How would you react if...

Goduznt Xzst

... one day your child, who you had raised an Atheist and an accepter of evolution sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

Malari

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

... one day your child, who you had raised an Atheist and an accepter of evolution sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

I think this is too abstract for me, as I'm not having kids, but I can only compare it to my brother or sister maybe saying the same thing. Naturally you love them anyway, unconditionally. As long as it didn't become a conversion war they can make their own decisions. It would be easier as they would already know your opinion on it presumably.

Pompey Magnus

Its their choice at the end of the day and if my child decided for himself that God exists and he wants to become a priest then I would support him.

P.S. I love the variation on "The Creation of Man" in your sig.

Goduznt Xzst

This thread really is just a branch off of the thread about whether you would date/marry a religious person. Most people wouldn't date someone with opposing views on belief and evolution.

But what do you do if your child rejects evolution and becomes devoutly religious? Do you disown them? Do you tell them they are wrong?

I know some will say they are never going to have children but I think the twinge comes in everyones life where they egotistically look at their own great genes and think "i'd like another generation to have the pleasure of using these"

Dades

I'd support my kid, once I was certain nothing I was likely to say would change their mind, frankly.

I would also find myself wondering what was missing from their life that led them down that path in the first place.

Asiaprod

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

But what do you do if your child rejects evolution and becomes devoutly religious? Do you disown them? Do you tell them they are wrong?

I could not see any parent disown their kids for choosing their own life style, I guess you need to have some to fully appreciate that answer:).
I would imagine that raising them you would already have explained your views, if they change their views, they can just as easily turn around and say, no, you are wrong. The only thing you can do is continue to love and support them, and hope they have a happy life. Its their choice.

Malari

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

This thread really is just a branch off of the thread about whether you would date/marry a religious person. Most people wouldn't date someone with opposing views on belief and evolution.

The difference is that when you are in a relationship with someone you have not known them your entire life and therefore you are more likely to have a conflict arise when this topic of conversation comes up. In families these things tend to come up before you even start to think for yourself.

MrPudding

Dades wrote: »

I'd support my kid, once I was certain nothing I was likely to say would change their mind, frankly.

I would also find myself wondering what was missing from their life that led them down that path in the first place.

I would be very similar. I have to say, I would be fairly disappointed.

I am actually struggling at the moment with my 10 year old. She know I do not believe, but I am trying very hard to get her to make her own mind up.

MrP

Mena

I can't see it ever happening really, my daughter is way too smart

That being said, what could you do? For me anyway, it would not be possible to stop loving her. As long as she had all the facts she is welcome to chose her own path.

Goduznt Xzst

Dades wrote: »

I'd support my kid, once I was certain nothing I was likely to say would change their mind, frankly.

I would also find myself wondering what was missing from their life that led them down that path in the first place.

I would be of the same mind. I mean it would be very hypocritical of me to expect my own parents to accept my lifestyle and then turn around and not accept the lifestyle of my own child.

But I would be very disappointed by the decision and I guess my relationship with my child would change to one where I wouldn't share my ideas and opinions as much due to the fact that it would just cause conflict.

I mean would you forbade them from engaging in religious activities as a youth? I'm guessing you would try to stop them from joining a known cult, but what about an organized religion? Would you take the same preventative measures?

Beruthiel

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

... one day your child, who you had raised an Atheist and an accepter of evolution sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

Well, what kind of relationship did you have with your child in the first place?
I've had many a discussion with my daughter on god, religion etc...
It does not compute that if you've discussed it with your child on a regular basis that they would eventually turn around and decide to join the priesthood.

Goduznt Xzst

Beruthiel wrote: »

I've had many a discussion with my daughter on god, religion etc...
It does not compute that if you've discussed it with your child on a regular basis that they would eventually turn around and decide to join the priesthood.

It would be arrogant of a parent to assume they are the sole source of influence on their child. I think peer influence, especially with the scale of social interaction allowed by the internet, plays a much greater part in shaping how the mind of a teenager develops opinions.

I might of been brought up by devout Christians, but nevertheless I'm an Atheist now. The reverse is highly possible. Just because you might raise your child as an Atheist and teach them to accept evolution does not mean that when they get to an age where they can choose for themselves that they will choose to be an Atheist.

CerebralCortex

I find this idea of raising a child as an atheist rather a strange concept. What does it involve?

robindch

CerebralCortex wrote: »

I find this idea of raising a child as an atheist rather a strange concept. What does it involve?

Um, ostentatiously staying in bed on a Sunday morning or getting up to make tea during the Angelus on the telly?

Beruthiel

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

It would be arrogant of a parent to assume they are the sole source of influence on their child.

If you, as a parent, make a lot of time and effort with your child, starting at a very young age and through their teens, I think you'll find that you're infulence is very strong. I know mine was.
As for peer infulence with regards to religion, that happens enough to make a difference? Not something I've found to be true.

especially with the scale of social interaction allowed by the internet, plays a much greater part in shaping how the mind of a teenager develops opinions.

