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides (GHRPs) - A Quick Look


What are they?

Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides (GHRPs) are synthetic forms of the natural hormone Ghrelin. These simple short-chained amino acid peptide strings possess most of the positive characteristics of Ghrelin (such as effecting GH secretion) and few of the negative properties (such as Ghrelin's lipogenic behavior (i.e. conversion of glucose to fatty acids)).

GHRPs belong to a broader class of compounds all of which share the common trait of being able to bind to the Growth Hormone Secretagogue Receptor (GHS-R) and effect GH release. These compounds include the synthetic peptides (GHRP-6, GHRP-1, GHRP-2, Hexarelin, Ipamorelin) and smaller synthetic non-peptide molecular compounds such as MK-0677 as well as the natural ligand Ghrelin. This broad class which includes all of the above but not Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) is termed Growth Hormone Secretagogues (GHSs).

These Growth Hormone Secretagogues (GHSs) exert their effect on increasing GH output in multiple ways.

First they INDIRECTLY increase growth hormone (GH) secretion by inducing Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) release from the hypothalamus in the brain. GHRH once released makes its way to the Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone Receptors (GHRH-R) in cells within the pituitary (a gland just below the brain) where it binds and exerts its direct influence in signaling GH release.

Second these GHS also make there way to those same pituitary cells where they themselves bind to a Growth Hormone Secretagogue Receptor (GHS-R) and exert a DIRECT influence in signaling GH release. This signaling uses a different mode of action distinct from that of GHRH. As a consequence both bound GHRH & bound GHS can exert their positive influence concurrently resulting in synergistic growth hormone (GH) release.

Third they INDIRECTLY increase GH secretion by reducing release of Somatostatin (the GH inhibiting hormone) from the hypothalamus and DIRECTLY by reducing the magnitude of Somatostatin's inhibiting action once it binds to its receptor on the pituitary cells.

In essence Growth Hormone Secretagogues (GHS) turn up the positive signal to release GHRH, turn down the negative signal to release the inhibiting hormone Somatostatin, speak directly to the growth hormone releasing pituitary cells themselves to encourage them to release GH and speak directly to the growth hormone releasing pituitary cells themselves to encourage them to ignore Somatostatin's message to stop releasing GH.


Oral GHS


Based on the effectiveness of GHRPs smaller non-peptide molecules were created in an effort to mimic the GH releasing effects of GHRPs with the desire to develop a compound with high oral bioavailability. As a result MK-0677 was eventually created as a non-peptide compound with sustained GH release and higher oral bioavailability. Unfortunately desensitization was found to occur fairly rapidly. In addition the dose for the orally administered MK-0677 is measured in several milligrams while the effective dose for the injectable GHRPs is measured in micrograms making GHRPs more cost effective. Research is ongoing on non-peptide GHSs, particularly with Ipamorelin derivatives so perhaps an oral GHS devoid of desensitization will eventually be developed.

My own thought is that these molecular compounds appear to be small enough to be used in a transdermal formula. Also it would be nice to have these orally/transdermally active compounds available to use on a limited basis perhaps making usage when traveling convenient.


Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides - A Longer Look


What are they?

In 1980 the first highly potent GH-Releasing peptide was developed and named GHRP-6. This peptide was found to illicit a strong GH release response and so became the first member of a class of growth hormone releasing peptides more broadly called GH secretagogues. Structurally GHRP-6 is composed of the amino acids L-Histidine, D-Tryptophan, L-Alanine, L-Tryptophan, D-Phenylalanine and L-Lysine. The "L" form of an amino acid is the naturally occurring form and often in the nomenclature the "L" is dropped. The "D" form does not occur in nature and is the isomeric form (i.e. mirror image) of the naturally occurring "L" form.

GHRP-6 is composed of both natural and isomeric forms of those aforementioned six amino acids. Its structure is represented as:

His-D-Trp-Ala-Trp-D-Phe-Lys-NH2

Investigators subsequently modified the structure of GHRP-6 and identified more potent peptides. For example, activity was enhanced by replacing D-Trp with D-2-(2-napthyl)alanine and His with D-Alanine to create GHRP-2 whose structure is represented as:

D-Ala-D-2 Nal-Ala-Trp-D-Phe-Lys-NH2

In 1982, after a long search the natural hormone "Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone" (GHRH) was finally isolated and identified. As a result the interest in Growth Hormone Secretagogues (at that point limited to the three peptides) faded. Eventually researchers discovered that those GH-Releasing Peptides (specifically GHRP-6 & GHRP-2) followed a mode of action which bound them to and was mediated through receptors different from those for GHRH. In addition researches discovered that these GH-Releasing Peptides acted synergistically with the natural hormone Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) in vivo (in both laboratory animals & humans) to produce large releases of Growth Hormone.

Taken together these two discoveries made it clear that GHRPs were not simply surrogates of GHRH. GHRP-6 and its analogues were artificial activators of a separate newly discovered receptor termed the "Growth Hormone Secretagogue Receptor" (GHS-R). Eventually the natural hormone Ghrelin was discovered as the endogenous ligand that binds to the GHS-R. Together the natural hormone Ghrelin, and all the synthetic compounds (both peptides & smaller molecules) such as GHRP-6 were termed "Growth Hormone Secretagogues" (GHSs).

