Jacques Rogge criticises Usain Bolt

juvenal

So Mr. Cardboard Personality himself Jacques Rogge has come out and criticised Usain Bolt's celebrations in the 100m and 200m finals.

The IOC chief spoke to AP and said (from BBC Sport) "That's not the way we perceive being a champion. I've no problem with him doing a show. But I think he should show more respect and shake hands after the finish."

Rogge said Bolt should "not make gestures like the one he made in the 100m", adding: "He might have interpreted that in another way, but the way it was perceived was 'catch me if you can.' You don't do that. But he'll learn. He's still a young man."

What sort of BS is this? I mean, I guess it's up to people to interpret his actions themselves, but I've yet to hear any of the other sprinters or commentators criticise Bolt. From what we can gather on television, Bolt has a very friendly relationship with the other sprinters, and thankfully the aggressive and strutting carry-on that we saw with Maurice Greene et al looks to be passé.

In the several interviews I've seen with Bolt on TV, he's had nothing but respect for his fellow athletes, and immdiately dismissed questions comparing him to Johnson or Phelps, saying their achievements speak for themselves and he's not comparable.

The guy achieved something no-one else has ever done in history, and it's refreshing to see that sort of unbridled joy on the track, rather than stern-faced machismo and goading.

Pherekydes

To be honest, I'm just at a complete loss about this criticism. It's the funniest thing I've heard yet at these games.

Rogge should work at getting those cheating horses out of the games. :rolleyes:

juvenal

Rogge and the IOC should be focusing on real issues that are damaging these games, e.g. drugs, questionable ages of gymnasts and an apparent renege by the Chinese authorities on freedom of expression during the games.

If anything, Bolt, like Phelps in week one, has done more for the Olympics and their sports than the suits could ever dream of doing.

robinph

I've no problem at all with the way that Bolt carrys himself before hand or celebrates afterwards. The way that some of the US sprinters behaved previously did annoy me though as that was more of a "we're superior to all of you lot, bow down before us" kind of thing. Bolt is superior to all of us and we should be bowing down before him, but he most certainly does not behave like that on the track, well other than the dissapearing off into the distance thing he does to the rest of the people he's raceing against.

dedon

I have to say if he didnt sake hands with the other runners after the race then that is REALLY bad form

robinph

Can't remember runners ever going to shake hands with everyone else after a race.

thirtyfoot

dedon wrote: »

I have to say if he didnt sake hands with the other runners after the race then that is REALLY bad form

He was jumping around and acting the eejit with Spearmon and Martiny down the back straight so I don't think its bad sport, its glamorous and exciting and kids will love it. It happens a lot when you win gold you just launch into a lap straight away, its not the IMC or the Community Games we are talking here. Those guys will meet afterwards in mixed zones etc etc and shake hands, say well done blah blah.

If you want to blame someone check out John Akii-Bua from the '72 games, after he won he launched into a lap and starting hurdling again, brilliant stuff.

dedon

robinph wrote: »

Can't remember runners ever going to shake hands with everyone else after a race.

They do!! What races have you been watching???

thirtyfoot

dedon wrote: »

They do!! What races have you been watching???

Ah jaysus, Usain doing what Usain does will do more for the sport than a few honorable chaps a la Chariots of Fire going "well done old man and mine's a sherry" after the race.

robinph

dedon wrote: »

They do!! What races have you been watching???

Semis and heats yes, finals no. In the finals it's a case of catch me if you can as they go off in search of a flag to run around the track with, well apart from the like of the marathon where they are just too knackerd anyway to really be up for running any further.

Racing Flat

I must say, I hate all the show boating. Doing pre-meditated moves before and after races and getting on the podium. How come long distance runners never do this?

I suppose I can slightly understand it beforehand, maybe it's part of psyching out the opponents. And afterwards when all excited - but when getting up on the podium (the next day), doing the old kiss the 2 fingers move... where's the humility in victory?

Maybe I'm just getting old. This show boating is part of the new 'Pop Idol' type culture, where everybody thinks they are better than everyone else. At least Bolt is....Maybe 'Big Brother' culture is the better example, where everybody thinks everyone else wants to watch them - but then everybody does want to watch Bolt!!!

What I don't like about it, is I bet if you go to schools races over trhe next few months, the winning kids will mimic this, possibly turning them into bad winners. Okay I'm old!

PS Muhammed Ali has a lot to answer for;)

thirtyfoot

Racing Flat wrote: »

. Okay I'm old!

