Brian townsend multi accounting?

loosecannon

http://www.4flush.com/online-gambling-news/brian-townsend-confesses-to-online-poker-multi-accounting/1131/

Apologies if this has already been discussed but would people mind explaining to me exactly what he's really done wrong here???

thedini

nothing, everybody should do it.:rolleyes:

Tight Ted

"Townsend will be donating $25,000 from his Cardrunners earnings to a yet-to-be-determined charity". Less than a buy-in to him.

What's bad about this, is at the top-levels, all the players have detailed notes and reads about each other. By using another account name, he can sneak in under the radar, and play against the same guy using his notes, while they have no notes on him. It also allows him to play at the lower levels, and grind up a nice sum of cash, without people going 'WTF it's Brian Townsend' and getting the **** out of town.

Think of the guy you know who always plays suited cards and chases his flush draws. Imagine he turned up to your game wearing a false mustache, a monacle and a top-hat, thus completely disgused. Therefore there would be no way of knowing it was him so you couldn't predict his tendencies, yet he could predict yours. Well, it's basically a more complex version of that.

bohsman

I argued there was nothing wrong with it in the bad beat thread, Ill stick to that opinion.

Should the fella in false mustache be made pay 25k to charity if people cop on?

Yabbadimday

bohsman wrote: »

I argued there was nothing wrong with it in the bad beat thread, Ill stick to that opinion.

Should the fella in false mustache be made pay 25k to charity if people cop on?

People shouldn't have to cop on,he's in clear breach of the terms and conditions of both stars and ft and was well aware of this.

No one said he HAD to pay 25k ,he's in business in this very industry and is obv hoping this will save enough face/money for him that it will actually turn out to be profitable in the long run.

Pretty retarded behaviour tbh from a guy in his position.

cuterob

he tried to grind back up his roll by playing at 25/50 omaha under a different name to save speculation of him being broke but lost 180k doing it anyway.. then someone outed him in on fulltilt chat one night probably drunk.. he's been banned from fulltilt for 6 months

Ace2007

bohsman wrote: »

I argued there was nothing wrong with it in the bad beat thread, Ill stick to that opinion.

Should the fella in false mustache be made pay 25k to charity if people cop on?

i'm also of this thinking....

platypus

Whats the difference in doing this and having accounts at different skins on ipoker for example? Imo theres nothing wrong if he didnt play the two accounts in same tourney or cash game

mdwexford

Wow the guy got to play anonymously for a few weeks, omg lets lynch him cause its against t+c's.

OutOfPosition

platypus wrote: »

Whats the difference in doing this and having accounts at different skins on ipoker for example? Imo theres nothing wrong if he didnt play the two accounts in same tourney or cash game

I like the way you copied what ppl said in the BBV and posted it out here, WP

platypus

OutOfPosition wrote: »

I like the way you copied what ppl said in the BBV and posted it out here, WP

I love the high content posts and in depth analysis you provide to all topics.

Didnt read BBV,but whatever

cooker3

How did the guy who outed him know?

Trippie

cooker3 wrote: »

How did the guy who outed him know?

read his soul?

Lurker1977

SamH133: can i play if i give up my bstownsend
SamH133: embarrased
SamH133: name
SamH133: and play more tan 25/50 plo on it
SamH133: or sould i log on stellar nubula
SamH133: i just wanna know
durrrr: thats you samh?
durrrr: stellarnebula?
SamH133: yes thats me
SamH133: im the illest
Genius28: what ive played u hu plo on that name b4
SamH133: yea
SamH133: im a loser
SamH133: named btowsned
SamH133: and embarrased
SamH133: to play less than 200/400
SamH133: thats me
durrrr: o ur saying thats aba?
SamH133: oh no
SamH133: im not
durrrr: wtf im confused
SamH133: im just sayin im a donk and embrrased to be played the likes of
SamH133: durrr
SamH133: and genius
SamH133: and patrick
SamH133: and benayamine
SamH133: at anlytin less tan 50/100
SamH133: and even present
SamH133: i love wehenver i sit tough someone says im sam farha
SamH133: its totally worth it
SamH133: anyways guys gl, and watch out for that stllarbunbula creep
SamH133: who migh or might not be definetly brian townsend
System: The $2,000 Guarantee ($24+$2 NL Hold'em) will be starting in 4 minutes.
SamH133: who is so cool
SamH133: he has to play at 25/50 under a new name
SamH133: brian townsend is nobodys daddy
SamH133: gl guys