This nomenclature continues in the literature to this day however increasingly new terminology is used. For instance the "Ghrelin Receptor" is synonymous with "GHS-R" and "Ghrelin mimetics" are synonymous with all the synthetic compounds that are capable of binding to the GHS-R. This paper uses the more established nomenclature throughout.

All GHSs act directly on the pituitary. They do so by binding to and activating their specific receptor (GHS-R). Once this occurs GH secretion is commanded to rise. GHRH does the same thing. It acts directly on the pituitary and binds to and activates its specific receptor (GHRH-R). Once this occurs GH secretion is commanded to rise.

However GHSs and GHRH operate through a different "mode of action" or intracellular signaling system within the cell that eventually activates GH secretion. These modes of action are contrasted as follows.

GHRH when it binds to its receptor (GHRH-R) on the cellular membrane of a somatotrope cell activates the cAMP–PKA (cAMP-dependent protein kinase) pathway (in essence a secondary messenger), and by a poorly understood mechanism causes a persistent rise in intracellular Calcium (Ca2+) ions by opening Ca2+ channels (simply ports on the cell membrane that open and close to either permit or deny entry) on the cellular membrane and letting into the cell Ca2+ from the outside. The rise in calcium concentration within the cell signals in conjunction with other signaling processes the instruction to the somatotrope cell to release Growth Hormone.

It should be noted that Somatostatin (the GH inhibiting hormone) once bound to its receptor brings about a decrease in GH in part by inhibiting cAMP formation. As a consequence of limiting this messenger the signaling cascade is weakened resulting in less Calcium (Ca2+) ions entering the cell and thus inhibition of GH release.

GHSs however do not rely on cAMP as a messenger. GHSs once bound to their respective receptor initiate a process that leads to an inhibition of Potassium (K+) ion channels. This action results in a sustained depolarization of the cellular membrane. The result is identical to that affected by GHRH, namely the Calcium ion level rises via voltage-activated channels leading to the signal to secrete GH. But the mode of action relies on the use of depolarization of the cellular membrane and inhibiting Potassium ion channels rather then GHRH's cAMP-mediated opening of Calcium ion channels.

In addition to allowing Ca2+ into the cell, GHSs may also cause a rise in intracellular Ca2+ by redistribution from internal stores of Ca2+ within the cell. This process is mediated by the generation of inositol trisphosphate whose main functions are to mobilize Ca2+ from storage organelles and to regulate cell proliferation.

This brief description is an over simplification. The important point is that GHRH and GHS act through their own receptors and distinct intermediate pathways.

This is not the only difference. Although the image herein depicts one pituitary somatotrope with both types of receptors activated (GHRH-R & GHS-R) this may not give a completely accurate picture. GHRH and GHS appear to act on different somatotrope subpopulations. GHRP has been shown to increase the number of somatotropes releasing GH, without altering the amount of hormone released by each individual cell. On the other hand, GHRH stimulates both the number of cells secreting GH and the amount of GH secreted per cell.

From these limited discoveries we can begin to understand how GHRH and GHSs compliment each other's GH releasing actions rather then duplicate one another.

It should be noted that Somatostatin (the GH inhibiting hormone) has been shown primarily to decrease the number of cells secreting GH without affecting the amount of GH secreted per cell.

To sum up in very general terms GHS increases, while Somatostatin decreases, the number of active GH secreting somatotropes, probably because these two factors act by depolarizing and hyperpolarizing cells, respectively (i.e. GHSs turns the cell into a Calcium ion sponge & Somatostatin turns the cell into a squeegee, squeezing out and repelling Calcium ions).

On the other hand GHRH does both, but acts primarily by stimulating the amount of secreted GH within the active somatotropes.


Hypothalamic Actions of GHS


In vitro (in a laboratory dish) the amount of GH release from GHRH and GHSs is additive. GHSs cause a rise of 2...GHRH causes a rise of 1...put them together and the GH rise is merely the sum 3.

But something different happens when you put these two compounds into living breathing mammals. In vivo (in body) the GH rise that occurs from the combination of GHRH and GHSs is more then the sum of their individual contributions. There is substantial synergy such that 1 + 2 = 6.

This occurs as a result of GHSs actions within the Hypothalamus (region of the brain) rather then its direct pituitary actions. There are GHS receptors (GHS-R) in the hypothalamus; perhaps even subtype receptors. When GHSs bind to these receptors they behave like a hypothalamic neurohormone and as such exhibit a dual action.

They stimulate endogenous GHRH release and concurrently suppress endogenous Somatostatin release. How they do this is a complex process with much still unknown. Basically they incite electrical activation of arcuate neurons (within the hypothalamus). About seventy-five percent of the cells excited by GHRP-6 project outside the blood brain barrier (hypothalamus) into the median eminence (boundary between hypothalamus & the portal system which connects to the pituitary which lies just below the brain) and are neurosecretory involved in the regulation of pituitary function.

The activation of these neurons by GHRP-6 is extremely long lasting (longer than 1 hour) and reaches the peak rapidly (within 5 to 10 minutes). Non-peptide GHSs respond slower perhaps for the reason that they penetrate the blood brain barrier slower than GHRP-6.

GHRP-6s excitation of neuronal activity beyond those neurons that regulate GHRH & Somatostatin (i.e. the remaining 25%) may account for some of the impact GHRPs have on non-GH releasing activity.

