Comolli for the sack!?

colly_browy

I for one hope we see the back of the man behind the signings of Kaboul, Boateng (5.4m!!), Tarabbt etc...




COMOLLI UNDER THREAT AFTER DEADLINE FARCE

Damien Comolli's position as Tottenham's sporting director is being described as 'under review' after details emerged of the club's farcical pursuit of new players as the transfer window closed on Monday night.


According to The Daily Mail, chairman Daniel Levy, who has since left London on a brief holiday to consider Comolli's future, took control of the sale of Dimi Berbatov in order to allow Comolli to concentrate on lining up replacements.


'Instead he failed in a deal to bring in Sergio Garcia from Real Zaragoza - 'nailed on' to sign for Spurs early on Monday - and the striker instead joined Real Betis. Ramos, with an encyclopaedic knowledge of the Spanish league, had made the striker his top priority,' the newspaper reports.


Spurs, with Comolli at the helm of their transfer activity, is understood to have then made a last-ditch attempt to recruit Emile Heskey from Wigan. Upon being rebuffed by Steve Bruce, Spurs then turned their attention to Kevin Doyle despite Reading boss Steve Coppell making clear at the weekend that 'potential suitors had the whole of the summer to pick at the carcass of his relegated club and that he had no intention of selling players on transfer deadline day'.


Coppell's exact answer upon receiving a call from White Hart Lane at around 10.30pm on Monday night is not known but it is clear that it amounted to a 'no'.


The details of Tottenham's desperate and shambolic search add credence to the claims from Old Trafford that during the last two hours of deadline day Tottenham repeatedly changed their minds over selling Berbatov. His transfer was only ratified when United offered to send Frazier Campbell to north London on a season-long loan deal.


While the addition of the youngster at least offers Juande Ramos, now shorn of three of the four strikers he began the year with, another attacking option, United have more cause to celebrate the striker's move than his new and temporary employers. Adamant that there is no clause in the loan deal that offers Spurs the opportunity to sign Campbell permanently, the youngster will return to Old Trafford next summer improved by valuable first-team experience.


"Going on loan to a great club like Tottenham will give him experience in the Premier League and he'll come back a better player and hopefully force his way into the team here," commented United chief executive David Gill. "So we're delighted with the deal - it's good for him and good for us."


And more bad news for the under-fire Comolli.

therecklessone

More expert PR from Levy and co.

Strong rumours abounded before the end of the window that Comolli faced the chop this month regardless of the outcome of the window, now Levy is briefing the press to put the blame for Berbatov being replaced by Campbell on Comolli's shoulders.

I'd like to know exactly what constraints Comolli was working under the last few days. Was he told to actually complete a deal for Berb's replacement, or was it a case of "we want you to have potential deals in place in case we need them at the last minute". If it's the latter then he was on a hiding to nothing, which club is going to allow a player leave an hour before the window shuts without having a replacement lined up themselves? Us obviously...;)

We were linked with Garcia six weeks ago, yet they are surprised by him going to Betis on the last day? Why should he wait for us to make up our mind if we want him?

Also, how much impact does the general policy of buy 'em young have on Comolli's task?

Seems Levy is trying to muddy the waters so that blame can be deflected away from himself, the statement on the club site saying Ramos had final say on the deal late on Monday evening certainly seems to indicate Levy is washing his hands of the blame, I can't believe Ramos would sanction the sale if he knew we had no plan B that late in the day.

For anyone who thinks Comolli going signals the end of the DOF regime think again. Ramos has always worked under a DOF, he is not likely to agree to take on the tasks traditionally managed by an English-style manager.

colly_browy

Fair points.

But wasn't that whole flawed "buy em young" policy come inititated by Comolli in the first place?

If you read between the lines of Ramos' recent interviews you can detect the frustrations of working under Comolli in the current regime. Mangers are control freaks by their very nature, i wouldn't neccesarily jump to the conclusion that Ramos would welcome another DOF. I certainly wouldn't.

therecklessone

colly_browy wrote: »

But wasn't that whole flawed "buy em young" policy come inititated by Comolli in the first place?

No, Levy on behalf of ENIC. Arnensen worked under the same constraints before he was poached by Chelsea, the only difference being Frankie spent less per player than Comolli

colly_browy wrote: »

If you read between the lines of Ramos' recent interviews you can detect the frustrations of working under Comolli in the current regime. Mangers are control freaks by their very nature, i wouldn't neccesarily jump to the conclusion that Ramos would welcome another DOF. I certainly wouldn't.

Mate, Ramos is not a manager in the traditional English sense of the word. He has worked under a DOF his entire career, the most recent being Ramón Rodríguez Verdejo, aka Monchi at Sevilla.