Lurker1977

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=238353

2+2 thread and a post from aejones which I think sums up why it was wrong of him to do it. But everyone who doesn't agree is entitled to their opinion. Personally, I believe the fact it is such a small player base, it gave him a huge edge versus the other regs. If an MSNL'er or a SSNL'er did it, I don't think they would be capable of exploiting the adjsutments the regs would make versus them.

aejones wrote:

I don't really get it (the direction this thread is going), so maybe there needs to be more opinion from people who play in similar games.

Genius' post scares me. I'm suddenly 4-6 tabling HU against someone at 50-1 NLHE and I find out a few weeks later it's a red pro? This would be completely ridiculous.

I don't think many of you realize the edge that is gained by someone (especially HU) while one party has all of the partial information available. There's a question that high stakes players/HU players ask each other from time to time: If you had a chance to play yourself, but you did not know you were playing you, how big of an edge would you have? The answer is completely astronomical.

I also think that the idea of him doing it for the reasons of embarrassment and not to gain an edge and get action are ridiculous. Jesus, I can't believe some of you actually buy this. If it's true, then Brian's insecurity and character issues might be more pressing than his poker issues. I mean this guy serious can't play 25-50 or 50-1? Honestly? There are like a half- dozen people in the WHOLE WORLD that are overrolled for 25-50 PLO, and I doubt he's actually one of them (although I'd certainly guess adequately rolled, even after a downswing). But by his 'cashout everything but 100k and play 25-50' rule, maybe he thinks he's super overrolled. I recently thought about cashing out everything but 100k to play 5-10, LOL, I think one of us might be a bit dilusioned!

I dunno, I was trying so hard to stay out of this thread but I keep getting bored and coming back to it, and it's tilting the **** out of me from the silence to the apology to the link to the CR front page to the acceptance of the apology.

Everyone accepting his apology needs to realize: there's nothing else he could have done. Point blank, he could not have denied it, it was way too obvious. He was the one that was stupid enough to play in games with such small player pools on a different account (and against regulars, nonetheless), and apparently his apology is going to wipe the slate clean ("since other people have done it, ldo").

I'd like to know where I can pick up my Samaritan of the Year award for playing on only my own account at all times, and 12 tabling against no one who will give me action. I guess I was mistaken that this was common practice.

Ste05

cuterob wrote: »

he tried to grind back up his roll by playing at 25/50 omaha under a different name to save speculation of him being broke but lost 180k doing it anyway.. then someone outed him in on fulltilt chat one night probably drunk.. he's been banned from fulltilt for 6 months

AFAIK, he hasn't been banned from FT, just had his Red Pro status revoked for 6 months. (This would mean when he plays he doesn't get the hourly rate of $35 + 100% RB)

TBH, I'm shocked Townsend did this.

CourierCollie

Ste05 wrote: »

AFAIK, he hasn't been banned from FT, just had his Red Pro status revoked for 6 months. (This would mean when he plays he doesn't get the hourly rate of $35 + 100% RB)

TBH, I'm shocked Townsend did this.

Breaking news 'Poker Player Cheats!'
Tune in later for the revelation that 'Oil and Water Don't Mix'. Weather report: 'Rain expected to be wet.'

Tight Ted

CourierCollie wrote: »

Breaking news 'Poker Player Cheats!'
Tune in later for the revelation that 'Oil and Water Don't Mix'. Weather report: 'Rain expected to be wet.'

CourierCollie is correct. It seems to me that a lot of pro poker players live up to the sterotype of being crooked ol'dogs. Even guys like Townsend who have the funds and the ability to play the game fairly and squarely.

