Iarnrod Éireann accused of wasting 5 million on "Ghost Trains"

Run_to_da_hills

Apparently CIE is wasting 5 Million a year on "Ghost trains" according to an article in today’s Metro. They should be charging the public more for the privilege of being on these "Ghost trains" particularly coming up to Halloween

Similar article in Yesterdays Tribune. http://www.tribune.ie/article/2008/sep/28/off-the-rails/

I think using 6 car darts at night is just as bad when a two car dart is sufficient.

T Corolla

I cannot believe that they would waist money like that. The 5:05am from Athlone obviously is driven up from Dublin to start that service. I have never seen railcars on the Athlone-Dublin line. You have to look at this from their point of view in that in the last year alone there have been alot of driver related issues and in order to get people to work they have to get the drivers to the start point of the journey someway.There are some stations that dont have a place to park a train at night time. It think it it time irish rail hired at least another ten drivers to cover illness/holdays and not to be running the current system on overtime and flexibile drivers.

karlr42

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Apparently CIE is wasting 5 Million a year on "Ghost trains" according to an article in today’s Metro. They should be charging the public more for the privilege of being on these "Ghost trains" particularly coming up to Halloween

Similar article in Yesterdays Tribune. http://www.tribune.ie/article/2008/sep/28/off-the-rails/

I think this was discussed somewhere else.
In all fairness, it would be worse to spend money to building depots all over the country.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I think using 6 car darts at night is just as bad when a two car dart is sufficient.

Taking each train of service for 30(?) minutes, taking up space somewhere while they decouple it? And what happens to the other two units? Can't put them into service without hiring more drivers.

dowlingm

On P11/RUI's forums the discussion between Jane from IE PR and Mark Gleeson has been posted. It makes shocking listening given the condescension exhibited by her to Mark G (especially since the Turbine's Ken Griffin was the one who did the research).

Run_to_da_hills

karlr42 wrote: »

Taking each train of service for 30(?) minutes, taking up space somewhere while they decouple it? And what happens to the other two units? Can't put them into service without hiring more drivers.

For almost 15 years It was no problem for CIE to run twin car sets to Bray in the evening and have them coupled in 4's ready for the morning service.

Have the rail staff got lazy in the last few years that they can't do this any more? They have plenty of space to link the cars up.

karlr42

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

For almost 15 years It was no problem for CIE to run twin car sets to Bray in the evening and have them coupled up ready for the morning service.

Have the rail staff got lazy in the last few years that they can't do this any more? They have plenty of space to link cars up.

Surely that would have happened overnight after services had ended? Not really the same.

Run_to_da_hills

karlr42 wrote: »

Surely that would have happened overnight after services had ended? Not really the same.

My point is why is CIE running almost empty 6 and even 8 car sets at night during the week when two car sets would be sufficient.

karlr42

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

My point is why is CIE running almost empty 6 and even 8 car sets at night during the week when two car sets would be sufficient.

Because it's easier to leave them coupled then to uncouple them. It never hurts to have extra capacity. Seems an an unnecessary effort to decouple them at 7/8, then have to recouple the next morning. Just creates unnecessary work, meaning increased costs.

DWCommuter

dowlingm wrote: »

On P11/RUI's forums the discussion between Jane from IE PR and Mark Gleeson has been posted. It makes shocking listening given the condescension exhibited by her to Mark G (especially since the Turbine's Ken Griffin was the one who did the research).

The condescension you refer to is based on more than this issue.

ixoy

Amusingly enough about 30 seconds after I saw this headline on the Metro, a ghost train passed through Portmarnock station.

Run_to_da_hills

ixoy wrote: »

Amusingly enough about 30 seconds after I saw this headline on the Metro, a ghost train passed through Portmarnock station.

I think Iarnrod Eireann should follow Ryanairs example, rather than having these trains running empty they should offer these seats on line at "give away" prices to fill them.

dowlingm

DWCommuter wrote: »

The condescension you refer to is based on more than this issue.

You might well say so, (and some examples would be even better) but the tone exhibited was not becoming for a representative of a company that has massive State backing and is largely protected from competition.

DWCommuter

dowlingm wrote: »

You might well say so, (and some examples would be even better) but the tone exhibited was not becoming for a representative of a company that has massive State backing and is largely protected from competition.

