GAA Mythbusters

cruiserweight

I am sure that most of you have seen Mythbusters. If you haven't is an television program on the Discovery Channel starring two American special effects experts, who use basic elements of the scientific method to test the validity of various rumors, urban legends, myths and news stories in popular culture.

This thread is to discuss some of the popular misconceptions and myths that exist in the GAA e.g. "Ulster teams play rubbish football" or "Kerry v Dublin is a big football rivalry". I will get the ball rolling and hope this doesn't descend into a flame war.

Ulster teams play puke football
There are loads of talented teams from Ulster. In recent years Armagh and Tyrone in particular have gained a reputation for playing unattractive football. Both do sometimes when they need to, but both teams also can play attractive football and have loads of quality players. For example Tyrone gave a display of good football against Dublin this year, Armagh v Tyrone in 2005 and Tyrone v Kerry in 2005 were good high quality games.

Kerry v Dublin is a big football rivalry
(I am paraphrasing some of a post from Aidan here)Dublin may have 22 All-Irelands and Kerry 35, so it would seem that they would be keen rivals, the media portray it that way sometimes. However, Dublin have only won 8 All-Irelands have been won in the last 80 odd years. 14 of them won before the 1920s when the team was composed mainly of country cousins. Kerry have about 25 in the same period, so this Kerry-Dublin stuff is only based around the Micko-Heffo years, and even then Kerry beat Dublin in most of those games, even hammering them by 17 points one year.

Kerry win soft All-Irelands
Any all-ireland win is hard to win. Most years Kerry have to play Cork who are far from an easy team to beat. In olden times if Kerry got out of Munster tehy would then have to beat 2 provincial champions to win the All Ireland. Nowadays it is 3 other teams if they get out of Munster and more if they get beaten. Sure we all know that in reality the Kerry players only train for a half an hour a couple of times a week. They go out on the lash every weekend and only head up to Dublin on the night before the final and fall out of Coppers at 4am.

Yavvy

All false....

Next Myth..
Wexford got a soft route to the AI Semi final...

aidan24326

cruiserweight wrote: »

Kerry win soft All-Irelands
Any all-ireland win is hard to win. Most years Kerry have to play Cork who are far from an easy team to beat. In olden times if Kerry got out of Munster they would then have to beat 2 provincial champions to win the All Ireland. Nowadays it is 3 other teams if they get out of Munster and more if they get beaten. Sure we all know that in reality the Kerry players only train for a half an hour a couple of times a week. They go out on the lash every weekend and only head up to Dublin on the night before the final and fall out of Coppers at 4am.

It's funny alright that an All-Ireland is only ever 'soft' when Kerry win it. Their wins in 04/06 against Mayo were seen as handy All-Irelands but no other team would have hammered Mayo the way Kerry did. Mayo weren't bad as such they were just blown away by a team at the top of their game.


Another popular myth that was doing the rounds for a while was that my own county Galway had a great forward line and a dodgy defence. It was lazily trotted out by every journo in town but the reality was not so straightforward.

In the years 2006 and 2007 when this myth was most popular Galway actually had the best (2006) and second best (2007) defensive record in the country in those year's leagues, playing in divison 1, while at the other end our much-heralded forwards were misfiring badly. Managing only 1-8 against Mayo in a Connaught final and 0-10 against Westmeath in a qualifier defeat.

This year though the forwards played much better which can be put down to Liam Sammon's more direct style of football, a style which much better suits players like Meehan and Joyce.

CyberDave

The myth that Galway hurlers are genuine All-Ireland contenders every year, after a good run in the league and a 6/7 week layoff before they play their first competitive game in the championship.

The myth that one day they might actually convert underage success into senior success.

aidan24326

CyberDave wrote: »

The myth that Galway hurlers are genuine All-Ireland contenders every year, after a good run in the league and a 6/7 week layoff before they play their first competitive game in the championship.

The myth that one day they might actually convert underage success into senior success.

Sadly that is now just a myth. Apart from the 1980s we've never been serious contenders, and probably got to a few lucky finals in the past due to being allowed straight in at semi final stage. We might just have the most overrated hurling team around, who promise much but consistently fail to deliver.

CyberDave

aidan24326 wrote: »

Sadly that is now just a myth. Apart from the 1980s we've never been serious contenders, and probably got to a few lucky finals in the past due to being allowed straight in at semi final stage. We might just have the most overrated hurling team around, who promise much but consistently fail to deliver.

So, I am correct in saying it's a myth!

VH

CyberDave wrote: »

The myth that Galway hurlers are genuine All-Ireland contenders every year

Not as frequent or as glaring, but the same is said about their footballers from time to time

aidan24326

VH wrote: »

Not as frequent or as glaring, but the same is said about their footballers from time to time

But that is based on a real tradition going back through the years. And in any case Galway are frequent contenders in football, and most years would at least be in that group of teams who could be considered to have an outside chance.

jebuz

I heard someone say once that Kilkenny are out of this world, this suggests, and I've said it before that the Kilkenny hurler are all robots. Anybody care to dispel this myth?

