3 lane motorway, changing lanes, right of way?

Random

If you're going down the M50 and you're in lane 3 and someone is in lane 1. You decide to move to lane 2, as do they. Both partys collide. Who's at fault?

Does someone have right of way in this scenario or is it simply a matter of watching the road around you?

Permabear

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Random

donegalfella wrote: »

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I'd have thought it comes under Learning to Drive which is why I didn't put it in Motors or Community/Transport.

Permabear

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Shazbot

True, but we never stop learning to drive. So i guess it falls into the category but thats for the mods to decide.

Back to the question. I'd say both are at fault but I can't imagine it ever happening (unless it has to you, hence the question). The driver in lane 3 should be only in that lane for overtaking and should theoretically be going faster than the drivers in lane 2 and 1 and should easily be able to get ahead of the driver in lane 1 attempting to enter lane 2.

Either way, both drivers should always throw a quick glance over their shoulders to check their blind spots. If both fail to do it and it results in your hypothetical situation then both are to blame.

Random

I thought this forum was about Learning to drive and not specifically about learner drivers?

Can a mod please move this then if I'm mistaken?

++ edit, posted at the same time as Shazbot but took too long to click submit lol.

Thanks for that Shazbot. Theory and practice are two different things. I'm looking for Rules of the Road verdict on this and also common opinion as well as experience on the issue.

Thanks

Permabear

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Tails142

donegalfella wrote: »

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You're not taking into account that one car could be in the other cars blind spot and may not be visible. I find you have to look over your shoulder and have a peek out the side window to be totally sure.

But while driving on a motorway if you keep good observation in your mirrors you should be able to keep track of what cars are coming up behind you.

I'll hazard a guess that the person at fault would be the car 'overtaking', i.e. the car on the right as if he's moving back in frmo the overtaking lane, if he hits a car moving from the left lane into the middle lane then he hasnt completed his overtaking manoeuvre very well.

On the other hand the car moving into the middle lane from the left lane could be at fault if he is travelling faster than the overtaking car in the right lane and 'undertaking'.

Obvisouly its in everyones interest to check your blind spots and avoid collision

Wishbone Ash

The thread is perfectly acceptable here.

I'm not sure if there is a specific regulation about this scenario but, as a purely personal opinion, I be inclined to think that the driver in the right lane has a greater priority of getting into the centre lane than the driver in the left lane.

It reminds me of the old carpark scenario whereby two cars on opposite sides reverse out simultaneously and into each other!

Permabear

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wil

WA I think that would be the general UK teaching.

This is not so uncommon a scenario as you might think, and invariably results from the inside lane driver not checking his blind spots for the overtaking driver in the outside lane.
Not noticing them there, they move in to the outside lane and collide unless the outside driver sees or anticipates the mistake and takes avoiding action

A driver in the outside lane is expected to come back to the inside lanes, so the inside driver should be expecting that to happen. There is not even always an obligation to indicate moviing in. But there is an obligation to indicate anytime you move to the outside lane.

Occasionally it could happen that the overtaking driver returns to inside lane too quickly or misjudges and clips the front of the inside driver.
In both incidences the good driver will normally anticipate the mistakes of the other and avoid or use the horn.
It is there for a reason.

Because relative speeds are not usually so great and there is usually reasonable room for anticipation and avoidance, I'd imagine even the person not strictly at fault would take some responsibility.

Wishbone Ash

donegalfella wrote: »

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I've seen quite a few near misses of this scenario usually at either side of the toll plaza. Both drivers check their mirrors and see that the lane between them is clear, both signal and manoeuvre.........cue horns/swerves etc.

Random

too many times I've come close to this on the upgraded M50. I'm moving back in from 3 to 2 and the guy in 1 decides he's gonna move out from 1 to 2 just after I've started my maneuver.

The problem of course is that while I can argue I'm mid manuever and the idiot pulled into me, if there's no witness's around then it's 50/50 in terms of blame when it comes to insurance.

This is why I'm very interested to see if it's covered under any aspect of the rules of the road, which I haven't been able to find. Our books don't seem to cater enough for roads with more than 2 lanes in one direction.

As for the person who said my overtaking manuever wasn't completed fully because I pulled back in from lane 3 to 2 as soon as I passed the car in lane 2, is this not what I'm supposed to be doing? I don't get your point. While yes I should cater for idiots in lane 1, I'm doing everything correct by moving back into lane 2 as soon as I finish my overtake in lane 3.

Just for clarity I'm talking about cars in lane 1 and lane 3 colliding as they move into lane 2. The car in lane 2 really isn't involved as we've probably both just past it and he'll just get stuck in the inevitable pile up.

colm_mcm

this is made easier if all parties go with the idea that the traffic on the right moves faster than the traffic on the left.

This never happens though.

wil

random wrote: »

too many times I've come close to this on the upgraded M50. I'm moving back in from 3 to 2 and the guy in 1 decides he's gonna move out from 1 to 2 just after I've started my maneuver.
.

The car in lane 3 has priority to move back in to lane 2 as he is overtaking and the car in lane one should be expecting him to come back to lane 2 then 1.
If the car in lane one wishes to move to lane 2, he should indicate (d'oh) well in advance, being aware that cars are passing in lane 2 and 3, then when there is room, move out. If you see a car overtaking another in lane 2, then you should wait till that is clear.

On the other hand, courtesy dictates that a car in lane 2 overtaking should allow cars indicating to move out to lane 2 the chance to do so by moving in to lane 3. If a car is indicating for a reasonable period then it is just plain ignorance to block them if there is no good reason, and move to lane 3.

Most of the onus though is still on the car on inside lanes to ensure their way is clear before moving to an outer lane.

All that aside, motorway driving is the easiest of driving and very safe if people maintain lane discipline, keep their distance, use indicators, check blindspots,and spend almost as much time looking in their RVM as in front.
Dis is Ireland.

wil

Imagine this scenario
Car in lane 3 loses all power and suddenly has to pull in to the hard shoulder or abandon the car in lane 3.
Which do you think is sensible?

Of course cars on the inside lanes should give way to this now slowing car on the outide lane and allow him in to the inside lanes and stop in hard shoulder.
The alternative is a huge pileup in to the back of a car stopped in lane 3 because inside lanes wouldnt alllow him in.

Does this scenario make it any clearer from a safety point of view.

This exact scenario happened to me in lane 3 on the way to Birmingham airport when my cambelt went.

I shudder to think would I still be alive if this happened on Irish roads.

Random

I don't think this really makes it too much clearer as the speeds involved here were obviously much lower I'm assuming?

wil

random wrote: »

I don't think this really makes it too much clearer as the speeds involved here were obviously much lower I'm assuming?

Cars on the outside lanes attempting to return to inside lanes have priority over cars on inside lanes attempting to overtake.
Any clearer?:)

Random

wil wrote: »

Cars on the outside lanes attempting to return to inside lanes have priority over cars on inside lanes attempting to overtake.
Any clearer?:)

I agree they should, but what are you basing this on?

wil

random wrote: »

I agree they should, but what are you basing this on?

Safety, how I was taught to drive and common sense.

Irish Rules of the road dont cover everything you know.