You think Bebo makes a difference on how your child views 'god'?

CerebralCortex wrote:

I find this idea of raising a child as an atheist rather a strange concept. What does it involve?

It involves doing nothing. Eventually, at some stage you'll be asked about god and you'll give your own thoughts on the subject and what others believe. Leave them to think on it and come back with what they think themselves.

robindch

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

... one day your child [...] sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

I'd be quite surprised as my kid's a girl, not a boy and I can't imagine that the CC is going to relax its knacker-requirement in the next fifty years.

Seriously, though, while she's still too young to get hooked on religion, I have a naive hope that she'll grow up to be too smart get entangled in it. Attending an Educate Together school should help in that. If, in her maturity, she does eventually choose to join up with some religious service provider, then it's really up to her at that stage and all one can do is stand back and let her at it, distasteful and all as it may well be.

Anyhow, in my own experience, quite a few religious people have produced irreligious kids, while the other way round seems rare by comparison.

I'll continue to nurture my fond hopes

Goduznt Xzst

Beruthiel wrote: »

If you, as a parent, make a lot of time and effort with your child, starting at a very young age and through their teens, I think you'll find that you're infulence is very strong. I know mine was.
As for peer infulence with regards to religion, that happens enough to make a difference? Not something I've found to be true.

You think Bebo makes a difference on how your child views 'god'?

It involves doing nothing. Eventually, at some stage you'll be asked about god and you'll give your own thoughts on the subject and what others believe. Leave them to think on it and come back with what they think themselves.

These seem like conflicting ideas. On one hand you are saying to be a strong influence on your child, and on the other you are saying to wait until they come to you. So which is it? How do you influence your child in regards to religion by doing nothing?

Also, religion comes up a lot as a child. I mean what do you tell your child to do on Ash Wednesday or when the other children are celebrating their first communion? Will you also celebrate all the Christian Holidays with your Child, such as Easter, Halloween and Christmas?

Zombrex

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

... one day your child, who you had raised an Atheist and an accepter of evolution sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

I wouldn't raise my child to be an atheist.

If he wanted to join the priesthood I would support him. They can always leave.

Beruthiel

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

These seem like conflicting ideas.

Not at all. I'm guessing you don't have any kids.
Spending time and effort on your child has nothing to do with religion and more to do with teaching them how to be.
Teaching the difference between right and wrong. Teaching them how to think for themselves.
Being with them and spending time with them. Being a good parent so that they respect you and who you are.

How do you influence your child in regards to religion by doing nothing?

Because if you have built a basis for a good relationship, when they have a question, they will come to you first to get an answer.

Dades

robindch wrote: »

Um, ostentatiously staying in bed on a Sunday morning or getting up to make tea during the Angelus on the telly?

Sounds somewhat like most 'catholics' I know. :pac:

Galvasean

Hmmm, if they served tea at mass....

Goduznt Xzst

Beruthiel wrote: »

Because if you have built a basis for a good relationship, when they have a question, they will come to you first to get an answer.

Would you say that this approach is foolproof? I mean do you believe that this parenting will mean your child will never join any religion ever? Regardless of their future friends, experiences and trials?

robindch

Galvasean wrote: »

Hmmm, if they served tea at mass....

Many do. Try the Christchurch's sunday morning service -- there's free tea and biscuits in the crypt when the main gig's over upstairs.

And, in all fairness, on a sunday morning, the Christchurch choir together with a good organist, really can blow away the clinging dust of a long Saturday evening, tea or not.

Dades

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

Would you say that this approach is foolproof? I mean do you believe that this parenting will mean your child will never join any religion ever? Regardless of their future friends, experiences and trials?

Who on earth would suggest that? Certainly not a parent.

Your approach is overtly confrontation sometimes, Goduznt.

Goduznt Xzst

Dades wrote: »

Who on earth would suggest that? Certainly not a parent.

Your approach is overtly confrontation sometimes, Goduznt.

If it is I apologize, I'm just trying to get back to my original question. I was not asking how an Atheist should raise their child so as not to join a religion, rather if they do join a religion how would you react and how would you treat your child from that point on.

I'm trying to get at the point that regardless of how well you raise your child there are influences on their opinions and emotions that are out of a parents control. This child doesn't necessarily have to be a teenager, they could be in their 30's and after a spending a while in Tibet they come back home to tell their parents they are becoming Buddhist. Or they could be in love with an individual who is highly religious and are adopting that persons beliefs because of this love.

raido9

I'm appalled with some of the responses on this thread.

The idea of raising a child an Atheist revolts me.

CerebralCortex

raido9 wrote: »

I'm appalled with some of the responses on this thread.

The idea of raising a child an Atheist revolts me.

What? Why? Can you actually raise a child an atheist? Anyone?
The idea that you raise a child to believe what you believe as the nature of existence to be true is revolting also. No?

