Why are Irish People so Unhealthy?

WindSock

Thought it would be more appropriate to post in this forum, but feel free to move.

I know people in this forum are interested and making a genuine effort to eat more healthily, but I was wondering why we, as a society in general are so unhealthy? I am comparing ourselves to most other european countries (Except any of the UK :P) the people that I have come across from Sweden, Germany, Spain etc, mostly seem to have healthy enough diets and look fantastic, whereas Irish people generally look run down and seem to be sick a lot. Sorry for the generalisations but I was just wondering why lots of us seem to have really crap diets.

g'em

Going to move this into Fitness where it might get a better (and probably more heated!!) response

yomchi

Education education education.

3 simlple words.

Oh and Americanisation too
Ireland used to be a unique land with it's own culture, now we've prostituted ourselves out to more 'interesting' cultures, we are heavily influenced by American culture, Macdonalds, Starbucks, heavy carb foods, and a couch potatoe mentallity. Combine that with our post colonial drinking habits and bobs your uncle and mary's your aunt.

Gillo

I think there's a certain amount of ignorance people I've spoken to just don't have a clue about healthy diet, I know it was never mentioned once to me in school (did LC in 1996, maybe it's changed). There's also the don't care attitude, which to a certain degree I am guilty off people know about healthy eating and exercise, but don't care about it to a certain degree I know I am guilty, I hit the gym on average four times a week (target is five) but I let myself down on the diet side, I try to eat healthily but sometime time and convenience take over other times I just don't care.

I also think (time for the sterotype) don't seem to care, I know a lot of it is said in just over in BG&RH but have a look at the lifestyle that's getting promated, again a lot of people I've met over the years seem to be measured by the amount of drink they can hold "sure, he's a great man, can go sixteen pints a night no problem. The Celtic tiger didn't help either with most people working as long as hard as they could, power lunch as a BLT and a latte, anyone leaving the office to go to the gym was a slacker.

My opinion, TBH mod's I've love to see this moved again, perhaps to AH where it is now, it's gonna be one sided I'd love to hear the opinions of the "unhealthy people" it's pretty much a given that anyone in this forum will be above the average health levels of the country.

Diamondmaker

Jon I totally disagree we were never an outdoors or healthy nation long before the Americanisation you mention.

Deedsie

Were we not an almost completely agricultural society not so long ago. Usually carried out outdoors? Ive gotten a tan this summer in Ireland believe it or not from just being out running. Imagine if the sun was shinging?

I think we are starting to improve though.

Fatloss08

bad weather is depressing and when most people depressed they comfort eat

when its roasting out , people do be out and eat less

well i do when its hot

ntlbell

because of our lack luster attitude to just about everything?

fitness just happens to fall into everything

hunnymonster

I don't think the German diet is particularly healthy. Lots of fatty meat, refined carbs, alcohol and "Kuchen"! Ok they do include more nuts and fruit than the Irish but their saving grace is that exercise is encouraged.

thirtyfoot

When you have a general media and then public that regard the majority of our olympians as no-hopers and wasters of tax-payers money how in earth are we ever going to get to a situation where the general media and then public will accept the required resources to be put into sports and recreation, PE in schools etc that in turn will ensure that most of the population will naturally lead healthy lives and won't have to be educated when they get older. For me, the way to a healthy nation is through sport.

Roper

I'm just back from France and everyone smokes like a chimney, have coffee, chocolate bread and cheese for breakfast and have wine at lunchtime. I'm not being stereotypical there that's honestly what I saw. That being said, car ownership is fairly low, public transport is great and portions aren't stacked as high as an elephants eye. Without extreme levels of observation on my part, beer bellys and lard seemed to be fairly uncommon.