The important point is to recognize that GHSs have an impact on GHRH release and Somatostatin suppression at the hypothalamus which appears to be responsible for the now well-recognized synergistic effect on GH release from concurrent administration of GHRH & GHRPs in vivo.

Furthermore it should now be firmly understood that GH release is regulated by the following trinity - GHRH, Somatostatin and GHSs.


GHS Potency (i.e. efficacy) & Dosing in Humans


When administered at clinical research dosages, all GHSs (both peptides and non-peptides) release significantly larger amounts of GH (i.e. are more efficacious) than GHRH. This is not to be confused with the term potency which takes into account the molecular weight of a compound and thus measures GH output on a "per mol" basis. By this measure GHRH is more potent.

However if the desire is to administer these compounds and effect GH release then the only relevant standard is absolute amount of GH release and in that regard GHSs release more GH than GHRH. The following standards determined through clinical study will specifically clarify this concept.

In humans the maximal i.v. dose for GHRH has been found to be 1 mcg per kg of bodyweight. That is a level that saturates the receptors and beyond which there is no further benefit, until that dosage has dissipated.

In humans the maximal i.v. dose for GHSs such as hexarelin has been found to be 2 to 3 mcg per kg of bodyweight. In normal humans (i.e. those without disease or clinical malady) GH release is increased as the GHS dose increases up to the aforementioned maximal dose. Even very small amounts have been shown to have positive effects.

Unlike GHRH, GHSs are resistant to well-known inhibitors of GH secretion. Studies demonstrate that hexarelin-mediated GH secretion is reduced but not blocked by a rise in circulating free fatty acids or by a glucose load, nor by an infusion of Somatostatin nor drugs that enhance hypothalamic Somatostatin secretion.

GHRH is influenced by metabolic and hormonal factors that consequently make GHRH a very unpredictable GH stimulator, with large variations between individuals and a diversity of peaking times.

In contrast GHSs are not greatly influenced by metabolic and hormonal factors, the absence of which makes GHSs a very predictable GH stimulator. GHSs are potent and efficacious, their actions synchronized and reproducible, with no non-responders.

GHSs have been repeatedly demonstrated in studies to be very strong GH releasers in healthy young males. In addition GHSs have been shown in studies to be very strong GH releasers in females at all stages of the menstrual cycle. This again is important to note because GHSs are not greatly affected by changes in various hormone levels, be they thyroid hormone, estrogen, etc.

There may be an age-related reduction in the GH-releasing capability of GHSs. The studies have not yet been able to come to a consensus. However, the synergistic effect of GHRH and GHS on GH secretion is not reduced as humans age throughout the entire lifespan. This holds true even for the very old (Those in their 90's).

There are no reported side-effects with GHS usage. However both the peptidyl and non-peptidyl compounds have been found to induce slight increases (still within what is deemed the normal range) in prolactin and in adrenocorticotrophin(ACTH)/cortisol, and in a few studies dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA). Low to moderate dose (1 mcg/kg) administration of GHRP-6 has been found to result in very large GH release with no significant effects on cortisol or prolactin. Of the peptides, Hexarelin appears to induce the highest level of these hormones (prolactin & cortisol). Ipamorelin a newer GHS has no effect on these hormones no matter what the dose.


Why you need both GHRH analog (CJC-1295) and GHRP


GHS Down Regulation

A single dose of a GHS in vivo brings about an immediate down-regulation of responsiveness to subsequent administration. This desensitization appears to abate and sensitivity fully restored within a few hours.

However continual infusion of large amounts of GHS brings about a substantial initial release of GH, followed, after several hours, by long-term down-regulation of GH secretion.

The only published comparison of the results of differing modes of GHS delivery (twice daily injections vs. continuous infusion) in vivo demonstrated a dramatic dissipation of anabolism following infusions of high-dose GHS. However a pronounced anabolic effect was maintained with the same dose of GHS administered by intermittent injection.

From the results of this study it is evident that with GHSs the optimal dosing pattern is administration by injection with sufficient intervals between dosing so as to maintain sensitivity.

The effectiveness is greatly diminished, perhaps to the point of having no benefit if GHSs duration of action becomes prolonged and sustained. GHSs unlike GHRH are best used to amplify those very import GH pulses while GHRH is effective at raising the total level of GH.

If we understand desensitization than we will easily understand why the oral GHS, MK-0677 in recent studies failed to demonstrate a "maintained acceleration of statural growth in children with GH-deficiency". MK-0677 was developed to be a long lasting orally active analogue of GHRP-6. MK-0677 is to GHRP-6 what CJC-1295 is to GHRH (i.e. long-lasting).

The problem is that while long-lasting analogues of GHRH do not result in desensitization and pronounced down-regulation, long-lasting analogues of GHRP-6 do desensitize and consequently lose effectiveness.

CJC-1295 brings about persistent and chronically elevated levels of GH while GHRP-6 if injected a couple of times a day amplifies the very important GH pulses. The two compounds greatly compliment each other. In the previous article on GHRH & CJC-1295 we discussed the importance of pulsation which has been shown to be necessary for growth. The other important component of anabolism is chronic GH elevation.

Continuously elevated levels of GH increase IGF-I levels more than intermittent increases in GH. The intermittent nature of GH release brought on by GHSs' mode of action does create a rise in IGF-I levels but the anabolic effect may not be pronounced.