I'm not saying all poker pros are dishonest but here's another example of a player who you think could afford to act honestly pulling one over on his "friend".

http://www.thehendonmob.com/ram_vaswani/putting_the_record_straight

cuterob

CourierCollie wrote: »

Breaking news 'Poker Player Cheats!'
Tune in later for the revelation that 'Oil and Water Don't Mix'. Weather report: 'Rain expected to be wet.'

i know??!!!? crazy right??? but if you don't wanna hear about poker related topics don't visit a poker forum.

ste05 you could be right as regards only his red pro staus being taken away

CourierCollie

cuterob wrote: »

i know??!!!? crazy right??? but if you don't wanna hear about poker related topics don't visit a poker forum.

ste05 you could be right as regards only his red pro staus being taken away

Sorry, I was in a bad mood when I posted that. But basically I was surprised at ste05's shock. I certainly wasn't shocked, perhaps a little surprised/disappointed.

Ste05

CourierCollie wrote: »

Sorry, I was in a bad mood when I posted that. But basically I was surprised at ste05's shock. I certainly wasn't shocked, perhaps a little surprised/disappointed.

Well it was based solely on who he is, and it's not the fact that he's a Poker player, I had an amazing level of respect for Townsend and what he has accomplished in his life, not only in Poker but also in Business by getting heavily involved in Cardrunners, and for him to do what, albeit not the worst crime he could commit, was so stupid, and it did shock me that he was involved in this. I think the only person who would have shocked me more would have been if Taylor Caby did this, I would personally consider Caby and Townsend more as entrepeneurs now then Poker players, and hence my shock.

Although, I wouldn't exactly see any huge gap between shock and suprise, but I don't really see the need to be disappointed in him TBH, I don't really care what he does with his life.

Dave147

He's actually a good personal friend of a friend of mine, and this is the first I've heard of this. Never met him but always enjoyed reading his blog. It's dishonest but I wouldn't go to the extreme of hating the guy for it. He also lives about 10 minutes away from where I'm living at the moment.

cardshark202

He cheated. /End thread

phantom_lord

cardshark202 wrote: »

He cheated. /End thread

yup. i'm surprised so many people think it was ok.

CHD

cardshark202 wrote: »

He cheated. /End thread

.

thedini

Dave147 wrote: »

He's actually a good personal friend of a friend of mine, and this is the first I've heard of this. Never met him

?:rolleyes:

mick84

Lads he took thousands of dollars from people. He's not sound. He like any other thief. Should be banned from the game and all the live tournaments for at least 3 to 5 years.

If someone took € 100 from you cheating you would lose it , same principle applies here.

The people he was playing against got cheated by a full tilt pro.
Thats 100% wrong.

bohsman

He didnt cheat, he broke the t&cs, it wouldnt even have been breaking the t&cs on most networks.

thedini

bohsman wrote: »

He didnt cheat, he broke the t&cs, it wouldnt even have been breaking the t&cs on most networks.

what networks? and i don't mean skins

bohsman

iPoker, crypto, entraction and boss to name a few while cake and party allow regular name changes,

thedini

can u change your name on paddypower for example? i didn't realise u could?

bohsman

thedini wrote: »

can u change your name on paddypower for example? i didn't realise u could?

No, but there is nothing to stop you moving to a different skin - the network have nothing against it. Microgaming make players keep the same name even if they move to a different skin.

nicnicnic

Isaac Haxton talks about the issue here, non abe related


http://www.cardplayer.com/tv/15-the-scoop/33343

Yabbadimday

bohsman wrote: »

iPoker, crypto, entraction and boss to name a few while cake and party allow regular name changes,

ipoker and crypto both allow different screennames on different skins,this is both transparent and allowed.
Cake and party have a policy of allowing screen name changes on the same account ie the old screenname is 'killed off' so to speak,again this is transparent.