He knew Comolli was there when he took the job, he is unlikely to take on roles he is unaccustomed to if Comolli is fired.

eoinf

Are the likes of David Gill & Peter Kenyon DOF's or are they something else.

Lets be honest both Utd & Chelsea dont seem to do too bad under that set-up. For years now we have struggled with this set-up ,is it just weak managers that the board dont trust so therefore the instate a "minder" when it comes to Buying & selling .

Ill be the first to admit im a little confused what Levy & or Comolli added to the club.

therecklessone

eoinf wrote: »

Are the likes of David Gill & Peter Kenyon DOF's or are they something else.

Lets be honest both Utd & Chelsea dont seem to do too bad under that set-up.

Equally, the sides that get relegated from the PL by and large operate under that system as well, should they be held up as examples of good structure? Real, Barca, Sevilla, most of the top Italian sides all employ sporting directors/DOFs and have tasted success, but on the other hand the DOF is also used by sides that fail on the continent.

What does seem to be an issue is exactly what role is laid out for who in our own structure, does the DOF manage the scouting network and youth development while leaving first team selection to the coach? Who picks the players we sign? Levy involves himself in some deals (Modric in, Berbatov out) yet Comolli is the fall guy when it goes wrong. The standard of transfers in have improved greatly since Ramos took over as head coach, does that mean he picks the players or is he still handed a list by Comolli like Jol was, and told to pick who he wanted?

I'm inclined to believe that Ramos and Comolli have a better relationship than Jol and Comolli had, and that is reflected in the players we have signed since JR took over. I also believe that Jol and Arnensen had a good relationship (Jol was Arnensen's choice as assistant to Santini, again an example of the board through their DOF dictatin terms to the head coach), which supports my theory that the DOF should ideally get to choose the coach he works with. The continuity is supposed to be provided by the DOF remaining even if the coach walks away, we just never saw Chelsea stealing Arnensen away from us.

I feel the board see the DOF as a buffer between themselves and any mistakes made on the coaching or player management side, and that is why we are hearing Comolli is for the chop. Meanwhile Danny boy is off on his hols and we're left wondering if United really had permission from us to talk to sulky, and if we have an option to buy Campbell or are we just keeping him warm for the Stretford Enders.

The Muppet

therecklessone wrote: »

What does seem to be an issue is exactly what role is laid out for who in our own structure, does the DOF manage the scouting network and youth development while leaving first team selection to the coach? Who picks the players we sign? Levy involves himself in some deals (Modric in, Berbatov out) yet Comolli is the fall guy when it goes wrong. The standard of transfers in have improved greatly since Ramos took over as head coach, does that mean he picks the players or is he still handed a list by Comolli like Jol was, and told to pick who he wanted?

I haven't a clue of how these things work at Tottenham but for me the most damning content of the article is the attempt to Buy Heskey. I realise he is back in the England team but competition for that place is not all that hot. Despite his early promise at Leicester he has been a failure since and not fit to lace the boots of the player he was to replace. Whoever is responsible for choosing players to buy needs a wake up call.

therecklessone wrote: »

Meanwhile Danny boy is off on his hols and we're left wondering if United really had permission from us to talk to sulky, and if we have an option to buy Campbell or are we just keeping him warm for the Stretford Enders.

Not wishing to revisit old ground but Cmon use you common sense, do you really think that United gave Berbatov a Medical without spurs permission? To do so would be foolhardy in the extreme and neither Fergie or Gill fit the bill. Gill has said you do not have an option on Campbell, I have never know him to be caught out in a lie on such matters so I believe him. I doubt Campbell would have agreed to a permanent move anyway even if there was time to negotiate. Reading the article above it appears that his inclusion in the deal was a last minute decision so time.

colly_browy

Again therecklessone: good points, well-made.

The reason i reserve more ire for Comolli rather than Levy is because the former has more involvement with the footballing side of things and, personally, it's those areas i know/care about most. I see what your saying about Levy playing a sly blame game via the press but i just think that 'passing the buck' is unavoidable in a DOF setup

Clearly, judging by team selections, Jol didn't fancy the likes of Boateng and Tarabbt. I just find it mind-crunchingly frustating that the club can sanction spending 10mill on players who the manager has no intention of playing. If, for that reason alone, i believe our adoption of the DOF system is fundamentally flawed. And it looks like it's continuing...

I'm yet to be convinced that Ramos rates Gunter or Gilberto, and I can see the Comolli/Ramos relationship disintegrating in the same way that Comolli/Jol one did. It gives me no pleasure to predict that our status as the most consistently inconsistent club in the PL seems much assured.

colly_browy

eoinf wrote: »

Are the likes of David Gill & Peter Kenyon DOF's or are they something else.