It has been repeatedly demonstrated and is now recognized that in children the growth response to injections of IGF-I is far less than the growth response to injections of GH. This is in accordance with most animal studies, which demonstrate that treatment with IGF-I does "not produce the full anabolic and growth-promoting effects of GH treatment".

Protocols that elevate GH while maintaining and amplifying the pulses seem to be effective at producing anabolism. The combination of CJC-1295 and GHRP-6 do just that.

GHRH (and analogs) + GHSs = a lot of synergistic growth hormone release

There is not a lot of deviation in the published studies on the effect of these peptides and the saturation dose needed to bring about the effect in normal people (who often act as a control group).

We need only to examine the results of the normal test subjects from three oft-cited studies that established the relevant protocol.

In the first study "Inhibition of growth hormone release after the combined administration of GHRH and GHRP-6 in patients with Cushing's syndrome", Alfonso Leal-Cerro..., Clinical Endocrinology 1994, 41 (5) , 649–654, three different peptide/peptide combinations were used.

GHRH was administered alone at 100mcg. This resulted in area under the curve (AUC) measured for 120 minutes of GH secretion of 1420 ± 330.

GHRP-6 was administered alone at 100mcg. This resulted in area under the curve (AUC) measured for 120 minutes of GH secretion of 2278 ± 290.

GHRH plus GHRP-6 was administered together at 100mcg each. This resulted in area under the curve (AUC) measured for 120 minutes of GH secretion of 7332 ± 592.

As a single dose these results show that GHRP-6 is about twice as effective as GHRH.

The synergy between GHRH & GHRP-6 is clearly evident as co-administration resulted in twice the benefit of the additive values of single doses of the two peptides.

The second study is the one that established the saturation dose for these peptides often used in other studies. "Growth hormone (GH)-releasing peptide stimulates GH release in normal men and acts synergistically with GH-releasing hormone ", CY Bowers..., J. Clin. Endocrinol. Metab., Apr 1990; 70: 975-982.

In that study GHRH at a dose of 1.0 microgram/kg was administered alone and then together with various doses of GHRP-6 (0.1, 0.3, and 1.0 microgram/kg). They found that the submaximal dosages of 0.1 and 0.3 microgram/kg GHRP-6 plus 1 microgram/kg GHRH did have the effect of stimulating GH release synergistically.

However the larger dose of 1 mcg/kg of GHRP-6 was found to be the saturation dose when used in combination w/ 1 mcg/kg of GHRH.

It is also noteworthy that serum prolactin and cortisol levels rose about 2-fold above base levels only at the 1 microgram/kg dose of GHRP-6 and not at the submaximal dosages.

The final study, "Preserved Growth Hormone (GH) Secretion in Aged and Very Old Subjects after Testing with the Combined Stimulus GH-Releasing Hormone plus GH-Releasing Hexapeptide-6", Micic D..., J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1998 Jul;83(7):2569-72 is fascinating for several reasons.

By reference to citation it is noted that "GHRH plus GHRP-6 (both at saturating dose) is nowadays considered the most potent stimulus of GH secretion in man being able to restore the GH secretion in states associated with chronic blockade of somatotroph activity (as in obesity)...it elicits a near-normal GH discharge in obesity, in patients with hypothyroidism and in patients with type 2 diabetes mellitus."

This particular study examined the effects of combined administration of GHRH, immediately followed by GHRP-6 in a group of very old subjects (age higher than 75 yr), as compared with both normal adults (less than 40 yr) and aged subjects (age 46–65 yr). The dosing levels used were 90mcg of GHRH followed by 1mcg/kg of GHRP-6.

All the subjects had a positive GH secretory response to the combined administration with no differences observed between men and women. However the group comprising the very old had the highest level of GH release followed by the group comprising the aged subjects with the "less than 40 yr group" experiencing a substantial rise but not as high as the other two groups.

The study concluded that the lack of side-effects & safety of the protocol and the discovered lack of age-related decline in the "GHRH-GHRP-6-mediated GH release opens the possibility of using it as a therapeutical tool to revert some deleterious manifestations of aging in man."

In CONCLUSION, Growth Hormone (GH) is regulated by a trinity composed of Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH), Growth Hormone Secretagogues (GHS) and Somatostatin. GHRH and GHSs individually have a positive impact on GH secretion. These two compounds operate through distinct modes of action which complement each other and when administered together result in synergistic GH secretion.

Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides (GHRPs), a subclass of GHSs are effective across all age groups in amplifying GH pulses. Pulsation is a necessary component of growth generation in mammals. GHRH when co-administered with GHRPs has the effect of further increasing the amplitude and "area under the curve" of a GH pulse. The result is a GH pulse many multiples more effective then that achieved by an unaided GH pulse.

In addition to pulsation, overall growth is better accomplished when total levels of GH are elevated without hindering pulsation. Elevated GH levels appear to be a necessary component of growth generation as well. One of the reasons this is so appears to be that chronically elevated GH levels result in more pronounced sustained levels of IGF-1 then that achieved through intermittent GH elevations.

Persistent levels of GHRH do not result in desensitization. Elevated levels of GHRH result in sustained GH release. A long-lasting version of GHRH, CJC-1295 has demonstrated the ability to sustain elevated GH levels in humans.

GHRP-6 is perhaps the most well studied of all GHSs. In physiological doses there are virtually no side effects. It has been demonstrated to be effective for all age groups.