Yes, you are old and you probably wear those old Ron Hill tights with loops at the bottom and get more of a kick out of John Treacy in the muck in Limerick in '78:D:D

http://www.tg4.ie/spor/moment/data/files/images/big/treacy_lg.jpg

Racing Flat

Tingle wrote: »

Yes, you are old

I don't like Robbie Keane's cartwheeling antics either:(.

Any idea where I can get those ronhills? Always liked those:D.

thirtyfoot

Racing Flat wrote: »

Any idea where I can get those ronhills? Always liked those:D.

I'd say John Buckley would have a pair hidden in some corner

thirtyfoot

Deluded Jacques Rogge fails to see the champion in Usain Bolt
(Claro Cortes IV/Reuters)
Blind fury: Rogge is stuck in the past
Rick Broadbent in Beijing

If you want to know just how out of touch the IOC is then listen to Jacques Rogge, a deluded individual who is the organisation's president. Commenting on Usain Bolt, the man who is single-handedly dragging athletics' reputation from the gutter back into the mainstream, Rogge was a tad miffed that the Jamaica sprinter had not taken a break from redefining the parameters of physical endeavour to shake hands with his rivals.

“That's not the way we perceive being a champion,” Rogge said. “I have no problem with him doing a show but I think he should show more respect for his competitors and shake hands, give a tap on the shoulder to the other ones immediately after the finish and not make gestures like the one he made in the 100 metres.”

Which goes to show how little Rogge knows about sport. He may be good at garden parties and probably has impeccable table manners, but he is a lone voice of dissent. Sport is a show and Bolt has become P.T. Barnum.

His celebration as he crossed the line in the 100 metres was an indelible Olympic image. For Rogge it lacked the stiff upper lip he would have preferred. “The way it was perceived was 'catch me if you can,'” the Belgian continued. “You don't do that. But he'll learn. He's still a young man.”

Bolt blasts past perfection, so why do I think he should stop?
Bolt was blazing: don’t let him fail us now
Rogge is an old man but will never learn. People love a winner with character and Bolt has it. He danced, he made his signature lightning gesture and he waved his gold shoes around. These have been his Games. Rogge's attitude sums up a myopic approach to sport. He wants it played by some draconian code of ethics instead of enjoying the beautiful drama and mind-boggling entertainment of the moment.

He is also wrong. Bolt is both a generous and magnanimous individual. He is utterly deferent to his coach, Glen Mills, respects his elders and said last night that he had just changed the sport a bit, whereas Michael Johnson revolutionised it. After another brilliant run here, he stopped in the mixed zone to speak specifically to the British media about Germaine Mason, the high jumper who was born in Kingston, Jamaica, but was draped in a Union Jack after winning a surprise silver medal.

You could draw up a list of things wrong with the Olympics as long as the 10,000 metres. It is a corporate carve-up where Visa is king. There have been several books devoted to corruption within the ranks. And then Bolt comes along with his harpsichord grin, laid-back manner and God-given talent. In many ways, he is the man who saved the Games, but Rogge is more concerned that he stops when crossing the line at breakneck speed and then waits for his rivals to finish before shaking hands and saying, “Well done, old chap.”

Sprinting, the boxing of track and field, has been dominated by a timeline of braggarts and egos. With his dancing, his talk of chicken nuggets and his wonderfully lackadaisical manner, Bolt is the best thing that has happened to the Olympics in decades. All the suspicion and finger-pointing that has plagued the Games have been forgotten, however briefly that may last.

“Flash, I love you but we only have 14 hours to save the earth,” Dale Arden said in the film Flash Gordon. Bolt says he is not Flash Gordon and, indeed, it has taken him only 9.69sec to save his sport.

Rogge is too consumed by his own importance and a deeply simplistic view of sport to realise all this. As for Bolt, he must feel like shaking his head rather than hands.

juvenal

Frankie Fredericks has weighed into the debate on the side of Bolt

The Times wrote:

Few top sprinters know better than Frankie Fredericks what it feels like to be the man no one is watching at the end of the 100 metres Olympic final.

The Namibian became the African nation’s first Olympic medal-winner when he won silver in both the 100 metres and 200 metres at Barcelona in 1992. But it was in Atlanta four years later that he really suffered runner-up syndrome as he watched a clean pair of heels belonging first to Donovan Bailey in the 100 metres and then Michael Johnson in the 200 metres.