Lets be honest both Utd & Chelsea dont seem to do too bad under that set-up.

No, they're CEO's, our equivilent to Levy. None of the top 4 employ a Director of Football.

RichMc70

Ultimately the blame as to lie with Levy.

No DOF is gonna be given a free hand to either purchase or sell players without the consultation (or permission) of the chairman, as there's just too much money involved these days.

Personally, I have no time for either Levy or Commolli but for now at least, I guess we'll have to carry on suffering their shameful handling of the club.

therecklessone

The Muppet wrote: »

Not wishing to revisit old ground but Cmon use you common sense, do you really think that United gave Berbatov a Medical without spurs permission?

Quite a few people in the press think we had not given permission, I'd like Spurs to clarify the issue, unless the club do then there remains the suspicion that you didn't have permission then upped you bid by a few £m as hush money.

Common sense suggests you had permission, but common sense also suggests that even the most far fetched of stories has an element of truth in it.

I saw no statement from Spurs saying we had not given permission, but a number of media outlets on Monday were reporting that Spurs had not given permission, so who knows?

The point is fans feel angry and confused by Monday's events, and the man responsible has fcuked off on his hols to leave his French buffer take all the flak.

The Muppet

If deadline day press gossip are all you are basing you opinion on it's not surprising your confused about it. Surely a club like Tottenham couldn't be silenced for a few quid "hush money" if they really felt they were wronged and had the evidence to prove it, which they definitely would have had if the medical wasn't sanctioned.

Hopefully the truth will out one day until then we may agree to differ on Uniteds role in this.

therecklessone

The Muppet wrote: »

If deadline day press gossip are all you are basing you opinion on it's not surprising your confused about it.

Hang on a second, you spent a good part of this week questioning the sequence of events for Corluka's transfer based on a post you read on red cafe, you're in no position to question my rationale.

The Muppet

therecklessone wrote: »

Hang on a second, you spent a good part of this week questioning the sequence of events for Corluka's transfer based on a post you read on red cafe, you're in no position to question my rationale.

Your rational is gone out the window again Ronan. I questioned the sequence of events because the picture of Corluka in A tottenham shirt was taken on the 8th of August, three weeks before the deal was offically announced.

I had reasonable grounds to suspect something wasn't right with the deal, It wasn't just me in Tin Foil hat mode.

therecklessone

The Muppet wrote: »

Your rational is gone out the window again Ronan. I questioned the sequence of events because the picture of Corluka in A tottenham shirt was taken on the 8th of August, three weeks before the deal was offically announced.

And your source for that nugget was red cafe, which you revealed when I asked you on the Corluka thread. In case you've forgotten:

The Muppet wrote: »

Thet's interesting, If the contract had been signed early August that would have made him a Tottenham player . How come he played for Man City yesterday?

therecklessone wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest, where exactly is that info?

The Muppet wrote: »

I read about the picture on RedCafe, why do you ask?

You didn't confirm the details until I questioned your info and you found a link to a Spurs blog that explained the story

As for my comments re. the events surrounding Berbatov, when a respected football journalist like Henry Winters is asking questions about the deal then I sit up and take notice. He may be wrong, but then the board of THFC are in a perfect position to clarify the day's events, aren't they?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/leagues/premierleague/manutd/2670835/Spurs-fume-but-Dimitar-Berbatovs-Manchester-United-deal-broke-no-rules----Football.html

Dimitar Berbatov happily rushed into Manchester United's willing embrace on Monday night, rather than Manchester City's as Tottenham had hoped, because Spurs had given him permission "to go to Manchester''.

That comment was taken by United as an invitation to meet Berbatov without feeling they were breaking any Premier League rules on courting other clubs' players.

The Premier League said yesterday no rules had been broken by United, because no complaint had been made. Spurs were angry that Berbatov was met by United at the airport, when they had agreed a fee with City.

The Londoners agreed to sell to United because of the player's desire to go to the champions, Juande Ramos' preference for getting a sulky player out of his dressing-room and because they needed a replacement striker. As the midnight deadline loomed, United's promising youngster, Fraizer Campbell, was the only option.

So Spurs yielded and agreed to drop their complaint over United's conduct in return for £30.7 million for Berbatov and the year-long loan services of Campbell. The figure was more than United initially wanted to pay, negotiations having begun with the champions offering £25 million, and Spurs may eventually view £30.7 million and a year of Campbell as good business with Berbatov so desperate to leave.

