Monitoring volume.

JJV

I'm just about to splash out £24.00 on a Radioshack analogue SPL meter. I think it will be a useful teaching tool to demonstrate different SPLs to students; not least to demonstrate what 85 dBs sounds like so that they can recognise when they are working in an environment where they should consider wearing hearing protection.

But on a different matter, I have read that 83 dB SPL is supposed to be the optimum magical monitoring volume. Supposedly if you mix at this volume your mixes will translate well over the largest range of listening levels without being drastically altered by humans' far from flat hearing responses & the effects as demonstrated by the Fletcher Munson Equal Loudness Contour.

Do you pay attention to what volume you monitor at? Have you ever measured the volume or do you do as I presently do & constantly adjust the volume up & down to try & cover all bases? Or is it just a case of familiarity with how a good mix should sound on your set up? & finally does anybody truly understand the decibel - 'tis an elusive beastie is it not?

dav nagle

I have learnt that the louder you go the more exposed a mix is. I can't wait to move out so I can turn up my own mix's and mix loud . I mix fairly low compared to many people but I have heard some say if a mix sounds good low and you can hear everything than it's a decent mix.

studiorat

The Decibel is a bit of a leap of faith. I know what a 1db difference sounds like or rather feels like. When it comes to monitoring talking about dB is useless without constantly referring to a benchmark of some sort.

dB is a ratio rather than an actual measurement. Without a reference it's useless.

And I monitor way too loud but I check at low levels too, especially for judging vocal levels etc.

PaulBrewer

Fletcher-Munsun buzz, yea?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fletcher-Munson_curves

Up and down is the secret I feel and keep the Ups short to avoid the lugs getting tired.

This is the way I've seen all the lads I've ever worked with do it (well the good ones anywus)

bedbugs

PaulBrewer wrote: »

Up and down is the secret I feel and keep the Ups short to avoid the lugs getting tired.

+1

Things can sound fantastic up loud -therein lies the danger. I'd say 90% of my mixing is low enough so that a conversation can take place over it without raising voices.

Then I listen loud on my A7s. Then on my NS-10s, then on my 7 yr old's crappy stereo. Then in the car.

If it sounds good on all of them....sorted.

studiorat

PaulBrewer wrote: »

Fletcher-Munsun buzz, yea?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fletcher-Munson_curves

Ya see the ear is tuned to the voice if you will. There's a natural resonance around 6kHz in the ear I believe, specifically for s's and t's etc. It helps understand each other, over the noise when you're running away from lions and bears. Something to do with evolution...

PaulBrewer

I had Thomas Lund from TC Electronic over from Copenhagen today -

He's a Techy Horse who's involved in the new international Loudness standard

ITU-R BS.1770

Here's some light reading ...

http://www.tcelectronic.com/media/AES121_Stop_Counting_Samples.pdf

iquinn

PaulBrewer wrote: »

I had Thomas Lund from TC Electronic over from Copenhagen today -

He's a Techy Horse who's involved in the new international Loudness standard

ITU-R BS.1770

Here's some light reading ...

http://www.tcelectronic.com/media/AES121_Stop_Counting_Samples.pdf

i'd read the original one:
http://www.tcelectronic.com/media/lund_2006_stop_counting_samples_aes121.pdf

i think it's better as it's more detailed.
Especially the conclusion 'normalize to -3dBFS'. It's out of context in the shortened version.

I use a kind of K system volume/loudness metering, in that I have a point on my volume knob where I know that's as loud as I want to go, that's the sweet spot if you will, where things sound/translate best.
I would use the full implementation of the K-system only I've never gotten around to getting an spl meter!

anders

studiorat wrote: »

When it comes to monitoring talking about dB is useless without constantly referring to a benchmark of some sort.

dB is a ratio rather than an actual measurement. Without a reference it's useless.

dB SPL was specified so...

Plenty of good points mentioned already. I tend to mix music that usually will be listened to loud (pop/rock) at a higher level than music that usually will be listened to at a lower level (say blues/jazz).

Gel

Okay, I've been engineering and teaching for 20 years. I went for a hearing test yesterday and I can tell you that I'm still not over the shock!!
I won't go into detail but take my advice. Don't monitor at loud levels!
All I can say is I won't be engineering too many more sessions!

danjokill

peak at 85dBspl on the 1khz at monitoring position for 1 hour with 15min breaks.
(for music or a rock to pop nature) My understanding is this will equate to appox. 80phon on the Robinson-Dadson curves. Then checking at lower and (slightly) higher volumes your mix for issues in the high's/lows/mid's. Everyones ears are different and age will prove a big factor and your monitor freq. graph too.

PaulBrewer

danjokill wrote: »

peak at 85dBspl on the 1khz at monitoring position for 1 hour with 15min breaks.
(for music or a rock to pop nature) My understanding is this will equate to appox. 80phon on the Robinson-Dadson curves. Then checking at lower and (slightly) higher volumes your mix for issues in the high's/lows/mid's. Everyones ears are different and age will prove a big factor and your monitor freq. graph too.

Head , give references if you're gonna throw around terms like Robinson Dadson curves.

jtsuited

i like this thread. my understanding is that your ears are always dying once you go past a certain age.
the evolutionary explanation is that once you go past your sexual prime running away from lions is sort of pointless!

I test my ears quite regularly and am sometimes a little bit worried. I can normally hear up to just under 19k (which is not bad for 24 year old drummer/techno producer/dj).

I can't monitor very loud as I get pain in my ears when they get tired, so it's sort of a safety net thingy.

Some people scare me at the volumes they constantly listen to music at. I love a big sound system belting out any sort of techno (minimal stuff is great on the massive systems), but guys listening to noisy guitar bands loud in cars is literally painful.

danjokill

PaulBrewer wrote: »

Head , give references if you're gonna throw around terms like Robinson Dadson curves.

Male, 31 and 3/4's , Smoker rapid drops after 16.5khZ, I could go on doctor Brewer if you'd like?

PaulBrewer

danjokill wrote: »

Male, 31 and 3/4's , Smoker rapid drops after 16.5khZ, I could go on doctor Brewer if you'd like?

No, references from the Gardai ..... ya chancer:rolleyes: and I'm sticking you down as 32.

danjokill

PaulBrewer wrote: »

No, references from the Gardai ..... ya chancer:rolleyes: and I'm sticking you down as 32.

lol ...... Truthfully though, the rob and dod curve is only something i looked at recently and very briefly. It seems a lot more logical when you look at the factors that were used to generate these curves.