Dades

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

I'm trying to get at the point that regardless of how well you raise your child there are influences on their opinions and emotions that are out of a parents control. This child doesn't necessarily have to be a teenager, they could be in their 30's and after a spending a while in Tibet they come back home to tell their parents they are becoming Buddhist. Or they could be in love with an individual who is highly religious and are adopting that persons beliefs because of this love.

I think most here are rightly sceptical that such a scenario as outlined in your first post would come about. Let's face it - it's unlikely even in a devout household. That said, children and ultimately adults are unpredictable so nobody could claim with certainty their offspring won't be the complete opposite to them.

Actually - your point about a child adopting someone they love's beliefs is a potential situation. An interesting question then would be how would you treat the religious suitor? (Not with must respect, if I'm honest).

raido9 wrote: »

I'm appalled with some of the responses on this thread.

The idea of raising a child an Atheist revolts me.

How is the concept any different to you raising your child with your beliefs?

Goduznt Xzst

raido9 wrote: »

I'm appalled with some of the responses on this thread.

The idea of raising a child an Atheist revolts me.

Why?

I should probably be more specific, you can't really raise a child as an Atheist per se. Rather you just raise them without a religious belief and teach them about the natural order of the world and humanity. Its not like you replace Bible reading with making them read "The Origin of species" or something.

Basically you are raising a child exactly the same way as anyone else but with their religious indoctrination removed.

Galvasean

raido9 wrote: »

The idea of raising a child an Atheist revolts me.

If that is the case you are probably revolted by the very concept of atheism.

Put the shoe on the other foot for a moment. If I were to say to you, "The idea of raising a child <insert your religious beliefs here> revolts me." how would you feel about that?

raido9

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

Why?

I should probably be more specific, you can't really raise a child as an Atheist per se. Rather you just raise them without a religious belief and teach them about the natural order of the world and humanity. Its not like you replace Bible reading with making them read "The Origin of species" or something.

What you've described above is fair enough, but thats not raising your child an Atheist.
I don't agree with force feeding children spiritual beliefs or non-beliefs as the case may be.

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

Basically you are raising a child exactly the same way as anyone else but just with their religious indoctrination removed.

As long as the religious indoctrination is not replace with an anti-religious indoctrination!

Dades wrote:

How is the concept any different to you raising your child with your beliefs?

I would consider myself somewhat of an Atheist. I would try not to raise my child with my beliefs.

Mena

Well, the thought of my daughter falling into the sticky trap of religion revolts me. I mean I feel physically sick at the thought, but at the end of the day you can't (should not) try to force anything on anyone.

raido9

Galvasean wrote: »

If that is the case you are probably revolted by the very concept of atheism.

Put the shoe on the other foot for a moment. If I were to say to you, "The idea of raising a child <insert your religious beliefs here> revolts me." how would you feel about that?

I'd agree with you.

Asiaprod

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

This child doesn't necessarily have to be a teenager, they could be in their 30's and after a spending a while in Tibet they come back home to tell their parents they are becoming Buddhist.

I don’t think you understand what a Buddhist is? or what Buddhism is for that matter. Your statement is way to generalized. I know Buddhists who believe in God. I know Buddhists who don’t believe in God... And I know Buddhists that just don’t know or care. Like wise some see it as a religion, others do not. I for one certainly do not.
Buddhism is not about God, it is about suffering and helping end suffering through wisdom and the activity of compassion. Leaving the God issue aside for the moment, I don't see how these ideals are in conflict this Atheisim. I believe many here already subscribe to these ideals in one form or another in their own lives.

Goduznt Xzst

raido9 wrote: »

What you've described above is fair enough, but thats not raising your child an Atheist.

How do you define Atheism? A child is going to know of God and death and evil from a very young age. If you are Atheist you are going to explain these things to them from an Atheist viewpoint. How is that not raising them as an Atheist?

Asiaprod wrote: »

I don’t think you understand what a Buddhist is? or what Buddhism is for that matter.

I do, and this is why I added it into the discussion along with the point about someone choosing the religion of their partner. As there are various different religious beliefs that an individual could practice, Tibetan Buddhism might be one most Atheists might be ok with, whereas Christianity might not.

Dades

raido9 wrote: »

I would consider myself somewhat of an Atheist. I would try not to raise my child with my beliefs.

As an atheist, not raising your child with your beliefs involves standing back while others attempt to indoctrinate your child with theirs. A child looks to you for guidance and will seek it elsewhere if not offered.

In theory non-intervention sounds great, but if you don't claim your kid - someone else might.

Tim Robbins

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

... one day your child, who you had raised an Atheist and an accepter of evolution sat you down and told you they where joining the priesthood?

I wouldn't have a problem with it so long as it was what they wanted and it was an informed decision.

My Dad told me once he asked his Dad if he could read An Phoblacht, the Sinn Fein rag, the answer he got was, yeah sure as long as you read every other newspaper including 'The Irish Times'.

My attitude would be similar. You can read the Bible and follow that route as long as you read up about other religions and atheism.

I'd be more worried about kids getting pregnant and doing too much drugs.