I think as a nation we love the idea of sport and exercise but not the reality. We don't have sporting culture although we love to think that we do. Sports clubs are utterly dependent on fundraising and if you're a minority sport then get out the begging bowl, cos the government will give you pittance unless you have the words GAA, Soccer or Rugby in your title. Exercise isn't ingrained in us as something that we do for the love of it, although I think that's been changing in the last few years.

g'em

Gillo wrote: »

My opinion, TBH mod's I've love to see this moved again, perhaps to AH where it is now, it's gonna be one sided I'd love to hear the opinions of the "unhealthy people" it's pretty much a given that anyone in this forum will be above the average health levels of the country.

I think it'll do just fine here for the moment.

This is one of those really, really interesting, but ultimately unending debates - it has no clear cut answer, it all depends of who's doing the answering and there's little reliable data to support any side. Even still, personal observations go a long way towards making for an good discussion. Admittedly you'll find the answers here somewhat skewed given the nature of the forum, but it's not true to say that 'anyone' here is above the average health level - it's a discussion about Irish health in general.

Even thought the OP has outline healthy eating in the question, nutrition and fitness are not mutually exclusive in a person's quest for better health.

So what's the cause of our ill-'fitness' -

Lack of education? There's plenty of perfectly healthy people in countries without top-notch nutritional education programs

Lack of healthy food? There's healthy, wholesome food in virtually every food outlet now, you can't use that old chestnut anymore.

We're eating ok but it's the lack of exercise to blame? This may have some merit. We ate more calories per person per day in the eighties thanks to the new launch of frozen and processed foods yet we were still slimmer and weighed less on average than we do now primarily because we burned on average 500 cals more per day through physical activities (more walking, more public transport, more cycling).

Macha

Well Norway is not known for having the best weather. Oslo is under snow for about 3 months of the year & spring and autumn can be as miserable as here. But 80% of Oslovites (if that's a word..) have membership to a gym. And having lived there, I can tell you that they all go.

Weather makes it easier but it really isn't an excuse.

g'em

Roper wrote: »

I'm just back from France...

Me too! What part?

Roper wrote:

...and everyone smokes like a chimney, have coffee, chocolate bread and cheese for breakfast and have wine at lunchtime. I'm not being stereotypical there that's honestly what I saw. That being said, car ownership is fairly low, public transport is great and portions aren't stacked as high as an elephants eye. Without extreme levels of observation on my part, beer bellys and lard seemed to be fairly uncommon.

I saw the very same thing. Every household buys fresh white bread every morning from the bakery, croissants are eaten en masse and alcohol is a part of every meal. But at the same time it's all very much moderated and alongside all of that traditionally "oh noez, holy insulin spike!!" food you can buy fresh strawberries, blueberries, raspberries, tropical (for Ireland) fruit, fresh veg and a huge variety of dairy for a fraction of the price as here. The locals all seemed very active, lots of cycling, gardening, and spending all day outdoors.

Roper

taconnol wrote: »

But 80% of Oslovites (if that's a word..) have membership to a gym. And having lived there, I can tell you that they all go.

Weather makes it easier but it really isn't an excuse.

I think they refer to themselves as Oslovushiusveriers... flurgen.

as you all probably know I run an indoor sport and if it rains, I get less people, if it's sunny, I get less people, if it's cold, you guessed it, less people. The best weather for me is slightly overcast. Then my classes will be packed.

If you are waiting on weather in Ireland to do anything then yu'll be waiting a looooong time.

Roper

g'em wrote: »

Me too! What part?
I saw the very same thing. Every household buys fresh white bread every morning from the bakery, croissants are eaten en masse and alcohol is a part of every meal. But at the same time it's all very much moderated and alongside all of that traditionally "oh noez, holy insulin spike!!" food you can buy fresh strawberries, blueberries, raspberries, tropical (for Ireland) fruit, fresh veg and a huge variety of dairy for a fraction of the price as here. The locals all seemed very active, lots of cycling, gardening, and spending all day outdoors.

I was in La Rochelle and the surrounding areas. Where were you? Where we were it was all seafood and actually very little veg at all. We went to friends of mine over there and they were saying that things like carrots, broccoli and the like aren't really in their local diet although you can get them.