Combined administration of CJC-1295 and GHRP-6 is a very effective, well studied method of increasing the total amount of GH secreted within the body. By adjusting the dosing of these compounds and accounting for such factors as age one may choose to achieve a "youthful" restoration, an above normal elevation or a substantially above normal elevation of both GH levels and pulsatile release.

brianthebard

Was there a point or are you just spamming?

Nowler

brianthebard wrote: »

Was there a point or are you just spamming?

Knowledge!!!!

Nowler

PLUS
That would be 1 hell of a long spam post

Roper

That's the second post like that you've posted. What you're advocating is illegal and has NOTHING to do with fitness, not to mention lazy.

podge57

The State of Pro Competitive Bodybuilding
This is an interview taken from February's '97 issue of IRONMAN magazine. It is about drug abuse in today's bodybuilding. Comments in blue are mine. I've found this piece to be very interesting for several reasons. Please read on. I've included everything.

The State of Competitive Bodybuilding
The Most Shocking Bodybuilding Interview Ever (IRONMAN, February '97)
by Steve Holman
Comments in blue are mine.

Warning:This is an extremely controversial interview. To be honest, we almost decided not to print it; however, because IRONMAN has always been an open forum, going to great lengths to tell the whole truth, we felt it was our responsibility to the sport and to you, the reader, to allow this athlete to speak his mind.
It took a lot of courage for this man to stand up and tell it like it is, and we are keeping him anonymous to protect his status as a professional bodybuilder. We're inserting [blanks] in place of names to help protect his identity-no process of elimination to narrow down the field-and also in place of drug names, so drug-using bodybuilders don't get any inadvertent "help" with their drug programs.
Keep in mind that we paid this man nothing because we feel money can only corrupt the information. When people are paid a high sum, they feel as if they have to give the interviewer his or her money's worth, and that can result in exaggeration.
As you read this, remember that this athlete came to us because, like us, he loves bodybuilding and wants to see it prosper, not die a painful drug-induced death.
Fasten your seatbelts. This dose of reality is going to open your eyes like nothing ever printed in this or any other bodybuilding magazine.

IM: You want to get some things off your chest. You have the bodybuilding world's ear. What is it you want to talk about?
BB: Well, you know, most of the things nobody wants to talk about. I want to let everybody know how it really is.


IM: How it is with the drugs?
BB: Damn right!

IM: You're having to take too many, correct?
BB: Way too many, man.

IM: What kind of drug bill are we talking about?
BB: Well, growth hormone alone costs you $30,000 a year.
That is absolutely true, HGH costs a lot of money.

IM: Good lord!
BB: And steroids, that's not a really big problem. I use a lot, but you can get it cheap. Mostly you gotta pay people to tell you how to use them. The growth hormone, IGF-IÉ.

IM: And just the thought of putting all that in your body all at one time-that's gotta take its toll on you mentally too.
BB: Well, I don't mind a little bit, because I do like big arms, big back, big chest and legs and everything. But when it comes to the point where I'm as big as I want to get-


IM: They tell you that you have to get bigger, right?
BB: Yeah, I don't have a choice. I'm gonna be bigger. Next year you're going to see me 24 pounds heavier.You know it's the whole mind-set that you gotta get bigger and sacrifice your shape. I may not like the way my back looks. I mean, I've got improvements to make, obviously. But those things come with time. Maturing into a physique is nice, but they want a monster.

IM: Do you think it can ever stop? I mean, if people keep getting bigger, what's going to happen to the sport?
BB: Well, the sport is already-

IM: Out of control?
BB: Yeah. It's an underground sport. It's [a cult that] likes to see the freaky mass monsters....They really don't care. They just say, Whatever it takes to do that, that's what we want to see. But I think a lot of people want to see something that's somewhat attainable.

IM: Do you think the size of the competitors has caused the people to be a little blast about it all? Like: Well, they're just going to have to do what it takes. We don't care; if they die, they die. We want to see 'em bigger, and we want to see 'em better.
BB: That's right. They want us to do it, and the judges want to see something bigger. In order for us to make a living and live our dreams, we gotta do whatever it takes, you know? You got guys like [blank, a bodybuilding columnist for another magazine] saying, "Well, nobody's making you." I guess nobody is, but a lot of us [have] this dream of being the best of the built.
Best of Roid built.

IM: Absolutely. And it's a performance thing too. It's gratifying to be on stage. What do you think is a solution here? Do you think there is one at this point?
BB: Well, it's hard to say. Once you've seen extreme physique development, how are you going to train the eye of the audience to accept something less? You can practically see [some of these guys'] lungs when they do rear lat spreads. You just gotta accept something less. By the way, before I go on, let me tell you right now, there's a lot of things in your hands.

IM: I understand. Your identity is completely confidential, I promise you that. We'll just say you're a top pro. That's all.
BB: Right. Okay. Ask anything.

IM: Do you think part of the solution is for the judges to start rewarding a more aesthetic physique?
BB: That would be the only way the sport would go into a positive direction. Like Bob Paris.

IM: Right, if Bob Paris came back. I think the problem is you have to have an eye for that type of physique, and the general public and most bodybuilding fans don't have it, so they look at size as the top criterion for victory.
BB: I think there's a certain presence, an aura to a really complete physique like Lee Labrada's, rather than someone who's just grotesque.

IM: Getting back to the whole drug thing, do you have to stay on the drugs year-round?
BB: Yes. I haven't gone off at all for years.

IM: You have to inject, what, three to four times a week?
BB: Every day.