For a start, that tone was never used in my direction when I was in that role. I think its more to do with IEs experience of the particular spokesperson in question. He hasn't helped matters as IE have him sussed. I'll say no more here. It wouldn't be right.

Cool Mo D

Well clearly casting aspersions on the man publicly is the mature way of resolving issues you may have with him. I know I'm impressed.

DWCommuter

Cool Mo D wrote: »

Well clearly casting aspersions on the man publicly is the mature way of resolving issues you may have with him. I know I'm impressed.

Listen buddy, I answered a post, then replied to a post without saying anything offensive. Just opinion. I have left it there and I stated that. Anything I have to say about the person in question, I say on the relevent forum, not here, so cool your jets and stop trying to stoke it up.

KC61

T Corolla wrote: »

I cannot believe that they would waist money like that. The 5:05am from Athlone obviously is driven up from Dublin to start that service. I have never seen railcars on the Athlone-Dublin line. You have to look at this from their point of view in that in the last year alone there have been alot of driver related issues and in order to get people to work they have to get the drivers to the start point of the journey someway.There are some stations that dont have a place to park a train at night time. It think it it time irish rail hired at least another ten drivers to cover illness/holdays and not to be running the current system on overtime and flexibile drivers.

The 0505 service has an Athlone based driver, and is not driven from Dublin that morning. The driver then bring the 0820 Heuston-Westport back to Athlone.

Additional drivers are being trained at present, but bear in mind that it takes eighteen months to pass out a train driver.

Incidentally, railcars do operate on the Athlone-Dublin line. All weekday services on the Westport line, together with three return workings on the Galway route are now railcar operated, together with two return workings to/from Westport on Sundays and three to/from Galway.

dowlingm

KC61 wrote: »

bear in mind that it takes eighteen months to pass out a train driver.

KC61 - no disrespect but since IE driving is a closed shop doesn't it take a bit longer than that to hire someone, train them to do a job (ticket checker or something) and then allow them apply for a driving position?

KC61

dowlingm wrote: »

KC61 - no disrespect but since IE driving is a closed shop doesn't it take a bit longer than that to hire someone, train them to do a job (ticket checker or something) and then allow them apply for a driving position?

Absolutely. However, I was referring to the time taken once drivers' positions were advertised internally and applicants approved. Any member of staff can apply for a driver's position.

There are drivers in training at the moment, and hopefully they will be passed out by the next timetable change, which should reduce the dependancy on overtime.

The point that I was trying to make is that you can't simply hire drivers at a moment's notice. There is an extensive training programme to ensure that a driver is aware of all the attributes of each locomotive/railcar type and (and this is the tough part) the attributesof every route that they might drive.

A train driver must have full "route knowledge" of each line before being able to drive a train on it. They have to be able to know exactly where every signal is located and where the braking point for that signal is, where every level crossing is, and where every crossover is. Easy you might say? Well remember also they have to be able to do that in pitch black darkness and that the braking point could be over a mile and a half away from the signal at a point where that signal is not visible.

dowlingm

KC61 - agreed entirely. I have no truck with anyone who might seek to accelerate the training program at the expense of route knowledge.

However, permitting direct entry drivers from other train companies without prior employment at IE would reduce the lead time, with only Irish-specific procedures needing to be passed on in addition to route knowledge. It might also improve the culture within IE operationally to have drivers pass on their experiences from other companies they've worked in.

Ham'nd'egger

dowlingm wrote: »

KC61 - agreed entirely. I have no truck with anyone who might seek to accelerate the training program at the expense of route knowledge.

However, permitting direct entry drivers from other train companies without prior employment at IE would reduce the lead time, with only Irish-specific procedures needing to be passed on in addition to route knowledge. It might also improve the culture within IE operationally to have drivers pass on their experiences from other companies they've worked in.

I suppose that hoards of people are going to leave transport companies and emigrate to Ireland to drive trains when this comes in:rolleyes:

paulm17781

Hamndegger wrote: »

I suppose that hoards of people are going to leave transport companies and emigrate to Ireland to drive trains when this comes in:rolleyes:

They could. How do our train drivers get paid compared to other countries? Even if they didn't, having a more open policy wouldn't be a bad thing, it certainly couldn't be worse.

dowlingm

ham/egg

there could indeed be Irish drivers working for UK or other foreign TOCs that wouldn't mind moving home especially now house prices are nosediving