Both men had to break a world record to finish ahead of him. So in witnessing Usain Bolt set new standards in both distances, Fredericks was in a better place to judge the Jamaican’s right to celebrate than Jacques Rogge, the president of the IOC, who complained that the new champion should have consoled his beaten rivals with a gentlemanly handshake.

“You cannot tell a guy who has run 9.69 seconds how to react. We should be happy,” Fredericks said, underlining that although he is part of the IOC hierarchy as chairman of the Athletes’ Commission, he is still a competitor at heart.

“This was a unique moment - a man that as an athlete is making history. It is not like it is a thing that is planned. There are seven other guys who want to be the world’s fastest man. In this case, Usain knew that Asafa Powell beat him two times before, so when he saw that Asafa was not in front, the child in him came out. It is his way of expressing himself.”

The sight of Bolt thumping his chest 20 metres from the finish line of the 100 metres as he eased over in second gear has been the image of the Games. A prostrate Bolt on the track digesting what he had achieved after breaking Johnson’s 12-year record of 19.32 sec to win the 200 metres gold medal in 19.30 a few days later ranks a close second.

Fredericks, universally liked during his sprinting career and now, is in no doubt that the men who followed in Bolt’s wake in both races would not have begrudged him his moment of self-indulgence. “He’s the star. It’s his moment and his victory lap. There are seven others who can hug each other afterwards,” he said. “Michael did the same thing lying on the floor. I had no idea what I did until I watched the tapes. But I wouldn’t have cared. I was in his slip-stream. I set a personal best and was happy.”

He is also in no doubt that Bolt did it cleanly. “I am not sceptical at all. I always believed that the guy next to me was clean because I was clean. I believe that Usain has worked hard,” he said.

“I did not think that Michael’s record would be broken so quickly. I thought maybe my grandchildren would see it. But we knew that he had the talent when he was 17. He’s such a tall guy. All the tall guys like Carl Lewis had a slow start but Usain gets out at the start - he is with them from the beginning.”

Fredericks is leading the drive to educate athletes about anti-doping and wants as much as anybody to separate the bad apples from the good. However he does not share the concerns about Jamaica’s lack of a national anti-doping agency.

“I have faith. The IAAF has a regional centre there and I am sure all the guys are tested,” he said. “People came to Namibia to test me and I think the same for Usain. Even if a country doesn’t have a national doping agency, we have to make sure that the top athletes are continuing to be tested.”

Athletes could not have chosen a better person in Fredericks, a computer science graduate, to represent them among the IOC suits. Although he did not win an Olympic gold medal, he has seen true greatness at much closer quarters than many of them. It is all the approval Bolt needs.

Racing Flat

I don't mind what he does at race end, but the pre-meditated posing isn't for me. A lot of the sport is gone out of sport. anyone who has played Sunday league football will know this, when the manager asks you to go down in the box, claim offside everytime the opponents attack, regardless of whether you think it is offside or not, same for corners, throw ins, it is also encouraged to fould the opponents, I could go on. An agression and winning at any cost mentality has taken over. I think the posing and posturing and oneupmanship that you see occasionally in athletics is leading in this direction. Remeber USA v GB in recent relays? Nasty triumphalism, with taunting by the victors to the losers afterwards. Not for me.

Long live Golf! If only all sports could follow that example. There'd be no need for a referee for Man U v Liverpool....


PS if I ever coach an athlete to an Olympic sprint final they won't wear sunglasses, chains, bracelets...

hunnymonster

I didn't like Rogge's comment's when Haile said he wouldn't run the marathon. Can't remember the exact quote but the effect was "the games are bigger than one man". Of course what he said is actually true, but when someone important (as Haile is) highlights a problem, deal with it, don't make the runner into the bad guy.

thirtyfoot

Racing Flat wrote: »

PS if I ever coach an athlete to an Olympic sprint final they won't wear sunglasses, chains, bracelets...

If you are going to wear shades, you need to be 110% sure of winning. You can't beat having the shades on with 50m to go in a 400m when lactic comes to town and you start to drop back and back......

NUTLEY BOY

Bolt is a convenient distraction for the Blazers to talk about !

That said, there is an odious tendency towards over celebration in sports these days which can be distinguished from the natural exuberance and joy of a phenomenal achievement.