IM: Every day you have to inject something into your body?
BB: Yeah. Every day. Let me go over my stack.[He rattles off a list of injectibles and orals that's so long, my jaw hits the desk.]

IM: This is just off-season?
BB: Yeah. And of course I like to use [blank] that blocks estrogen and also increases testosterone levels. Also [blank] four times a day in the off-season to allow me to eat more calories. I also take half a tablet of [blank], which works better synergistically with growth hormone. Six weeks or so out I start taking some [blank] to stop some of the gyno. I did have to have it removed a few years back, but it kind of flares up now and then.And I use [blank] to take some of the water out. And [every so often] I switch from the heavy androgens to the lighter anabolics, like [blank and blank], 300 milligrams every other day. Let's see, [blank], 200 milligrams a day. That helps you harden up your physique, increase your vascularity. I take some [blank], which helps me harden, and I keep my insulin the same and my growth hormone the same.

IM: Whew! Quite a laundry list!
BB: Well, you know there's also many other things, like [blank], which keeps my gonadal system up and [blank] to boost my testosterone to make sure I don't atrophy down there. Also, anti-estrogens and other compound factors to combat the many side effects that I get.

IM: Have you ever noticed any serious health problems that you think are related to this?
BB: I piss a lot of blood come contest time.

IM: But in the off-season you feel pretty decent, even though you're taking all that stuff?
BB: Well, recently I started getting blood tests every two months.


IM: How about cholesterol count, blood pressure and so forth? All that's pretty normal?
BB: No, everything is high. My blood pressure gets really high, and that must be watched, especially when I take stimulants.

IM: It sounds as if you're on pins and needles a lot of the time.
BB: If you gotta do it, you got no choice. You want to make a living in this sport, that's what you gotta do.

IM: Race cars keep going faster and faster and there are more crashes, but the drivers keep doing it, right? What do you think your total drug bill is for the year?
BB: About $60,000, but it's going to be higher next year. Just this last year I had to add [blank]. Right now it's the number-one bodybuilding "supplement" in the competition ring. All these guys you see getting bigger, it's that. No question. Two years ago...I don't want to take nothing from [blank], really nice guy, nice family man, but physiquewise he was flat as a pancake. Now he's bigger, 20 to 30 pounds heavier. It's all [from this stuff]. [Blank] is heavy on it. Of course, we all are. I'm scared ****less.

IM: Are you guys pretty frank with each other about what you're taking?
BB: Only with friends. I mean, I get questions in the gym all the time, and I tell them I take [a popular protein powder]! Yeah, we talk.

IM: You don't feel you need to keep secrets and maintain an edge?
BB: There are no secrets. There's one guy out there-I won't mention his name-he's a top pro who helps out the other pros with their [blank] 'cause we don't know how to do it, so we go to him. He helps us out.

IM: I know the old-timers say there's no camaraderie in the sport anymore.
BB: Oh, there's some. But the only thing we talk about is-

IM: Drugs and training.
BB: We don't talk about training, because most of the guys-

IM: All train alike?
BB: Well, yeah. We don't train that hard. [Most of the guys] are half asleep when they [work out].
Real champions like Haney, Yates, Swarzeneger, Oliva and all the others, trained brutally hard!

IM: So it's mostly just the drugs. The top guys really don't have an inkling how to train without them. Do you think most of the top 10 guys are taking pretty much the same thing then?
BB: Yeah, they're all jabbing themselves just as much, but I think [winning] has to do with your estrogen levels and your normal testosterone levels, your receptor abilities and things like that. You know, it's a genetic thing. Some people are more susceptible to steroids. Five milligrams might hit me differently than it might hit you.


IM: I asked you this earlier, and I know you said you think that it's just all part of the game, but aren't you afraid that this will catch up with you later in life?
BB: I am. I don't think I'll be able to have children. My doctor told me my sperm count is way too low. And my thyroid [is blown out].
That is most unfortunate.

IM: Do you feel that the sport indirectly promotes the whole drug thing?
BB: Yeah, but then you have people saying that nobody makes us. But this is our childhood dream. This is something we want to do, and for the most part we don't have other jobs.


IM: Do you think this drug test they had at the Olympia was a step in the right direction?
BB: It was a step in the right direction for the sport and probably a step in the wrong direction for people's careers because I know four people who [should have] tested positive. But we can beat the drug tests. Next year if they want to get diuretics, that's fine. We'll use plasmics. It's fairly simple. There's always exotic steroids."Let's change some molecule on the 17th position, and it can't be detected." [Blank] still can't be detected.
I Disagree, drug test is a must. When real drug testing is done ( not the thing they do right now in the Olympia ), things will come upside down. Remember Olympic weightlifting. After the new drug tests, people literally lifted half the weight they used to.

IM: This is the most eye-opening interview I've ever had. I appreciate your opening up to me.
BB: You're welcome. It could be because I'm very low on carbohydrates.

IM: And you're pissed off.
BB: Yeah, you know the diuretic scene is very difficult. I'm back there with my I.V. bag and heart monitor. It's just the situation. You take a person and put him into a lab in a freak science experiment. Then you throw him on stage, and you take him off to pump blood back into him. Is that a sport?The training is pretty much beaten to death. In fact, your magazine for the natural athletes is what I recommend. Professional bodybuilding [is about] drugs. Of course, there's abuse in every professional sport-boxing, basketball, baseball, football.
I sincerely agree.