Macha

Roper wrote: »

I think they refer to themselves as Oslovushiusveriers... flurgen.

Ah yes. How could I forget? :pac:

g'em

Roper wrote: »

I was in La Rochelle and the surrounding areas. Where were you? Where we were it was all seafood and actually very little veg at all. We went to friends of mine over there and they were saying that things like carrots, broccoli and the like aren't really in their local diet although you can get them.

No way, I flew into La Rochelle and then you drive about an hour south to Pons just beyond Saines/ SW of Cognac - La Rochelle is gorgeous.

Yup, seafood is a big staple over there and it's delicious and cheap - a huuuuuge bowl of mussels for €9 w00t!! - very little in the way of good quality meat, some chicken (expensive) and pork (reasonable) but the beef and lamb is pants. You're right about the veg, I was thinking more along the lines of salad vegetables (cucumber, leaves, tomatoes, onions etc.). I completely overdid it on the bread and cheese but it was brilliant being able to have fresh berries every morning for breakfast and fresh fish each day for dinner.

Darwin

I too have returned from France (Nice) and have spent several summers there. Perhaps this is a rather simplistic view, but the consistent good weather is a big factor in people getting out and exercising. In Nice there is also easy access to a long promenade where people run, rollerblade, cycle and a warm sea for swimming. There is no necessity to go to a gym to work out. The second thing is the lack of a pub culture - sure they are fond of the wine and beer, but not to excess. I hate generalisations, but perhaps as a nation we find it difficult to be moderate in a lot of things (spending, eating, drinking, being lazy) and that's where to root of the problem lies.

fragile

The drink culture in Ireland is the source of a lot of problems, especially with regard to eating healthy and putting time aside for exercise.

hunnymonster

the car culture doesn't help either.


My mum is visiting me at the moment. Yesterday when I met her after work I suggested we get the train home. It is a fairly brisk 30 min walk from where I work to the train and it almost killed her! She learned to drive about 10 years ago and since then has stopped walking anywhere. I'm not saying walking will make you fit but it will burn a couple of calories.

Leon11

My question is what age does the drop off in regular exercise occur compared to other countries? From my friends at school the majority of them still play football. Having gone through my degree the majority of males in the class played sport. In fact I think all bar 2 played at least a team sport in addition to about 7/8 out of 15 doing the gym. Of them 3 or 4 would have taken it up through myself and one or two others pushing them to go. However when it came to girls there was a massive difference, out of the 12 in my class I know one went to the gym and was in really good shape and another danced 3-4 times a week. The rest to my knowledge didn't do any form of exercise together.

I can't remember who it was but there was a comedian saying that in Australia people will get together and do an acivity and have a few beers whilst doing it, tag football, frisbee, whatever. Here in Ireland the activity is drinking! To be honest though if someone is happy enough to spend their time drinking away to their hearts content I have no problem with it. If they're happy they're happy!

Axni

Roper wrote: »

I'm just back from France and everyone smokes like a chimney, have coffee, chocolate bread and cheese for breakfast and have wine at lunchtime. I'm not being stereotypical there that's honestly what I saw. That being said, car ownership is fairly low, public transport is great and portions aren't stacked as high as an elephants eye. Without extreme levels of observation on my part, beer bellys and lard seemed to be fairly uncommon.

Although the typical French breakfast is a veritable carb-fest, lunch and dinner tend to be more heavily weighted towards protein. Although some drink wine at lunch, most don't and there isn't the binge drinking we see here. From my own experience of living with a French family, the big diffence I noticed was that they almost never ate between meals. Snacking does not seem to be a part of their culture like it is in ours.


I think a some of the problem can be laid at the door of education. I'm shocked at what some intelligent friends of mine consider "healthy eating" to be. Admittedly it's perfectly possible to educate yourself through resouces like this forum, but I think a bit more education at school level would go a long way.