Bolt's conduct BEFORE the end of the 100 metres sets a poor example for kids who will pick up on it in the same way that footballers antics rub off on them. The 100 metres finishes at the finishing line and it is a really bad technique not to run through the finishing line whilst still racing. That said i'm sure that Bolt is worried about what I think :D

When will the inevitable 9.5 seconds performance occur ?

eagle eye

He talked a lot of excrement imo. It was refreshing to see Bolt's celebrations and he doesn't seem to understand how much this means to him and his country. He was the first man to win the 100m from Jamaica, and that is their no.1 sport.

token56

when you win 3 gold medals and break 3 world records I think you should be able to celebrate how you like

juvenal

I referenced this in another thread - Martyn Rooney of GB taunting the Bahamians and Jamaicans as he crossed the line in the 4x400m heats. Big difference in celebrating your victory to yourself and the crowd, and taunting your competitors as you cross the line in a heat.

Article and photos.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-1048184/Rooney-risks-wrath-Rogge-mocking-celebration-Britains-4x400m-relay-success.html

Video

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/7577029.stm

thirtyfoot

juvenal wrote: »

I referenced this in another thread - Martyn Rooney of GB taunting the Bahamians and Jamaicans as he crossed the line in the 4x400m heats. Big difference in celebrating your victory to yourself and the crowd, and taunting your competitors as you cross the line in a heat.

Article and photos.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-1048184/Rooney-risks-wrath-Rogge-mocking-celebration-Britains-4x400m-relay-success.html

Video

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/7577029.stm

Rooney mentioned karma coming back to bite after the race, maybe he regretted what he did.

juvenal

Tingle wrote: »

Rooney mentioned karma coming back to bite after the race, maybe he regretted what he did.

Yeah I think he'll have learned a thing or two after this morning.

liveforphotos

Sprinting, the boxing of track and field, has been dominated by a timeline of braggarts and egos. With his dancing, his talk of chicken nuggets and his wonderfully lackadaisical manner, Bolt is the best thing that has happened to the Olympics in decades. All the suspicion and finger-pointing that has plagued the Games have been forgotten, however briefly that may last.

“Flash, I love you but we only have 14 hours to save the earth,” Dale Arden said in the film Flash Gordon. Bolt says he is not Flash Gordon and, indeed, it has taken him only 9.69sec to save his sport.

If you think that Usain Bolt is the saviour of track and field athletics, you are very much mistaken. Am I the only person who has huge doubts that Usain Bolt is a clean athlete? His chest-beating as he coasted across the finish line metres ahead of the world's top sprinters (while breaking the world record) was an ugly sight to my eyes. It lacked all credibility as a clean performance in my opinion.

Add to that the fact that, a few days later, he breaks Michael Johnson's already obscene 200m world record and there is no doubt whatever in my mind that no matter what his natural talent, he has an extra edge that is not natural. In my eyes, the guy is an embararrasment to the sport of athletics. He is having a laugh. I hope he is found out sooner rather than later, but when he is, unfortunately it will tarnish the reputation of the sport even further. Those who hail him as the saviour of the sport are either turning a blind eye to the impossibility of his performances, or are naive in the extreme.

As a former sprinter who loves the sport of athletics, it gives me a real queasy feeling to see this guy turning in times like that and posing like that. I'm quite sure that those who are in charge of testing will target him for careful attention from now on. However, it won't be easy, because there is little or no proper out-of-competition testing in Jamaica. Factor in the Jamaican women's 1-2-3 in the women's 100m and the other Jamaican sprint and sprint relay results in this Olympics and you would want to have a hole in your head not to see what's going on.

keane2097

liveforphotos wrote: »

If you think that Usain Bolt is the saviour of track and field athletics, you are very much mistaken. Am I the only person who has huge doubts that Usain Bolt is a clean athlete? His chest-beating as he coasted across the finish line metres ahead of the world's top sprinters (while breaking the world record) was an ugly sight to my eyes. It lacked all credibility as a clean performance in my opinion.

Add to that the fact that, a few days later, he breaks Michael Johnson's already obscene 200m world record and there is no doubt whatever in my mind that no matter what his natural talent, he has an extra edge that is not natural. In my eyes, the guy is an embararrasment to the sport of athletics. He is having a laugh. I hope he is found out sooner rather than later, but when he is, unfortunately it will tarnish the reputation of the sport even further. Those who hail him as the saviour of the sport are either turning a blind eye to the impossibility of his performances, or are naive in the extreme.