Now given that club officials have received hundreds if not thousands of e-mails from our fans questioning the club's conduct during the last few hours of the transfer window, and given that both Comolli and Levy used the club website to explain the transfer window dealings (to some extent) to fans, it is not unreasonable to ask that they provide clarity in the face of such articles, if only to convince fans that we have not caved in the face of bully boy tactics.

By the way, the intent of mentioning this in the first place was to question the role played by the chairman of THFC, not have a pop at United, so you shouldn't feel obliged to defend your club.

RichMc70

The Corluka situation has been explained in a few posts here already. I don't know if what has been said is 100% accurate but to me it seems extremely plausible. Plus the fact that the press havent bothered to wet ink on the story suggests that there was probably nothing untoward.

Speaking of the press, there have been a large number of articles that has suggested Utd did'nt have permission to talk to Berbatov, however whether they did or did not seems immaterial now, as the deal is done. Fini.

The question now for Spurs fans is "who the fcuk is to blame for the debacle?"

I've already said I blame Levy but I reckon he'll have the attitude that the buck stops at anyone in a position lower than himself, so therefore I think Commolli will be emptying his desk soon.

The Muppet

therecklessone wrote: »

And your source for that nugget was red cafe, which you revealed when I asked you on the Corluka thread. In case you've forgotten:

My memory is not what it once was but not that bad that I forgot what I posted in the last few days. I wasn't denying the source of the information (the date on the picture), I was pointing out that it was 100% accurate and correct . I wasn't posting hearsay and conjecture , My questions were based on fact.

therecklessone wrote: »

You didn't confirm the details until I questioned your info and you found a link to a Spurs blog that explained the story

I did confirm the details but you questioned their validity, then I posted the link as I like to back up my posts as. I find that can sometimes help prevent being accused of trolling for some who can't see past my username.

therecklessone wrote: »

As for my comments re. the events surrounding Berbatov, when a respected football journalist like Henry Winters is asking questions about the deal then I sit up and take notice. He may be wrong, but then the board of THFC are in a perfect position to clarify the day's events, aren't they?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/leagues/premierleague/manutd/2670835/Spurs-fume-but-Dimitar-Berbatovs-Manchester-United-deal-broke-no-rules----Football.html



Now given that club officials have received hundreds if not thousands of e-mails from our fans questioning the club's conduct during the last few hours of the transfer window, and given that both Comolli and Levy used the club website to explain the transfer window dealings (to some extent) to fans, it is not unreasonable to ask that they provide clarity in the face of such articles, if only to convince fans that we have not caved in the face of bully boy tactics.

By the way, the intent of mentioning this in the first place was to question the role played by the chairman of THFC, not have a pop at United, so you shouldn't feel obliged to defend your club.

Fair enough, I understand Spurs fans annoyance at their dealings this summer I would be looking for clarification myself if in a similar position.

WhiteWashMan

The Muppet wrote: »

Your rational is gone out the window again Ronan. I questioned the sequence of events because the picture of Corluka in A tottenham shirt was taken on the 8th of August, three weeks before the deal was offically announced.

I had reasonable grounds to suspect something wasn't right with the deal, It wasn't just me in Tin Foil hat mode.

jaysus, youd start an argument in an empty room

The Muppet

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

jaysus, youd start an argument in an empty room

Lol , I didn't start anything .;)

Dublin Spur

Muppet, you seem to have a very odd interest/obsession with Spurs.
are you Tottenham in disguise ??

therecklessone

Dublin Spur wrote: »

Muppet, you seem to have a very odd interest/obsession with Spurs.
are you Tottenham in disguise ??

He's banned from the soccer forum, he just needs his fix...

Dublin Spur

therecklessone wrote: »

He's banned from the soccer forum, he just needs his fix...

All starting to make sense now
Cheers Ro

galinka

colly_browy wrote: »

Clearly, judging by team selections, Jol didn't fancy the likes of Boateng and Tarabbt. I just find it mind-crunchingly frustating that the club can sanction spending 10mill on players who the manager has no intention of playing.
I'm yet to be convinced that Ramos rates Gunter or Gilberto, and I can see the Comolli/Ramos relationship disintegrating in the same way that Comolli/Jol one did. It gives me no pleasure to predict that our status as the most consistently inconsistent club in the PL seems much assured.

If Jol did not play Boateng or Taarabbt i'd say best thing he did - but in reality he played both - unlike Ramos who refuses to give Boateng a number and i doubt has much time for Taarabt.

I don't rate Gilberto at all - but i think Gunther is a fine prospect able to hold his play in an Int team at 19. After Chelsea game hopefully Ramos will think the same.