The difference with stars and FT is that they have a supposedly strict one acc per player rule and this is hugely different from ipoker,crypto et al in that this is what the players on these sites expect. The guys that played against his new stellarnebullar account have a right to feel cheated

I don't buy the whole embarassment factor in prompting Townsend to play under a different name at the lowly 25/50 level,it reeks of bulls**t and is a ridiculous carry on from a man in his position.
Remember this guy is a businessman and his reputation should be of the upmost importance to him for the sake of his business and his partners.

bohsman

Stars certainly arent strict, was it not common knowledge that the Dutch pros were sharing an account a few years back to win the tlb.

Yabbadimday

bohsman wrote: »

Stars certainly arent strict, was it not common knowledge that the Dutch pros were sharing an account a few years back to win the tlb.

Try opening a new stars account and you'll see how strict they are.

Were they also not strict enough to confiscate a million bucks from a guy playing on a different account?

Lurker1977

It was widely accepted (up until about last year afaik) within HSNL that players were sharing accounts. But there was a lot of hulabaloo about it and one red pro on FT got fired and his account closed. Since then its been frowned upon.

But what ever way people want to dress it up, BT knowingly set up other accounts to play other players where his reads gave him a HUGE edge versus them. Look at Gordo16's blog, he clearly said that had he known it was BT he was playing then his style would have changed versus him instead of him thinking it was a random donk. BT surreptitiously set up new accounts for the purpose of playing guys he would have an edge against at HSNL for personal gain. Its cheating as far as I'm concerned.

It was mentioned elsewhere that people who had original FT accounts and attempted to set up a 2nd one to use for rakeback when it became available on FT had their accounts shutdown within 3 days. Yet BT got away with it for quite some time. Turning a blind eye perhaps?

BobSloane

What he did was wrong but he's still not as evil as this guy:rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEmU59ifUog

bohsman

Yabbadimday wrote: »

Were they also not strict enough to confiscate a million bucks from a guy playing on a different account?

He was playing on 2 accounts+ in the same tournament, completely different.

This the blog you're talking about Lurker? Robbed from DannyDiamonds post on the badbeat thread robbed from 2+2.

Such is my life. I sit on 15 tables alone trying to bumhunt a bunch of horrible little fishies hunched over my computer screen waiting with drool pouring out of my mouth jerking off to japanese porn calling up my fat little friends to brag about how balling out of control I am while I blog about my monthly profits then say NA NOT RIGHT NOW when someone that might be better than me tries to play me. Then I continue to wait while tellin that guy I just denied how good he is and respect him then I get back to my daily activities jerk off another time then upload the pics from my previous night where I was wearing a piss stained t-shirt out at the bar with my white homeboys throwing up gangster gang signs hitting on ugly fat bitches (yeah I banged one for 200 ship it playa playa u ma boi) with my phat ass bling bling necklace that matches my ****ing braces. Hell Yeah I'm blingin. Just bought this new sick diamond studded rolex too I'm one of the best online players now when I play live I let everyone know just how good I am. Look at me and my phat stax, how dare you get that much money in preflop with 42 suited thats just not enough equity bro where'd you learn how to play? Anyways I'll pass on the KJ offsuit preflop cause I'm probably dominated and I know better. Can't **** with me ballaz. Oh **** I just doubled up and coincidentally my supermodel hot girlfriend just called guys so I gotta go bang her. Playas gotta play BOIS!!! Whats this Townsend playing on multiple ID's? THATS ****ING BLASPHEMY. How dare he abuse the rules like that I lost ****ing 3 buyins to him that one day. You know how many weeks I had to sit there drooling all over myself waiting for some fishies to join to earn those buyins? Well atleast I knew to sit out after 30 minutes of play. I deserve my money back! What a ****ing cheater! If I knew that was you I would have been able to play vs U much better cause I've watched all ur videos on cardrunners, and CTS taught me how to four bet ur ass but I didn't think I had fold equity cuz I thought u were a fish and I was just gunna bum hunt and grind aces until u stack off light with AKo cuz ur just a big dumb fish and only donkies do that ****. O well I'll just buy some more bling and fly to thailand where the womans really want my hot ****. Oh hell yeah bois keep playin playaz.