As a former sprinter who loves the sport of athletics, it gives me a real queasy feeling to see this guy turning in times like that and posing like that. I'm quite sure that those who are in charge of testing will target him for careful attention from now on. However, it won't be easy, because there is little or no proper out-of-competition testing in Jamaica. Factor in the Jamaican women's 1-2-3 in the women's 100m and the other Jamaican sprint and sprint relay results in this Olympics and you would want to have a hole in your head not to see what's going on.

Dude you're being terribly condescending for a guy making an argument with absolutely no proof to back himself up imo.

Open question to people complaining about Bolt's poses and celebrations:

Why don't you like fun?

old boy

would i be right in saying jamacia is the only country, not to have out of compition testing.

Pherekydes

liveforphotos wrote: »

If you think that Usain Bolt is the saviour of track and field athletics, you are very much mistaken. Am I the only person who has huge doubts that Usain Bolt is a clean athlete? His chest-beating as he coasted across the finish line metres ahead of the world's top sprinters (while breaking the world record) was an ugly sight to my eyes. It lacked all credibility as a clean performance in my opinion.

Add to that the fact that, a few days later, he breaks Michael Johnson's already obscene 200m world record and there is no doubt whatever in my mind that no matter what his natural talent, he has an extra edge that is not natural. In my eyes, the guy is an embararrasment to the sport of athletics. He is having a laugh. I hope he is found out sooner rather than later, but when he is, unfortunately it will tarnish the reputation of the sport even further. Those who hail him as the saviour of the sport are either turning a blind eye to the impossibility of his performances, or are naive in the extreme.

As a former sprinter who loves the sport of athletics, it gives me a real queasy feeling to see this guy turning in times like that and posing like that. I'm quite sure that those who are in charge of testing will target him for careful attention from now on. However, it won't be easy, because there is little or no proper out-of-competition testing in Jamaica. Factor in the Jamaican women's 1-2-3 in the women's 100m and the other Jamaican sprint and sprint relay results in this Olympics and you would want to have a hole in your head not to see what's going on.

Why do we need testing when we have you to tell us who is clean and dirty? If the real indication of doping is an amazing performance, then your post is the cleanest I've seen yet. Well done.

liveforphotos

Pherekydes wrote: »

Why do we need testing when we have you to tell us who is clean and dirty? If the real indication of doping is an amazing performance, then your post is the cleanest I've seen yet. Well done.

Gee. If there were Olympic medals for sarcasm, I guess you would have been eliminated in the heats.

Sorry to cast aspersions on a popular hero of the moment, but some performances are just too unreal to be true. I predict that the truth will out in the end, though it may take a long time. The testers are getting smarter though. Witness the seven female Russian athletes who were caught just before the Olympics.

Of course nobody has proven that Usain Bolt has achieved those "amazing" performances via chemical assistance. I stated my opinion very forcibly, mainly because I love the sport of athletics and I hate what is happening to it. It is getting close to the state of affairs that pertained in professional cycling a few years ago and maybe still does.

Human growth hormone, steroids that can clear the system in a few hours, new "designer" steroids, athletes cycling through different steroids so as not to stay on each one for long. The list of products and methods is growing longer day by day. In-competition testing is utterly inadequate to catch most of the cheats. Unless there is random out-of-competition testing in all countries, suspicion will attach to performances like those of the Jamaican sprinters.

Pherekydes

liveforphotos wrote: »

Gee. If there were Olympic medals for sarcasm, I guess you would have been eliminated in the heats.

Sorry to cast aspersions on a popular hero of the moment, but some performances are just too unreal to be true. I predict that the truth will out in the end, though it may take a long time. The testers are getting smarter though. Witness the seven female Russian athletes who were caught just before the Olympics.

Of course nobody has proven that Usain Bolt has achieved those "amazing" performances via chemical assistance. I stated my opinion very forcibly, mainly because I love the sport of athletics and I hate what is happening to it. It is getting close to the state of affairs that pertained in professional cycling a few years ago and maybe still does.

Human growth hormone, steroids that can clear the system in a few hours, new "designer" steroids, athletes cycling through different steroids so as not to stay on each one for long. The list of products and methods is growing longer day by day. In-competition testing is utterly inadequate to catch most of the cheats. Unless there is random out-of-competition testing in all countries, suspicion will attach to performances like those of the Jamaican sprinters.

All supposition. You don't care who you smear. You're with the "nobody can run faster than x clean" camp.

liveforphotos

Pherekydes wrote: »

All supposition. You don't care who you smear. You're with the "nobody can run faster than x clean" camp.

That's right. I am. And it is all supposition. For now.