Similarly with cooking. It's not rocket science, but plenty of people I know claim to be unable to do it. I don't know whether it's laziness or a feeling that cooking is somehow "beneath" them, but the over-reliance on processed food means they often don't know what they're eating.

With regards to excercise, our weather doesn't help, but like others have said there are plenty of other countries with that problem. From a female perspective I think it's largely an attitude / laziness problem, just from my observation. There's this pervasive feeling that a lot of sports and weights are "butch" and only practiced by shemales, meaning a lot of women end up in yoga, aquarobics, pilates and step classes. Not that there's anything wrong with these, but done in isolation they wouldn't provide the benefits of plenty of other activities. I think things like Tag rugby have been a great boon in term of encouraging people to participate and see the benefits of team sports. I've tried pretty hard to explain the benefits of weight etc to my friends over the years. It falls on deaf ears so maybe it is a laziness problem

KTRIC

I'm living in Munich, Germany for the past year and I can tell you now that Germans are not healthy. At least the Bavarians aren't.

Most of the guys in the office have beer belly's and eat some serious sh!te for lunch. Most meals contain meat of some sort and they think beer is a stable food source.

c - 13

Well some of could stem from the education as others have pointed out. When I was in school we did a small bit on the food pyramid, possibly in science or something and that was the end of that. As for exercise if you weren't on the GAA/Soccer/Hockey team you had one 40 minute session of PE per week which we didnt even do most of the time.

Its changing a bit now, my sisters (ex)primary school focuses on healthy eating in the school yard and so on. Which I think is certainly a good thing but more could be done to promote people to exercise.

Its much easier to sit on your arse and stuff your face with the readily available garbage from your local spar (which are on every street corner now) than to get up and go for a walk for example. Plus people have more money in this country than they know what to do with (a big change from the 80's) so they're pouring it all into a sedentary lifestyle becasue they dont know what to do with it.

Either that or its an after effect of the famine, we're making sure we eat enough now in case it happens again.

Leon11

Axni wrote: »

Although the typical French breakfast is a veritable carb-fest, lunch and dinner tend to be more heavily weighted towards protein. Although some drink wine at lunch, most don't and there isn't the binge drinking we see here. From my own experience of living with a French family, the big diffence I noticed was that they almost never ate between meals. Snacking does not seem to be a part of their culture like it is in ours.

Lived with a french roommate abroad during the summer along with a ukranian, mexican and candians. I could not understand how they ate so little when I was around the house all day. They all did something be it gym, rollerblading/skateboarding and gymnastics. I don't know how many times I've seen my sister watch tv for 2-3hrs at a go after college, she has a gym membership yet hardly uses the thing like a lot of people I know. It's almost a ready answer when the topic of exrcise ever comes up, oh ye I'm in a gym but I've only got to use it once in the last 6 weeks because such and such came up. Such a waste of money. There's a lot of money to be made over here in the form of exercise and nutrition if the right people are targetted! Such a **** thing to say but it's true.

hunnymonster

Leon11 wrote: »

My question is what age does the drop off in regular exercise occur compared to other countries? From my friends at school the majority of them still play football.

I would say that is quite unusual. In many primary schools these days, kids are not allowed play sport at lunchtime because the school insurance doesn't cover it. Schools are scared to force kids to do PE and parents are only too happy to write notes to get them off. When I was in college (early 90's) about half of my friends do some sort of sport. the other half drank for fun

Leon11 wrote: »

If they're happy they're happy!

happy but expensive. Think how much better value we could get from the health service if we didn't have to fix all the unhealthly living problems.

fragile

I think a lot of Irish people look for the quick-fix solution to healthy eating and exercise.

I know lots of people who have gym memberships but won't even consider using the stairs at work instead of the lift, or walking to the gym instead of using the car :eek: or packing a lunch for work instead of eating the crap in supermarket delis.