NicheG

jebuz wrote: »

I heard someone say once that Kilkenny are out of this world, this suggests, and I've said it before that the Kilkenny hurler are all robots. Anybody care to dispel this myth?

I seriously don't think they are robots. There is a chink in this Kilkenny team in that I don't think they have as near a good forward line as they had 2003-2005.
Before any Deise supporters start rubbing their hands; the comaprison would be that I think the 03-05 team would beat this current Waterford team by 12-16 points; wheras the current Kilkenny team I think will probably beat them by 7-9 points.

So maybe they are robots???

cruiserweight

A few other myths about the current Wexford football team

- Wexford are just Mattie Forde and 14 others.
- Wexford haven't won this year: Meath, Laois, Down and Armagh have lost.
- The only significant result Wexford should be judged by this year is the only game they lost.

Flukey

cruiserweight wrote: »

Wexford are Mattie Forde and 14 others.

If that is not the case then they've either got too many or too few players on the pitch at any time.

As to Kerry and Dublin, there is a lot more to their rivalry than the 1970s, both before and after. The 1970s was the most highest profile part of it, but not the only part of it. Due to television it has got very high profile coverage at the time and through to the present day. Heffo and Micko were at the centre of it then, but in days when we didn't get much televised football the two of them met as players. A lot of their rivalry has it roots in that. Go further back even before their playing years, and rivalries existed. Dublin may have less success, but it is still a big rivalry and a very long one. In the same way, Kerry have dominated their rivalry with Cork, but you'd still call it a great rivalry.

CyberDave

cruiserweight wrote: »

- Wexford are Mattie Forde and 14 others.

That isn't a myth, it's a fact.
Mattie Forde + 14 other players = Wexford team/15 players

Maybe you meant the myth is that Wexford are Mattie Forde?

cruiserweight

Flukey wrote: »

If that is not the case then they've either got too many or too few players on the pitch at any time.

As to Kerry and Dublin, there is a lot more to their rivalry than the 1970s, both before and after. The 1970s was the most highest profile part of it, but not the only part of it. Due to television it has got very high profile coverage at the time and through to the present day. Heffo and Micko were at the centre of it then, but in days when we didn't get much televised football the two of them met as players. A lot of their rivalry has it roots in that. Go further back even before their playing years, and rivalries existed. Dublin may have less success, but it is still a big rivalry and a very long one. In the same way, Kerry have dominated their rivalry with Cork, but you'd still call it a great rivalry.

CyberDave wrote: »

That isn't a myth, it's a fact.
Mattie Forde + 14 other players = Wexford team/15 players

Maybe you meant the myth is that Wexford are Mattie Forde?

Edited now. Yes the common myth would be that Mattie Forde is the only good footballer that Wexford have and that we would be nowhere without him :rolleyes:

CyberDave

cruiserweight wrote: »

Edited now. Yes the common myth would be that Mattie Forde is the only good footballer that Wexford have and that we would be nowhere without him :rolleyes:

Jeez! We are sticklers for details on here.

Pride Fighter

Ulster has a county that has won an All Ireland in hurling.

Who are they, you ask.

The answer is
















































London.

cruiserweight

Pride Fighter wrote: »

Ulster has a county that has won an All Ireland in hurling.

Who are they, you ask.

The answer is

London.

I am pretty sure that they were not playing in the Ulster championship when they won that they were not playing in Ulster

premierstone

cruiserweight wrote: »

I am pretty sure that they were not playing in the Ulster championship when they won that they were not playing in Ulster

I'm pretty sure London is'nt a ''county'' either

Rowley Birkin QC

Kilkenny don't play a "match" until late August.

Meath are dirty.


Discuss.

sslazio11

Flukey wrote: »

If that is not the case then they've either got too many or too few players on the pitch at any time.

As to Kerry and Dublin, there is a lot more to their rivalry than the 1970s, both before and after. The 1970s was the most highest profile part of it, but not the only part of it. Due to television it has got very high profile coverage at the time and through to the present day. Heffo and Micko were at the centre of it then, but in days when we didn't get much televised football the two of them met as players. A lot of their rivalry has it roots in that. Go further back even before their playing years, and rivalries existed. Dublin may have less success, but it is still a big rivalry and a very long one. In the same way, Kerry have dominated their rivalry with Cork, but you'd still call it a great rivalry.

I was thinking to myself the other day that Kerry-Dublin was a great rivalry, and then I realised that Dublin haven't beaten Kerry in a championship game since 1977!

Kerry beat them in the final in 1978, 1979, 1984 and 1985. They beat them in the quarter-finals in 2001 and 2004. And, of course, last year's semi-final.

It's a great occasion when Kerry play Dublin, and everyone gets nostalgic, but it's 7-0 over the last 30 years. That's not a rivalry of any kind, much less great.