Yabbadimday

bohsman wrote: »

He was playing on 2 accounts+ in the same tournament, completely different.

Slightly different,agreed and this is from gordos blog that i think Lurker1977 was alluding to(that other quote is very funny though)-

"As a short aside, I have been asked by a lot of people recently what I think about aba’s apology and all of the facts surrounding his multi-accounting. I will say that I think he has been unfairly made out as a scapegoat for the issue simply as a consequence of his stature in the poker industry. At the same time, as I stated in a 2p2 post on the issue, he did tell me in person in Vegas over the summer that he wasn’t makersmark66, etc and that some guy thought it would be funny to list Santa Barbara as the location, etc etc. While he did call me to apologize before everything ‘hit the fan,’ so to say (which was a nice gesture that I greatly appreciate), I just, frankly, hate being lied to. I understand that he was slightly embarrassed about playing lower stakes, and that the anonymity of another account was probably a great motivational tool to become more proficient at PLO, but as it directly concerns me, I was obviously pretty pissed about the whole thing as I had a pretty great record against his aba account but lost fairly significantly to the makersmark66 name. To be fair on this point, however, Brian logged a statistically insignificant number of hands against me HU under his new accounts and there is a very high probability that he is just simply a more solid 6max player than me and this wholly accounts for the differences in win/loss between the two accounts. So in conclusion, I personally, a player in the games and someone that logged a ton of HU vs. Brian, am a little disenchanted by the whole controversy and am starting to think that everything about this business is tinged with corruption (that’s the downswing speaking there, folks haha) but at the same time, think that the fury that this whole deal has stirred up is too much and not entirely fair to Brian, who obviously isn’t the first person to have used multiple accounts online. If you guys are interested in reading more on the issue, a lot of people, many of whom are far more educated and passionate about the issue, have had a lot to say on the 2p2 forums. This was personally the first and last time that I will publicly mention this again. Thanks for reading." http://blogs.cardrunners.com/gordo16...ake-1219975663

Lurker1977

Yup, thats the one Yabba.

Chucky the tree

The worst thing I thought was the token $25k charity donation, at least stump up a full buy-in ffs.

Lurker1977

Im sure the people that it helps won't see it as a token. Tbh he could have just held his hands up and said sorry. Does anybody know if FT are redistributing any winnings or is it just a slap on the wrist?

cuterob

Lurker1977 wrote: »

Does anybody know if FT are redistributing any winnings or is it just a slap on the wrist?

he lost 180k doing it

Tight Ted

BobSloane wrote: »

What he did was wrong but he's still not as evil as this guy:rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEmU59ifUog

Or this guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MN1HCuoQU_Q

zap27

Are people mainly upset because he was a pro and duping the little guy or are you saying that multi accounts on the same networks is frowned upon/not allowed?

I have an account on Pacific and have done for a good while and came across LuckyAcePoker.com fairly recently. Signed up for it to get the bonus and realised its the same network as pacific. I'm no shark or anything but is this practice frowned upon? If they found out it was me with the 2 accounts would I get banned?

Are there certain networks that definitely don't allow multi-accounts on different skins?

bohsman

Stars and Full Tilt dont have seperate skins and 2 accounts on the same site arent allowed. Microgaming make you keep the same username even if you change skin.

Hectorjelly

i think 25k is plenty considering he already lost 180k

phantom_lord

Hectorjelly wrote: »

i think 25k is plenty considering he already lost 180k

did he actually say he lost 180k? i haven't looked at the 2+2 thread since he wrote his apology but i thought he lost 180k at taking shots at nosebleeds according to that high stakes database site, and that he won a bunch at 25/50, and so at worst would be b/e on that sn?

Yabbadimday

[nicK] wrote: »

heh, i guess there should be a point to my post..

bt did cheat according to the rules.. he finally recognised it and apologised

He obviously recognised he was cheating before he started playing on his new account,I think 'got caught' would be a more accurate term.