Also, I have never been able to understand the fascination with English soccer that is so prevalent in Ireland! why are so many people hooked on watching a game that they have no intention of playing themselves instead of actually going out and playing a game, any game?

g'em

fragile wrote: »

I know lots of people who have gym memberships but won't even consider using the stairs at work instead of the lift, or walking to the gym instead of using the car

People using the lift to go up one or two flights of stairs in my gym is a huge pet peeve of mine, and the staff are the biggest culprits...

greenkittie

Tingle wrote: »

When you have a general media and then public that regard the majority of our olympians as no-hopers and wasters of tax-payers money how in earth are we ever going to get to a situation where the general media and then public will accept the required resources to be put into sports and recreation, PE in schools etc that in turn will ensure that most of the population will naturally lead healthy lives and won't have to be educated when they get older. For me, the way to a healthy nation is through sport.

No way, it took me years to get over the trauma of school PE and actually be fit and active again. I know i'm not alone either, a lot of people get put off exercise by school PE classes.

hunnymonster

g'em wrote: »

People using the lift to go up one or two flights of stairs in my gym is a huge pet peeve of mine, and the staff are the biggest culprits...

When I was on crutches earlier in the year, I lost count of the number of people who tried to tell me where the lift was when they met me on stairs. I know they were only doing it to be helpful but these are people who know me and know how my life works!

hunnymonster

As a spin off question to PE in schools, as a straw poll, how many people here were taught to swim in school? I was told recently that it has been on the primary school curriculum for years but most schools simply ignore it.

c - 13

hunnymonster wrote: »

As a spin off question to PE in schools, as a straw poll, how many people here were taught to swim in school? I was told recently that it has been on the primary school curriculum for years but most schools simply ignore it.

Yeah I learned through primary school (Finished secondary in 2002). They did lessons for 10 weeks each year but it was optional. I'm not a very good swimmer mind you.

hunnymonster

Several people have posted about education being the key. Ireland is certainly not the only country now to educate people about nutrition. My step-son is German and 12. He had a long holiday with us over the summer and I was surprised at just how little he knew about food. From the exercise side though, he was great with all sorts of clubs and activities open to him in school. They are also graded on their sporting efforts so it's part of the core curriculum rather than something bolted on at the end.

Macha

Actually I think the schools thing is more relevant than the weather. I went to primary school abroad and we did sport every day. Bussed it out to a nearby pool, tennis, netball, rollerblading. We even had a mini-Olympic games every year that involved loads of silly non-sports like sliding along a wet piece of tarpaulin.

In Ireland, it's just the ususal: oh it's hockey season. oh it's cross-country season. No imagination. Plus by the time I got into 6th year it had descended into us doing aerobics videos in the gym. What a disaster.

Roper

At the moment I'm working with a very innovative school (my old one as it happens, luckily there is no "permament record!" Liars!) and they have a really interesting TY programme. I'm on board for 15 weeks doing martial arts, another woman does dance (and indeed they HAVE to go and do a dancing competition at the end of the year with a local girls school!) and then there's climbing, swimming and I believe they've had lots of minority sports over the years as well. This school also has great athletics, GAA and Hurling teams, which it did when I went there too. So there's a massive background in sports which they've kept, but they've also branched out.

Reyman

It's all to do with exercise! I read somewhere (reference mislaid) that 12 year old boys in the 1960s consumed 50% more calories than they do now but were far fitter, had practically zero fat levels and were over a stone lighter than now.

I have never met someone who exercises hard and is fat !! It seems everyone is stuck in front of either a TV or a computer every night eating crisps, etc. instead of getting out and playing football, walking, running etc.

ntlbell

hunnymonster wrote: »

As a spin off question to PE in schools, as a straw poll, how many people here were taught to swim in school? I was told recently that it has been on the primary school curriculum for years but most schools simply ignore it.