IM: How long do you think you can keep at it? I mean at this pace?
BB: Well I've been on forÉoh God. I'll tell you right now, if anybody's going to die next, it's going to be [blank]. He's too old to be messing with [junk] like that. His pancreas I don't think is too good.There's a look that you get. I can see it. [Blank, a top pro] is very ill. I understand what he wants to do for the sport, and he can do some great things, but he's dying and every contest he loses is a blow to him. He's killing himself literally because he wants to make this sport better. Eventually he's either going to win the contest or he's going to die.

IM: He's really playing Russian roulette?
BB: Yeah, he was using [blank] before any of us. I prefer his look back [a few years]. He wasn't big but aesthetic-a pleasing physique. Something a kid would look at and say, Hey, I would like to look like that. Now he should be concentrating more on certain bodyparts, but instead his body is getting bigger, his stomach, his head, everything.

IM: It's a scary look. Yes, the body's getting bigger, but all the internal organs are getting large, bloated.
BB: They should have a contest for the biggest growth-hormone gut.

IM: Got anything else you want to get off your chest?
BB: Yeah, you know I have a hard time thinking because of all the things I'm on now. But they don't talk about how much drug [abuse] there is. And it's not just the steroids. We've got to use speed and stuff like that. We have to use a lot of diuretics, things that aren't too healthy, and they don't feel good. Lots of guys are using cocaine-not just because they like it, but it helps you get cut up, it helps you not eat.With drugs there's use and abuse. But at our level I feel we're getting exploited, you know? They pump us full of drugs...or we pump ourselves full of drugs to make ourselves look like freaks, and we get on stage and that's our job. But we don't get paid hardly anything. The guy who uses our pictures, the supplement companies, make all the money, and they don't give us nothing. If it wasn't for our picture, they wouldn't have nothing to promote.

IM: Yeah, and you gotta keep risking your life to try to make a few bucks winning a show.
BB: I'll tell you what: [Some] of the guys, like [blank], are gay prostitutes.

IM: Think so?
BB: I know so. That's how they can afford all those drugs. That's definite. Of course [certain people in] the gay community are going to walk up and say, Hey, we'll give you so much to have sex. That's just like a straight guy walking up to Cindy Crawford and saying it. But for us it's a way to make a good $10,000 a month. It helps with our drug bill and sometimes they just give us drugs for the act.

IM: When you think about it, you guys can't make much money.
BB: There's not much money in the contracts. Especially with the drugs, the living, the food. You have to sacrifice your-

IM: Integrity?
BB: Yeah, your integrity, your pride. It's all a sacrifice. The drugs, the prostitution. These guys don't want to do that. They have to look in the mirror. They know they're sacrificing what makes them a man.And all this crap you see about carb loading and sodium. Bunch of ****.

IM: So you don't think they actually do sodium loading? It's all just drugs?
BB: Precontest every once in a while you catch a guy in McDonald's or eating pizza. You can do that kind of thing-of course, in moderation.

IM: But you're a pretty heavy supplement user?
BB: I don't use supplements at all! No vitamins, nothing.


IM: You don't think that vitamins and minerals would help protect you somewhat from all the drugs?
BB: Yeah, but-

IM: You've got put your money where it's going to be the most effective, right? On drugs.
BB: Right. I'd like to see a $1 million prize [for a bodybuilding contest]. That's something else that would help the sport. If there's a decent amount of money in there, it would be something people would watch. Unfortunately, I think people want to see the freaks at this point. Really big mothers up there. It's like you said, you really can't go backwards. I guess you have to let [it] self-destruct and see what happens.

IM: I don't want to see any of you guys die.
BB: We will. I guarantee you. You're going to see lots of guys dying in the next few years.

IM: I hope the drug test is a step in the right direction, and maybe they'll start judging for more aesthetic physiques. If they did backtrack to more of the Bob Paris look, I think it would help.
BB: Is that ever going to happen?

IM: How much longer do you think you're going to go on with it?
BB: Till I reach my goal. Or it beats me.
The second will happen, most likely.

IM: Have you ever experienced any kind of depression or rage?
BB: Oh, yeah. Beaten many peopleÉgot out of hand. I feel bad about that.

IM: Having all that coursing through your system has to do something to you mentally.
BB: Well, besides that, you feel a lump here, and you feel scared, and you don't know what's going on.

IM: Do you get checked by a doctor regularly?
BB: I get the blood tests, and he reads it. It's foreign to me. I just ask how much longer do I have to live, what am I doing wrong?

IM: But he doesn't do any MRIs on you? It's just basically a blood test?
BB: No. He checks my thyroid, sperm count. Of course, I'm never going to be able to have children.

IM: Perhaps some of this will reverse itself once you-
BB: No, I have irreversible damage.

IM: That's really sad.
BB: I think it happened last year. When I upped everything, I shut my thyroid down. And if I go off the [blank], I'm going to get fat. I'm going to stay on the stuff permanently. If I go off, I'm going to rebound. None of these guys go off. It's just nonstop. These guys do what it takes.Don't you see that they're exploiting us? They're selling us. They're pumping us up, putting us on stage, throwing us off, and they're collecting the money. And we're back there rolling around in death.In the process they will make money. Sell ourselves. Sell our souls, and we don't get much. And even if you take the drugs, it's no guarantee you're going to win. You have to have something going on there. But [the people who run this sport] say, Keep it going, keep it going. And watch their wallets getting bigger. They don't care.
It is a big business today.