Jugs82

Myth - Leinster Hurling is Dead

Offaly beat Limerick and put it up to Waterford
Wexford were unlucky against Waterford

Its just that Kilkenny are so damn good at the moment!

Pride Fighter

Jugs82 wrote: »

Myth - Leinster Hurling is Dead

Offaly beat Limerick and put it up to Waterford
Wexford were unlucky against Waterford

Its just that Kilkenny are so damn good at the moment!

You forgot to mention Dublin being within a score of Cork for 69 minutes and losing by only 5 points. And we nearly beat Wexford as well.

Flukey

Sslazio11, one team can dominate pairings that are still great rivalries. Kerry beat Cork far more often than they lose to them, but it is still a great rivalry. With both Cork and Dublin, Kerry have had many great matches over the years, and a lot of them have given a high quality of football and have been close. Kerry won last Sunday, but it was some match, as was the draw the previous week and the Munster final. There is a lot more to a rivalry than the total matches that each team has won. You also have to remember there is more to Kerry and Dublin than their championship meetings and Dublin have beaten them in the league since 1977.

03642151

bigkev49 wrote: »

Kilkenny don't play a "match" until late August.

Meath are dirty.


Discuss.

fact meath are filthy had some good footballers too but had serious cynical streak

flyingwing

You actually CAN hop the ball when its raining.

03642151

no its crazy to hop a ball when its raining a mark of a poor footballing brain

Culchie

Mythbuster :> When you take your points, the goals don't always come:D

thirdmantackle

Towards the end of a match a wide is as good as a score

since when??

homerjay2005

thirdmantackle wrote: »

Towards the end of a match a wide is as good as a score

since when??

can be true. sean sullivans effort in the drawn game v cork proves this point. the ball going dead kills the ball and means you can return to positions and regroup for one last assault.

eagle eye

cruiserweight wrote: »

Edited now. Yes the common myth would be that 1. Mattie Forde is the only good footballer that Wexford have and 2.that we would be nowhere without him :rolleyes:

1. Wexford have plenty of good footballers but only one great one

2. You are not nearly as good a team without a fit Mattie Forde.

cruiserweight

eagle eye wrote: »

1. Wexford have plenty of good footballers but only one great one

2. You are not nearly as good a team without a fit Mattie Forde.

Even on the mythbusters thread people are buying into the lazy analysis of the Wexford team

aidan24326

Jugs82 wrote: »

Myth - Leinster Hurling is Dead

Offaly beat Limerick and put it up to Waterford
Wexford were unlucky against Waterford

Its just that Kilkenny are so damn good at the moment!

I think that might be a fair point alright. Everyone talks of Wexford and Offaly going back alot but maybe they're not that far off where they were before. Kilkenny are too good for pretty much everyone right now, even brushing Cork aside, and they would probably be dominating the Munster Championship aswell if they were in it.

cruiserweight wrote: »

Even on the mythbusters thread people are buying into the lazy analysis of the Wexford team

I think most observers would agree that Wexford are not as dependent on Mattie Forde as they used to be, though Forde is still the key man (as he would be in most teams to be fair)

But the likes of Redmond Barry and Ciaran Lyng really stepped up to the mark this year.

flyingwing

03642151 wrote: »

no its crazy to hop a ball when its raining a mark of a poor footballing brain

What an outrageous statement. It all depends on how you bounce it. A sign of a poor footballing brain would be someone bouncing the ball forwards and expecting to come onto it at pace as would happen in normal conditions. With this technique it will always skid away. Bounce it hard and down and it will come right back up, regardless of the rain. A muddy pitch is another situation altogether.

RSF Cill Dara

what is he talking about sure ciaran lying is one of the most talented footballers in the country + colim morris is a great player

K-9

cruiserweight wrote: »

Even on the mythbusters thread people are buying into the lazy analysis of the Wexford team

They did pretty well in the 2nd half without him! Though I wonder could a fully fit Mattie have been the difference? There is a tendency to concentrate on a star player when he's there, eg. Paddy Bradley and Derry.

Pride Fighter

You have to congratulate Wexford. About 7 years ago they were pretty much nowhere in Football and you would say they are a hurling lot down there. Now they are reaching AI Semi's in both codes 07 in the hurling and this year in the footy. The county board must be doing a good job and they are an example to all counties that are weak in one sport and good in another. Kilkenny could take a leaf out of their book regarding football and the weaker hurling counties should do the same but in reverse.

aidan24326

Kilkenny will never have a competitive football team as there's just no interest in football in that county, the will to do it isn't there.

machiavellianme

NicheG wrote: »

I seriously don't think they are robots. There is a chink in this Kilkenny team in that I don't think they have as near a good forward line as they had 2003-2005.
Before any Deise supporters start rubbing their hands; the comaprison would be that I think the 03-05 team would beat this current Waterford team by 12-16 points; wheras the current Kilkenny team I think will probably beat them by 7-9 points.

So maybe they are robots???

Hmmm, so beating them by 23 points means does what for this myth?