We started in 1st class i think 1985/86 I think it was about 3 pounds for a term

Roper

Reyman wrote: »

It's all to do with exercise! I read somewhere (reference mislaid) that 12 year old boys in the 1960s consumed 50% more calories than they do now but were far fitter, had practically zero fat levels and were over a stone lighter than now.

I have never met someone who exercises hard and is fat !! It seems everyone is stuck in front of either a TV or a computer every night eating crisps, etc. instead of getting out and playing football, walking, running etc.

Well I believe you have struck the nail on the head .

I don't think any of you know me personally but I eat an awful lot of crap. I wouldn't recommend my diet to anyone. I have 3 or 4 really good meals every day and in between I eat foods from the caramelised group, the refined flour group, the chocolate group (lots of that), the biscuit group and actually come to think of it, the meat group too. I consume about 5-6000 calories a day and I don't get fat. I have beers and wine if and when I want, I order fast food one day a week. But in any given week I will train martial arts for 6 or 7 hours, run at least 5k, sometimes 12k, do one or two strength sessions and obviously work too. (which I should be doing now ).

Now obviously not everyone has the time to train that I do, but if you chop my training in half and do the same with my calories, you still have a well fed guy who trains a lot. Don't get me wrong, diet is important. But as a people we don't really do a lot.

LivingDeadGirl

greenkittie wrote: »

No way, it took me years to get over the trauma of school PE and actually be fit and active again. I know i'm not alone either, a lot of people get put off exercise by school PE classes.

+1, ya beat me to it!

estebancambias

italian kids are the most obese in europe...fact.

I'd say the spanish are generally healthy though.

fragile

greenkittie wrote: »

No way, it took me years to get over the trauma of school PE and actually be fit and active again. I know i'm not alone either, a lot of people get put off exercise by school PE classes.

I agree completely, our PE teacher in secondary school was an elderly man with arthiritis and a drinking problem :eek: his idea of PE class was to throw a ball into the yard and yell at anybody who didn't look like they were enthusiastically chasing it around!

I don't think the Olympics are any help either! they are so far removed from the average person that it's just alien. I mean, to reach Gold in the Olympics you have to start competitive training from a very young age and essentially sacrifice all other activities. A parent who was seen to do this to a very young child would be called a freak for being so overbearing on their child, yet everyone celebrates if a Gold medal is brought home

Roper

A: You're wrong about all Olympians being brought up that way. I think you could just look at our own Olympic medalists for cases in point.

B: Surely PE quality is the problem and the solution then? You and others might have been put off by poor quality PE, but that's not the way it is right now and a lot of schools are looking at more diverse ways of getting kids involved. See my post above for example.

nesf

Alcohol is certainly a contributing factor I think. Purely from a calorie perspective the average amount thrown back on a Friday night is going to have people a bit on the heavy side. Per capita we're on average throwing back over 13 litres of pure alcohol a year with the majority of that coming from beer (source)*. That's a lot of extra calories added onto (most likely) too many calories coming from a bad diet to begin with. Combine the two and unless that person is exercising a lot they're going to be fairly overweight.




*Remember this average is across every person in the country 15 years and over. So that number includes a lot of non-drinkers and occasional drinkers, which gives you an idea of how much the regular drinkers are getting through each year.

fragile

Roper wrote: »

A: You're wrong about all Olympians being brought up that way. I think you could just look at our own Olympic medalists for cases in point.

Your right Roper, I didn't mean to imply that all Olympic athletes go through this, but the vast majority in gymnastics and such sports almost certainly do.

Roper

fragile wrote: »

Your right Roper, I didn't mean to imply that all Olympic athletes go through this, but the vast majority in gymnastics and such sports almost certainly do.

Aye, but have a look at the cultures they come from. China, the former USSR and The USA in the main. Totalitarean states in the main but the USA do pressure quite well too.

Leon11

Neilstown boxing club is a 100 yards from my house. Looking out right now at the school playingfield and there must be at least 20 kids <10 running round the outside with sparring gloves on! Hall looks pretty busy too. That must be at least 3 golds in 2020/24:D

Way off topic.