IM: But you did say looking like that helps you with women?
BB: That makes it a little worthwhile, but I never had any problem with the bitches. I got plenty before. Now I'm bigger, so I get a lot more. But you also get the bad-that includes harassment from the homos.I want to say for the guys who want to take their physiques to a [higher level], weight training, eating right and exercising will help you achieve your goals. What's big to you may be small compared to a pro, but like I said, Lee Labrada will look huge to a lot of guys. So you can attain your goals, get bigger, get better with the women, look good. You may not win Mr. Olympia, but you can still have something to be proud of [without the drugs].[Competitive bodybuilding, for the most part] is all chemistry. It's chemical warfare. Andreas Munzer had something we never had. All those striations and [blank] drugs, but look what it did to him. He died by the sword. And [blank] pocketed everything Andreas ever did.We have to deal with the rat race and the counterfeit steroids. All these guys saying, Yeah, I fell down and broke my arm. That's not true. That's the dealer breaking their arms because they didn't pay for their shipment of growth hormone.

IM: You say you go to Mexico for a lot of this stuff?
BB: Yeah, I go to Mexico. The European tour is where most of us get our drugs.[Switches subjects again] You don't need drug testing. Just a Lee Labrada. It didn't take a ton [of drugs] to do that. Pick that, and there you go. All the other guys will have to trim down to look like that.

IM: Go for the aesthetic physique. That's one of the big steps they have to take. By the way, isn't there a drug that you can inject directly into the muscle to blow it up?
BB: Oh, yeah, [blank]. Use that for my peak on my biceps. [Blank] uses it everywhere-80 to 100 shots. Tell you right now it hurts like hell. But it's hard to predict. It may look good five days before the show, then it lumps out and you'll get guys with the real lumpy, weird-looking biceps.This whole sport is about being a bitch. You gotta be a bitch to pay your bills. You gotta be a bitch to win. That's what it's all about. Total exploitation. I'd like the athletes to make a little more money. All these magazines talk about how much Michael Jordan and Mike Tyson make. They don't talk about how much we make, 'cause it's disgraceful. What am I going to do? Sell pictures of myself?

IM: Do a lot of the guys sell drugs on the side?
BB: Oh, yeah. I've done that myself. Now it's a lot harder.
A drug dealer too.

IM: So what else? Is there's anything you can think of that you're really pissed off about.
BB: Well, I'm pissed off that we have to use this amount of drugs. I was happier with my physique last year. [They want us] in the 270-pound range.

IM: Don't you think the magazines are a little at fault too?
BB: Yeah, they are. They don't print nothing about the drug regimen. They're selling fake dreams to kids: Take this protein powder, and you're going to look like that. And it ain't true. Drugs play a predominant role, and most of the [champions'] training articles lead to overtraining. You know that. And unless you're on steroids, you're going to end up unhappy and lose your dream.
Absolutely true.

IM: I guess it's a vicious cycle.
BB: The insulin's very dangerous. I'm feeling it right now. I'm getting real tired, headaches, weakness. I breathe hard. Not a good drug to take.

IM: What's the danger with the insulin? It's a hormone, so what's the big problem?
BB: You can die right there. I mean, there isn't one of us who hasn't been in shock. You really don't know.

IM: Have you ever had to go to the hospital because of it?
BB: I've been in the hospital a few times, yeah. They had to use half a bag of glucose intravenously to keep me going. I didn't have any glucose in my liver, because I did too much insulin. My brain was starved, and I was beginning to fall asleep, go into a coma. It's the most painful feeling you'll ever feel. During that time your mind's going nuts.What am I getting out of all this? A cover picture? That won't pay the bills. Maybe they should start giving back to the athletes instead of taking. If they're gonna make it where we have to be bigger, we should get something out of it. Golfers make more money than we do. I saw how much they make at these rodeos too. They collect $50,000 for riding some damn bull. They don't have to take drugs to do that.

IM: The danger's there for eight seconds, then they're out of there. You guys have danger all year long.
BB: Yeah it's dangerous.

IM: To say the least.

This is the end of the interview. Read on for more comments of mine.

Hanley

Roper wrote: »

That's the second post like that you've posted. What you're advocating is illegal and has NOTHING to do with fitness, not to mention lazy.

+1

Size=everything

Nowler your not even 220lbs and yet have done PHs and are considering using insulin and powerful research peptides no offense but you are way out of your league I mean you shouldn't even be touching PHs right now as you still clearly have a lot of growing to do yet you want to start messing with peptides and insulin. Your risking your health for an easy way out and if you have to rely on these chemicals simply to get yourself above 220lbs then you might want to re think how far you can go

Hanley

Size=everything wrote: »

Nowler your not even 220lbs and yet have done PHs and are considering using insulin and powerful research peptides no offense but you are way out of your league I mean you shouldn't even be touching PHs right now as you still clearly have a lot of growing to do yet you want to start messing with peptides and insulin. Your risking your health for an easy way out and if you have to rely on these chemicals simply to get yourself above 220lbs then you might want to re think how far you can go

Thank god someone said it.

g'em

Nowler, you're banned. As has been said on many, many occasions the general discussion of steroids is fine, but advocation of/ instructions on how to use them is absolutely not allowed.