Anyway getting to Nesf's point regarding alcohol, I don't think it's the alcohol it's more so the food that's eaten after a night in the pub that does the real damage!

nesf

Leon11 wrote: »

Anyway getting to Nesf's point regarding alcohol, I don't think it's the alcohol it's more so the food that's eaten after a night in the pub that does the real damage!

The problem tends to be, from my experience, that even when people realise that they need to lose weight, they tend to think about the food they eat and forget about the alcohol as if pints had no calories and don't count them into the equation. It's only a contributing factor though, and not the root cause but I think it's an important one because of how ingrained drinking is in our culture.

kevpants

Having been born and raised in Australia until age 11 I have to say the comparison between there and here (in the 90's) is shocking.

I played rugby league from aged 7 - 11 and I have no memories of ever feeling nervous or heartbroken in any sporting event. Even the coaching and rules were geared towards fairness and enjoyment of sport.

In rugby league you get 5 tackles befoe you have to turn over the ball and on each tackle a different section of the team got the ball (backs on 1st tackle, forwards on 2nd, hooker made a break on 3rd, fly half made a break on 4th...) also there was no kicking of the ball allowed and you got more points for a try if more than 4 players got a touch of the ball in the buildup.

Contrast with me arriving in Ireland to be shouted at and called an "eejit" by middle aged men because I had yet to master the sport of gaelic football 3 weeks after entering the country. Also being told to "Pass it to Jimmy as quickly as yee can", Jimmy being the best player and "If you don't start well you'll be on the bench after 10 mins". I started out as a fearless energetic team player who made the school gaelic team a few weeks after first learning the rules but by the time I was playing as a teenager my confidence was GONE.

Roper

kevpants wrote: »

Having been born and raised in Australia until age 11 I have to say the comparison between there and here (in the 90's) is shocking.

I played rugby league from aged 7 - 11 and I have no memories of ever feeling nervous or heartbroken in any sporting event. Even the coaching and rules were geared towards fairness and enjoyment of sport.

In rugby league you get 5 tackles befoe you have to turn over the ball and on each tackle a different section of the team got the ball (backs on 1st tackle, forwards on 2nd, hooker made a break on 3rd, fly half made a break on 4th...) also there was no kicking of the ball allowed and you got more points for a try if more than 4 players got a touch of the ball in the buildup.

Contrast with me arriving in Ireland to be shouted at and called an "eejit" by middle aged men because I had yet to master the sport of gaelic football 3 weeks after entering the country. Also being told to "Pass it to Jimmy as quickly as yee can", Jimmy being the best player and "If you don't start well you'll be on the bench after 10 mins". I started out as a fearless energetic team player who made the school gaelic team a few weeks after first learning the rules but by the time I was playing as a teenager my confidence was GONE.

LOL! GAA used to be dog eat dog for kids but things have changed considerably. Myself and my mate were only talking about our old trainer a few weeks ago. He was a brutal bastard and we were only 12. Just not a nice person and you had no love for the game after 1/2 a season with him. My bro-in law is training his local team now and he'll find a place for everyone. They'll make a C,D, or E team to get kids involved and it's all about fun and skills.

A friend of mine spent some time as a pro footballer in Holland and was amazed to find that the kids at the academy weren't allowed to tackle until they were in their teens or thereabouts. It was all about pass, move, touch. He came from the English game so he was stunned.

Leon11

Roper wrote: »

A friend of mine spent some time as a pro footballer in Holland and was amazed to find that the kids at the academy weren't allowed to tackle until they were in their teens or thereabouts. It was all about pass, move, touch. He came from the English game so he was stunned.

Kiwi's do the same. Rugby is all about developing skills until you're hitting teens, Then you introduce the tackle (most can already tackle:D) and once they hit 16/17 they'll start lifting.